Susan's Place Logo

News:

According to Google Analytics 25,259,719 users made visits accounting for 140,758,117 Pageviews since December 2006

Main Menu

A list of TS traits from my therapist

Started by Just Mandy, March 24, 2008, 03:41:35 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

taru

Quote from: Kate on March 26, 2008, 01:55:18 PM
I don't think that list is so bad. Most of it is just symptoms or manifestations of the shame and guilt that builds up in many of us from hiding the GID. We often become introverted, very watchful and paranoid of our behaviour and people's reactions, build lives and worlds in our heads since we can't exist in the REAL one, etc.

So it describes a "person with issues that make them introverted/depressed" + some feminine stereotypes?

Which does not help in precluding other psychiatric problems causing the person to think they have GID. Which is the reason psychs are required in getting official treatment. Thus it doesn't seem to help very much, and can be abused - there is a long history of trans people conforming to stereotypes to get treatment.
  •  

tekla

Having had one, and no longer wanting it is a different deal all together.  A lot of people get jobs they dream about, work to have, dream about having, only to find out that they are not exactly what they wanted - or they grew to become something else.  I know many people in what I do now who used to do other things, ranging from teaching college to being a CPA to working as a big time administrator at a federal agency.  An old professor friend of mine sold his house, bought a big-rig, hit the road and never looked back.  There are a lot of postings in other places today about the finding that more LA police officers died of suicide last year then in work related shootings.  Perhaps they too were wrong about what that job was really about. 
FIGHT APATHY!, or don't...
  •  

Lucy

Quote from: taru on March 26, 2008, 02:04:17 PM
Quote from: Kate on March 26, 2008, 01:55:18 PM
I don't think that list is so bad. Most of it is just symptoms or manifestations of the shame and guilt that builds up in many of us from hiding the GID. We often become introverted, very watchful and paranoid of our behaviour and people's reactions, build lives and worlds in our heads since we can't exist in the REAL one, etc.

So it describes a "person with issues that make them introverted/depressed" + some feminine stereotypes?

Which does not help in precluding other psychiatric problems causing the person to think they have GID. Which is the reason psychs are required in getting official treatment. Thus it doesn't seem to help very much, and can be abused - there is a long history of trans people conforming to stereotypes to get treatment.

Taru, I think you have a very valid point, I hope that lists like these arn't used by transpeople to get treatment. Every person should be assesed on there own merrits and not prejudged because they dont fit the norm for treatment. On the other hand as you say, people portraying certain traits just so that they stand better chances of moving forward at a quiker pace is just as wrong.
  •  

lady amarant

You know what folks, at the end of the day, if you feel you conform to some of the points on the list, you're probably right, and if you feel you don't then you are probably right too. Perhaps at some point in the past you would have fit and don't anymore, perhaps you never did. Ultimately each of us knows ourselves the best, as long as we can be honest with ourselves, and it is not for me, or for you to say that the list is invalid or not. For me, the list works, for you perhaps, it doesn't. Who cares...
  •  

RebeccaFog

Quote from: Kate on March 26, 2008, 01:55:18 PM
Quote from: tekla on March 26, 2008, 01:20:55 PM
jobs that require intense concentration and highly technical vocations are also jobs that tend to pay a lot more, so doesn't everyone want them?

I don't. I'd be seriously tempted if I was offered a clerical or supportive type of job, even for less money. I'm tired of the isolation and responsibility of my programming/tech position. A NASTY combination that worked for my previous self, but now I see how it's been just feeding my problems.

I don't think that list is so bad. Most of it is just symptoms or manifestations of the shame and guilt that builds up in many of us from hiding the GID. We often become introverted, very watchful and paranoid of our behaviour and people's reactions, build lives and worlds in our heads since we can't exist in the REAL one, etc.

~Kate~
that's how I feel too
  •  

Constance

Quote from: Kate on March 26, 2008, 01:55:18 PM
Quote from: tekla on March 26, 2008, 01:20:55 PM
jobs that require intense concentration and highly technical vocations are also jobs that tend to pay a lot more, so doesn't everyone want them?

I don't. I'd be seriously tempted if I was offered a clerical or supportive type of job, even for less money. I'm tired of the isolation and responsibility of my programming/tech position. A NASTY combination that worked for my previous self, but now I see how it's been just feeding my problems.
I'd have to agree with Kate. I do advanced tech support for a living, not because I like falling on the sword for engineering, QA, and sales, but because it's what I do and I have a family to provide for. If I could afford a lower-tech, lower paying job, I'd take it.

RebeccaFog

I'm in crappy I.T. too.


I will pay someone to kidnap my users and lose them all in the desert somewhere.
  •  

Just Mandy

QuoteYou know what folks, at the end of the day, if you feel you conform to some of the points on the list, you're probably right, and if you feel you don't then you are probably right too. Perhaps at some point in the past you would have fit and don't anymore, perhaps you never did. Ultimately each of us knows ourselves the best, as long as we can be honest with ourselves, and it is not for me, or for you to say that the list is invalid or not. For me, the list works, for you perhaps, it doesn't. Who cares...

That's the way I see it. Who cares, it's just a list, if it does not fit you then who cares? Some of us are just more
stereotypical TS than others, but it does not change anything, we are still all in this TS club together. We all
have to fight the same fights. I feel kinda bad for posting this list, I thought that since it applied to me everyone would
enjoy reading it. It was eye opening for me.

I'm here to learn from those who have gone before me and to give back and teach the ones that follow me. I'm not here to
start wars on who is more TS based on a stupid list. I love everyone here, I feel a lot closer to some of you than anyone I've
met in person since I share so much of your thoughts and experiences. Everyone here has helped me in so many ways the last
six or so months and even though I don't agree with all of you but I respect what you have to say. Sorry, I'm obviously a little
emotional these days and maybe take things too personally.

Something sleeps deep within us
hidden and growing until we awaken as ourselves.
  •  

lady amarant

I think the list was interesting Amanda, and I am glad you posted it!  ;)
  •  

Rachael

Quote from: AlwaysAmanda on March 26, 2008, 02:36:25 PM
QuoteYou know what folks, at the end of the day, if you feel you conform to some of the points on the list, you're probably right, and if you feel you don't then you are probably right too. Perhaps at some point in the past you would have fit and don't anymore, perhaps you never did. Ultimately each of us knows ourselves the best, as long as we can be honest with ourselves, and it is not for me, or for you to say that the list is invalid or not. For me, the list works, for you perhaps, it doesn't. Who cares...

That's the way I see it. Who cares, it's just a list, if it does not fit you then who cares? Some of us are just more
stereotypical TS than others, but it does not change anything, we are still all in this TS club together. We all
have to fight the same fights. I feel kinda bad for posting this list, I thought that since it applied to me everyone would
enjoy reading it. It was eye opening for me.

I'm here to learn from those who have gone before me and to give back and teach the ones that follow me. I'm not here to
start wars on who is more TS based on a stupid list. I love everyone here, I feel a lot closer to some of you than anyone I've
met in person since I share so much of your thoughts and experiences. Everyone here has helped me in so many ways the last
six or so months and even though I don't agree with all of you but I respect what you have to say. Sorry, I'm obviously a little
emotional these days and maybe take things too personally.
i dont believe your therapist has a list for a 'stereotypical' ts... if anything, that list helps compound some BAD stereotypes...

This is turning into another '->-bleeped-<-er than thou' pissing contest... like any other comparative thread..
R >:D
  •  

tekla

Lighten up.  Its more like "You Might Be a Redneck If...." for TS folks.  Look, anything that lists, "We excel in reading and writing at an early age" could have stopped upon proofreading posts on this board.   

Come on "We have an inability to discuss deep feelings with others" means every guy I've ever met, including the gay ones, is really TS. 

"We avoid pictures and videos of ourselves" - but a TS/CD/TG site without a photo gallery is like an airplane without wings.

Any time you seek to be inclusive, you fail at being exclusive, so one size fits all.
FIGHT APATHY!, or don't...
  •  

buttercup

I don't know about any of you, but every psychiatrist I have ever gone to, has given me a form with loads of questions and you have the tick the box that fits.  Forms are forms, just screw it up and throw it in the bin if its that upsetting!  They have to start somewhere.  And if you lie, well its on your head.
The psych can only get so far into your head as much as you will let him/her.  ::)
  •  

Rachael

Quote from: tekla on March 26, 2008, 06:40:48 PM
Lighten up.  Its more like "You Might Be a Redneck If...." for TS folks.  Look, anything that lists, "We excel in reading and writing at an early age" could have stopped upon proofreading posts on this board.   

im sorry, i forgot that transsexuality was a joke....
  •  

Sarah

I will answer for me on this.
I will give a yes a "1" point, a in between a ".5" point and a no a "0" point.
Quote from: AlwaysAmanda on March 24, 2008, 03:41:35 PM
We have a primarily cope with the condition by shutting down all emotions
No. Absolutely not.
QuoteWe have an inability to discuss deep feelings with others
No again. very innacurate.
QuoteWe are very insecure
No again. once again very much not accurate.
QuoteWe have very few, if any, close friends, prefers to spend time alone
Not,could be further from the truth.
QuoteWe exhibit extreme shyness at times
Not shyness. I need to get away from people, but I am not shy. by any means.
QuoteWe have a hatred of (and inattention to) our appearance
NO! Absolutely not. I have no hatred of my apprearance.
QuoteWe avoid pictures and videos of ourselves
No. *laugh* I like pictures of me. I avoid messy pictures of me! *laugh*, I like to look good!
QuoteWe often have inattention to health issues
No way. I would deal with things right away if something ame up. Rev. Master would probably kill me if I didn't take care of myself. I would too (figuratively!) :laugh:
QuoteWe have extreme modesty about our sexuality and partial and full nudity
No way. I'll give this a .5 for full nudity but not for modesty and not for extreme.
QuoteWe often take on dangerous jobs or activities
No.
QuoteWe often have well above average intelligence
Oh yes.
QuoteWe immerse ourselves in activities or jobs that require intense concentration and highly technical vocations.
Yeas, that's probably true. But intense concentration? I am a commercial artist. I guess some people would consider that intense.
QuoteWe are extremely competitive or extremely non-competitive with no middle ground
Wow. No middle ground. I aim for a middle ground.
QuoteWe are very imaginative daydreamers
.5 imaginative yes, daydreamer no.
QuoteWe display self destructive behavior
No. That's again another one. This sounds stereotypical to me.
QuoteWe possess a tolerance for others, very unlikely to be racist, homophobic etc.
That's true
QuoteWe are anti-war and anti death penalty
That's true as well.
QuoteWe have the need for more than usual privacy in our  lives
No, not really. I need time to work, and I take time to retreat, but not privacy.
Probably a little bit. .5
QuoteWe are very unlikely to fight or have a physical confrontation
No.
QuoteWe gave deep seated hatred of authority
No. Disrespect for the way some things are handled, yes. but hatred? no.
QuoteWe have on and off battles with clinical depression
NO WAY. I do not have this. WOW. WAY stereotypical.
QuoteWe are easily able to place people by the sounds of their voice
That's probably true. Interesting.
QuoteWe are able to easily read peoples emotions
That's true too.
QuoteWe excel in reading and writing at an early age but have difficulty with mathematics
.
Uhh. Maybe. I got an A in math. I found out I was dyslexic and that fixed everything.
Handled it accordingly. I love math. You will see that here.
QuoteWe often have suicidal thoughts, plans or attempts
NO F-ING WAY! OMG That is so typical of people to think that.


So.
Well lets tally up the score shall we?
15 absolute "no's"
4 "middle's"(.5)
and
6 "yes's."
So,
No's are zero, so we will only be adding the middle's and yes's.
.5 x 4= 2
2+6yes's= 8

The total number of questions is 25.
to get the average,we'll devide 8 by 25, which gives us .32

So, to get the percent of accuracy, we need to write this as a word problem.

.32 is {what} percent of 25?
In math, "is" means equals, and "of" means multiply.
So we will write this as:
.32= Q x 25
So to solve this we  would divide .32 by 25
which is .0128
we still need to convert that to a percent, so we will do that by moving the decimal over two places to the right.
which gives us 1.28 .

1.28% accuracy.

That's not so good.
That's not even an F.
That's like a J! :laugh:
If it was any more of that kind of accurate, it would be shooting itself! :laugh:

That's not really saying much for this list!
:laugh:
See you later!
Sara

  •  

cindybc

Hi, Amanda,

QuoteYou know what folks, at the end of the day, if you feel you conform to some of the points on the list, you're probably right, and if you feel you don't then you are probably right too. Perhaps at some point in the past you would have fit and don't anymore, perhaps you never did. Ultimately each of us knows ourselves the best, as long as we can be honest with ourselves, and it is not for me, or for you to say that the list is invalid or not. For me, the list works, for you perhaps, it doesn't. Who cares...

I quite agree with whoever the author of the above quote was. Well, to me the list was a remember when.

I remember reading such a list or one similar to this one 8 years ago when I was a member of Susan's way back then. I could identify with most of that list but have long since worked out the problems.  There are a few that still adhere even after the past 8 years. I personally think that a such a list could be used as a check-off list from when one began transitioning on up to the point where they are at now.

C'mon, girls, loosen up, it is only a guideline to help those who do not yet have any idea as to who they are, where their going and what should they look for to get to the final destination. 

Cindy
  •  

Berliegh

I think lists like that are damaging and I'm really not a big fan of stereotyping.....

The list as Rachael rightly pointed out could be compiled and aimed at anyone in the street, not just transsexuals......so you cannot use it as any form of guideline or check list...

  •  

Rachael

i made a statistic! 79% of all transsexuals wear clothes!
83% of all statistics are true dontcha know....
R >:D
  •  

taru

It seems like the opinions are geographically divided :-)

Most of the people that think that the list is a bad thing are from Europe, while the majority of people liking it are from the US.

Quote from: buttercup on March 26, 2008, 07:01:46 PM
I don't know about any of you, but every psychiatrist I have ever gone to, has given me a form with loads of questions and you have the tick the box that fits.  Forms are forms, just screw it up and throw it in the bin if its that upsetting!  They have to start somewhere.  And if you lie, well its on your head.
The psych can only get so far into your head as much as you will let him/her.  ::)

The problem is what happens if the psych does not think that the patient is TS. In countries with socialized medicine changing the psych is usually not possible - and that means no treatment from the official system unless the given psych thinks one fits into the box. Of course the psych is not required to have any real knowledge of GID before starting. Thus stereotypes are very dangerous.


  •  

Rachael

So people in the us are anti war and anti violence? give me a break :P
R >:D
  •  

Shana A

Quote from: Rachael on March 27, 2008, 07:01:26 AM
So people in the us are anti war and anti violence? give me a break :P
R >:D

Plenty of us are anti war... but as evidenced by a comment made by VP Dick Cheney earlier this week, the administration doesn't listen to what we're saying.

Z
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." Oscar Wilde


  •