Quote from: JLT1 on July 14, 2013, 07:56:42 PM
You are planning on going to graduate school.  What are your top 5 (or even 10) choices?  Perhaps you could open up your job search to include places like that.  Even if that were to be away from your family for a while....

I'm aiming fairly high, but I have NYU and Columbia on my list in NY.  I don't know if I could make my out of state choices work right now.  We'll see.  I have applied for research positions, but there are very few available in the social sciences and usually they require a masters degree.  I only have a bachelor's right now.  I have applied for desk work at both of those schools, but I haven't heard back from any of them.  Believe me, I have tried pretty much every option available to me except retail.  I have been offered things during my search, but I foolishly turned some of them down.  One job wanted me to work 80 hours a week, not including travel.  It was a good title and payed all right, but it would have killed me.  Warning to any of the young girls and boys, stay away from any social science degree unless you are certain know what you want to do with it.  And be realistic because not everything is possible.  A degree and a great academic background will only get you so far (often that is nowhere). Many positions have further requirements that aren't always discussed and it comes down to who you know and whether they are willing to help you.  My dream is to be a professor so it makes sense for me to have gotten the degree I have, but the in between is horrendous. 

Quote from: learningtolive on July 14, 2013, 11:20:07 PM
I'm aiming fairly high, but I have NYU and Columbia on my list in NY.  I don't know if I could make my out of state choices work right now.  We'll see.  I have applied for research positions, but there are very few available in the social sciences and usually they require a masters degree.  I only have a bachelor's right now.  I have applied for desk work at both of those schools, but I haven't heard back from any of them.  Believe me, I have tried pretty much every option available to me except retail.  I have been offered things during my search, but I foolishly turned some of them down.  One job wanted me to work 80 hours a week, not including travel.  It was a good title and payed all right, but it would have killed me.  Warning to any of the young girls and boys, stay away from any social science degree unless you are certain know what you want to do with it.  And be realistic because not everything is possible.  A degree and a great academic background will only get you so far (often that is nowhere). Many positions have further requirements that aren't always discussed and it comes down to who you know and whether they are willing to help you.  My dream is to be a professor so it makes sense for me to have gotten the degree I have, but the in between is horrendous.

You could always come into nursing? Good pay and hours

Are you trying/wanting/going to transition before you go to graduate school?  So that you are female when you start that process?  I know that a good school for you MS can lead to a good school for your PhD and from there, a good teaching position.  Being a woman when you start could keep what is an already difficult road a little smoother as opposed to transitioning while in graduate school. 

Quote from: JLT1 on July 15, 2013, 11:27:36 AM
Are you trying/wanting/going to transition before you go to graduate school?  So that you are female when you start that process?  I know that a good school for you MS can lead to a good school for your PhD and from there, a good teaching position.  Being a woman when you start could keep what is an already difficult road a little smoother as opposed to transitioning while in graduate school. 

Well, I hope to be full time by the time I go to school.  I'm trying to go directly into a ph.d program because there is a better chance for funding and stipends.  We'll see if that works.  But yeah, I probably will be full time so it should be okay.

Quote from: Tristan on July 15, 2013, 08:45:09 AM
You could always come into nursing? Good pay and hours

Eh... my family has so many connections in the medical field.   It's not my thing.  Besides, I don't have the time to try and become an lpn or Rn at this point in time.  I already invested enough time in college at the undergraduate level.

WHINY ALERT
It's been very frustrating.  I don't know how others deal with this, but not having any support and only facing opposition wears down on you.  My whole family is done with me and I really don't have any  acquaintances to talk to or anything without annoying them with my issues.  I feel like I'm totally alone and no one cares or understands how difficult this all is for me.  The prospect of facing this all alone is really hard. I realize it isn't easy on my family either, but they never take my feelings into account.  And worst while I try to just talk with my family for some comfort or not to feel isolated through this process everything becomes so cold.  I get that my family is annoyed with me, but it shouldn't always be like this.  I feel like like I'm just a big walking burden to everyone I know and no one wants me around.  At this point, this forum is about all I have.  That's why the whole getting kicked out thing bothers me most.  I can pick myself up one way or another, but losing the only emotional support I ever had is tough.  I hate to admit this, but I'm a total loser.  Everyone has had it with me and I can't blame them.  In a way, I brought this upon myself.  I shouldn't have sprung this on my family so quickly and I shouldn't have been as emotionally needy with the acquaintances that I had.  I have burnt everyone out with my issues and it is my fault when it is all said and done.  Now I am totally alone to face this whole transition process with and I'm very scared. 

Sorry to be whiny, but I have been in a dark place and need to get it out someway.  I can't keep it bottled up and don't know what else to do but scream it out here on this thread.  Everything with my family has been clouding my judgement and putting a lot of emotional stress.  And it doesn't help that the hormones have been making me go from one emotional extreme to the next at the drop of the hat.  I feel like hrt is making me bipolar in some ways,lol.  Nonetheless, thank you for listening to me whine.

Under the circumstances, I think a little whininess is completely understandable. I certainly don't blame you. Vent all you need to.

Quote from: learningtolive on July 15, 2013, 05:43:48 PM


WHINY ALERT
It's been very frustrating.  I don't know how others deal with this, but not having any support and only facing opposition wears down on you.  My whole family is done with me and I really don't have any  acquaintances to talk to or anything without annoying them with my issues.  I feel like I'm totally alone and no one cares or understands how difficult this all is for me.  The prospect of facing this all alone is really hard. I realize it isn't easy on my family either, but they never take my feelings into account.  And worst while I try to just talk with my family for some comfort or not to feel isolated through this process everything becomes so cold.  I get that my family is annoyed with me, but it shouldn't always be like this.  I feel like like I'm just a big walking burden to everyone I know and no one wants me around.  At this point, this forum is about all I have.  That's why the whole getting kicked out thing bothers me most.  I can pick myself up one way or another, but losing the only emotional support I ever had is tough.  I hate to admit this, but I'm a total loser.  Everyone has had it with me and I can't blame them.  In a way, I brought this upon myself.  I shouldn't have sprung this on my family so quickly and I shouldn't have been as emotionally needy with the acquaintances that I had.  I have burnt everyone out with my issues and it is my fault when it is all said and done.  Now I am totally alone to face this whole transition process with and I'm very scared. 

Sorry to be whiny, but I have been in a dark place and need to get it out someway.  I can't keep it bottled up and don't know what else to do but scream it out here on this thread.  Everything with my family has been clouding my judgement and putting a lot of emotional stress.  And it doesn't help that the hormones have been making me go from one emotional extreme to the next at the drop of the hat.  I feel like hrt is making me bipolar in some ways,lol.  Nonetheless, thank you for listening to me whine.

I know what your going through and I'm not just saying that to be nice either. I really have been what your going through right now. Of coarse every family situation is different and your family might not respond in the same way mine has. But eventually once the shock wears off and things calm down it should get better for you. And while you may never get the full acceptance you want you may get some support so don't give up hope. Btw your not a loser negative thinking is not going to get you through this time. As hard as it is you must stay positive and try to focus your mind on not where your at now in life. But where you'll be five to ten years from now. 

When I told my sister, her first reaction was to give me reasons this might have happened.  She never gave me a minute of grief (my brother has never said one word one way or the other).  My sister knew of several medical reason, also talking about my one year older sibling who was a hermaphrodite, birth certificate said female, death certificate said male.

So today was a fun day in general. 

I pretty much have decided that I will be cutting of normal relations with my family temporarily.  Even if we live together for the time being, I don't think we should be speaking with one another unless it's necessary.  I'm tired of being confronted and insulted.  I get told on a daily basis that I will never pass and I am manly.  You would think making me cry a zillion times would get it through to them that I don't need to hear this. 

In any event, I really don't want to continue a relationship like this. i understand things take time and patience is required; however, they don't even try to understand and come around to my perspective.  I don't see this improving at all.  It's not hostile anymore, but it's a ridiculous passive aggressive control facade they put on.   They tell me that I should be understanding about them wanting me to leave the house and not see me while I transition.  I'm told I'm selfish and wrong for letting this hurt me.  I'm sorry but this is just pure emotional abuse.  Oh, you're not kicking me out?  I'm putting words in your mouth? You are just asking me to either stop transitioning or be kind enough to leave the house and cease seeing them regularly once the changes begin to become noticeable to them.  Totally different from being kicked out.  Not a semantics game at all.   I get they are hurting, but they don't even see how difficult this is for me.  Is it really odd for me to feel hurt that they are asking me to leave and cease frequent contact with them?  How does one not see this?  And yeah, telling me that I will never pass and will look like a man in a dress is not supposed to be hurtful?  I get that's what they believe, but they have seen me cry over this and they continuously point out how non passable I am.  Is that really the right way to treat someone going through a transition?  So at this point I'm going to do what I can to leave.  It sucks, but what can I do. 

How long do you guys think I have until the changes become noticeable to my family.  I have been on estradiol for a month, but it's a low starting dose.  Do you think I can stay under cover for at least 3 months? Maybe a little more? Hopefully I can get myself up and out within that time frame. 

It sounds like you are doing the right thing by removing yourself from the situation while also trying to not mirror their abusive behavior. You're making the best of a very difficult situation and I really admire your approach.

There are lots of posts about people's experience with how long you can mask the changes. I have known lots of trans people and honestly some of them have gone for a year or more without anyone noticing. Also, the changes are typically quite slow - so there's a chance that your family might not notice if you are seeing them regularly (just like when someone gradually loses or gains weight it's not very noticeable to those who see them every day).

At three months the changes were starting to be a little noticeable to me, but honestly people around me wouldn't have noticed if I didn't say anything. I personally feel I could have gone over six months before my breast growth started to get noticed. Every person varies though and some people see faster growth. When people really took notice is when I started wearing dresses Until then I grew out my hair, was on HRT, colored my hair, and even wore nail polish and people still just thought I was being kinda weird but people didn't know I was transitioning. You might have a similar experience.

Good luck girl! It's an amazing journey, even though it can be really difficult through parts of it.

Well I am told that transition is a little selfish but thought life there are times you need to be a little selfish and do stuff for yourself to in this case be yourself ( true self)

I am so so happy you have come to this conclusion LTL! You deserve to be treated with respect and dignity. Whether or not they agree with you just being yourself and living an authentic true life, there is zero justification for their treatment of you. I remember when you first came out to your sisters and they said they would support and help you. Even stick up for you if your mother didn't come around right away. And what did they do? They reneged on their words. They not only completely betrayed you, they started actively abusing you. THAT IS WRONG.

You are doing the right thing in creating distance from them and you. You need to do this in order to survive. There is only so much abuse one person can take and I worry that you will either stop transitioning and put it off for an indefinite period of time or do something worse. Thank God you made this choice. Possibly, in the long run, it will help them see things the right way. The right way is supporting you. That is love. Or at the very least, at least stop hurting you. I know in my situation by staying at my BF's for two weeks my mom is being nicer to me.

But I started wearing things on the make side of androgynous. But I also talked to my mom about dresses and tops and different styles of wedding dresses and it was an awesome conversation and she even said I should become a  beauty editor. So that is def progress. So things can change. However the worst thing my mom ever said to me was I look strange in makeup (but that was at 1 month HRT) and she called me princess. Hardly bad stuff. It was more her tone.

Also, I know people say transition is selfish. That may be true for someone older with kids and stuff because that is a huge repsonsibility and you are supposed to put your kids before you. So it is your mom who is being selfish. We are both young and single and childless so I don't see how transition to our true selves is even remotely selfish. Is it really so selfish just being honest? I think not.

You are doing the right thing L2L, I'm proud of you for coming to the place where you are saying enough! You have done all you could at your end and it's your time to get a life now. In three months your development will be minimal on low dose estrogen, you will have plenty of time to accomplish what you need to. You have the blessings and caring thoughts from all of us dear!

I noticed slight changes within the first month or two, but if they see you every day it will take longer for them to perceive the incremental changes occuring than the big chunks of changes the rest of the world, that sees you only occasionally, will see.  With the low dosage you should have plenty of time.  It's hard for me to tell you because my appearance didn't change that much at all and I know that is atypical.

Well it's good to know I should have some time before I have to leave.  It's good to have some breathing room.  Plus, I'm secretly hoping that my distancing myself from them and my cold shoulder attitude will make them more likely to come around.  That way I won't have to leave.  But we will see.

Nonetheless, pending my blood work results,my dosage of estradiol should be doubled and I will start spiro as well.  Then I will be reducing my timeframe a little more, but I bet I can still get away with at least another 3 months.  Still that depends on whether my blood work results come back with normal hemoglobin rates.  If it's too high, I need to see a hemotologist until I can increase my estradiol dose.  For some reason I am vegetarian with high hemoglobin.  Doesn't make sense.  I'm hoping my last results were skewed due to dehydration.  I guess time will tell.

Honestly, given how your mother reacted the last time you stopped talking to her, if anything was going to work, that's probably it.   Hard to know though.

Well, I figure I would give everyone a quick update on how things are going.  As of now, I really haven't been speaking with most of my family.  It's a little weird, but I feel better even if I'm a little lonely.  I have been talking somewhat with my mom, but it is more small talk than anything.  She got sick with bronchitis, so I couldn't maintain being mad when she isn't the best condition.  So we have been speaking to some degree.  There hasn't been hostility and things have gotten a little better.  Still, I don't think anything has really changed.  She is where she is, and I am where I am.  However, she hasn't brought up my transition to me; therefore, I guess that is a small improvement. I even brought up my endo appointment/blood work and she didn't say anything negative to me.  But it still isn't good.  I went on her computer the other day and unintentionally saw her history.  She had a bunch of search results for "how to legally stop your child from transitioning'  and ways to force a transition to stop.  So even though she isn't confronting me about it, she has plans to get me to stop.  This sucks because I was starting to get up my hopes that maybe she would come around, and I would be able to stay at home.  Maybe I will. She tells me she prefers me to leave once the changes start for her own emotional stability, but that she would never kick me out.  Perhaps in time things will change.  For now, I am trying to respect her wishes and trying to find something, but all I get is rejection letters or the usual scenario of a non reply.  It's all frustrating.  I just wish I had some knowledge on what the next few months hold for me. Sorry for the rambling message, but I wanted to share my current situation and you know how much I like to ramble,lol.

I'm glad that aren't bothering you as much. Just watch your behavior and what you say or do around them. And what you write anywhere. They can use that against you if they want to use psychiatric reasons against you. If your state is like mine all they really need is two witnesses that will sign a sworn affidavit with a little proof your unfit in some way and the judge or magistrate to sign it and the police can come get you for a 72 hour hold and get you on a psychiatric contract from there. That's what I'm still on now and someone I know is still responsible for me until I can finish the contract. I have herd if this method being used one 2 trans people in there early 20s in Chicago and one in Georgia so just be aware

Quote from: Tristan on July 23, 2013, 07:39:16 PM
I'm glad that aren't bothering you as much. Just watch your behavior and what you say or do around them. And what you write anywhere. They can use that against you if they want to use psychiatric reasons against you. If your state is like mine all they really need is two witnesses that will sign a sworn affidavit with a little proof your unfit in some way and the judge or magistrate to sign it and the police can come get you for a 72 hour hold and get you on a psychiatric contract from there. That's what I'm still on now and someone I know is still responsible for me until I can finish the contract. I have herd if this method being used one 2 trans people in there early 20s in Chicago and one in Georgia so just be aware

Well, we got into another family blow out again today.  So the whole quiet family situation didn't last too long.  And probably only occurred because my mom got sick and couldn't speak for a few days.  Now she is back and letting me know.  I guess, I just have to learn not to care about what my family thinks.  I'm still in the house, so it could be worse.  And I'm only being asked to leave for the sake of everyone else, so it's not quite the same as being kicked out.  It's just a request for me to leave once the changes happen.  But I'm still hoping that will change and they will become okay with me again.

On your point about psychiatric threats, my mom made that point today. She said she could easily call someone up and get me locked up in a ward.  But she said it in anger and she wouldn't be able to hold me because I have no mental illness that would allow them to contain me (except if they use my depression against me). In any event, she said she wouldn't do that, but she vocalized that threat so it is on her mind.  It's odd.  She acts very bipolar about the situation.  Sometimes we are "okay", to put it best, and then other days I'm the demon destroying her world. 

I kicked out my eldest son when he was 17 because he was not living according to the parameters I set out for him, and was becoming an obnoxious sloth. He never finished high school and had to either get to work or starve. I had to give him the boot back then, because I knew he would never develop into a responsible adult the way he was going and so I jerked the rug out from under him for his own sake. He is now the project manager over several large building construction sites in a major western city and recently took the time to thank me for doing what was painfully needed to get him moving forward. He went on to say that had I not done that he would probably still be lounging around on my couch.

LTL you're in the same place that my son once was, going nowhere in a hurry. If you continue to hang out at your parent's place it will just be more of the same ongoing drama. Painful as it may seem, it's time to put non-essentials on the back burner and move. We've all encouraged you to move out no matter what it takes, but you are not listening to the good advice everyone has offered. Sorry hon, but it is time for you to get moving for your own sake!

Quote from: Shantel on July 27, 2013, 10:45:48 AM
I kicked out my eldest son when he was 17 because he was not living according to the parameters I set out for him, and was becoming an obnoxious sloth. He never finished high school and had to either get to work or starve. I had to give him the boot back then, because I knew he would never develop into a responsible adult the way he was going and so I jerked the rug out from under him for his own sake. He is now the project manager over several large building construction sites in a major western city and recently took the time to thank me for doing what was painfully needed to get him moving forward. He went on to say that had I not done that he would probably still be lounging around on my couch.

LTL you're in the same place that my son once was, going nowhere in a hurry. If you continue to hang out at your parent's place it will just be more of the same ongoing drama. Painful as it may seem, it's time to put non-essentials on the back burner and move. We've all encouraged you to move out no matter what it takes, but you are not listening to the good advice everyone has offered. Sorry hon, but it is time for you to get moving for your own sake!

well, I will say my situation is a bit different fron your son's.   I am making plans on getring my life on track and am working on developing my future.  5he propblem with moving out is that it takes time.  I am doing my best to get into a place rhat will allow me to go if need be.  But there are roadblocks.  I need to save up money and I can't get a loan.  I was a vicrim of id theft, someone stole my social and used it to open multiple bank accounts in various Midwestern states, and ir has been difficult to even get a checking account for this reason.  Finally got that and have been slowly proving my innocence bank by bank.   I'm lucky rhat the thief never used my name or dob as that makws it easier ro clear, but unfortunately his actions are tied ti my social.  So getring a loan without a cosigner isn't really in the question until this is clear.  And not having credit makes it hard  to get a place.   So, believe me when I say I am working to get things on track.   It's just a lot has been thrown at me rhes3 past few months.  Right now, I'm doing what I can to afford rhe move if and when it comes.

I will say, however, I have no desire ro cut my family out of my life.  Even though it's been hard, they are important to me.  I fear moving will only distance us further than us going through the hard times together.   I don't know what will happen,  but I hope oue relationship can be saved, even though I am starting to doubt that ir can.