Quote from: oZma on February 07, 2013, 07:37:58 PM
because she said liberty is not equal to doing what you want and in fact it is... as long as you don't hard others, or their property...

you proved her point right there, personal liberties are great until you step on the liberties of someone else, and for that we need people to hold you accountable for doing such a thing.

Quote from: Shawn Sunshine on February 07, 2013, 07:41:04 PM
you proved her point right there, personal liberties are great until you step on the liberties of someone else, and for that we need people to hold you accountable for doing such a thing.

so the act of buying a gun, without the consent of government, is harming someone? please

I'm not saying NO regulation, I'm talking about OVER regulation.  Example, the city I live in has an ordinance that you may not own a hand gun that can hold more then twelve rounds, however many hand guns come with a clip capable of holding fifteen, so in reality are three bullets going to make a difference? I mean let's get real, how much time and tax payer money was spent on arguing over three rounds? As far as a waiting period sure, run a background check that's reasonable.  However I think it's silly that one type of firearm there's no wait, while another is three days... I believe in Illinois a rifle you can buy with no wait but a hand gun you have to... Or maybe a shot gun there was no wait... Either way it's inconsistent, make it simple so that law abiding citizens have access yet criminals do not... Besides, if someone was truly set on murder a firearm is not the only way to go about it.  No matter what, if someone has ill intentions and have the will then they will find a way.  Most crimes of passion that you describe in your example are not premeditated and usually resources at hand are the first weapons of chance and opportunity used.  Any idea how many things in your home could be used to kill someone? Pretty much anything if used with enough force and rage.  Over all in GENERAL the average American is not going to commit a violent crime.  There will ALWAYS be the select few that stray from the norm and no amount of planning, law making or prevention will create a system that is 100% violence free.  As much as we try and cover it up with "humanity" we are all still animals pretending to be humans, and there are some that no matter what will just be savage beasts.

Quote from: DianaP on February 07, 2013, 07:56:51 PM
And when a dog acts badly, you punish it, making it so the dog won't misbehave again.

no, i don't punish her... i encourage good behavior and ignore her when she misbehaves.  ill tell her NO, but i won't punish her...

DianaP, it seems that you are under the assumption that owning a gun lends a person the violence. And as far as some one going off the handle and trying to shoot a cheating spouse, it's hard to hit a moving target and in addition it is highly unlikely that someone picking up a gun off the shelf and attempting to use it for the first time will be able to land a shot let alone a kill shot.. How do I know.. Unfortunately though personal experience where someone tried to do the exact thing to member of my family who was cheating with their spouse... The way that ended was the assailant taking thief own life in the home with the weapon, trust me, not something you want to see.. Oh and what's that they lived in a state that required a background check and waiting period.. A lot of good that did.  So honestly the whole cheating spouse line holds zero weight with me because I've seen it p close.  As long as someone else's liberties are not being impeded there is no reason why someone shouldn't be able to own a firearm.  Oh and you can buy tanks and F-22 when they get decommissioned, he'll the given tent needs to pay off that national debt somehow! But the barrels are plugged and any sensitive equipment removed.. But heck who wouldn't want a tank... Take that winter snow and ice! Granted the gas mileage sucks.. Oh well trade offs... 

You can not buy functioning artillery, which a fully armed tank would be.  However depending on the company you own and with the proper licensing you can in fact have certain types of artillery.. Like avalanche patrols use  to shoot at potential avalanche prone areas ect..  But not the average Joe.  But if you own a ton of land, have the cash and want a tank to tear up your yard or plant turnips with then who cares, you can't drive it on the street, besides there have been more cases of people stealing tanks from armories and joy riding then people who actually bought them legally.  Which comes back to the point that criminals don't  care about laws...  A good person isn't going to go bad because of a gun.  A gun is a THING people make choices, I'd venture a guess that kitchen knives probably are used in more violent crimes then guns.. I'd love to continue the debate of a fruitless conversation, but it's past my bedtime... And what will I be dreaming of..  A truly free society where you have the right to live your life and own what you please as long as it doesn't step on your neighbors toes, or petunias for that matter.

"You can not buy functioning artillery" 

No, but you can make your own:



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Does it have to be a real gun?

Quote from: DianaP on February 07, 2013, 08:17:50 PM

what's stopping you from buying an F22 raptor jet armed with sidewinder missiles?

Description of Straw Man

The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of a position. This sort of "reasoning" has the following pattern:

Person A has position X.
Person B presents position Y (which is a distorted version of X).
Person B attacks position Y.
Therefore X is false/incorrect/flawed.

This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because attacking a distorted version of a position simply does not constitute an attack on the position itself.

Hmm, I wish I hadn't got busy at work.  I would have liked to finish the conversation I was having, but obv y'all have moved on from that lol.  Oh well..

Quote from: kkut on February 07, 2013, 10:09:21 PM
DianaP, you make incorrect assumptions (the strawman) and state them as your opposition's. You then attack it which is now easy to do. In order to be armed, you need the latest weapons??? That's a complete nonsequitur. If you truly feel you're more secure with a completely unarmed citizenry, you must polish up on your history.

thank you kkut... i really didn't want to respond to her again lol

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  "Why do you need to carry a GUN ?" to keep the peace on this thread 

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Because Chicks with Guns are Hot




Okay friends 

Time to take a break, take a breath and find something constructive to do with yourselves

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