(I have to admit, I do also get frustrated by the "deception" narrative. It's true in some cases, but *no one* should be deciding whether or not a partner should feel deceived except the person themselves. I don't, and like you, Tiger Lilly, I trust that my wife was not lying to me.)

I also should have clarified that I'm bisexual, so I was not "looking past" my orientation. I was fortunate enough that my sexual orientation already included women.

Quote from: Jeepgirl90 on May 23, 2013, 11:15:20 AM
Aren't you being a little harsh? In all honesty noone know the whole situation. Plus being Trans* has it own set of obstacles to overcome, Maybe things are a little more complicated than just straight up hiding a secret.

I do not want to derail the Tiger Lilly's thread, I have a habit of doing this. Honestly I do not feel that I was being harsh I was only giving my opinion, and you are correct none of us know the whole situation. If what the OP said is 100% true then her ex was already very close to not being able to deal with "it" anymore but there was another child brought into the relationship before she decided to tell Tiger Lilly. This is the thing that seems a bit unfair to me, but like you said none of us know the whole situation. Yes being Trans has its own problems, and Tiger Lilly's ex will probably have more trouble doing what she needs to do if she is living in a situation where she has to watch her begin new relationships with men especially if those men become hostile to her, or she feels they are not the best people to be around the children. These types of things could cause her to de-transition and make the whole situation worse!

Quote from: Jeepgirl90 on May 23, 2013, 11:15:20 AM
I think everyone here should know really, how hard it is to actually be trans* and to deal with it. Like was said earlier, It comes down to  transition or die alot of times, this is why we have the highest suicide rate out of any group, because it is so hard to deal with, and not everyone can deal with it. I know for me personally, I thought I could live as a guy for the rest of my life, thought I could control it, yet I was wrong, just like many of us are...

I agree with this, and I also tried really hard to live without transition. I was not implying that Tiger Lilly's ex should be made to feel bad about her need to transition, and I hope she does not take it that way.

Quote from: Jeepgirl90 on May 23, 2013, 11:15:20 AM
You pretty much turned a honest question from Tiger Lilly,, and turned it into an attack on her S.O. In fact, if her S.O. is a member here and saw your post how do you think she would actually react to it?

I don't understand how you can say I have attacked her S.O,? If you mean my comment "I have very little sympathy for any grown adult who marries and has children while knowingly concealing a secret that they know would end the marriage and subject their children to the trauma of a dysfunctional family."
well I think a better word would be "empathy" rather than sympathy. I cannot empathize with anyone who has GID and is able to conceal it from someone they love, I have only had two serious relationships in  my life & in both I was completely honest with my partners from very early on, though at one time I also did believe that I could deal with the problem without transition I was still upfront about it with my partner, we have been together for 13 years but I am sure that had I not been honest from the beginning and I dropped the bomb on them at some point years into the relationship there would have been very serious problems most likely resulting in the end of our relationship.

I did not turn this into an attack on her ex, and I hope if she reads my post she will see that. Their marriage is over (according to Tiger Lilly) so it is now an issue of how to best handle a difficult situation. I only wanted to point out that the children in the relationship are innocent in this situation and they have no say in what their parents decide to do, but they are the ones who often suffer the most (I hear the horror stories every day). I hope that both Tiger Lilly and her ex will try to do what is in the best interest of their children, if it is handled carefully both parents can have good relationships with their children while simultaneously having happiness in their own lives!

I am sorry it was taken as an attack, it was not my intention.

Quote from: Tiger Lilly on May 23, 2013, 02:27:56 PM
I appreciate your concerns and comments, trust me I do but I am going to have to disagree with them to an extent. 
Do I wish I never has been in this situation?...yes.  Do I wish that my husband could have been upfront with me in the beginning?....yes.  Would I have stayed having known of her gender dysphoria?....probably not.  I admit those fully.  However after making myself more knowledgeable on gender dysphoria I know that not every case is a clear case of deception.  And knowing my ex's family background I can understand where feeling would have been supressed and denied.  

I think a lot of what I wrote is coming out the wrong way, it is difficult to add emotion to text! I do not know what your ex's background was like so you are correct about this possibly being responsible for her trying to suppress her problems, I also did not come from a very accepting family or part of the country, so I can empathize with this point.

Quote from: Tiger Lilly on May 23, 2013, 02:27:56 PM
As far as a new relationship is concerned, I have never once, nor do I plan on ever being in a relationship where I am being dominated and controlled.  To  say that I would allow this is to imply that women are mindless and are damsels in distress which I for one am not.  Even without my ex's dysphoria I would never let some other man come in and take control and bad mouth my ex in front of me let alone my children.  I would just as well stay single if that was the case. 

I am glad to hear that you have this opinion, I was not implying that you are the type of person that would be rolled over by a man. I (and I am sure many others on this site) look at hetero relationships with a slightly different perspective than most of the population. I have had the privilege of being on both sides of the fence and one thing I hear over and over when I listen to female friends is their desire to ignore the things in the male character that they don't like. It is what it is, most normal men want to be the provider/protector for their woman, they want to be seen as the hero. They desire approval for their actions and most women either consciously/subconsciously pick up on this and in an effort to show that they love them they give subtle approval. No amount of feminist indoctrination will ever change this, on this issue I am not cynical I am pragmatic!

Quote from: Tiger Lilly on May 23, 2013, 02:27:56 PM
And I truly believe that a household with 2 well-adjusted parents is a better house than just one.  I apologize to all the single parents out there, but it is just my belief.  So this is why we have agreed to raise our children together.  We are not enemies, and I do not hate her as I know she did not ask to be trans and well you know s*** happens in life and we just have to roll with the punches no matter how many times they knock us down.   I would never deny her access to our children because that is just plain cruel.  So again another point that is not going to happen.

This I also strongly agree with, trust me I see my partner come home some nights and all she does is cry because of what she has seen two very unhappy parents doing to their children that day! The key to happy successful children is what you already said "2 well-adjusted parents", and it sounds like you already know this, which is very healthy. But I believe the old saying 2 is company and 3 is a crowd, I have 2 friends that divorced several years ago but due to student loans/mortgage and their children's schools they chose to continue to live together and it worked until one of them started dating again and as of today they are having more problems than they did while they were married. I was only mentioning this as something you should keep in mind, and know that there may be a point where you would have to quit the current living arrangements.

Quote from: Tiger Lilly on May 23, 2013, 02:27:56 PM
I would never deny her access to our children because that is just plain cruel.  So again another point that is not going to happen.    

I was not saying that you should, and I do not think that would be healthy in any way for your children. I was only mentioning that you would most likely be able to retain custody of your children, I know of a couple where the spouse decided to transition & the wife was totally unaccepting and wanted out of the marriage, but she was financially dependent on her spouse since the spouse made much more than she did and she was afraid that she would not be able to obtain custody of her children & provide for them If she wanted to start a new life with a different person. She stayed for too long in a relationship that became very toxic for everyone involved. I do not know your situation so I am not saying this in any way is similar to your relationship.

Honestly I may have read more into your post than what was there, It seems that you and your ex are still in a healthy relationship where you live together and raise your children, I am a little confused as to why you wanted to divorce so quickly if you are not considering moving out and starting a new relationship ? In my state there are many benefits to being legally married on paper, especially if you are living together & have children, taxes, insurance, and medical treatment are part of the benefits. If your spouse is ok with an open relationship then I do not understand the need to divorce I guess this was the reason I misinterpreted what you wrote I apologize, I should have been able to pick up on another's need to vent. 

I should have been more specific when I mentioned "dissolved our marriage".  We have ended our romantic partnership, but we are still legally married for all the reasons mentioned above.

We both realize that if any serious relationships develop then we would have to re-evaluate our arrangement I suppose.  I don't know about her, but I am not looking for anything serious now or in the forseeable future - and I am one who can go long stretches in between serious relationships (the longest one I believe was 5 years).