Susan's Place Logo

News:

Please be sure to review The Site terms of service, and rules to live by

Main Menu

Question about Dr Hayes in Sydney

Started by Jayne01, July 31, 2017, 06:36:40 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Jayne01

Hello,

I have a question regarding Dr Hayes in Sydney. I started HRT about 7 weeks ago and Dr Hayes is my endocrinologist. My hormone therapy is not going very well, which I talk about in another thread on this forum.

I called his office today asking if I could speak to him regarding my medication. The receptionist told me that he doesn't talk to his patients on the phone. She said I need to make an appointment or I could send an email. The problem is that it is not his email, it is the generic reception email address, so there is no confidentiality. This all seems very strange to me.

I tried explaining to the receptionist that I am in extreme distress and I need to speak to him regarding my medication. She was very dismissive and simply told me that she doesn't make the rules. I don't know what to do. I have heard nothing but good things about Dr Hayes, but it seems if things are not going smoothly he is uncontactable. I don't know if I should try and find another endocrinologist. Are there other doctors in Sydney who are knowledgable in trans issues?

Please help! I am getting very desperate. My dysphoria is very bad and the HRT is having zero effect. I am very very distressed.
  •  

kelly_aus

Quote from: Jayne01 on July 31, 2017, 06:36:40 PM
Hello,

I have a question regarding Dr Hayes in Sydney. I started HRT about 7 weeks ago and Dr Hayes is my endocrinologist. My hormone therapy is not going very well, which I talk about in another thread on this forum.

I called his office today asking if I could speak to him regarding my medication. The receptionist told me that he doesn't talk to his patients on the phone. She said I need to make an appointment or I could send an email. The problem is that it is not his email, it is the generic reception email address, so there is no confidentiality. This all seems very strange to me.

I tried explaining to the receptionist that I am in extreme distress and I need to speak to him regarding my medication. She was very dismissive and simply told me that she doesn't make the rules. I don't know what to do. I have heard nothing but good things about Dr Hayes, but it seems if things are not going smoothly he is uncontactable. I don't know if I should try and find another endocrinologist. Are there other doctors in Sydney who are knowledgable in trans issues?

Please help! I am getting very desperate. My dysphoria is very bad and the HRT is having zero effect. I am very very distressed.

Being unable to speak to a specialist is not uncommon, at least when you just call randomly. I've found that arranging a call via email usually does the trick. Staff at medical practices are covered by much the same law as the doctors and revealing confidential medical info can get very expensive for them, very quickly.
  •  

Dena

I have two thoughts. You might ask how soon you can get an appointment but the faster route would be to send the email. In most doctors offices the entire staff has access to the medical records and in that office, I am pretty sure that everybody understands that many of Dr Hayes patients are transgender. Start the email with a routing request, put a few blank lines in to separate the payload from the header then explain your issue. I suspect the office staff isn't going to read past the routing request.
Rebirth Date 1982 - PMs are welcome - Use [email]dena@susans.org[/email] or Discord if your unable to PM - Skype is available - My Transition
If you are helped by this site, consider leaving a tip in the jar at the bottom of the page or become a subscriber
  •  

bubbles21

Hey there,

It's horrible that this has happened, however, not uncommon. I have had contact with his office previously and booked an appointment, however, due to other events i was not able to attend. When i tried to organise payment of the fee they charge for missing an appointment the receptionist was extremely rude and dismissive. After that i just stuck to my normal dr who has done all of my hrt things for the past 4 years which is dr hespe in glebe (sadly i don't think she takes patients anymore). I've also read other complaints about this receptionist online not only by trans patients but by his other older patients as well. They say he is an awesome dr but the receptionist is what pushed them away from his business.

As for suggestions, i would say give the gender centre a call they should be able to help with directing you to a dr. Or you could try my dr, dr hespe to see if she will take on another patient. She has worked with trans patients for years and imo is the best dr i've had. Other drs you could try are the drs at taylor square private clinic and endo could be stephen thornely in Sutherland.

Hope this helps a little, if i find out any more info i will post again.

Kind regards,
B
Blossoming with my Happy Pills :)
  •  

Jayne01

Thank you for the replies. My meds aren't working at all. I am in a bad place right now. I will try sending an email. I am very uncomfortable doing that, but I don't know what other choice I have.

Dena, what is a routing request?
  •  

Dena

Something that says I am a patient of the Dr Hayes and I request that you forward this to the doctor for his consideration. This will tell the people in the office what to do with it without discussing your reasons.
Rebirth Date 1982 - PMs are welcome - Use [email]dena@susans.org[/email] or Discord if your unable to PM - Skype is available - My Transition
If you are helped by this site, consider leaving a tip in the jar at the bottom of the page or become a subscriber
  •  

AnonyMs

There's no one else in Sydney with Dr Hayes level of experience. Not just as an endo, but in the vast number of trans patients he's seen. He certainly knew a lot more than my psych did, and my psych is one of the ones who sees trans patients.

He is difficult to get hold of and is booked out for many weeks, however he does sometimes make space if it's urgent.
  •  

Jayne01

I suspected that Dr Hayes may be the only one with lots of experience.

I sent an email to reception. Hopefully it gets to him and he replies.
  •  

AnonyMs

You could also go see a psych and get some antidepressants. I refused to take any as I was concerned it would confuse the effects of hrt and I wouldn't know what was working.
  •  

Jayne01

I have previously tried anti depressants. They didn't do anything either. Maybe my body just rejects any kind of medication? I don't see how that would be possible since my blood test show a significant increase in E and slight drop in T since starting HRT.

Did the HRT work for you?
  •  

kelly_aus

Quote from: Jayne01 on July 31, 2017, 11:34:31 PM
I have previously tried anti depressants. They didn't do anything either. Maybe my body just rejects any kind of medication? I don't see how that would be possible since my blood test show a significant increase in E and slight drop in T since starting HRT.

Did the HRT work for you?

Apart from alleviating depression, HRT has done very little for me.. Physically? Very little change.. Emotionally? Very little change..  What it has done, apart from alleviate the depression, is leave me more clear headed - seems running on T was not great for my cognitive processes.

What did you expect from HRT? It seems to me that many people have this idea that it's some magic pill, it's not.
  •  

Jayne01

I don't know what I expected. I certainly didn't expect nothing at all. Absolutely nothing. No clear head, not a damn thing.
  •  

AnonyMs

I have seen a few posts, possibly on other forums, where people don't get much mental effects out of HRT. It doesn't seem very common though.

I've not tried them, but my understanding of antidepressants is that you may have to try a number of them until you find one that works.

HRT did work for me. I started on low dose and that was great for some years but eventually it wasn't enough and I got seriously depressed. That's when I decided to see Dr Hayes and went onto a full transitioning dose. That combined with some decisions I made at the time made my depression evaporate. It's been coming back again a bit recently, which probably means I need to take the next step, which is kind of difficult as its going to out me.
  •  

Dan

#13
It seems that HRT can have variable effects, which is not surprising:
"....For some people this psychological change happens as soon as they start taking hormones,
and for others it happens as physical changes happen."
  •  

LizK

Quote from: Jayne01 on July 31, 2017, 11:11:25 PM
I suspected that Dr Hayes may be the only one with lots of experience.

I sent an email to reception. Hopefully it gets to him and he replies.

Hi Jayne

Navigating Drs can be a real pain sometimes.

The receptionist is bound by the same privacy act as the Dr. They cannot disclose anything to anyone nor should there be any discussion of you or your case out side of normal conversation required to take care of you. IMHO I have found that those who are the sticklers with the rules are also the most jealous of guarding information including patients privacy.

If you breach a patients privacy you could end up with very serious legal problems (apart from the moral implications).
Transition Begun 25 September 2015
HRT since 17 May 2016,
Fulltime from 8 March 2017,
GCS 4 December 2018
Voice Surgery 01 February 2019
  •  

ClaireBear

Quote from: NoName01 on August 01, 2017, 12:53:31 AM
I don't know what I expected. I certainly didn't expect nothing at all. Absolutely nothing. No clear head, not a damn thing.

If you don't mind my asking, what effect were you expecting from HRT?

The primary objective of hormones is to initiate body changes to make the body more congruent with gender identity.  Some people do experience an emotional and psychological shift too.

Hormones are not like painkillers though.  They take a long time to have effect.  Puberty is not something you go through in 7 weeks.  Most women are still experiencing changes after 5 years on hormones, although most of the major changes are complete within 3 years.

I had good physical changes from HRT and incredible psychological and emotional changes.  But they took time - almost nothing happened in 7 weeks.  I think I was still on a quarter dose at 7 weeks, and wasn't taking any anti-androgen or progesterone.

I saw Dr Hayes last week.  I believe he is an absolute professional in his field of medicine.  The sheer volume of trans clients he has dealt with over the years gives him remarkably insight into transition medicine and trans healthcare.  He is an endocrinologist and a medical specialist.  His schedule is full several months in advance.  I don't know any endocrinologist (or other medical specialist) whom you can just contact on a whim by telephone.

If you want a more urgent appointment to speak with someone about your sex hormones, I imagine Taylor Square could fit you in with one or two days notice.  If you are worried about your mental health, perhaps a psychologist or psychiatrist could help?  Let me know if you need a few names.  If peer support or case work assistance would help, maybe a trip to the Gender Centre would be beneficial.  Also, don't forget that ACON can assist with access to a social worker if that's of any use.

I hope you find what you are looking for.
  •  

NoName01

Hi ClaireBear,
What I was expecting from HRT was for my dysphoria to ease so that I wasn't consumed by it. I had read so many reports on this forum where people claim an almost immediate relief, sense of calm, clear head after starting hormones. Even Dr Hayes himself told me that he had patients who reported relief within hours of taking their first dose and that I should certainly feel some mental effects within a week or two at most. He started me on a very low dose of E only, and by the end of 6 weeks when I saw him again he had me on the maximum dose of pills plus a high dose of estrogen gel. He seemed quite surprised that I was not having any psychological effects. It got to the point where I actually started to get some physical changes in the breast area and still no psychological effects. I have since stopped taking HRT all together. I see Dr Hayes again in 2 weeks where he can hopefully tell me what is happening. My last blood test showed that the hormones where definitely being absorbed by my body, which is why he seemed surprised at the lack of any psychological effects. He also told me that he had several patients who take only a very small amount of E which settles their mind and they go on living their lives happily as males.

I did not experience any of that. It has confused me greatly. I didn't think I was contacting the Dr on a whim. I am an existing patient of his and the medication he prescribed to me was not doing what he told me to expect it to do. I thought it would be quite reasonable to try and contact him for some quick advice on what to do regarding the dosage until the next time I saw him. He doesn't talk on the phone, which seemed odd but I could accept. But his receptionist told me to send him an email. I thought I might get some kind of response within a few days, but it has been 2 weeks and still nothing. That seems to be strange to me. It takes me a minimum of 2.5 hours to get to his office and another 2.5 to get back. It doesn't seem fair that I have to lose money by taking a day off work just so I can go see him for a response that would have taken less than 5 minutes by email or phone.

I have had very little experience with doctors of any kind. However, last year I did have minor surgery on my nose and the specialist/surgeon I was seeing was available to contact if I had any problems.

Dr Hayes receptionist actually told me over the phone that I should contact my GP or go to a hospital. How can either of those options help me with a question regarding HRT dosage for being trans?

Anyway, I have gotten over my disappointment in this whole process and I'm just waiting out the time until my next appointment with Dr Hayes in 2 weeks. I can also ask him in person about his policy of "set and forget" he seems to have with his patients.
  •  

AnonyMs

It does seem to be very unusual not to get relief from dysphoria. I can only think of speaking to some psychs and see if there's any other things going on. You can be trans and still have other issues. If it comes to it, I think there's one or two online that may have more experience that those available in Sydney.

I would imagine if you weren't trans at all then taking HRT would have made you even more unhappy.

Quote from: NoName01 on August 20, 2017, 02:55:22 PM
Anyway, I have gotten over my disappointment in this whole process and I'm just waiting out the time until my next appointment with Dr Hayes in 2 weeks. I can also ask him in person about his policy of "set and forget" he seems to have with his patients.

I've had this experience where I could go to another doctor (and really didn't want to), and he's also seen me again on short notice when it was something only he could handle. I can't say I liked it, but he's very busy and its wasn't unreasonable. He's also done a lot to help me, and I'm certain he's a very kind guy.

Anyway, I'd not push this bit too hard. I very much doubt it will get you anywhere and he's the best there is in Sydney, if not Australia. Its not just the strictly technical side, but he does have a very wide experience of trans people and the situations we live in.
  •  

NoName01

Quote from: AnonyMs on August 20, 2017, 06:52:06 PM
I've had this experience where I could go to another doctor (and really didn't want to), and he's also seen me again on short notice when it was something only he could handle. I can't say I liked it, but he's very busy and its wasn't unreasonable. He's also done a lot to help me, and I'm certain he's a very kind guy.

Anyway, I'd not push this bit too hard. I very much doubt it will get you anywhere and he's the best there is in Sydney, if not Australia. Its not just the strictly technical side, but he does have a very wide experience of trans people and the situations we live in.

I have no doubt that he is a nice and kind person. I have seen him 3 times so far and each time he was very friendly and seemed like he wanted to do what was right for me to help me get the relief I am looking for. I have seen 3 or 4 different receptionists the times I have visited and they seem to be the biggest problem. They don't seem to have any compassion and treat you in a way that makes you feel like you are an inconvenience to them.

I have no intention to push him to the point where he may not want to treat me. I only want to ask him how I can contact him if necessary. Surely a doctor has some kind of duty of care for their patients to be contactable in the event that something is not going as expected.

I am so very disappointment that the HRT has not worked for me the way I was led to believe it would.
  •  

ClaireBear

Hiyya NoName,

I'm sorry it's not working as expected for you.

The effects of HRT are a function of age, genetics, and a whole host of other complex factors.  Hormones effect everyone very differently.  The same is true of all women - many cisgender women can be exposed to estrogen for many years and only have mild feminisation effects and very little breast growth.

I think would be unusual for Jon to promise you any kind of immediate relief since it's so variable.  I think the most you might expect to hear from him is that 'a lot of clients do report a fairly early initial sense of psychological calmness and relief as testosterone levels lower.'

A lot of medical journals also suggest that this initial psychological relief might be conflated with a placebo effect and the relief of finally beginning a medical transition in someone who is desperate for body congruence. 

The main purpose of feminizing hormones is bodily changes, not psychological effects.  Psychological effects are generally a secondary effect.

Transition endocrinology is indeed a bit of a 'set and forget' science as you say.  The purpose is to gradually bring the hormones into the healthy female range (ideally around the pubertal range) and then wait for feminizing effects on the body.  It's a long term game.  There are also obviously some 'male' features that can't ever be reversed after the initial puberty.  For some other people, the objective is not necessarily full transition, but just to reduce the androgenising effects of testosterone.

The body can go reasonably long periods of time with neither Estrogen nor Testosterone without any adverse effects (as menopausal women do), and for this reason sex hormone endocrinology is rarely an urgent form of medicine.  This is why it's unusual to get an 'urgent' appointment, like you would if you had surgery that was necrotic or infected, or had some other serious surgical complication.  But if you do want to see someone urgently about your hormones, I'd recommend Taylor Square.  They should be able to fit you in within a few days.

I'm sorry it's a long trip to get to Dr Hayes' office.  That's an effect of transgender healthcare being such a non-mainstream area of medicine.  As you settle into your new hormone regime, hopefully you won't need to visit very often, or can get supplementary help from a local physician?  I have learnt pretty well how to manage my own hormones over the last few years.  If needed, I also found a number of GP's who will prescribe hormones when I disclose my status - but I look female and have a female Medicare card (I do however, find their incessant curiosity about my surgery a bit demeaning).

The other thing worth mentioning is that the emotional effects of estrogen are not always completely obvious, even when your brain is undergoing significant changes.  It might only hit you that you've changed a little when your sitting at the beach bawling your eyes out about a beautiful orange sunset!

About the admin staff at Dr Hayes' office - if you give it some time, I think you'll find they are a lot more empathetic than you might think.  They deal with trans people all day, every day.  But they do run a tight ship.  Hayes' appointment book is full months in advance, and he works hard to keep costs low for his clients.

Out of interest - what is your testosterone level?

Also - Would you like to come to a group meeting at the Gender Centre sometime?

Hope it improves for you.

Claire

  •