Are you a man or not-female? Are you a woman or not-male?

[Nero]

Hello guys and dolls.
Lately, there's been a lot of discussion about genderqueer and androgynous people.
I know the transgender spectrum is very broad, but I always assumed that if a person identified as MTF, that meant she saw herself as a woman and vice versa for FTMs.
But now I'm confused. Can a person really be transsexual and not see themselves as members of the target sex?
Quotes from a certain self-identified FTM, a gender therapist active in the trans community:

"I am neither a man nor a woman."

"On forms and the like, I don't like to check 'male', I wish there was a box for 'not female'."

"It's not really possible to transition from one sex to the other."

"I didn't transition from female to male; I transitioned from female to not-female."

The FTM in question has had chest reconstruction and HRT. I don't know whether he's had lower surgery.
The guy has every right to describe himself as he sees fit. I'm not disputing that.
But if he's neither male nor female, wouldn't he technically be androgyne? Some androgynes modify their bodies.
Being that he's working with transpeople as a therapist, I don't appreciate these articles he writes.
He never makes it clear that other FTMs may not feel as he does. Granted, he does say, "I am neither male nor female.", but without any mention that this may not be the norm for other FTMs.
These articles seem to be presented as the "FTM experience."
As an FTM, I don't find these declarations of an FTM transitioning from female to not-female very uplifting or supportive.
I don't want to transition from female to not-female, I am a man!
Instead of:
"It's not really possible to transition from one sex to the other."

He needs to say - "It wasn't possible for me to transition from one sex to the other."

I am so glad that I didn't come across his site until after I had accepted myself as FTM.
Had his site been the first I'd visited while I was still questioning, I'd have been very depressed, and not very hopeful about my future as an FTM.
As a gender therapist who is also FTM, he should be more mindful of his words and their presentation, as they carry more weight than others'.

Your thoughts? If you are FTM, do you see yourself as a man or just not-female? For MTFs, are you a woman or just not-male?
Please no lectures. I said the not-female FTM in question has every right to call himself what he pleases.



Edit: I was relying on memory for the quotes. I looked again and what he actually said was ,"I don't believe it's possible to transition from one sex to the other."
At least he qualified it by saying it was a belief. But, how are his TS patients supposed to feel if their therapist doesn't believe it?

[cindianna_jones]

I am a eunuch. I know that.  I'm very happy that the world treats me as female, cause that's what I always wanted to be.

Cindi

[Dennis]

I'm still pretty early in transition. Socially I present as male and that is the important thing for me. I think because of the fact that I haven't had bottom surgery, I have trouble thinking of myself as "a man". I know it shouldn't get to me, but it does. I do think of myself as "male", and do more and more as time passes.

I've read that therapist's writings and thought they were interesting for that perspective. I guess everyone has his own perspective on that.

Dennis

[Mario]

,
As usual everyone has their own opinion of themselves. For me, I have always "felt" male and for many years and now have presented that way. Even though I have just had top surgery I can't even explain how just that alone makes me feel complete. All the extra facial hair now is a plus too So it is much of what the public perceives as to how we feel about ourselves. I think anyway.

I do agree with you on the guy's presentation. But you know it is just his on himself.  For me, I see myself as a man.

                                    Marco

[stephanie_craxford]

....

Your thoughts? If you are FTM, do you see yourself as a man or just not-female? For MTFs, are you a woman or just not-male?
Please no lectures. I said the not-female FTM in question has every right to call himself what he pleases.

I am a woman.  I was never a man, that was just a popular misconception

Steph

[taylor]

I transitioned social perception I remained myself. 

[LynnER]

Im not a guy, Ive nor have I ever been a guy..... though I did play one for real life........*Grins*

[Nero]

I think because of the fact that I haven't had bottom surgery, I have trouble thinking of myself as "a man". I know it shouldn't get to me, but it does.

Hey cabbage patch doll,

I can understand that. When you're constantly confronted with unwanted parts, it's hard. I think of myself as a man, but I sure have a hard time feeling manly when I'm in the shower and confronted with my breasts.
However, for some reason, I still feel manly with just my pants off. I guess I'm just so out there, that I think it's fine for a man to have what I have down there, but not okay for a man to have breasts. Go figure.
I think you're perfect the way you are, Dennis, but it's your body not mine.

[Buffy]

I am a better, nicer person than I was before...

I would describe myself as much happier fitting into a female role, life style (and expectations).

Physically, mentally and hormonally I am Female.....but my chromosomes will be forever male.

Damn those X's and Y's and that Deoxyribonucleic acid

Buffy

[Jillieann Rose]

I am a woman.  I was never a man, that was just a popular misconception 

Yap that me too.
Female even if this thing that I live in " this body" isn't.
I will beat my body and make it what it needs to be because I am the master and it is my slave.

Jillieann

[Jennifer72]

I now realize that I am a woman. I was just pretending to be something I'm not.

Jennifer

[Luc]

Regardless of my lack of excess testosterone, and a couple unwanted body parts, I'm a man. All man. I just wish everyone else could see me that way.

Rafe

[Nero]

Regardless of my lack of excess testosterone, and a couple unwanted body parts, I'm a man. All man. I just wish everyone else could see me that way.

Rafe

Well, at least we're on the same page with this one.

[jaded]

very well put rafe

[Melissa]

First of all, I'm a person.  Second a woman.  And third, if directly asked, I'm of the transsexual variety.

Melissa

[Louise]

 quoted an FTM in his post:

Edit: I was relying on memory for the quotes. I looked again and what he actually said was ,"I don't believe it's possible to transition from one sex to the other."
At least he qualified it by saying it was a belief. But, how are his TS patients supposed to feel if their therapist doesn't believe it?

Most of us would not agree with this, but it depends not only on what one means by "sex" but by "transition".  If this means that one cannot go from living as a man to living as a woman, or from living as a woman to living as a man, then it is patently false.  If it means that one cannot alter one's hormones and anatomy to make these more consistent with one's sense of self, then it is also obviously false.  But if it means that one cannot alter DNA and go from beiing XY to XX or vice versa, then it is obviously true.  It is also true that one cannot go from being a fully functional male to a fully functional female (one who can conceive and give birth) or from a fully functional female to a fully functional male (one who can impregnate a female through normal sexual intercourse).  With advances in surgical techniques and transplants this may someday be possible, but for the forseable future it is not.

When this person denies the possibility of transition he seems to be taking transiton and gender in the last of these senses.  This also seems to be the sense presupposed in such conservative religious and legal positions as denying transexuals the right to marry.  This identification of gender with reproductive function totally ignores the psychological experience of gender.  He needs to read Kate Bornstein.

[taylor]

Louise,

I would take it to mean that one cannot transtion from what they already are, even if society did not see them that way.  Look how Rafe puts it, and others too, your already what your desiring society to see you as, now you must transition the body to fit into societies standards of sex presentation and expectations of gender expression. To me it is about correcting social perceptions, not changing ones actual sex. Of course if one believes in genetic determinations ( I don't for the record) then I guess it could be viewed very differently.

Peace,

Taylor

[Casey]

I wasn't sure if you were looking for replies from just FTMs and MTFs or not, so I apologize if my reply is out of place.

First, I believe that it is exactly people like this gender therapist that Dave Barry had in mind when he quipped, "Experts. Sometimes you have to use them." I agree with you, this person should be very careful of the opinions they post on the Internet. But then again we wouldn't know not to refer ANYONE in the T* community to this person otherwise.

"Don't judge a book by its cover." That's something that we as a species are learning and passing on to the next generations. Unfortunately we haven't learned to do this for gender. I agree with the consensus, you already are what you are irrespective of what your body is or appears to be. I feel that in many ways the physical form of the body is unimportant. But then I'm coming from a different place than you are so YMMV.

/quote]
I wouldn't have thought so. It's that very mindset that told me I'm not transsexual. I could have saved myself years of self-esteem issues if I though this was the case.

/quote]
Not necessarily. There are a few identities that would work depending on how he sees himself.

[Sarah Louise]

I like Stephs' response, it pretty much sums up my feelings.

I do have to agree with the original question though, the broadness of the spectrum does sometimes confuse me.

Sarah L.

[veronica06]

at the moment?  this precise minute??/

still 100% pure U.S.D.A. American male.........

and very highly macho.

but my heart says I want to be female.