The Plus and Minus of HRT

[Virginia]

you are like the mirror situation of my spouse. S/he is a transitioning female androgyn.

It's nice to meet you, CynthiaLee. I have actually chitchatted with your spouse a few times on the Androgyne forum. We have alot in common!

[fastknight]

Two months tomorrow. Not very long, but whatev.

+ male hairline
+ breasts chest fat shrinking, I know they'll never all go away on their own, but still..makes showering a lot more bearable
+ voice dropping and starting to crack
+ grew a quarter inch
+ lots of "nervous male energy"!
+ drastic increase in upper arm muscle/strength
+ some fat redistribution (lost 10 pounds and beginnings of hollows in cheeks)
+ increased sexual interest
+ genital growth
+ before I came out and even before I got started on T, I was irritable, angry, aggressive, cold, mean and intolerant/insensitive to other people. Now, I'm calm, happy, friendly, easy-to-get-along with and I'm even gradually trying to let my sense of humor come out.

- fat redistributed to abs
- STUPIDLY painful menstruation - as if I didn't hate it enough
- sudden hot/cold flashes - guess it's my body temperature reconfiguring things out


Seriously, the stuff works wonders.

[Naturally Blonde]

Two months tomorrow. Not very long, but whatev.

+ male hairline
+ breasts chest fat shrinking, I know they'll never all go away on their own, but still..makes showering a lot more bearable
+ voice dropping and starting to crack
+ grew a quarter inch
+ lots of "nervous male energy"!
+ drastic increase in upper arm muscle/strength
+ some fat redistribution (lost 10 pounds and beginnings of hollows in cheeks)
+ increased sexual interest
+ genital growth
+ before I came out and even before I got started on T, I was irritable, angry, aggressive, cold, mean and intolerant/insensitive to other people. Now, I'm calm, happy, friendly, easy-to-get-along with and I'm even gradually trying to let my sense of humor come out.

- fat redistributed to abs
- STUPIDLY painful menstruation - as if I didn't hate it enough
- sudden hot/cold flashes - guess it's my body temperature reconfiguring things out


Seriously, the stuff works wonders.

Hormone therapy seems to work much better with Female to Male transsexuals than the other way around. Most of your plus's are of course minuses for male to females and those plus's are hard to eradicate. Especially male hairlines and male fat distribution in Male to Females which are dead give away signs in the passabitly stakes.

I've met quite a few female to males and on many occasions had no idea of their origins where as male to female in the main are very easy to spot.

[Naturally Blonde]

Yet their surgery can be best described as 'rudimentary'.

You could describe surgery from both genders as 'rudimentary'.

[Naturally Blonde]

Yes, FTMs get the best out of hormones.
But they also get a really ->-bleeped-<-ty deal when it comes to surgery.

Usually F to M's are far less detectable in the street and male to females are usually very detectable, even in a dark club. The male body shape is far easily recognised no matter if genital surgery has been facilitated. To actually get a female body shape is very hard for male to females.

[cynthialee]

is so jealous of vexing I wanna bug her eyes out....

No really omg you are sporting a nice figure. I would kill to look like that.

[Stella Blue]

Really? I haven't experienced that at all.
See following diagram (**WARNING! Image not safe for work!**):

http://www.noobtown.co.nz/body.jpg

You are very fortunate to have a great body shape!! Do you know of the best way to lose fat on the sides of the waist?? I have lost a decent amount of muscle and male body fat pre HRT but I can't get rid of of those love handles on the sides... besides those I am quite skinny and only about 125 lbs... though I am pretty short so the I'm not anorexic or anything at 125 lol... for about 5'2 I think that is a healthy weight.

[FairyGirl]

Do you know of the best way to lose fat on the sides of the waist?? I have lost a decent amount of muscle and male body fat pre HRT but I can't get rid of of those love handles on the sides... besides those I am quite skinny and only about 125 lbs... though I am pretty short so the I'm not anorexic or anything at 125 lol... for about 5'2 I think that is a healthy weight.

Being quite skinny might be part of the problem. Before HRT I lost over 60 pounds in 9 months, which put my BMI all the way down in the underweight range. Since then and while on HRT I have gained back about 12 pounds (5 kilos) because it was healthier, and when I did most of it went straight to my hips and breasts. The "love handles" I used to have migrated downward to blend into my upper hips and for the first time I actually had a real waist.

I have been told that you can't target specific areas for weight loss; that's not how it works. Typically you lose it in a "last on, first off" manner. Except in the case of HRT which does tend to add new weight back on into target gender appropriate places.

As for Naturally Blonde's comment which ƃuıxǝʌ replied to, that hasn't been my experience either.

[Stella Blue]

Yeah I've been running mostly, and situps to tighten up the belly haha. Its been taking off a decent amount of bulk from my body but I have a ways to go. Best I can do is be more consistent with it and keep eating healthy, so if I can't get rid of that area of fat then hopefully it will blend in eventually and won't bother me soo much (once I start hormones). I plan on putting a little bit of weight back on once I start hormones I just wanted to try and get rid of what I can in muscle and male body fat beforehand.

[placeholdername]

I managed to get rid of the love-handle type stuff before starting HRT, with a very simple exercise:

You stand straight, and then lean sideways with the opposite arm over your head (so if you lean left, put your right arm over your head).  But don't lean your head on your shoulder, keep your neck aligned with your spine.  If you do it right, you should feel the stretching right in the area where the 'love handle' is.

I did that once or twice a day for 1 minute on each side, and the small bit of 'love handle' that I had went away within a couple months.  It's not a big time investment, so you don't have much to lose .  I did it while waiting for food to heat up in the microwave...

[Stella Blue]

Haha maybe I should try that. I usually just stand there with my face to the microwave, hopelessly impatient, thinking maybe if I continue to gawk at the food it will somehow be done faster.   

[FairyGirl]

Yeah I've been running mostly, and situps to tighten up the belly haha. Its been taking off a decent amount of bulk from my body but I have a ways to go. Best I can do is be more consistent with it and keep eating healthy, so if I can't get rid of that area of fat then hopefully it will blend in eventually and won't bother me soo much (once I start hormones). I plan on putting a little bit of weight back on once I start hormones I just wanted to try and get rid of what I can in muscle and male body fat beforehand.

that's actually a good idea. It worked for me and for others who have mentioned losing weight before HRT as well.

Thanks for the tip Ketsy

[Naturally Blonde]

Really? I haven't experienced that at all.
See following diagram (**WARNING! Image not safe for work!**):

http://www.noobtown.co.nz/body.jpg

Who is in the diagram? and where is it taken from? from the picture's the body shapes look pretty good. Most of the TS's I've seen here in England, U.K don't have that kind of fat distribution.

[Naturally Blonde]

It's me; it was taken from...behind me.
I have that kind of fat distribution because I eat a lot of good fats and don't smoke or drink alcohol.

Very funny! I wish it was that easy. I've never smoked and I don't drink alchohol and I have a very good diet with plenty of fresh fruit and vegtables, fish and lean meat only.

You pics are good but you have to understand that no matter what diet or intake, not everyone can achieve the same fat distribution as yours which may be due to genetics and other factors but not just based on diet.

[Naturally Blonde]

I eat bags of potato chips cooked in oil, fatty curries, free-range chicken, fatty steaks, lots of steamed veges, very little fruit and a lot of carbs (noodles, bread, etc).
Sounds like you don't have enough ordinary fats in your diet.

And I think you need to understand the opposite; just because your results have been poor, doesn't mean everyone will end up like you.

That was the point I was making actually. That it varies from person to person and some get the right fat distribution and some don't, no matter what their diet. Now If I was on your diet of chips, high carbs and saturated fats my belly would be even bigger than it is now! and in the past I have tried to pig out on the foods you mention to see if I can put on weight in the right areas but it doesn't happen, and the weight went on in the wrong places far worse than it is now.

You could have 10 people on HRT and 5 might respond to it and adapt the right fat distribution and the other 5 might just get and increased male type fat distribution. Also age can sometimes come into it as well and the younger you are the more chance you might have of HRT working.

[Cindy]

I think both vexing an naturally blonde bring forward a very important point. Just because you manage to get on HRT does not mean it works for you. We seldom hear about the people who have suffered because HRT has been a  (physical?) let down. But it is very important to understand it.  If you think you are going to look like a play girl bunny, forget it. Not many women do, (and most don't want to thank Goddess) and most pics  are heavily air brushed. I realise this comment is different to what naturally blonde and vexing are talking about but it is the same old reality check. You don't always get what you want and it can be incredibly frustrating to take on this life and not get the out comes that some other people do.  I appreciate naturally blondes comments. It puts a lot of pain into perspective.

JMO
Cindy

[MillieB]

Whilst disappointment with results of HRT is a major issue, I can't help but think that it is one of those things that falls into the catagory of 'that's life!' because what are the alternatives? Not transition for fear of not passing or looking as good as you like? Well, I did just that and all it got me was a couple of decades of turmoil and feeling like an alien in my own body and a complete inability to form intimate relationships. My biggest fear is that I won't get the desired amount of muscle loss rather than body fat distribution,which is frankly a little odd for a genetic male as I store fat all over, incuding my breasts, at 38 I am really not expecting miricles from HRT and think that it will probably be more benificial to my head rather than my body. Whatever happens, I will try to work with what I've got and pass as well as I can and I'm really not ruling out surgery either.

I think that sometimes it is a very human thing to focus on the impossible and make that your ideal, I was talking about this with my therapist and she was saying that she thought that I would look great and pass well,but added, you're not going to be some six foot supermodel, I thought that the last thing in the world I would want to be was six feet tall and skinny, I'd like to be even shorter than I am (I'm 5' 6") with big hips and a small waist and a great big bum. The fact that my therapist is very petite and short probably explains why she sees being  six feet tall as an ideal.

HRT is a lottery for trans women at any age and the odds shift against you as you get older, we all know this,but until there is a better alternative, I'm just going to cross my fingers and try to stay positive. It could just be a total coincidence but out of the trans women that I know,the ones who have used the patches seem to get slightly better results than those who have taken oral estroegen tablets, does anyone know whether there is any fact in this?

[K8]

HRT is a lottery for trans women at any age and the odds shift against you as you get older.

When I first started transitioning, I would complain to my GG friends about various physical shortcomings of mine – shoulders too broad, whiskers, nose too big, no hips, [*fill in your favorite ones here*], etc.  Almost invariably they would say: "Oh yeah, I have the same problem" or "Oh my sister is like that" or some such.  I soon learned that we all have things we'd love to have better.

HRT has been pretty kind to me, considering I didn't start until I was 65.  I was afraid that it would have little effect on me, considering my age, but I count myself lucky because it has changed my body – just not as much as I would have liked.  The big thing for me is that it makes me feel wonderful.

- Kate

[Naturally Blonde]

HRT is a lottery for trans women at any age and the odds shift against you as you get older, we all know this,but until there is a better alternative, I'm just going to cross my fingers and try to stay positive. It could just be a total coincidence but out of the trans women that I know,the ones who have used the patches seem to get slightly better results than those who have taken oral estroegen tablets, does anyone know whether there is any fact in this?

You raise some interesting points Millie. I was on oral estrogen tablets for about 9 years and it wasn't working. I have been on patches for about a year and there are improvements. So my next attempt was going to be injectable HRT but it isn't lisenced in the U.K which is a shame, but implants are so I'm now going to see how I get on with those.

The problem with pills is that they get broken down so much by the digestive system that the effects are not as powerful as injections, implants or patches (in my opinion) which go more directly into the blood stream.

[TheOtherSide]

You raise some interesting points Millie. I was on oral estrogen tablets for about 9 years and it wasn't working. I have been on patches for about a year and there are improvements. So my next attempt was going to be injectable HRT but it isn't lisenced in the U.K which is a shame, but implants are so I'm now going to see how I get on with those.

The problem with pills is that they get broken down so much by the digestive system that the effects are not as powerful as injections, implants or patches (in my opinion) which go more directly into the blood stream.

injectable estrogen isn't licensed in the UK but testosterone is? That's strange