I know this is hardly a surprise, but the wife finally brought up separation and divorce last night. She has been supportive, but doesn't feel she can fully help me unless she "gets over our marriage" as she put it. This hurts so much as my feelings for her haven't changed. Her feelings for me definitely have changed. She thinks of me as female now and no longer can bring herself to be intimate with me. I could see this coming for awhile now as she has gotten increasingly more withdrawn. It looks like I am going to have to learn to make a life for myself without her. We have an 8 year old son and the idea of not being a daily part of his life is devastating.
:-( I'm so so sorry for you.
I am sorry for you. A breakup when it is not desired is rough.
Hugz
Sorry to hear that, unfortunately it does happen too often.
Unfortunately Melody, I have been in the same place. We even got to the point that we slept in separate rooms. I still care about my ex, but we are now on different paths.
If it comes, it will hurt. But it only lasts for a while. But if it doesn't happen, be grateful every day and never forget how blessed you are.
I pray it does not.
Melody, my heart goes out to you. I hope that you can at least have her as a good friend, if a divorce does happen. We have to look at both sides of this. She is losing the man she loves.
Hi Melody, My wife & I have been back and forth on this very thing for the past year or so. It is not pleasant, I know, but as Angela said she is loosing the man she married so it is natural for her to feel this way. Try to go slowly and be patient with her if you can.
Randi
I'm so sorry... that must be incredibly hard to deal with.
I keep hearing that it is a common result of the transitioning process, but the fore knowledge that it may happen must not be much comfort when it actually does happen.
-G
Sorry to hear that, Melody. I wish you the strength you need to overcome this difficult but temporary obstacle on your path.
Oh that is so hard honey, so sad.
Keep talking with her, if it happens then if you keep talking it will go smoother. It is possible to remain friends. Make sure you talk about what you want. There is no reason why you won't be able to see your son everyday. If that is what you want it is worth fighting for. It might be you still live in the same house for some time. On the bright side she does say she wants to help you still.
Me and my wife went for split custody, I have our kids half the week, but we remain in touch on the other days.
Thanks everyone. I came out to her in late July and she has been going back and forth ever since. I feel foolish because I knew this could happen, but we had been taking a wait and see approach and then the conversation last night blind sided me. It may not happen however I am thinking some time apart may give us thinking space. There really isn't much for me here in Texas. No friends or family besides my wife's side. I have family and friends in Florida that I am out to and who continue to actively support me. That may be a good place to set up shop temporarily or permanently if need be.
Quote from: Nicky on October 04, 2010, 03:48:14 PM
Oh that is so hard honey, so sad.
Keep talking with her, if it happens then if you keep talking it will go smoother. It is possible to remain friends. Make sure you talk about what you want. There is no reason why you won't be able to see your son everyday. If that is what you want it is worth fighting for. It might be you still live in the same house for some time. On the bright side she does say she wants to help you still.
Me and my wife went for split custody, I have our kids half the week, but we remain in touch on the other days.
Thanks Nicky, that is good advice. I think the wife and I will remain friends. We did see a therapist together and the therapist remarked on how we seem to have great communication and respect for each other. This may just be too big though.
I would love to have a similar arrangement as you have with your kids, but I don't know if I can build a life here. This is not the most open minded area of the country and not my favorite place. I gave up a good job and my own medical insurance so my wife could be near family. Maybe we could give it a go in the same household, but I don't know.
Melody, I'm so sorry. I wish I could give you a hug right now. I can only imagine how painful that must be. I can understand where she is coming from. If my partner had to transition into a female, I'd find it harder to stay physically/sexually attracted to them, since I'm simply not attracted to females, and I'm not interested in an intimate relationship with a female. But I don't think my love for them would change. It would be a complicated situation, as I imagine it is for you and her.
Again, I'm so sorry Melody. I wish I could give you a hug right now.
I am so sorry for you Melody, this happened to me at the start of my transition. I got an ultimatum, WHEN ARE YOU GOING. Broke my heart and three years later it still hurts. We are friends but I now live a long way, away from them now. I only see my children once a year. But I have made a new life, which I had to do or die so I guess I needed the break and the push, however hard it was, gave me the space to be who I am instead of the lie I was living.
Keep talking that's the best advice and respect on another. I always tried to put myself in their shoes and thought what if they had come to me and said they had wanted to transition. I new I would have been the same.
Stardust
Melody,i am so sorry for this,i can understand a little of what you are going through but i am one of the extremely lucky ones as i am still married and live with my wife,but things changed,we still sleep in the same bed ,but outside of hugging and peck type kisses,intimacy is out we are celibate and have been for 7 years now. We started out in our marriage as best friends and that is what we still are only i am a woman now and that is how she addresses me and treats me,but i found out early on to take my time(it took 5 years) and involved her in the process(it's worth a try) i learned so much from her it made it a whole lot easier(her main expression was a woman would not do that and was hearing in my sleep too) she finally stopped saying about a year after i was fully transitioned. I hope and pray you can work it out.
I can honestly say even when both spouses are bisexual and the transsexual is suported 100% the relationship is strained.
Even though Sevan and I both freely accept and suport eachothers transition it is hard and I worry about my relationship.
Transition is a serious chalenge to a relationship no matter the particulars of the relationship.
I personaly know what it is like watching from the sidelines as your spouse slowly aquires the traits of their opposit birth sex.
I went from makeing love with a woman to making love to an androgyne. Female skin to male skin. Female fat distribution replaced with muscles....
It is hard to stay when you are the spouse.
Feelings of lose, anger, and fear all poke their head up.
As a transwoman who started her transition 4 years into my marriage I worry. I know what it is like for me watching Sevan transition. I can only imagine ze has similar feelings about my transition. But knowing what GID is like helps me be ok with hir changes.
I can only imagine how hard it must be for a cisgender spouse who doesn't have GID.
Quote from: cynthialee on October 04, 2010, 05:31:13 PMI can only imagine how hard it must be for a cisgender spouse who doesn't have GID.
I think what must be especially hard is that the person in transition must necessarily be focused on their own needs for the most part, because it is such a long and difficult task. There are so many aspects to it. And then there's the small (and sometimes big) celebrations of each milestone and accomplishment, but how do you expect your partner to share that happiness with you when they're feeling like you're killing their spouse? I do think the situation is fraught with minefields, and almost guaranteed to lead to hurts on both sides, often serious. To hold a relationship together in "normal" times is hard - what we're asking for is on an altogether different order! Yet... I know in my own case, I so dearly love my wife, that it hurts me terribly to see the pain I'm causing her, yet I'm powerless to do otherwise. That is one of the main reasons I'm in therapy currently...
Hi there. I am saddened by what you are going through. There are no words that can make it all better, but know that I feel for you and am willing to talk any time you need it!!
Nicole
Quote from: cynthialee on October 04, 2010, 05:31:13 PM
I can only imagine how hard it must be for a cisgender spouse who doesn't have GID.
I am sorry but could someone please tell me what cisgender means? Thanks
Biological. or Non Trans.
Cisgender: Someone who associates and is comfortable with the gender they were assigned at birth.
Not transgender; identifying with the same social gender as most people with the same biological sex.
Aw. I'm so sorry. :( I've never been in a relationship at all, so I can't imagine what it's like, but your post does upset me. I'm so sorry. I hope things gets better for you.
Thanks again for the well wishes. Going to an emergency therapy session tomorrow, but I think we are headed to divorce. We talked some more tonight and she said she didn't want her and my son to stand in the way of my new life. That is noble, but I also know that she is concerned with how she is perceived by others and the impact on my son of seeing his dad turn into a woman. This would make her just another divorced woman and single mom. Easy for people to understand. I know I don't have the right because I am the one that brought this to our family, but I feel hurt, betrayed and angry. I feel like I am about to lose my home and my family.
Without sounding cold or uncaring, you may lose your home and you may be cut off from your wife and/or son, but you will not lose your family here.
But no matter what happens, don't disparate. You are about to embark on a new journey.
If it comes down to it, I hope you can still be part of your son's life.
I would hope that it all goes the way you wish it too.
The therapy is a good idea. Just remember you have as much right to your son as she does. There is no reason why they could not go with you if you left.
Quote from: Nicky on October 05, 2010, 01:18:04 AM
The therapy is a good idea. Just remember you have as much right to your son as she does. There is no reason why they could not go with you if you left.
She could especially since she could work anywhere as her job pays very well and is 100% telecommuter, but she has said she wouldn't go. I left my family and friends for her, but she won't do the same for me it seems.
I am sorry to hear this happening to you. I sort of understand what you are feeling. My ex-girlfriend told me this when she couldn't be with me anymore after I came out to her. She tried to love me for who I am but ultimately said she can not be with a woman. I was angry, depressed, and scared.But I made the mistake of never looking at the relationship from her perspective. I did talk to her afterwards. Still not going to be together but we are friends. I hope fir the best of the situation where you do get to see your son and remain friends with your wife.
Jennifer
Hi Melody,
As others have said it is a sad thing, but also from a relationship status not surprising. Ignoring the TG issue here look at the divorce issue. OK she ( and you) are very hurt at the moment. The pain is deep, she probably feels betrayed, she may well feel that her husband has had a long term affair with another woman; You.
You feel betrayed, a life that cannot be ignored finally has to be faced and the person you love cannot give you the support you wish.
Your son.
Children deserve caring and loving parents. There is a host of information that they do not need male / female models in parents. They need love and care. There is no evidence that effeminate males produce homosexual sons, there is no evidence that masculine females produce lesbian daughters. There is a host of evidence that same sex couples (of any gender) bring up healthy, happy children with ' norma' sexual orientations. There is, as evidenced on this web site, a truck load of people who had 'normal' male/female parents who loved their children and we are TG. My parents were so vanilla that would not understand this statement :laugh:.
So to my mind you need to discuss this. You are a biological parent of your son. He will not be deformed in anyway by your transition. Getting that message through to your wife is the problem. I live in Australia, a quite liberal country, and in a muli- cultural city. In this city, if I was in your situation the law would rule 50/50 in everything.
Not sure if this helps but get legal advice ASAP.
Cindy
Quote from: superkitty036 on October 04, 2010, 08:40:30 PM
I am sorry but could someone please tell me what cisgender means? Thanks
As others have said.
The expression came from geometry and is widely applied in protein chemistry; proteins are made from amino acids, and they can be produced with a right or a left orientation, essentially mirror images of each other. Nothing to do with right and wrong BTW, in our evolution, proteins require the correct orientation amino acids to interact with enzymes etc. You can produce drugs that have amino acid substitutions that will inactivate the metabolic process, useful in drugs for disease.
Cis and trans became a sort of code to explain for a mirror image of a person. I and many other women are uncomfortable with such terms. I'm not a trans anything, I regard myself as, and I am female. OK I do not have all the biological functions of all females but that in itself is an umbrella term. Not all of any sex or species have all the characteristics of that sex and species.
But we as a community use such expressions to help in our debates and clarify positions. That is fine, and can be helpful. But we do have to make sure that we do not insult people by using incorrect terminology.
Cindy.
Remember Rocky Horror Show?
It's just a jump to the, cis/trans why can't they tell me :-* :-* :-* :-*
Melody, I really feel for you. I will say that my wife and I will have a conversation in the very near future wherein I basically tell her that there is really very little doubt about me, and that every step I've taken so far only confirms it more clearly for me, and this is who I need to be. So far she's still clinging to hope that this isn't real. So that will, presumably make it more real for her. I'm also going to let her know I think I should tell the kids about it at this point also (subject to conversation with my therapist today). Obviously I don't really know how these conversations will go, but I can tell you I've put "Plan B" into place in case I should find myself suddenly asked to leave the house. I know where I'd go and what I'd do, and how I'd pay for it. That's a very unhappy exercise, but necessary I think.
And on the cis/trans thing: It's from Latin. A cisalpine Gaul would be on "this" side of the mountains, a transalpine Gaul would be on the "other" side of the mountains (the far side, lol...).
Here in my country, the number of divorce has been increasing linearly. Too many people divorce despite having their lovely children.
Fortunately or not, I believe my kids are the most important in my life time, and my wife also does. This agreement always keeps us from going for divorce. We both believe that kids without father or mother are so miserable whether they later become happy or not. We can clearly feel it from kids whose parents were divorced.
However, crossdressing or transgenerism has never been a facor in our thinking about divorce. My wife washes my thongs and bras, and I did not go for HRT although it was approved. I can say that my kids are more important than my transgender issues. Probably this is why I am often called crossdresser or transgender rather than tanssexual.
Barbie~~
Just a quick hug, Melody. Many of us have been in that same spot. No matter what anyone says, the truth is that it just hurts! Don't let you wife's sounding so noble bluff you either. She has already lost the one she signed on with. Sounds like she is thinking ahead of you, already doing some posturing in case of legal actions. Take care, sweetie and stay smart about what you do!
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffc01.deviantart.net%2Ffs10%2Fi%2F2006%2F084%2F9%2F5%2F_cheer_up_hug__by_darkmoon3636.gif&hash=7c6095f8ca928dd1b1352af1ee297138fe0f6989)
Kristi
Just to clarify, my wife believes I should be part of my son's life no matter what. She doesn't want to take him away from me. What she doesn't want is my son to be bullied because of his dad. She doesn't want this to affect his school performance or cause him additional pain. So it seems like I need to disappear for awhile. RLE will most likely be somewhere else.
Kristi, no I am not being taken in by her supposed nobility. She is simply acting scared.
My wife once said that she never intended to marry a woman. In retrospect, she was in panic.
Nowadays she understands and accepts whatever I do. I guess it is a serious crisis in your case, Melody. If both of you and your wife can have enough time to think over it, I guess your wife would overcome it, if you indeed want to be with your son and wife.
However, you seem to already think about possible divorce, as indicated in your introduction in this forum. Your feeling seems so strong than me, and I may not offer any good suggestion for you. What I can say is that you need to gain some time.
My wife sometimes used to say that kids with freak dad are still better than those without dad.
Barbie~~
I'm sorry Melody, I like many others who have replied went though this too. I was expecting it though, my spouse had been through a lot of stress...financial, her dad dying from kidney cancer, her mom decending into Alzheimers, and her husband turning into a woman.
But, we remain friends, she's even dating someone from her past, and I'm OK with it.
Be strong, and revel in your possibilities. It's OK to grieve too.
Came back from the therapist today and the wife and I had a long talk. Things didn't move much except that she allowed for the possibility of moving to wherever I am if I can set up a life there. She recognizes that I did it for her. Things are still stressful. We are civil and logical about it, but as my therapist mentioned today, we haven't just lost our spouses, we have lost our best friends. She can't emotionally support me in what I am doing because I am taking her husband away. It is a tough thing all around.
Quote from: Melody on October 05, 2010, 04:58:52 PMShe can't emotionally support me in what I am doing because I am taking her husband away. It is a tough thing all around.
{{{{{{{{Melody}}}}}}}} :'(
I had a therapy session today, too. We also talked about this topic. My difficult conversation is coming up sometime after this (long) weekend - it has to be delayed, because we'll have a houseful of family (my parents, her parents), but the therapist agreed that it's best all around if I let her know in no uncertain terms that I do plan to transition, and give her a chance to figure out what it means for us. So I do understand what you're going through. Please accept my biggest cyber-hugs, girl! Wish I could do more to comfort you...
Thanks Colleen. I do have my endo visit tomorrow morning with my HRT letter in hand from the therapist. It is so nice to read that letter and have it all spelled out that someone besides me thinks I have GID. Anyway, I can't believe that I might be getting a prescription tomorrow to start hormones. I am praying long and hard tonight that the blood tests check out. I really need to feel like I am doing something positive for me and that is a big step.
Quote from: Melody on October 05, 2010, 05:39:37 PMIt is so nice to read that letter and have it all spelled out that someone besides me thinks I have GID.
I know exactly what you mean. In my therapy session today, my therapist said (and I hadn't noticed) that she had been making out the receipts for payment in the name of Colleen, which wouldn't do me any good at income tax time (for claiming them as medical expenses). As she was making out the new receipt, she stopped, and was about to put "his" name on it, then she said "...no, I don't think I'm willing to put that name on here..." And I confirmed with her that she can indeed write the HRT letter when the time comes. And she will be more than willing to do so. She is really certain of my diagnosis. She said "I'm not legally allowed to
diagnose you with GID, but I know the requirements of the diagnosis, and there's no doubt. So yes, even though I'm not nearly at the HRT stage yet (I'm waiting for the formal assessment at CAMH, so I can get into their program and have my SRS covered by the gov't health system), I do know exactly what you mean...
Quote from: barbie on October 05, 2010, 08:26:08 AM
My wife sometimes used to say that kids with freak dad are still better than those without dad.
I like your wife's observation Barbie. Freak may be overkill and a bit harsh a term to many but in this case I understand and appreciate the point of view. Something is better than nothing in may ways.
-mS
It's so sad you have to live through this Melody. I really hope you will find the strength to deal with it. (I'm in a marriage myself that has turned into friendship-only, and the feeling I have for the future looks very similar to what you are experiencing now)
About your son and bullying, I tend to disagree you need to move away during RLE. My experience with two boys at school (and I'm the one bringing them and picking them up most of the time) is very different. The school has a big role to play here, by not tolerating any bullying. A child psychologist also told me that when you react to bullying immediately, and talk to the bully, this kind of behaviour would stop within a few weeks. Luckily my boys have not yet experienced any bullying so far.
Take care!
Quote from: mistressstevie on October 05, 2010, 09:52:29 PM
I like your wife's observation Barbie. Freak may be overkill and a bit harsh a term to many but in this case I understand and appreciate the point of view. Something is better than nothing in may ways.
-mS
Thanks mS for your comments on my post. I have been a little bit busy doing my routine jobs here since the weekend. Attending some conferences and writing some research proposals. Oh. I submiited my research proposal just ago, and am taking some rest.
Suprisingly or not, I observed that my transsexualism is not an issue any more.
I visited my previous work place while wearing hot pants as it was unusually warm. Some women said like "I heard that you moved for a new job, but you are still here. Oh. You are wearing hot pants! How are you?" No woman at my previous work place wears hot pants during their working hours. I repliked like "I am a visitor today!" Most of them seem to take my crossdressing as a matter of course.
At home when I was just about to leave for the airport, my little daughter suddenly came back home from her preschool with her mom. She immediately noticed my wearing bras, and tried to touch my chest several times. I ran away in the room. She is so much curious... She also mentioned my wearing lip gross. She said like "My dad looks like a woman. I wish that my dad becomes my mom as I want to wear lipstick..." My wife just smiles at my wearing a women's top.
After I arrived here, I phoned my home. All chats with my daughter and wife are just about everyday affairs. My daughter complained that her brother was playing too much computer game, not allowing her to watch an animation movie through the computer monitor. I warned my son that I will bring the computer to my house in the next time when I stop there. But my sons seem to know that actually I will never do that. My eldest son seems to know everything about my transsexualism, although he seldom says about it. His teachers used to say that he likes me better than my wife, because I understand him better. But, when I ask him whether he can live with me, he does not reply. I guess my wife is still better for him to live with. Anyway I guess I will get a new house, and my family will come here next year. For a while, I try to visit my home to see my family at least once per two weeks.
Anyway, whatever I wear, my sons and daughter seem to believe that I am a nice dad.
Barbie~~