Some advice and/support

[Happylilbabygirl]

I'm not sure if I'm in the right place or not.

A few months ago, I found some women's panties under my boyfriend's side of the bed. At first, he made up a lie about them belonging to a relative that he moved some clothes for, were left in his car, and must have been in with his stuff. Even before then, I thought that they were his because I'd seen what looked like pink silky panties on him one time. I wanted him to tell me himself so I didn't tell him what I thought. He lied for awhile but I kept telling him that I didn't believe him. He finally broke down and asked "What do you want to hear... that I stole them from xx so that I could wear them?" I said yes and he was quite shocked.

Since then, he has become a little more comfortable and doesn't try to hide it so much anymore. I don't mind that he wears women's under clothing. He still gets embarrassed and says that he's going to throw it all away. Usually, I tell him not to because he likes it and there is nothing wrong with it. It's not something that turns me on but it doesn't turn me off. I get turned on when HE gets turned on whether it's due to silky panties or not. The one thing that I do have a problem with is that I've noticed a lot of my panties, pantyhose, slips, and other silky clothing are missing or ruined. Whenever I find something else missing, I get upset because they were mine. I didn't have many sexy/silky articles but what I did have, I liked. Anytime I mention this to him, he says that he's going to throw all of his panties away and never wear them again. I don't have a problem with him wearing them, I have a problem with him taking mine.

I guess I also have a few questions or concerns about this that I'd like answered. How can I make him more comfortable and able to open up to me more. He's getting better about the panties but not about other things, such as shaving his legs, enjoying anal penetration, and wearing other articles besides panties. I want him to be 100% comfortable with me. I believe that it's important for people to let themselves shine and not conform to mainstream. I guess I also worry that if he gets too comfortable that he'll realize (or tell me) that he's either gay or that he really wants to be a woman. While I'm okay with people who are gay, transgendered, transsexual, etc, I'm afraid of what that would mean for our relationship. I'll deal with it when and if it comes but it is a concern that I have now.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[erocse]

This sounds very familiar. It sounds like my wife and I twenty years ago. My wife had tried to get me to be more open and honest, but I sensed,  she may not have wanted to hear or deal with the truth at that time, or at least that is what I had convinced myself of. As it turns out , my wife was and is very understanding. I regret having been so secretive, for so long . We are now making up for lost time.

   So if you think you can handle whatever it is that he maybe holding back from telling you. then you need to have a talk with him.  If he is anything like how I was, it will be difficult, after years of hiding to come to terms with everything he has to deal with.

   Keep this in mind. If he is transgender he may not acknowledge that fact even to himself. simply asking him, "Do you wish you were born an girl?" or "do you want to become a girl? isn't the answer. He may need counseling. Also for him to suggest he is going to "get rid " of all his pretty things or purge himself is very common amongst transgender people during the course of there life.

  The most important thing to keep in mind is, this may just be all that it is. he may not be transgender at all. it may simply be a fetish or a personal interest of his.

  In any case, you need to get some pretty things just for him to wear. hopefully this will put an end to your missing things, etc. This is funny, for years my wife had the same problem with me. mind you we are l the same size, but I would still try to squeeze into her clothes. if at some point i ripped or tore a button . instead for confessing I would simply discard the garment. Now years later, if anything comes up missing, it is a joke between us. I alway jump in and say, "it wasn't me!!"  We laugh over it now.

  My wife is on this site as well, (Mrs Erocse) I am sure she will have some input here.

    Hugs, Roxy

[Robert Scott]

I agree with Erocse said ... get him some pretty girly things of his own.  You don't have to spend tons of money ... go to a thrift store .. go with him so it can appears as if he is buying them for you.  One of the things that made me feel more comfortable talking to my wife about being trans was the subtle hints she gave me -- buying me men's cologne, getting me men's underwear, men's jewelry -- it let me know she was okay with my masculine side and expressing it more.

[Happylilbabygirl]

Thank you both for your comments. I'll will go out and buy him some girly stuff. He'd actually probably like that even if he's a little embarrassed.

[Padma]

Or you could take him out to buy stuff he likes, and he could pretend it's for you if that made him more comfortable in the shops - but that way, it'd be him choosing it (which could be more challenging for him - and you - but also more empowering). And if he's got things he really likes, your clothes are safer - plus you get to enjoy the side-effects .

[Ruby]

Hi Happylilbabygirl,

Welcome to Susan's. I am a spouse here. It's nice to hear from you. Most of the members are one or another variety of trans, but they are happy to have us spouses around too. Your story is interesting. Here is my two cents for now.

Getting him some girly things seems like good advice to me, maybe anyway. I don't think he's ready to go shopping with you. I know, in the old days,  my partner (now fully transitioned male to female) was terrified to go in the lingerie department for many years. She just couldn't handle the shame of it.

It sounds like he is really struggling with internalized societal shame. The culture at large heaps mountains of shame on the subject of men in female clothing. It is conditioned into us as soon as we are born; genders are taken as very serious business. Remember taunts on the playground of boys being referred to as girls as a putdown? That stuff goes deep into us and is the stuff of shame. Shame is the fabric of the psyche that keeps people in the closet whether it is for homesexuality or transgenderedness. The closet means hiding whatever it is from society (including girlfriends, parents, etc) but also from oneself.

You sound like a very patient and kind hearted woman. You may be able to reassure him that other people do this. Other happy, productive, kind men like to wear women's garments and shave their legs. Have you come across Helen Boyd's books yet? The wife of a crossdresser writes about their experiences.

When you are talking with him about this, in your very compassionate way, the thing you should emphasize as extremely important to you is the value of truth. Hiding, stealing, not telling is very hurtful. It happens when someone is suffering in the shame department, but it can be healed as Roxy attests. You can convey to him that it is safe for him to tell you, I believe. Your coming here is testimony to the bravery in your heart to face the issues.

Keep talking. Communication is always the most important tool in any relationship. 

Hugs,
Ruby

[Cindy]

I think there has been very nice advice here.  Often the 'shame' that a crossdresser feels is overpowering. It can be a regression of their whole manhood. Something that I understand men have a terrible time trying to cope with. He may well be terrified that you may let slip his secret. and his life is ruined. I would take him out as others have said and buy him some sexy underwear. Keep assuring him it is OK. Get dressed together and enjoy each other. You may, not want to have sexual intercourse with a guy dressed in woman's finery, but there is nothing to stop having a great kiss and cuddle session. And work it out from there .

You do need to ask him, when he is comfortable with what his desire is. If he is happy being CD fine. BTW very few CD are gay, the very vast majority are heterosexual. They just like to occasionally wear female clothes. If he is TG then it may be a different story. You both may need to seek some sort of gender counselling. But can I say, most men who want to wear female clothing, particularly underwear, particularly sexy underwear, are probably CD and want to have a normal heterosexual life. 

At Susan's the equations are imbalanced as many of us are transgendered (and most of us hate that expression ). Most of the 'MtF's' peoples gender is female, we want and do change our sex organs to match our gender. (sorry for leaving the Guys out but the same thing in reverse).  I would be extremely surprised if any MtF got a 'sexual' thrill wearing our clothes. OK, I do take pleasure in looking nice, I like the whole get dolled up to go out with friends. I do like guys looking at me 'cos they are interested in me. I do love shopping for clothes that I like. And yes I do buy clothes that I havent worn 'cos they looked cute at the time. Typical. I also buy too many handbags, shoes, jewellery, you name it. Most Cd's have a different perspective to that. They do not identify as female. Even if they may have fantasies, that is what they are fantasies.

MtF TG people will happily walk into a surgery and say castrate me please. I'll even pay you for it.  CD,s would not.

Sorry I've probably been politically incorrect to virtually every group of my friends. But I hope it give you a perspective.

BTW you come over as a very charming, extremely intelligent and loving woman. He is a very lucky man. I hope he makes you a very lucky woman.

Cindy 

[Sandy]

Lilbabygirl:

There's a lot of good advice that others have given, so I don't need to expand upon it.

First off, thank you!  Thank you for accepting and understanding.  You have no idea how much of a difference an understanding partner makes in the lives of those like us under the transbrella.

He is obviously struggling with his deep seated guilt, even with your wholehearted acceptance, he still feels guilty and perverse.  Your patience will allow him to face his issues and come to accept that part of himself without guilt or fear.  Counselling would be very helpful, but again he would have to accept the need and go.  Buying him his own things will help him accept your faith and trust.  It might be better if you did it as a surprise initially.  He may still feel too embarrassed to go with you to pick out things for himself.

Whether he is a cross dresser or transsexual is something that only he can answer, and it sounds like he is currently too guilt ridden to face that just yet.  Again patience is the key.

Another thing you could do is have a "girls night".  Have him dress as he wishes and give him pointers on dress, deportment and makeup.  Your participation could help him feel less guilty.  And besides, it's fun!

Also, encourage him to come here, we do have a cross dressing group here and his participation would be welcome.  Also realize, if you have not already, he can't "turn into a transsexual" by interacting with other transsexuals anymore than he could catch "teh gay".  This is something that we are born with like our eye color and not changeable.  Additionally there are other sites that are more oriented to the CD/TV group and he might find more in common there.  Being able to talk with others can help him feel less lonely and isolated.

Welcome again and thank you again for your patience, acceptance, and love.

-Sandy

[Happylilbabygirl]

Thank you all for your thoughts, advice, and kind words. It is much appreciated.

I mentioned this site to him and he freaked out a little. He thought I came here because I didn't like it. When I told him that I came here to find out how to help him be more comfortable, I could tell he was relieved. I think that he's starting to trust and open up to me a little more. He revealed that he had bought a toy and had it hidden. I told him that I was okay with that and wanted to see it/ask questions but he froze up again. I think he is starting to realize that it's really okay with me but still has fears that it will be too much and I'll leave him (which isn't the case). Sometimes he will mention things, almost as if he was joking around and when I ask if he really does that or if he really has that, he says 'maybe'. He later told me that his 'maybe's' are his way of telling me things without actually admitting to them.

He is really ashamed and he thinks that people will think that he's gay. I'm trying to help him see what he is just fine the way that he is and that doesn't mean that he is gay, it just means that he likes wearing women's clothing. I'm a very patient and understanding person and I hope that he learns to trust me more and more as time goes on.

It's nice for me to have a place where I can talk about this because it's hard for me to talk to him because I'm afraid of saying something that will scare him more. I've noticed that I ask questions or want to talk about it, he resists a lot and wants to change it.

We don't have much money right now so we/I can't go shopping but I really can't wait to. I'm actually quite excited about it.

Thank you all for the advice, compliments, and your honesty.

[hland]

You know, in helping my husband transition from female to male, I had some similar fears about his sexual orientation and even the stability of our relationship. Would he want to date a "straight" women after his surgery, now that he could open up his options? Would he seek out other sexual relationships if his labido be too high for me to satisfy? Would he want to experiment with men? After talking to him about some of these things, I have just come to the conclusion that, like with any relationship, you have to just enjoy what you have, for the time you have it. Our relationship is wonderful now and we are both satisfied. If I spend all my time being paranoid, worrying, and unhappy I may miss some of the best moments we may have together! And if in the future he decides to seek out something different, I would be devastated, of course...but ultimately, I want him to be happy, too...and I also couldn't do a thing to change it. So, I guess sometimes you kind of just have to talk yourself down, remind yourself that you trust him and you love each other...and see where things take you. Hope it helps a little!

[cynthialee]

Wow this could have been written about me a few years ago...

You have gotten good input from the other members but I must warn you to carefuly consider weather it is safe to buy him stuff yet.
When I was with my x 'Pam' she bought me some nice frilly things and it set me off. I was worried that she saw me as a sissy, gay, or less than male. (well duh. lol) I never wore the stuff she gave me and I purged everything I owned that week.

Tread lightly and with care and consideration.
Regardless of weather your mate is a closeted transwoman or a closeted cross dresser the operative word here is closeted.

[hland]

One more thing! I would also like to commend you and compliment you for your openness to the entire idea that your boyfriend may be into cross dressing, etc. I think it is wonderful that you are so open and we need more people like you on our side! There is so much hate out there and if we band together to show the world that it's okay to love who you want regardless of their gender, sexual interests, sexual preferences, etc.! Thank you! And I hope to see you here more often.   

[Happylilbabygirl]

cynthialee, would you have been mad if you had talked about it first? I told my boyfriend last night that I couldn't wait for us to get some money so that we could go shopping. He thought that I was talking about getting sexy things for myself but I meant for both of us (I literally have almost nothing sexy left) and I told him that it would be for both of us. He hugged me without saying much. I figure if I tell him that I'd like to buy him something and at some point surprise him with something, he may like that.


hland, you hit on some of the concerns that I've had and you're right... I should just enjoy what I have now and not worry about what may happen in the future. I found that yesterday I was much happier and enjoyed the time that I had with my boyfriend after not focusing on the 'what ifs'.

Also, I agree that there needs to be more open-minded and accepting people out there. Sometimes I don't understand why so many people have so much hate in them for people who are different from them. I'm usually the first one to speak up for groups of people being discriminated against or marginalized or disrespected in any way due to differences even though none of those differences necessarily apply to me.

I have this analogy that I use a lot that can be used in A LOT of situations. There is a big tree with 4 people standing on different sides of the tree. They all see some things that are similar about the tree but there are also some differences. The person on the north side sees a big knot in the bark and some moss. The person on the south sees a big hole with a squirrel in it. The person on the west sees a line of ants crawling and a ladybug. And the person on the east sees  a big branch and some scratches in the bark. Imagine that there's a blind man who knows nothing of what I tree looks or feels like and each of these people want to try to tell him what a tree is. They can each tell only about what they see that is similar on all four sides. But that wouldn't give the blind man a complete picture of what a tree is. They can each tell only of the differences and disagree with each other about what a tree is and isn't. But that still wouldn't give the blind man a complete picture of the tree. They could all tell about the similarities and differences and still disagree on those differences and fight about which difference IS what a tree is. (I think that's how society is right now). Or they could all tell the blind man about the similarities and differences and learn from each other and the differences. The blind man wouldn't be the only one learning about the tree as a whole because so would all 4 of the other people.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that just because people are different from me, doesn't mean that I'm right or wrong for how I am and neither is anyone else. We are all right just being ourselves. And if we all took the time to talk and listen to others, even if they are extremely different from us, then we might learn a lot about people and the world itself. There would also be a lot less hate and a lot more love. I've found that the people that I choose to be in my life are usually people who have views, ideas, or habits that aren't mainstream. I like to learn about people who are different than me and I find those people to be more accepting, understanding, and pleasant to be around. So thank you all for being yourselves in all your differences.

[cynthialee]

If 'Pam' had a conversation with me about it prior to getting me stuff I would not have been as hostile I wager.

[Christy Edwards]

I think it tottally awesome how u r as a wife. My wife is very cool. I think it's family,friends and kids that concern her. So because of that I will take my time. I really want my wife to open up and try and learn more. Her getting on Susan's would help tremendously. She'll come around.
So, again, thank u for ur post...Great thread that so many can relate...
Hugs...Christy

[japple]

I'm a little different in that I told my wife on our first date but it still was difficult at times.

SHAME! He feels incredible shame.  Huge emotional pressure and guilt for being a freak, pervert, whatever.  It might be so deep and long he doesn't recognize it anymore.  He has a terrible fear of losing you.   The thing is, this stuff doesn't really go away. There is what we call a binge and purge cycle.  I threw all of my female clothes into a hole at 16, threw them into Lake Superior at 18..etc.  You get rid of it..sure that you're done for good..then it comes back.

There is a big part of him that he doesn't feel like you can know.  A secret.  This isn't good for your relationship.  It's not healthy to feel unknowable..or dishonest.

You're probably not going to make him feel comfortable in a normal way.  It might take extra effort from you.  He's going to be looking to you for disapproval, and the slightest sense of disapproval is going to outweigh any approval by 100. 

My wife, while totally cool with me crossdressing (I'm trans so it's a little different) put her foot down about not wearing her stuff.  She then took me shopping for my own stuff.  Even then she had to drag me from rack to rack, which was super frustrating for her because I didn't have fun with it.  Even though I looked like I didn't want to be there, I loved it.  We're crazy like that..

So you might need to be more than approving, you might need to be enthusiastic.

The other big thing you're going to deal with is that he probably doesn't know himself.  He will inevitably want to push this as far as he needs to go.  With your help it might be now.  Without it it might be when you're fifty..but it'll happen.  He might be transsexual but he also might just like panties.   It might take a long time for him to understand and for you to know the truth.

You might want to find him a therapist.  NOT because you want to fix him or think he's got a mental problem, but because you want him to have someone to be open with.   See if you can find a therapist with GBLT or trans experience.

My wife found my recent therapist.  I knew I wanted to go but didn't take the initiative after bad experiences with gender therapist in the past.  It's been amazing!

My wife was my rock.  I am a better person and better partner because of her help and encouragement.  She's straight, she doesn't get turned on by any of this, but she supports me and I have so much more comfortable free time to help around the house and live a more normal life.  I'm engaged with her on a deeper level.  I am knowable to her and we can love each other 100%.

Some things that were good for me and my relationship:
The Bruce Willis film "Breakfast of Champions" is not a good film but has a cross dressing character who's wife is cool with it.  At a moment where he feels guilty she says something about being happy with their active sex life and how most married people she knows are completely sexually dysfunctional and dishonest.

The film "She's a Boy I Knew" is a documentary which follows a transsexual's coming out and transition with her wife and ultimate happiness by everyone despite not so great outcomes.

There are a lot of books.

[Lacey Lynne]

You know, in helping my husband transition from female to male, I had some similar fears about his sexual orientation and even the stability of our relationship. Would he want to date a "straight" women after his surgery, now that he could open up his options? Would he seek out other sexual relationships if his labido be too high for me to satisfy? Would he want to experiment with men? After talking to him about some of these things, I have just come to the conclusion that, like with any relationship, you have to just enjoy what you have, for the time you have it. Our relationship is wonderful now and we are both satisfied. If I spend all my time being paranoid, worrying, and unhappy I may miss some of the best moments we may have together! And if in the future he decides to seek out something different, I would be devastated, of course...but ultimately, I want him to be happy, too...and I also couldn't do a thing to change it. So, I guess sometimes you kind of just have to talk yourself down, remind yourself that you trust him and you love each other...and see where things take you. Hope it helps a little!

God Bless You ... and all the other amazing significant others on this thread.  Wow!  I'm SOOO glad that it works out for some people.  Honestly. 

My case is the opposite extreme.  For 11+ years, I've not cuddled, kissed or been intimate with ANYBODY, and it's killing me.  Funny thing is that THIS is the one thing I've always REALLY wanted in life (an amazing relationship like some of you have) but, apparently, am NOT allowed to have by some seemingly supernatural force. 

Lastly, I'm 55 ... will probably remain nonop ... and am realistically too old to find anybody.  Who in the heck would want me?  Nobody.  Sorry, wallowing in self-pity.  I'll stop doing that now. 

Anyway, look:

Rock on!  Some of you have anazing partners and awesome relationships!  GOOD!  Heaven knows, it is the best that life has to offer.   Cherish it.  Not everybody gets it. 

Peace & Happiness

   Lacey Lynne