Hello, everyone!

I'm kind of going through one of those stupid extra-dysphoric bouts where I'm freaking tired of nobody being able to recognize my female side unless I put a hell of a lot of effort into it, and my stupid brain always freaks out about how "OMG, I'm never going to get there!" feeling like I'm never going to reach the point where I just look female completely naturally with no effort whatsoever. So I just wanted to ask a simple question...

Members here talk all the time about "male fail" mode... that magical time in HRT where people start gendering you as female even when you're out in "guy mode." So out of curiosity, how long on HRT did it take everyone to get there?

I know I'm freaking out WAY too early in HRT about this, and I know that everyone's mileage will vary, but I'm just looking for some sort of general guess on length so that I can get my stupid brain to quit freaking out and just shut up about it already.

I'm at 6 months and I haven't hit that point yet, I thikn I'm starting to get close but not there yet. However I think it varies from person to person

I've had a couple of these. Oddly enough, they all involved a purple shirt. >_>

But yeah - it's unique per-person; you'll know when you encounter it, but you can't really put a timeline on it.

Carrie I hate being in guy mode too! You can try wearing as much feminine clothing as possible. You could try wearing some makeup in guy mode that's what I do. I find I can't completely dress as a man or I'll start crying now so I make the best out of a bad situation by making myself as feminine as possible. But Carrie don't worry you will eventually reach the point of people not being able to tell what you are. But in the mean time you can help give people a clue as to who you are by making yourself as feminine as possible.

 I could probably still pass as male if I wished, even now that I'm two and a half years in. I haven't put this guess to the test, however. I probably started looking strange and feminine as a male something like six months into HRT.

I don't know about mail fail mode but I failed to pass as myself at the bank yesterday. It took the teller several minutes of looking at the photo and back at me and she eventually was like yeah I kinda see it. I've been on HRT for 12.5 weeks. I was called sir yesterday too though by a cashier at Walgreens so I'm not totally failing. I was so upset and I shouldn't have been since I've been on HRT for so short a time but yeah. It happened several times yesterday (another person called me buddy) and I think it was  beard shadow as I couldn't get a close shave because I shaved the night before. What do you consider boy mode? I don't have any male clothes my mom gave them to Purple Heart.

For me I guess it was just about exactly six months, when I got kitted out in a hockey jersey, combat boots, and baseball cap to go to a hockey game (and bundled up underneath, although in women's jeans) and drunk creeps promptly hit on me. I stopped attempting male mode at all around the four-month mark, though, so that's as close as I can get to what you wanted?

Eh, my HRT dose is pretty low, so HRT probably has little to do with it. It started a bit before HRT anyway. Person with long hair, carrying a messenger bag for a purse, speaking like a girl... people tend to default to "ugly female", and those who know I am (or am supposed to be) a guy put me in a different category. I'm not a girl, but I'm definitely not a real guy either. Heck, there've been some accidental misgenderings. Honestly, if you get your voice down well, grow your hair out and don't make a point of acting the guy part, you'll enter this awkward stage quite fast. Not that it's bad. To me it's weird but much less weird and much preferable to just being a guy.

I'm at a year and a couple months, mostly read as male.  But I'm not stopping anything!!   

It's different for everyone, like has been said before there's a dozen "little things" that if most are seen as male, you're male...if most are seen as female, you're female.

The tricky part is that these dozen things aren't singular items, they are cumulative and combination...i.e., broad shoulders + small hips (relative to each other, not the actual inches) = guyish, etc.

Some things are definitely one or the other, but aren't necessarily definitive (boobs = FEMALE, unless other signs negate them, in which case you're a "man with moobs"; 5 o'clock shadow = MALE, regardless of other things)

Height, weight, etc all play a part...my first thought on reading your post was "I wonder how her voice is?"

So...how is your voice?

I'm about 18 months in.  About 4 months ago I've begun failing in guy mode while in my mechanics clothing. 

Hey Carrie Liz,

I sure understand the self talk that can undermine our confidence but it is part of the transition to better days.  It seems to me that so much of this is where we start from in body, age and attitude.  And then, having a point of arrival or a "there point" as a goal might lead to disappointment?  I hope you will give your brain some TLC and dare NOT to compare.  Enjoy the journey.  Savor each moment of emerging self recognition of the new you. 
I frequently interact with college faculty and diversity groups and have been reminded that cisgender women and men also get misgendered.  A librarian laughed about those "kids that speak their minds" and recalled being asked if she was a guy or not.  Some of our sisters here at Susan's look so petite and nicely girly to begin with that it seems the journey must be easier.  I doubt they think it is any easier tho? 
I am a bit over two months on HRT and the biggest change in how I feel happened months earlier when I finally accepted myself as transgender.  I encourage you to forget about the male fail or any other test of passing, you gotta love yourself!

Hugs,
Tessa James

5 months was my first ma'am. At 8 months I was getting it very consistently so I went full time, but people I think were still looking at me strange (especially men). It wasn't til about 16 months in where I started seeing what I looked like in boy clothes again without makeup to say that man mode is completely gone.

When I dress rather androgynous I get puzzled looks.  Four months of a potent dose of HRT is coming up in six days.

I really agree with Tessa on not being overly concerned by "Male Fail".  I agree so much I'll just quote her, "you gotta love yourself!"

Me? My voice? Uh, it passes. I fought back the breaking in my puberty, so it never became truly boyish. Even though I still hate testosterone for making me lose singing range, voice quality and making me make some distinctly male sounds I couldn't even do willingly if I tried, sometimes. Like, an occasional weird cough, sneeze, laugh, etc. sound in a pitch lower than I can reach if I try to ramp down my voice as much as I can. For that reason probably I have a male voice somewhere down there, but never wanted or had to use it so I don't know how. And seriously it's better this way. I just wish it didn't exist at all, and that I could sing properly within the full range I know I'm supposed to have.

So all I had to train once I decided to transition was very subtle things no one but me would've cared about. And singing. At some point I got pretty good at singing high, and then just as I was in the process of being tossed around and waiting for the psychiatrist, I had some sort of final puberty breakout that cancelled my singing practice and made a brand new Adam's apple appear. Seriously, not only does this thing look awful, but it's so uncomfortable! It's like an intruder in my neck. I'll do everything I can to gather the funds for a tracheal shave at the same time as I have my SRS. Even if it became invisible I'd want that. There's a freaking pebble in my throat and I very much dislike it. How do guys not get annoyed by it slightly - just enough to hurt a tiny bit and annoy a ton - in the way of every neck movement, every swallowing, every thing that touches the neck? (because to top it off this thing is sensitive!)

5-6 months people at work were like are you sick? you look like your losing too much weight? your face looks different? whatever drugs you are doing you need to stop your over doing it. Why is your hair long?.. cut it you look like a girl... lol

Thanks for the replies, everyone!

And yeah, I suppose this really isn't about passing, it's just a matter of personal vanity. I should really be grateful that I can pass at all when I go out, but I'll admit that even the ability to have a "guy mode" at all still drives me absolutely nuts. And I'm just all whiny and upset because I still have to put on a wig and a padded bra and a very specific type of clothes in order to pass, and it just makes me feel kind of like a fake, like I feel like I'm not really a girl because I have to put all this effort into passing, and once all of those things come off I'm just right back to being my stupid dumb guy self. Again, I know this is selfish, but it bothers me, and I really just want my gender to be incidental... something that I don't have to think about, something that I don't have to put so much effort into just in order to get the barest amount of recognition, and something that I don't have to think about and obsess over all the damned time.

And you know, there's always that lingering fear in the back of my head that I'm never going to get there, so I just needed some reassurance.

Quote from: Serena Lynn on May 24, 2013, 12:14:13 AM
5-6 months people at work were like are you sick? you look like your losing too much weight? your face looks different? whatever drugs you are doing you need to stop your over doing it. Why is your hair long?.. cut it you look like a girl... lol

Love it!

Quote from: Carrie Liz on May 24, 2013, 12:20:25 AM


And you know, there's always that lingering fear in the back of my head that I'm never going to get there, so I just needed some reassurance.

Carrie I have these same worries its not easy but I try to remember how early I am in transitioning and that it's kind of ridiculous to think I would completely pass as a woman at this stage in hrt. But I understand your fear that you'll never pass but if you look at the commits here it took a lot of months before they started completely passing. Carrie your going to be just fine it takes time.

Quote from: Serena Lynn on May 24, 2013, 12:14:13 AM
5-6 months people at work were like are you sick? you look like your losing too much weight? your face looks different? whatever drugs you are doing you need to stop your over doing it. Why is your hair long?.. cut it you look like a girl... lol

Had the 1st "losing too much weight" and "are you ill" questions heading my way after about 2 1/2 months. Made me slightly "de-androgynize" my clothes in the office (okay, so I was pushing it ). Weight loss (not much, trimmed it down before starting HRT), but more particularly my waist getting slimmer (started at a waist-to-hip of 0.81, now at 0.74, all via loss in the waist though), and more translucent skin are the main culprits.

I think I'm at the 50/50 personally. I did an experiment to see if I pass. Basically, since I don't go out at all due to working 3rd shift at my job, I used Omegle to try this out. When I'm in guy mode I dress kind of androgynous (v-neck, skinny jeans, etc). When I got on Omegle in guy mode I got more disconnects from other users than I could count. So I stopped, put on my girl clothes, slapped on some mascara and eyeliner, made sure my hair was looking good, and the difference was astounding as I got less and less disconnections. Now I haven't been practicing my voice as I should be so I turned off my mic, but based on my appearance alone I'd say I pass.  That really boosted my self-confidence (which is always at an all-time low).