Hello everyone,
I am posting this because I asked my father tonight what his argument is for why I should not become a female (I'm male right now). This is (pretty much) his argument, translated from Korean and summarized:

He says that being happy as a transsexual will only last 5 years. 10, if you're lucky. After that, life goes downhill. No one will like you because you are "not normal". Nor will your family. Why would they, when you think such "abnormal" thoughts and "absolutely crazy"? You will be forever alone, and you will be depressed and regret your decision. You will also die early because of harmful hormones. The reason they only show trans that are in their 20s and 30s is because the ones beyond their 50s are the ones that aren't happy, while the ones in their 20s and 30s are (because they are still in their short period of happiness).
No one will be your friend. 99.99999% (Yes, he did say a lot of 9s, but I don't exactly remember how many. I think that you all will get what's he's saying, though) of the people in this world only like people that are normal. The 0.000001% that do like things that aren't normal are just crazy. Also, the ones that support their children changing genders are either crazy or don't care about them. When they change, they become a "nobody" to them.
The only legitimate reason that would be reasonable enough to let someone change genders is when they have a serious hormonal balance issue. They have so much hormones of the other gender that (in a male's case) they do not have body hair and their penis is almost non-existent. Other reasons are not good enough, and they will just regret their decision.

I would like to know other people's opinion on this argument. Just saying, but he also took a psychology course, which is why he knows all this stuff (or so he says *shrug*) .

Short answer? His argument is dirt.

Longer answer is it's dirt because it sounds based on ignorance and is pulling out numbers from his ass. Does he have any evidence to support his claims?

Plenty of transgenders have relationships and friends and get treated just like cis people do. Despite popular believe, it is not obvious to many people that somebody is transgender if they have had a successful transition. And transgender people do not walk around with a sign saying what they are for all to see.

Don't let him scare you, because that's what it sounds like he is trying to do.

He took "a" psychology course...which means he's as qualified to speak about trans issues as a medium-sized rock.

For the most part, he's just using basic fear arguments to keep you from transitioning. Now having said that, he does say a couple things that are true:

The number of people who will find you desirable will be less than if you stayed male. This does not mean that you will be "forever alone." There are people who will accept you and who will want a relationship.

Unfortunately, families have been known to reject their transsexual son/daughter/husband/wife etc. However, this is not due to the transition, but rather because "the family" doesn't understand or practice unconditional love. If a family truly loves its members, it will accept them no matter what (the only exception is if the person is an immediate or chronic threat to the family's safety and well-being).

There are times when a transsexual has regrets...the studies mention a few of them, it's around 1% are unhappy. The other 99% are very happy. Your father mentions "the ones we don't talk about..." If that is true, how does he know about them? He doesn't --that's why he uses hyperbole in his arguments.

Being trans is a challenge, I'm not denying that...but to use fear rather than knowledge is irresponsible for an adult.

Sounds like he's basically using the "I had basic training that I didn't really understand about psychology therefore that makes my word absolute." In other words, a crutch to his prejudice. If he really took college (polytechnic?) level psychology, he would know about the need for reliable sources/citations as part of the scientific method and that treatment of trans women (hormone therapy) is known to reduce secondary mental health symptoms (depression, anxiety, social distress).

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306453011002629

Obviously with no real information to back the claims he only has his word to beat you over the head with.

If he's still using (equivalent, i.e. Korean) terms as 'normal' and 'crazy' then it doesn't say much about his psychology course, does it?

What is normal anyway? Normal is being yourself, and even when you look at the semantics, this is what people really mean when they talk about 'normal'.

Being trans is all about being yourself inside and out to the exact same degree as someone who isn't trans. It's not about becoming another gender or another person. This is not scientifically possible. You can only be who you are.

The psychology course argument just doesn't wash. Lots of people have driving licences, but this doesn't make them good drivers.

His argument is crappy because he just made it up, lol.

I doubt if any of his argument is based on psychology and if it is based on what he learned in his psychology course, then his course was full of crap!

I transitioned and had SRS at the age of 24, nearly 40 years ago, and lived a perfectly normal life. I woodworked well, was totally accepted, and nobody ever gave me a second glance. In my 30s rumours of my medical background came out and I lost a few "friends" but the good ones remained and a lot of people just dismissed the rumours as not-possible! In my 50s I was more open about my background and nobody believed it. I am 64 now, I have as many friends as ever (and better friends at that!). I have been married twice (no kids) and my dating and love life are no different than any of the born-female girls that I know.

I only know one other from "my generation" and she is even more open than I am and our lives have been much the same so there are TWO of us who's experiences don't agree with you father's theory!

So, he's basically saying not to transition because nobody will like you.

If you live your life for the sole purpose of getting other people to like you, then you are already living life wrong.  In such a case, it becomes irrelevant whether one transitions or not, because they aren't really living.  They are just going through the motions.

Quote from: VeryGnawty on July 30, 2013, 05:49:21 AM
So, he's basically saying not to transition because nobody will like you.

If you live your life for the sole purpose of getting other people to like you, then you are already living life wrong.  In such a case, it becomes irrelevant whether one transitions or not, because they aren't really living.  They are just going through the motions.

QFT.
And if someone doesn't transition so people will like them, who is it those people like? Someone they don't truly know. And it's counter intuitive. People are attracted to people who like themselves. Not as much to people who fall all over themselves trying to be liked. The more you are yourself and comfortable with yourself, the more people will like you.

Pre transition: no friends, little respect. I didn't respect me so how could anyone else?

Post transition: (major problems); heaps of friends, invited to dinners, parties, serve on committees at government level, sought after and -- I have a boyfriend.

I need more time to fit my life into my life!!!

Now which one would you prefer?

Your Dad, clueless and biased or Cindy, living it.

Cindy (Oh I vote for me!!)

He used the average age of transgendered folks as a base for his five-year argument...
The problem with this is, the idea of being transgendered is only slowly taking hold. The number of those so identified is increasing over time at a probably-more-than-linear rate, and it's easier for younger people to make the leap (fewer commitments, say). Thus there will be more young transitioners than old, almost by definition. And there's only a minority of trans folks who've lived decades in their new bodies.

Many happy more-than-five-years' folks, though. Which should cancel the other half of his argument.

I think he's sorta right. Transitioning and living as a transgender woman is hard. It's not something to choose.

The only reason to do it is if you have no choice, if living any other way is unthinkable.

I think your father is expressing some of his own fears and projecting them onto a group in its entirety.

He is right in that it is difficult and you probably will lose some friends over it, hopefully you will make other friends.  As for being happy, I'm happy that I transitioned and it has been over 10 years.  Before I transitioned I had "periods" of happiness, but most of the time I was unhappy and sad.

You should always listen to your parents opinions, but in the end, its "Your" life.  You need to do what is right for you.

I am going to be controversial and say some of those things are legit things to consider.   Transitioning isn't the easiest road and there are possible negative consequences.   Yes, he is overblowing it and some if what he said is false, but we should all undersrand that there will be challenges.  You have to ask yourself if transitioning is worth it in case you are presented with social strife.  Many of us say yes and we overcome it.  It isn't easy, but it will turn out great if it is rhe right path for you.  But only you can tell whether it is worth it fir you.

P.s.  I do want to add that much of what he said was pure fear mongering and false.  Much of it is a negative fantasy that he created.  However, I do think we need to also look at the possible negatives when deciding to transition as well.

Your dad talks out of his ass

99.99999% of his statistical claims lack empirical support.

Maddy

In my opinion, his argument is irrelevant. Regardless of how much sense it does or doesn't make. Whatever he does or doesn't know. If you are transgendered and feel you need to transition then he can argue till he's blue in the face, it won't change that fact.

You live your life. He doesn't live it for you. It's your decision to make. Your path to walk, mistakes to make and learn from. And ultimately, your chance to make a happier life for yourself.

Transitioning isn't something people do because other people tell them it's the right thing to do. It's something people do because it's what they feel they need to do. So do what you feel you need to do. For you. Not for him, not for anyone else.

As an aside... you know what they say about normality. If you think someone is normal, you just don't know them well enough.

In my next post, I'll address his points one-by-one, but for now, I'd like you to consider looking at things from the following perspective:

• For all kinds of relationships, be they professional, romantic, sexual, or friendship, people are attracted to confidence and positive attitudes. People do not like being with downers and insecure people. This should be obvious.
• Confidence and positive attitudes come from having high self-esteem.
• Generally speaking, transition is one of the hardest journeys that people can undertake. And the reason why they do it is because they feel like not transitioning would make their lives even harder to bear.
• Those who really should but don't transition will inevitably feel miserable for the rest of their lives. That misery will destroy their self-esteem and become social poison.

Based on that, we can infer the following:

• Those who really should and do transition gain a degree of self-esteem that was previously unknown to them, which leads to confidence.
• That confidence is attractive and leads to new relationships and better relationships.
• People admire someone who would undertake such a difficult journey with such confidence. They use words like "courage" and "brave" to describe this person.

If you ask every transsexual on this site about what her/his "new life" is like, the answer would match the above points.

EVERYONE who went to college (just about) took a psychology course. I don't think most of them even talk about transgender. And if it did, it's full of sh** and so is your dad.

Maybe all of a sudden 5  years on, I will lose all my friends and so on-- for real?!  I am more social transitioning than I was before, also more popular. I didn't date pre-transition and I do now.

--Jay