Does it honestly matter whether you pass as your gender or not?

[MarinaM]

And..... You guys are afraid of me?

No! I'm a big girl. 

[Janet_Girl]

Crash,

Many here feel that you are an upsetting force.  We are a touchy bunch, because every time we turn around, people ( cis people ) are trying to tell us we are nuts. That we should be given any treatment that will 'cure' us.

We don't need to be cured, except for the hormone treatments and surgeries.   You, my friend, are coming across as one of those people.  We are here to support each other.

If you can not be supportive and keep being an upsetting person, we will ask you to leave.  We do not need some one who is antagonistic.

[-CRaSH-]

Crash,

Many here feel that you are an upsetting force.  We are a touchy bunch, because every time we turn around, people ( cis people ) are trying to tell us we are nuts. That we should be given any treatment that will 'cure' us.

We don't need to be cured, except for the hormone treatments and surgeries.   You, my friend, are coming across as one of those people.  We are here to support each other.

If you can not be supportive and keep being an upsetting person, we will ask you to leave.  We do not need some one who is antagonistic.

I never once said that you guys n' gals need to be "cured", or are a problem.
Never.

[-CRaSH-]

I just had a conversation with a man who had no idea... For the first time ever I didn't disclose, and he was pleasant. Just another person.

Not my type, but nice nonetheless. If he sneaks around my facebook long enough he will figure it out. This will prove to be an interesting experiment.

Yeah, not all CIS's are inately violent towards T's. I guess you guys are just afraid of what could happen.
Kind of like being a passenger on an airplane. You're probably not going to crash, you just fear the possibility.

Though I'm curious. What was different about this guy, that made you not want to disclose?

[Janet_Girl]

No you did not, but your attitude does.  Every time you seem to make it all about you.  Please alter the way you interact.

And any fear we have is based in fact.  Every year we read off the names of those who have died, usually at the hand of another.

Too better understand this, look back at the civil right movement.  Many African-Americans did at the hand of another.

[-CRaSH-]

No! I'm a big girl. 

, well you're probably one of the few around here that doesn't have a negative view of me.

So I get where that comes from .

[MarinaM]

Yeah, not all CIS's are inately violent towards T's. I guess you guys are just afraid of what could happen.
Kind of like being a passenger on an airplane. You're probably not going to crash, you just fear the possibility.

Though I'm curious. What was different about this guy, that made you not want to disclose?

I try not to do negative. I try to disarm others because I will not fight, not normally'
This is a fluid thing, especially early on, and I have to try tol approach it from every angle.
I don't know, I guess I just wanted to try it so that I could see what it felt like. It feels good, but knowing he will find out somehow (I'm not hiding it) is a strange comfort. I don't want this to be the most important thing in my life forever. I just want to get through it and contribute to society like everyone else.

[-CRaSH-]

No you did not, but your attitude does.  Every time you seem to make it all about you.  Please alter the way you interact.

And any fear we have is based in fact.  Every year we read off the names of those who have died, usually at the hand of another.

Too better understand this, look back at the civil right movement.  Many African-Americans did at the hand of another.

I understand that, but as i've said before I would not get violent if I found out that my GF is a T. Im not like many other CIS's.

And the only time that I make things about me is when I'm trying to give a CIS point of view, seeing that there are very few CIS's around here, I think that it brings a fresh perspective.

It also seems like a few of you dislike me just for being a CIS, I even got a personal message from one user implying that I should leave for not being "one of you".

[Suzy]

ahemmm...........

I have watched this with fascination.  It seems obvious to me that Crash will just never get it no matter how much you explain this to him, though I don't see him as particularly harmful either.  You do know, I hope, that as long as you continue to bait him he will continue to rile you.

I, for one, am convinced that there are some things that can really only be learned by experiencing them.  There are parts of this journey I never would have believed before I started on it.  I bet you could say the same thing.  And there are parts of other journeys I personally know nothing about.  For many of those I am thankful.

The key, however, is respect.  When we share what some of this is like with those for whom it is outside of their own experience, we should at least be granted that fundamental respect.  And we should grant it to others.  That is what seems to be lacking here. 

The whole issue of "passing" or not is a very personal one.  And yes, I detest that term.  I never feel as if I am out to deceive anyone.  In the final analysis, is there a right answer?  Of course not.  We find our own ways to survive this.  For me it is quite important.  For others, not all all.  So be it.  Perhaps we could learn from one another instead of taking pot shots.

[-CRaSH-]

I try not to do negative. I try to disarm others because I will not fight, not normally'
This is a fluid thing, especially early on, and I have to try tol approach it from every angle.
I don't know, I guess I just wanted to try it so that I could see what it felt like. It feels good, but knowing he will find out somehow (I'm not hiding it) is a strange comfort. I don't want this to be the most important thing in my life forever. I just want to get through it and contribute to society like everyone else.

When you say "I wanted to try it".

What do you mean? A relationship? Or sex? Or some other form of intimancy?

[-CRaSH-]

ahemmm...........

I have watched this with fascination.  It seems obvious to me that Crash will just never get it no matter how much you explain this to him, though I don't see him as particularly harmful either.  You do know, I hope, that as long as you continue to bait him he will continue to rile you.

I, for one, am convinced that there are some things that can really only be learned by experiencing them.  There are parts of this journey I never would have believed before I started on it.  I bet you could say the same thing.  And there are parts of other journeys I personally know nothing about.  For many of those I am thankful.

The key, however, is respect.  When we share what some of this is like with those for whom it is outside of their own experience, we should at least be granted that fundamental respect.  And we should grant it to others.  That is what seems to be lacking here. 

The whole issue of "passing" or not is a very personal one.  And yes, I detest that term.  I never feel as if I am out to deceive anyone.  In the final analysis, is there a right answer?  Of course not.  We find our own ways to survive this.  For me it is quite important.  For others, not all all.  So be it.  Perhaps we could learn from one another instead of taking pot shots.

What do you mean "bait him"? I'm not a troll. And I'm not taking shots at any of you.

Although some of you tend to react rather aggressively towards my posts.

[Sarah Louise]

Ok, the topic of this thread is "Does it honestly matter whether you pass as your gender or not?"

Lets get back to it and ease up on the person attacks.

[MarinaM]

When you say "I wanted to try it".

What do you mean? A relationship? Or sex? Or some other form of intimancy?

Simple interaction as just another girl. After all, that is pretty much how I identify. As for now, Crash, I will be bowing out of this conversation

[-CRaSH-]

Simple interaction as just another girl. After all, that is pretty much how I identify. As for now, Crash, I will be bowing out of this conversation

Oh, but you might want to consider joining a dating website for T's and CIS's.
There are a few males out there that'll treat you like a girl regardless of your current situation.

[Sarah Louise]

Lets not go there Crash. 

We aren't a dating site. 

And that is not on topic.

[Del]

From the straight point of view I think it matters a little.

While at work I have seen some customers come in that appeared to be transgender. In my ignorance I could not tell if they were pre-op or post-op of any given sex.

That may seem trifle but it gave me a 50/50 chance of getting it right. If I did they would be overjoyed I reckon but if not they could go to management and my job would be history.

For this reason I would just smile, say an in general howdy if I thought they were male and hello young lady if I thought they were a female and just hi if the mix was too close to call. It would have been easier if they passed. But I will not laugh at, talk about or make snide remarks about those who either do not or are borderline.

Hope that helps from a straight view.

[-CRaSH-]

From the straight point of view I think it matters a little.

While at work I have seen some customers come in that appeared to be transgender. In my ignorance I could not tell if they were pre-op or post-op of any given sex.

That may seem trifle but it gave me a 50/50 chance of getting it right. If I did they would be overjoyed I reckon but if not they could go to management and my job would be history.

For this reason I would just smile, say an in general howdy if I thought they were male and hello young lady if I thought they were a female and just hi if the mix was too close to call. It would have been easier if they passed. But I will not laugh at, talk about or make snide remarks about those who either do not or are borderline.

Hope that helps from a straight view.

What was your job?

[Sandy]

In the interest of not hijacking this thread any longer and perhaps having a civil discussion about our similarities and differences, might I suggest, CRaSH, that you start a thread of your own and we can continue the discussion there?

I will make no further off topic remarks.

-Sandy

[-CRaSH-]

Are you refering to the differences between T's, CIS's?
You're not really clear concerning the topic of this thread that you are proposing that I create.

[Sarah Louise]

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,96557.msg706349.html#msg706349

Crash's thread.

Discuss what you want.