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Need some reassurance with Electrolysis

Started by heather3791, August 18, 2018, 09:35:09 AM

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heather3791

So yesterday I completed 30 hours of electrolysis. The technician has worked on my chin this entire 30 hours. She says that I have a lot of hair follicles. I'm definitely seeing some results but when I let my hair grow and look in the 5x makeup mirror I still see a considerable amount of hair on my chin. Everything I've read says plan on 200 to 400 hours to clear the entire face/neck. If I use the middle number of 300 hours then my guess..and it's definitely a guess would be that the chin is 50 hours, each cheek is 50 hours, upper lip 50 hours, and the neck 100 hours. Does this sound accurate? Obviously the numbers would change if I end up being that 400 hour patient. My question centers more around how each area of the face and neck is divided up. I assume there are more follicles on the chin and upper lip than other areas. Does this sound right? I'm trying not to get discouraged but it's so difficult to fathom 270 to 370 more hours of this torture and money spending! Any words of encouragement would be greatly appreciated!
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GingerVicki

I am doing laser hair removal and the upper lip and chin seem to be the only hangups. These two spots are tough for me. I never grew much hair on my cheeks so, I can't speak to those areas. Most high school boys have more cheek hair then I ever did.
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JudiBlueEyes

Heather it will take what it will take.  Don't focus on the end number as it will drive you crazy.  The goal is to keep at it so you deal with the hairs while they are in their growth phase, as opposed to resting phase.  If you can afford it keep a steady appointment each week.  My Electrologist always moved around to thin out the hair and not cause heat damage by staying in one area too long.  I also had her work on dark hairs first since they produce shadow that is hard to cover with makeup.  Hang in there!
But now old friends they're acting strange
They shake their heads, they say I've changed
Well something's lost, but something's gained
In living every day.
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heather3791

Thanks ya'll. I will stay the course and keep on grinding. The day somebody figures out how to eliminate all hair in a very short period of time will make that somebody a very rich individual. 
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VickyS

Hi Heather,

My electrologist said I will probably need 300 hours as a very ball park figure.  She is working on the darker hairs first to give a more aesthetically pleasing result with less visible hairs as I have a few black, then red then white.

She said the hairs on my upper lip and chin are quite densely packed so she can't blast them all at once and try to clear a complete area due to it damaging the skin so she has to dot around to just thin things out, but sometimes I can't tell that any have been removed there! When she worked on my cheeks it was a TOTALLY different story, she did a thinning session first (1 hour each side) then a more intense session of clearing (2 hours per side over 2 days) and wow! what a difference, so yes, chin and upper lip are very dense so keep the faith! They will go eventually but it will take time.

V x
Came out to self: mid Oct 17                   Last haircut: 3rd Nov 17       
Came out to wife: 17th Jan 18                 Therapy started: 1st Mar 18
Electrolysis started: 10th Apr 18              Referred to GIC: 16th May 18
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Virginia

My electrologist has removed well over a dozen women's and mens beards. She was clear going in the average treatment time is 500 hours.

I was 49 and had a full medium brown beard with alot of red and blonde hair. I kept my Van Dyke so it only took 20 full face laser sessions and 340 hours of blend electrolysis (included cleaning up my eyebrows into a more gender neutral shape). My electrologist goes for a natural look and leaves the fine vellum hair, so you don't wind up looking like you just shaved.

There's a long way to go after that first clearing. You have no way of knowing if a hair is at the right point in its growth cycle for the procedure to be effective. And the body likes its hair. Eight years later there is a bugger along side my nostril and one on my neck that refuse to die. Shrug. I go in for a 15 minute maintenance session once or twice year and to catch up with my electrologist.

As an aside-
Meladine is a product sold to increase the effectiveness of laser hair removal. I used two full bottles of the stuff and the only thing it did was cause ingrown hairs and infected pustules.
.
~VA (pronounced Vee- Aye, the abbreviation for the State of Virginia where I live)
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Miss Clara

My first volume facial hair removal took 32 hours over two days to clear my entire face and neck using thermolysis (Flash electrolysis).  The densest hair was on my chin, and to this day I wish I hadn't allowed my electrologist to attempt to clear every hair on my chin because it damaged my skin.  I went on to complete 230 hours of electrolysis, both Flash and Blend modalities.  Blend is far less damaging, but takes 10 times as long to clear a section of hair which translates to much higher cost.  At $100/hour, electrolysis could be your most expensive feminization procedure, it all depends on how thick, widespread, and stubborn your beard is.  I know of some girls who got rid of their facial hair with just 6 laser treatments.  Unfortunately, laser doesn't work on blond, red, or gray hair.  Even light brown is questionable.  Keep in mind also that as you age your skin retains less moisture which makes electrolysis less effective.  It pays to keep hydrated and to moisturize your skin religiously to improve the effectiveness of electrolysis.

What you are trying to do is get rid of terminal (male) hair.  Hair grows from one of many germ cells in the follicle.  If there's a blood supply present at the follicle, another hair will grow from a germ cell to replace the one that was killed.  The new hair is often finer and shallower rooted than the terminal hair, but if left alone can grow to be a thick terminal hair, and have to be retreated. 

It's important to be hormonally female to keep these fine hairs fine and short (villus hair).  Going off your hormones and letting your T levels rise is going to encourage terminal hair growth. Those villus hairs will go terminal if there's enough T in the blood supply.   After all those hours of electrolysis, my face is still covered with fine, short, white hairs.  I call them my female hairs because they don't develop into the terminal hairs that men have.  Some do, however, and have to be retreated.  I just pluck them out.  I can't stand the idea of shaving my face.

BTW, three fractional CO2 laser skin resurfacing treatments and one dermabrasion did not correct the skin damage from overly aggressive flash electrolysis of the dense hair on my chin.  Among my trans women friends, the problem of skin damage from electrolysis, especially among older women, is quite common, so be careful.  A person with a trained eye will recognize the scarring and peg you as trans.

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Virginia

Extremely informative post, Clara Kay, thank you.

Quote from: Clara Kay on August 22, 2018, 04:48:42 PM
the problem of skin damage from electrolysis, especially among older women, is quite common, so be careful.

Another risk of electrolysis is damage to the pigmentation cells of the face. Pin head sized spots with no pigmentation leave the skin looking like "chicken skin." My electrologist explained the occurrence is unpredictable.
~VA (pronounced Vee- Aye, the abbreviation for the State of Virginia where I live)
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Kendra

At age 16 I had a full beard and looked old enough to buy beer for my friends.   
At age 51 I started thermo electrolysis with a very experienced electrologist. 
No damage, and the following year was the last time I had to shave.
I stopped wearing foundation.
Assigned male at birth 1963.  Decided I wanted to be a girl in 1971.  Laser 2014-16, electrolysis 2015-17, HRT 7/2017, GCS 1/2018, VFS 3/2018, FFS 5/2018, Labiaplasty & BA 7/2018. 
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Karen

Quote from: Kendra on August 24, 2018, 10:57:23 AM
At age 16 I had a full beard and looked old enough to buy beer for my friends.   
At age 51 I started thermo electrolysis with a very experienced electrologist. 
No damage, and the following year was the last time I had to shave.
I stopped wearing foundation.

Wow... that's awesome.   Whats about red bumps?   I did a couple of paths with my electrolist and ended up with red bumps that took a long time to get rid of.   Maybe it was the heat...??

Thanks

Karen
Karen

* felt different like I did not fit, with strong feminine feelings and gender questions my entire life
* Sept 2016 - January 2017 real began to seriously question and research gender
* August 2017 friend explains transgender and gender vs sexual orientation, and immediately felt shock and begin to believe I maybe transgender
* March 2018 after 3 therapists, accepts I am transgender and am transitioning
* July 18, 2018 began HRT
* Feb 4, 2019 began Estrogen
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Kendra

First half year was three two-hour sessions per week, then less often as my face cleared.  As predicted by my electrologist the first few months involved rough red skin, my face felt warm until I returned to my office (half hour drive).  I received some odd looks at work but nobody asked, and if I forgot about it fewer people seemed to notice.  It was a valuable way for me to learn how important our mind is.  If we know something is okay, other people don't notice as much.

After a half year my skin was less sensitive to the same amount of electrolysis.  After a full year I could walk into a coffee shop a few minutes after electrolysis and nobody noticed.

For those first challenging months my electrologist recommended diaper rash compound but I found a better solution was "Mom's Balm" made locally in Roslyn, Washington State - it's a clear ointment for applying after receiving a tattoo.  I found the tattoo salve/ointment soothing and almost invisible to wear - I would cake it on for the car trip, and then dab most of it off with a napkin before walking into the office so my face wouldn't be so glossy.
Assigned male at birth 1963.  Decided I wanted to be a girl in 1971.  Laser 2014-16, electrolysis 2015-17, HRT 7/2017, GCS 1/2018, VFS 3/2018, FFS 5/2018, Labiaplasty & BA 7/2018. 
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KathyLauren

Yikes, some of the numbers I'm seeing in this thread are scary!  My electrologist estimated 2 years at 1 hour per week.  That is like 100 hours total.  I am at a year and a half and seeing significant progress.  I am hoping that the 500 hours estimate is way too high.  I can see 150 hours being possible at the rate I am going.  Hopefully it is less.
2015-07-04 Awakening; 2015-11-15 Out to self; 2016-06-22 Out to wife; 2016-10-27 First time presenting in public; 2017-01-20 Started HRT!!; 2017-04-20 Out publicly; 2017-07-10 Legal name change; 2019-02-15 Approval for GRS; 2019-08-02 Official gender change; 2020-03-11 GRS; 2020-09-17 New birth certificate
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heather3791

So I actually went to my electrolysis today. I purposely went an extra day without shaving just to get a better idea of what is showing as cleared. I pointed out to her that we've spent 31 hours on my chin and was just curious as to how many more hours might be spent in this area. She smiled and said I had a few to go. Halfway through the treatment she apparently turned up the juice for the first time. I definitely felt it. The pain was more noticeable but not excruciating. (I had taken my normal 800 mg of Ibuprofen and applied some numbing cream before hand) When we were done she said you'll definitely want to put some ice on it. I looked in the mirror and I was pretty red and puffy. More than I've been since we started. But what I also noticed was a much larger smooth area. So I guess my initial comments about the 31 hours pissed her off or something:) But hey I'm cool with it if it speeds this process up. Just don't know why she didn't try this several sessions ago!
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JudiBlueEyes

Kathy, I am your age and had a light beard to start.  I have gotten 150 hours so far, over three years due to stoppage for vacations and surgery.  Every time I thought I was ahead of the curve, more reappeared.  I am seeing really strong progress now, but I won't predict how much more is needed as it seems to be a fools errand.  I never considered that i'd still be at it but who knows?  I'll just keep going until its over!  The light at the end of the tunnel is getting closer.  Hang in there!
Judi
But now old friends they're acting strange
They shake their heads, they say I've changed
Well something's lost, but something's gained
In living every day.
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Virginia

#14
Quote from: heather3791 on August 24, 2018, 06:57:48 PM
I guess my initial comments about the 31 hours pissed her off or something:)

I've learned alot laying on my electrologist's table for 340 hours; it's definitely NOT to a client's advantage to p!$$ her off. A slight variation in technique will cause a huge increase in pain and swelling, or could leave a person scarred for life. It's a simple matter to "forgot" to plug in the electrode cable. A person's session will not only be a waste of their money and time, but pulling out all the non treated hair will trigger the body to make MORE hair grow in the areas that were worked on.
~VA (pronounced Vee- Aye, the abbreviation for the State of Virginia where I live)
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heather3791

Quote from: Virginia on August 24, 2018, 08:58:34 PM
I've learned alot laying on my electrologist's table for 340 hours; it's definitely NOT to a client's advantage to p!$$ her off.

Lol. My electro lady is as sweet as pie. I was just joking about pissing her off:) But yes, I agree...don't mess with someone who has a lightning rod stuck in your face!
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Breeze 57

Had a session of electrolysis today and very happy with it.  I actually look forward to it everytime I go in as it makes me feel so much better about myself afterward.  It can sting, but the results are so worth it.  My session today was 90 minutes and that cleared my entire face (everything: neck, cheeks, chin, upper, and lower lip areas).  That's the quickest it has been done so far, hence my joy.  My electrologist has been trying a new technique the last 2 sessions.  Instead of one big blast per hair, she now does 3 pulses while going in and 3 pulses while going out.  I'm optimistic this method will produce a higher kill rate.  Hang in there everyone.  We will get through this.  One other thing I've been trying to take my mind off the pain: holding a frozen water bottle.  The cold in my hands serves as a distraction for my mind.  This is in addition to the topicals and the Advil.
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heather3791

Quote from: Breeze 57 on August 25, 2018, 05:41:15 PM
Had a session of electrolysis today and very happy with it.  I actually look forward to it everytime I go in as it makes me feel so much better about myself afterward.  It can sting, but the results are so worth it.  My session today was 90 minutes and that cleared my entire face (everything: neck, cheeks, chin, upper, and lower lip areas).  That's the quickest it has been done so far, hence my joy.  My electrologist has been trying a new technique the last 2 sessions.  Instead of one big blast per hair, she now does 3 pulses while going in and 3 pulses while going out.  I'm optimistic this method will produce a higher kill rate.  Hang in there everyone.  We will get through this.  One other thing I've been trying to take my mind off the pain: holding a frozen water bottle.  The cold in my hands serves as a distraction for my mind.  This is in addition to the topicals and the Advil.

Hey Breeze. You got me confused, interested, and amazed at the same time. How on earth did you get your entire face cleared in 90 minutes!? (It sounds like you're describing a laser treatment and not electrolysis.) How many hours have you completed in total? I've spent 30+ hours on my chin alone! Can you please elaborate a bit more? I'd love to know the recipe and the name of this new "3-pulse" technique your electrologist used. Thank you!
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Breeze 57

Heather:  First off, let me say, I think my electrologist is amazing and I feel fortunate to have her.  She is very innovative and has had clients from all over the world.  I started electrolysis at the very end of December 2017, so I've been at it for appr. 8 full months now.  At most I only do one time a week (I do weekends) and in total I probably have maybe 60 hours in.  I didn't keep an accurate hours count the first few months.  I know in the last 3 months I have a total of 6 hours her chair.  Admittedly, I've never had a full/thick beard, but it wasn't sparse either.  Probably a little less than average.  I've only done electrolysis, never had any laser treatments.  Everytime I go now it is a full clearing which I absolutely love.  I have to say, even my electrologist was happy she got completely done with me in 90 minutes.  I'm not sure her "techniques" have a name or if she just tries new things, but she tells me she tries to keep the hair guessing and varies her methods.  I think she is kind of experimenting to see if this is more effective.  This 3 in and 3 out method does take more time though so the number of hairs treated per hour will decrease.  And if she finds resistant hairs, she will treat them twice or sometimes even 3 times.  I don't know all the technicalities, but I know on the one pulse method, she used "chin 8" with a duration of a quarter of a second pulse.  With the 3-pulse method, I'm not sure of the intensity, but the duration per pulse is much shorter.  I know everytime she pushes the pedal, the machine gives 3 pulses.

Hope this helps.  I know she gives a lot of talks at electrology conferences, so I think she is pretty well known in that circle.   I know I read other gals experiences with facial hair removal and I feel so grateful. 
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Donna

Quote from: Karen on August 24, 2018, 11:06:09 AM
Wow... that's awesome.   Whats about red bumps?   I did a couple of paths with my electrolist and ended up with red bumps that took a long time to get rid of.   Maybe it was the heat...??

Thanks

Karen

Welts and red bumps were a problem my first session. Now I just take Benadryl before hand and don't get the histamine reaction any more. I'm getting great lip and chin clearance
December 2015 noticed strange feelings moving in
December 2016 started to understand what my body has been telling me all my life, started wearing a bra for comfort full time
Spiro and dutastricide 2017
Mid year 2017 Started dressing and going out shopping etc by myself
October T 14.8 / 456
Came out to my wife in December 2017
January 2018 dressing androgenes and still have face hair
Feb 2018 Dressing full time in female clothing out at work and to friends and family, clean shaven and make up
Living full time March 1 2018
March T 7.4 / 236
April 19th eligard injection, no more Testosterone
June 19th a brand new freshly trained HRT and transgender care doctor for me. Only a one day waiting list to become her patient 😍

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