Hey Peoples!
Its been a bittersweet few months. I'm right now in a great relationship with a girl who I wouldn't trade for the world. Smart, unique, cute. On a sidenote, she's also trans. I'm also still tending to my eating disorder, but step by step, getting better. Kind of. I hit my lowest so far last month, and am not proud to say that saying that makes me feel quite good.
My question to you is: Its been asked a million and two times, but, this is, after all, a site based on gender, gender identity, gender presentation, so I'll just wing it. For a transboykidperson, I'm quite feminine in all and every ways, no doubting it anymore. For you older/younger masculine transguys, what are your opinions on the femme transmen? I've gotten "Fakes", "Confused Wannabes", etc, etc, I really do want to hear your truthful opinions! No one can say that within the trans community there isn't some hatred towards each other for self presentation, or discomfort.
Femme trans men are alright. No better or worse than anybody else.
There is a Tumblr for femme ftms. http://femneftm.tumblr.com (http://femneftm.tumblr.com)
Some pictures might be NSFW
Should we also have a threat asking what femenine transmen thinks of maculine transmen?
I'm not exactly the most masculine guy you'll ever meet, but yeah, I tend to find more stereotypically feminine men (cis or trans) more attractive. I can't imagine it making you any less of a man.
I am a somewhat masculine trans woman and I just love the more fem transguys.
Sorta like my exact opposite.
:)
I think it's perfectly fine as in some ways I definitely fall into that category. I like having stylish hair and it's definitely one of those things that make me feel more comfortable with myself so damn anyone who tells me I have to have a, "more masculine haircut in order to pass". I also like fashion and wear a lot of women's shoes and jackets (granted, most people can't tell if they're mens or womens because of the style) because I am a small dude and I wear what works, what makes me feel good and what makes me look good. To me, it's not about passing all the time anymore (when it does happen it's nice, I can't lie about that) it's about just being myself and being comfortable with myself.
Well as a feminine transman, I don't think any transperson should judge. (Or any Cisperson for that matter.) I act just like any other feminine dude, I'm described as "camp" and "well groomed" at college. To be honest it actually helps me pass. I've met transmen who are more camp then me and they don't bother me at all.
Although I do have ambitions of being a drag-queen some day :P
I dig them. ;D
i have nothing against fem trans guys as a whole (there are a few i cant stand). im a in the middle type guy by the way, im a kinda artsy straight guy.
Thanks for the link, Nygeel.
Lol tumblr always makes me feel so old and boring. xD
Quote from: Felix on November 13, 2011, 02:37:59 PM
Thanks for the link, Nygeel.
Lol tumblr always makes me feel so old and boring. xD
Might've gotten the URL wrong. ftms instead of ftm.
Right I saw that but it was pretty clearly a typo and I got where it was supposed to go.
It is making me reevaluate how girly I actually am. I'm nothing near most of the guys on that site. But then I'm not exactly macho either.
I love femme boys, though.
Quote from: Felix on November 13, 2011, 01:55:54 PM
I dig them. ;D
I see
got any plans for the week? :-*
:D
Why the hell should I care?
This looks just like another attempt to make others look bad. A transman is a transman, no matter their personality.
I'm a masculine type, but I don't really even think about whether or not people are masculine or feminine to be honest. So femme transguys are to me no different from femme cisguys, masculine ciswomen or masculine/femme transfolk, androgynes, intersex, etc.
Thank-you for all the great responses :D
I meant this no way in a negative way, I'm sorry for those of you who somehow took some odd ''offense'' to it? I was simply wondering, for in my experience, while most guys, trans or cis, don't really care, there are always a few who seem to have an issue, as if by stating I'm trans, and acting the way I do, I somehow taint others perspectives on transpersons as a whole. Sorry, but I truly meant no threat/insult?
I APPROVE.
The way I see it, if I don't want others to pass judgment on me, what right do I have to pass judgment on anyone else? What is right for me may not be right for anyone else, and I recognize that the inverse is true as well.
Quote from: Nygeel on November 13, 2011, 02:40:10 PM
Might've gotten the URL wrong. ftms instead of ftm.
Wait,I still can't get the link to work :(
With the correction to the URL: http://femmeftms.tumblr.com (http://femmeftms.tumblr.com)
Quote from: Nygeel on November 13, 2011, 07:24:58 PM
With the correction to the URL: http://femmeftms.tumblr.com (http://femmeftms.tumblr.com)
It's actually http://femmeftm.tumblr.com (http://femmeftm.tumblr.com) (ftm not ftms).
Anyway, thanks. I needed to look at something like that. It's good to see all the ways people identify and present themselves. Gives me ideas...
Quote from: cynthialee on November 13, 2011, 12:18:34 PM
I am a somewhat masculine trans woman and I just love the more fem transguys.
Sorta like my exact opposite.
:)
Same can be said for me - yet one caveat:
- So long the guy is fine just being who/how he is by his nature, not using some agro overcompensation to try and cover up his fem nature.
This of course ALSO applies to cis-guys.
Am to much 'male-natured' (fem-trans-dyke) myself, not to take on powerplay BS easily.
Yes, I've taken my E and run on ~ zero T too, he he
Axelle
Put one in my bed and ask me in the morning! >:-)
As long as they are a decent person, it's really a non-issue for me. I prefer to judge people by more than that. Personally I would probably find him more attractive than a masculine transman or cis-man.
I'm pretty goddamn femmey myself, when I'm confident enough to be. I'm in the process of growing my hair back out, though (finally).
Like someone already said, I'm not gonna judge anyone else who's trying to do the same damn thing I am.
QuoteFor you older/younger masculine transguys, what are your opinions on the femme transmen?
I don't relate, but that's no reason to form an opinion of them.
Be true to yourself and don't worry what anybody else thinks they need to think.
Femme FTM tumblr: http://femmeftm.tumblr.com/ (http://femmeftm.tumblr.com/)
Darrin I saw you on it! ;D
Also saw a couple guys I've seen around town doing queer stuff. :)
Quote from: Felix on November 14, 2011, 06:47:07 PM
Darrin I saw you on it! ;D
Also saw a couple guys I've seen around town doing queer stuff. :)
lol I'm pretty femme. I mean, I don't wear dresses like a lot of those dudes do (NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT!) I just don't identify as a masculine guy. I love photography and music. I'll just never be one of those guys who sits round drinking beer and watching football. Nothing wrong with that, I just don't. And I'm also not saying that beer and football is strictly manly. Just an example.
Quote from: Darrin on November 14, 2011, 06:53:55 PM
lol I'm pretty femme. I mean, I don't wear dresses like a lot of those dudes do (NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT!) I just don't identify as a masculine guy. I love photography and music. I'll just never be one of those guys who sits round drinking beer and watching football. Nothing wrong with that, I just don't. And I'm also not saying that beer and football is strictly manly. Just an example.
Your description is about where I'm at, and I feel roughly that way about it too. I'm a caveman compared to a lot of the guys on that site, but I'm a lot more feminine than most of the transmen I've met elsewhere.
And yes of course it's fine for anyone to express themselves anywhere on that spectrum.
I consider myself pretty masculine in interests and stuff. Other people might disagree, but whatever. But I have no problem with femme ftms. People have the right to express their gender however they want to. A lot of them look cute as a button too. :3
I am a very femme transboy. I like my girly pants sometimes, love my heeled boots, and love my jewelry. I think we rock. But then, I also really like seeing the masculine transguys too, my personality just isn't the traditional guy's personality.
I think that either way, just because we may like to dress in certain manners doesn't make us any less men. Just makes us different types of dude. Different strokes, and all that jazz.
Quote from: Ayden on November 14, 2011, 08:24:07 PM
I am a very femme transboy. I like my girly pants sometimes, love my heeled boots, and love my jewelry. I think we rock. But then, I also really like seeing the masculine transguys too, my personality just isn't the traditional guy's personality.
I think that either way, just because we may like to dress in certain manners doesn't make us any less men. Just makes us different types of dude. Different strokes, and all that jazz.
You know, I said earlier that I dig feminine transmen. I should point out that masculine transmen are also pretty hot. All kinds of guys can be pretty tasty and amazing.
This has nothing to do with this thread, but you have a great taste in music, Felix. Love your signature.
I think it is so cute (even feminine cismen is cute) I like it
My personal opinion is that it doesn't matter. You know what you want, and no one else can tell you what you want. I've always thought that gender roles were kinda stupid, myself. I lean towards being masculine in personality, but there are some feminine things I enjoy, and I'm not about to stop enjoying them just because people say only girls enjoy them. I also rather like androgynous clothing styles, as well as more masculine clothing styles. I'm not about to give either up to fit someone else's idea of how I should act or look.
So in summary, I've seen femme trans guys, and femme bio guys, and it doesn't strike me as being a big deal at all.
Heh, I'm kinda effeminate myself. I keep my hair long-ish and get called 'scene-boy' a lot. It was trying at first, being who I really am.
I'm not the froo-froo type of man by any means, but I suppose a lot of people mistake me for being an Emo or something like that because of how I look. 'Scrawny' kid with dark hair that has obviously seen a straightener, artsy with tattoos and piercings and all that and an affinity for black.
Like I said, it was difficult at first to just be 'me' and express the things I felt like expressing to the world. I think the notion that we 'should' be more masculine in an attempt to over-compensate is a mind-trap a lot of FTMs fall into. After the huge voice-drop, surgery and facial hair (though still would like more, please) I find it easier to just accept that part of me just isn't entirely masculine. Everything is a spectrum and gender (or gender identity) should not affect who we are at our core. We'll like what we like and (in a perfect world) we'll all present to the world what we feel comfortable presenting.
Now, I'm not a masculine transguy, at all, so maybe I shouldn't put in my two cents, but I will anyway. The fact of the matter is that I don't understand why femme transguys aren't more accepted in today's society (But I too get some pretty nasty comments about it, along the lines of, 'You act like a girl, so just be a girl!' and what not,) After all...cisguys can be femmine, and it's considered trendy for goodness sake! Just look at Johnny Depp >___O; No matter what you say, he's not very manly, but this is beside the point @____@;
Obviously, no, I see nothing wrong with girly transboys. I think we're awesome.
Quote from: Atreyu on November 17, 2011, 12:07:41 AM
I think the notion that we 'should' be more masculine in an attempt to over-compensate is a mind-trap a lot of FTMs fall into. After the huge voice-drop, surgery and facial hair (though still would like more, please) I find it easier to just accept that part of me just isn't entirely masculine. Everything is a spectrum and gender (or gender identity) should not affect who we are at our core. We'll like what we like and (in a perfect world) we'll all present to the world what we feel comfortable presenting.
^This.
I also find it impressive that most of the people who do just, "be themselves" have a much healthier outlook on a lot of things. It's finding that understanding that putting on an act can be detrimental that can be a hard step - because often you're also stepping outside of what a lot of people consider "normal" (ex: having tattoos, piercings, different hair, different clothes, etc.) or you are so wrapped up in what other people think of you that it becomes detrimental as well. This is not to say that everyone should all be the artsy, rocker, "not normal" person of course. It's just a matter of personal taste. If your personal taste really is dockers and a button up shirt, then rock that sh*t. But don't force yourself to present an appearance to the world when that's not what makes you comfortable or what you actually like (exception of course would be certain situations - business, weddings, etc. etc where it is perfectly ok to "dress up" or not be yourself for the situation).
Some bio guys are feminine so I don't really see how they are different.
Quote from: Darrin on November 15, 2011, 03:53:45 PM
This has nothing to do with this thread, but you have a great taste in music, Felix. Love your signature.
Lol I don't know man, Morrissey's a feminine enough guy that it's not too far off topic. :D
I deleted my original response to this because I didn't think it was satisfactory.
Femme trans men are fine; femme is just another variation of males. I hold them to the same standard as any other feminine man, and regard them as such.
But I also cannot relate to them.
I'm pretty feminine but usually I just call myself Androgynous instead. It has worried me about being a "true" FtM while still being somewhat femme. I think it's alright and as it was said before, it doesn't make you any less of a man
Gonna give my honest opinion... I don't see the point in transition if you just wanna be like your birth sex anyway. Other people can do what they want but for me, transition is about being able to be who I am and have that match my social presentation. Not about getting a new social presentation that will just confuse people even more once they learn who I am.
:)
Quote from: pretty on November 22, 2011, 07:05:00 PM
Gonna give my honest opinion... I don't see the point in transition if you just wanna be like your birth sex anyway. Other people can do what they want but for me, transition is about being able to be who I am and have that match my social presentation. Not about getting a new social presentation that will just confuse people even more once they learn who I am.
:)
I kind-of agree with this. I'm pretty femme myself and don't see the need or want to be a hyper masculine guy, but I don't understand the guys that wear the dresses, sparkly shoes and whatnot. I don't want to judge anyone. People can do as they wish and I wish them the best, but I just personally don't get it. I guess if you're andro or something, sure, but FTM? It confuses me.
I know everyone supposedly has a feminine side, but I can't think of any thing that's feminine about me. So I certainly don't know what it feels like to be a feminine trans man. I also don't think there is a right way to be a trans man, you just have to ID as a man. I understand that presentation and gender identity are different and that for a lot of reasons a trans man may still present in a feminine manner. I just don't understand why any man would be super feminine, since men and women have different brains. It just doesn't make sense to me.
I seriously doubt that ftm guys willing to wear dresses and heels represent a sizable portion of the population.
When I call myself "feminine," I mean to the extent that I like feathers and rainbows (though I dress in jeans and t-shirts or button ups), I giggle, I am totally cool with chickening out of certain risky activities, I'm skinny and soft and foolish, and I don't mind talking about feelings or vulnerability.
This is still far far more masculine than seems to be acceptable for a female-assigned person in our society. And yeah, ID'ing as male is pretty much the main thing it comes down to. I'm a guy.
I am tough and dirty and clever. I'm not sure what else. I'm still learning which qualities I'm supposed to have for people to accept me as male, and I kinda refuse to strive for the ones that don't suit me.
Quote from: Felix on November 22, 2011, 11:53:21 PM
I'm still learning which qualities I'm supposed to have for people to accept me as male, and I kinda refuse to strive for the ones that don't suit me.
I agree with this 100%.
I don't think it makes them any less of a man. If I have their respect they have mine. I wouldn't mind dating one either.
Quote from: aydan_boy on November 13, 2011, 09:34:10 AM
What are your opinions on the femme transmen?
They are men. That's a fact.
While I don't consider myself a feminine transman I find them to be just as male as any other male identified individual. I don't know any IRL so can't really add anything else.
So long they well balanced - which might be their prime challenge - its just fine.
I think the challenge is to look femme and then acting / overcompensating for it by being "über-male".
It will make live VERY difficult for any partner. YMMV...
Axélle
A guy is a guy, so to each their own. I have some things about me that are considered feminine or something like that, but why does that matter? I'm a guy at the end of the day, end of story bro. Having feminine mannerisms or style choices can lead to difficulty in passing, but if personal style is more important to that person, I don't really see a problem. Same goes for butch women. If there are tomboyish/butch/masculine cis women, then I don't see why trans women who like the same things should be treated any different. Some people just have their own style, and whatever works for them is fine by me.
Quote from: Mr.Rainey on November 22, 2011, 03:11:03 AM
Some bio guys are feminine so I don't really see how they are different.
Eggzachary. And as a strictly gay, 6 on the Kinsey scale man, I'm frequently attracted to feminine men. As long as they seem male to me, I often find them attractive whether they're cis or trans. I think some of the bigotry directed toward men with some traditionally feminine traits (and women with traditionally masculine traits) has its roots in sexism. Having some feminine traits can be a good thing and do not make one less of a man.
Quote from: dalebert on March 18, 2012, 03:56:59 PM
Eggzachary. And as a strictly gay, 6 on the Kinsey scale man, I'm frequently attracted to feminine men. As long as they seem male to me, I often find them attractive whether they're cis or trans. I think some of the bigotry directed toward men with some traditionally feminine traits (and women with traditionally masculine traits) has its roots in sexism. Having some feminine traits can be a good thing and do not make one less of a man.
Your hanging around helps me a lot. I've always had a lot of shame and dysphoria wrapped up in the idea that gay guys will always find me disgusting. Some of them have so far, and weren't kind in expressing it. I can't help who I am, though. I didn't decide to be this way.
We can't help who we're attracted to, but I don't understand why people
1) project their personal tastes onto everyone else.
I see this in spades with gay guys. For instance, there's this weird bears vs. twinks rivalry where if someone posts pics of twinkish guys in a gay forum, the guys into bears start all this ->-bleeped-<- about how they're not "real men" and imply if you're attracted to that you're not a real man either. I've seen it the other way around also. I've seen people say someone is downright ugly when they're clearly not. They just don't fit that person's tastes for whatever arbitrary reason.
2) are total dicks about it when they're not into someone.
Like the stuph above. I think it comes from insecurities, people who feel better about themselves by putting other people down.
It seems some combination of the above that causes guys to be dicks to trans guys or for some str8 guys to be dicks to trans women. Clearly there are people who are attracted to trans people but the dicks think they can speak for everyone else.
Quote from: pretty on November 22, 2011, 07:05:00 PM
Gonna give my honest opinion... I don't see the point in transition if you just wanna be like your birth sex anyway. Other people can do what they want but for me, transition is about being able to be who I am and have that match my social presentation. Not about getting a new social presentation that will just confuse people even more once they learn who I am.
:)
Quote from: Darrin on November 22, 2011, 07:20:22 PM
I kind-of agree with this. I'm pretty femme myself and don't see the need or want to be a hyper masculine guy, but I don't understand the guys that wear the dresses, sparkly shoes and whatnot. I don't want to judge anyone. People can do as they wish and I wish them the best, but I just personally don't get it. I guess if you're andro or something, sure, but FTM? It confuses me.
You'd think by now people would understand that sex and gender are two completely different things. A person can understand themselves as male while also having a feminine gender expression. That does not make them any less male than some macho guy. Btw, there are some transguys who thoroughly enjoy dressing up in drag while on T. Transition for them wasn't about clothing styles, but about making their bodies match their own understandings of their bodies. Not all transguys transition just so they don't have to wear a ->-bleeped-<-in' dress. As we should know by now, it's entirely possible to be a masculine woman so transition isn't necessary just so you don't have to wear feminine clothing. It's unfortunate that mentalities like this still present in the medical community make it harder for feminine transguys to gain access to hormones or surgery and causes pressure to fit into some cookie cutter binary.
As far as "my opinion" on feminine transguys. I have absolutely no problem with them. More power to them for being who they are in a world that likes to judge anyone who is "different."
I love this guy's channel.
Homosexuality and Vaginaphobia: How to Turn Down a Trans Guy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVk3IO45TE4#)
Quote from: dalebert on March 18, 2012, 11:07:46 PM
We can't help who we're attracted to, but I don't understand why people
1) project their personal tastes onto everyone else.
I see this in spades with gay guys. For instance, there's this weird bears vs. twinks rivalry where if someone posts pics of twinkish guys in a gay forum, the guys into bears start all this ->-bleeped-<- about how they're not "real men" and imply if you're attracted to that you're not a real man either. I've seen it the other way around also. I've seen people say someone is downright ugly when they're clearly not. They just don't fit that person's tastes for whatever arbitrary reason.
2) are total dicks about it when they're not into someone.
Like the stuph above. I think it comes from insecurities, people who feel better about themselves by putting other people down.
It seems some combination of the above that causes guys to be dicks to trans guys or for some str8 guys to be dicks to trans women. Clearly there are people who are attracted to trans people but the dicks think they can speak for everyone else.
Yeah I think part of my problem is that there are so few gay guys, and hetero boys are now off the table. When a gay guy rejects me by pointing out that they feel exactly the same way I do about how my body is built, that hurts. Also I've never actually pursued any gay guys, but have been preemptively informed that pursuit isn't welcome, even when it was the last thing on my mind. The meanness feels intentional, a step above mere lack of social skills.
I prayed all my life to wake up and like girls so I could fit in and be normal. I still do, and I'm ashamed of that. So when a gay guy is a dick to me it proves that I belong nowhere, that I really am a biological mistake and that's my most defining detail.
I do recognize that this is just baggage that I need to get over, not the fault of the people who push my buttons.