Quote from: Sybil on November 04, 2013, 04:48:48 PM
I'll do my best to answer your reply in a more direct way.
Everyone is different. You really may have just had trouble with it. My personal example goes like this: I was very effeminate up until age 12. Family and peer bullying made me try harder to be masculine from 13 to 18. I actually made some friends this way, but was depressed and never fully successful at fitting in with boys. I caused a lot of drama and became too attached to certain friends. I gave up again when I was 19 until now and dropped the masculinity act.

However, if I had been masculine -- or one step further, successfully masculine -- the entire time without acting or trying, it wouldn't have made me any less valid as a woman, because it wouldn't have made any cis girl less valid as a woman.
I don't feel this is true. I can personally attest to several men who have been interested in me, despite my downstairs, who do not particularly care for that configuration. They loved my personality and thought I was an amazing investment. There have also been men who were okay with what I had down there but would also be okay afterwards. There are even more who are not okay with it now, but really want me to look into them again when it's gone. The majority of these men have been extremely fun, intelligent, well-balanced people. Many of them have said they would not be ashamed of me. Several of them are my closest friends who I have known since I was a teenager. A handful of them are men who were offensively naive about trans people and had to be educated first.

I haven't had FFS. I'm not really passable. I'm overweight. I dress neutrally. A lot of this is about personality and what potential a man sees in you.
I understand the needs. I think about them all the time. I daydream about them and have actual dreams about them. Men are one of the things I think about most. I talk to my cis best friend about men and what we want from them really, really often. It's a great source of frustration in my life, but the reason I'm not in a relationship is entirely of my own devices. I'm waiting until after I get FFS and possibly SRS so that -I- am less insecure, not the man I'd be with. Whatever the case, it's definitely not the fault of men as a whole.
I do think it's hard for cis women to understand trans women, but not impossible. I've also had some bring up male privilege to me and try to tell me that I couldn't understand, or that I don't know what I'm in for. This is really just ignorant banter. I don't believe in the concept of adversity ownership, where an individual who has not suffered a particular type of adversity can never understand it. Human beings have the capacity to empathize and apply relativity -- it's not simple, no, but it is more than possible, and assuming it isn't possible from the get-go certainly does not help at all.

Genuinely, I wish you were not in so much turmoil over this subject. I've been through all of the insecurities, the worries, and the feeling less valid than cis women. I've worried about men and how they see me. I've worried about how valid I might be. It's an awful, awful collection of feelings, but a lot of them are founded in silly things. Despite still being stuck in uncomfortable stages of transition, life has shown me that none of those things are actually true, and I'm very hopeful for the future. I hope that you can reach that point, too, and that you don't have to forever carry such a burden.

Thank you, that was sweet.
Well I have been dating and yes I have met nice guys... but when it comes to love... from my experience... its complicated. And really I do have a feminine character. A boyfriend once told me that it dissapointed him that I was feminine like the way his ex girlfriends are. He sorth of hoped that I would be different.

And no its not the fault of men as a whole. Or woman. Its just that everything seems to be about looks. Not about how you really are. In terms of female or male. It seems being female or male means nothing anymore except for appearences.

And that saddens me.
Can you understand that?

Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on November 04, 2013, 04:56:59 PM
And You are asking me?
Oh well, jokes aside, I am a firm believer that Water signs have some inherently enhanced femininity in them, which is seen as a blessing in females and somewhat diminishing quality in males. Being a Piscean female, I very much can attest to this, but I would not dare to argue that this is a reason why we know things we never learned. Unless, Sibila (sorry for confusion) would confide with us and confirm that she too is either Pisces or Cancer (I am not mentioning Scorpios, because most of those that I have met have a lot of ... issues going on in their heads...)

I am sagittarius.

Quote from: Sibila on November 04, 2013, 05:34:06 PM
And no its not the fault of men as a whole. Or woman. Its just that everything seems to be about looks. Not about how you really are. In terms of female or male. It seems being female or male means nothing anymore except for appearences.

And that saddens me.
Can you understand that?

My experiences have been quite different.. Early this year I found a wonderful woman who loved me for who I was.. Not what I was or my appearance.. Sadly, I lost her to liver disease.

I'm currently exploring the possibility of getting back together with an exGF (we dated 20 years ago) and she has always loved me for who I was.. Whether I'm a man or woman is immaterial, she loves me for me.

Quote from: Sibila on November 04, 2013, 05:34:06 PM
Thank you, that was sweet.
Well I have been dating and yes I have met nice guys... but when it comes to love... from my experience... its complicated. And really I do have a feminine character. A boyfriend once told me that it dissapointed him that I was feminine like the way his ex girlfriends are. He sorth of hoped that I would be different.

And no its not the fault of men as a whole. Or woman. Its just that everything seems to be about looks. Not about how you really are. In terms of female or male. It seems being female or male means nothing anymore except for appearences.

And that saddens me.
Can you understand that?

Its true that most do only see the appearance,the *dna*,whats *between the legs and not the ears* but remember that change comes with people like you and me.And why i posted my first post,to say that as we all know that feeling,we should let the superficial mind set go and be who we really are.Im glad to see though that your here and like i said,i do hope you stay here with us and we can all teach each other how to be better human beings and not *genders* lol

Quote from: Sibila on November 04, 2013, 10:46:53 AM
IT DOES because you CANNOT fake MASCULINITY! I was VERY creative and always wanted to become an actor. Everyone acknowledged my talent as a kid. So why did I not succeed in pretending to be a boy? Why did I not cope.

And why did they cope??? They were MASCULINE and AUTHENTIC MALES ! Even if they want to be woman. That does not make you a woman!
Most woman do not even want to be woman and look at us with suprise.

I simply cannot and do not believe them... I simply cant. I know that that might hurt others... but it is the truth though.

Everyone is different and even though some of us played the male role rather well, that in no way takes away our femininity.
I hid my transgender issues very well for a long long time.
I love sports; but then there are a lot of ciswoman who love sports also. So don't place every trans woman in the same pigeon hole.
We are like every other segment of the population, we all have our own views on how we perceive things.

Quote from: Sibila on November 04, 2013, 05:34:06 PM
Thank you, that was sweet.
Well I have been dating and yes I have met nice guys... but when it comes to love... from my experience... its complicated. And really I do have a feminine character. A boyfriend once told me that it dissapointed him that I was feminine like the way his ex girlfriends are. He sorth of hoped that I would be different.

And no its not the fault of men as a whole. Or woman. Its just that everything seems to be about looks. Not about how you really are. In terms of female or male. It seems being female or male means nothing anymore except for appearences.

And that saddens me.
Can you understand that?

Yes, I really feel that I can understand that. As sad as it is, looks matter quite a bit.

They matter to some of the men I've met who are more hopeful about me after I get FFS.
They matter in my passability.
They matter to some of the friends I've lost who think it would be "less silly" if I "completely looked the part."
They matter enough to be the fine line in how I'm treated in many places and situations.

There are good eggs and bad eggs. I don't want to get FFS to cater to the bad people, but I do want it to make my life easier and have more confidence in myself -- and frankly, I want to be as attractive as I can for my future significant others. I can't blame them for liking what they like, and as someone who will love them, I want to nurture that. These desires all seem pretty normal to me, it's simply challenging that my starting point is much less fortunate than the majority of other women.

I do wish it didn't matter. The scrimping and saving of money for years is stressful and torturous, but that's the hand we've been dealt. I'm trying to do my best with it, and I'm very, very excited for when the time comes.

Quote from: Kelly the Post-Trans-Rebel on November 04, 2013, 06:16:31 PM
My experiences have been quite different.. Early this year I found a wonderful woman who loved me for who I was.. Not what I was or my appearance.. Sadly, I lost her to liver disease.

I'm currently exploring the possibility of getting back together with an exGF (we dated 20 years ago) and she has always loved me for who I was.. Whether I'm a man or woman is immaterial, she loves me for me.

I was talking about men. Woman are different. But I am not allowed to say so though.

Quote from: Chaos on November 04, 2013, 07:36:21 PM
Its true that most do only see the appearance,the *dna*,whats *between the legs and not the ears* but remember that change comes with people like you and me.And why i posted my first post,to say that as we all know that feeling,we should let the superficial mind set go and be who we really are.Im glad to see though that your here and like i said,i do hope you stay here with us and we can all teach each other how to be better human beings and not *genders* lol

I dont see myself as a bad human.

And I cant help feeling dissapointed that the commen belief of cispeople is that transwoman, are everything, but woman.

And thats not because they are small minded. There have been so many stories in the press of tough alpha males becoming woman...
On the other hand, the internet is flooded with T girls that top men and woman.

Transwoman are not liked and appreciated as the gender they are.

Transwoman constantly seeking the media have made my life harder instead of less hard.

When people meet me and find out, so many times I have heard them say that I am so different from the transwoman they met, who they could not see or believe to be woman.

And we all can call them bigots and bad humans, all we want.
But its the way many people think about us now...and we have " ourselves "to thank for it.

Okay friends 

It's been fun, but not much fun

Topic locked

Thank you

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