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does any body think that early intervention would of helped

Started by stephaniec, January 21, 2014, 11:08:36 AM

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debbie1lawrence

I have frequently referred to my life attempting to pretend I was male as "Living in Stealth".  i've compared it to being a bit like a spy, an undercover cop in the mob, or a Jewish person in Nazi Europe.

Just before my father died, I found out how truly accurate this description was.  By the time I told my parents, the first time, I was about 6 years old.  I was in tears because my mother had unlocked the bathroom door and saw me in her clothes.  After she went to the bathroom, (which was why she unlocked the door, she came out and sat on her bed with me.  I cried, telling her how much I wanted to be a girl.  She seemed understanding and even took me shopping for a pair of tights.

A few days later, everything changed!  They told me that I should never get dressed in public and I shouldn't tell ANYONE about wanting to be a girl.

It turned out that my mother had spoken to her therapist about the issue, and she was told by the psychologist that the "treatment" for transsexuals was daily electroshock for 30 days in a row, "Aversion Therapy" (torture), and if those failed, then lobotomy.  There was not even the possibility of gender reassignment.  Granted this was in 1961, nearly 8 years before Harry Benjamin wrote his study of transsexuals.  Christine Jorgensen had written her book and her story had already been out for around 5 years.  Still, the AMA and APA did not endorse SRS or even HRT.  Doctors could lose their licenses and/or hospital privileges if they assisted a transition.  Castrating a man was considered worse than giving a woman an abortion.

My mother had already been through daily electroshock - 3 separate 30 day treatments, of daily shocks.  Back in those days, there was no anesthesia, no paralytic, and the patient was usually forcibly bound in 5 point restraints.

When I tried to bring it up with my father, he would tell me "I took a test in college and they told me I was 75% female".  At work, however, he dead-ended his career by wearing a pink tie to work.  He tried to encourage me to "pretend you're a boy".

Mom was even more covert.  We began devising a code to let me know which clothes I could take and which ones I couldn't.  She would tie a loose knot in her pantyhose, which meant I could wash them and then "throw them away".  We also had a "goodwill pile" - from which I could take what I wanted.

Even when she found a stash of stuff that included a sexy teddy I really liked, she didn't get angry because I had the stash, she only got mad because I didn't ask for it and just stole it.

When I was 11, she began taking me shopping, and asked me to help her pick out clothes for her.  She'd wear them once or twice then put it on the "goodwill" pile, from which i would take it.  She even bought a pair of Go-Go boots she couldn't possibly wear because a polio operation had resulted in an ankle the size of a grapefruit.  it was a miracle she could even get them zipped.  Those actually ended up in my closet mysteriously.  She even got a wig to cover a bad hairdo, even though she only wore it for about 2 weeks.

Due to asthma (stress aggravated), I was seeing a psychologist several times a week.  When I tried to tell HIM that I wanted to be a girl, he said "we know, and you probably should be a girl, but we aren't allowed to talk about that".  During a research study, they had put me with the girls' dorm house mother and my asthma improved so radically that they actually considered taking me out of the home.  However, when they put me with the boys' dorm house mother, my asthma got so bad i almost had to be hospitalized.

I was a bit different, having undescended testes, I barely met the minimum requirements to be a boy.  Even what I did have was significantly smaller than what other boys had.  There is even a scar that seems to indicate surgery on my scrotum.

When I was 11, my testes dropped, and I wasn't happy about it.  I knew that i would be changing into a man and it made me almost suicidal.  By the time I was 14, i had a deep bass voice and became self-destructive, turning to recreational drugs, alcohol, and prescription drugs that led to a misdiagnosis of epilepsy.  Before long I was drinking into black-outs where I either ended up in the coat room with my head between almost anyone's legs, or with everyone in the room ready to kill me and everyone I was with.

I tried to kill myself at least 40-50 times between high school and college.  Attempts ranged from drug overdoses to playing matador with cars on a dark curvy road to eating 1/4 pound of glass chips and ground glass.  Somehow, I survived.  Ironically, even though I was seeing a therapist, each time I tried to bring up the transsexuality, they refused to even allow me to discuss it.

It wasn't until I was almost 25 years old and was working a 12 step program that I finally shared it with a sponsor as part of my 5th step that I got ANY feedback at all.  Even then, it was very limited guidance.  I told my girlfriend and when she seemed to accept it, I decided to marry her.  I didn't find out until 12 years later that she never accepted, but she didn't want to lose me.

8 years, 1 marriage, and 2 kids later, we went for couples counseling.  This time, my wife brought up the gender issues, and the therapist arranged a one-on-one.  By the end he told me and my wife that I was a transsexual and would probably end up in an early grave if I did not transition.

I started transition and my wife and I got divorced.  It was only when my wife threatened to have my visitation revoked, showing me a letter from a social worker advising that visitation be revoked or at least supervised, unless I stopped the transition, that I aborted the transition.

A 170 lbs, a heart attack, a stroke later, my father's death bed wish was "If I give you nothing else, be yourself, even if that's Debbie".

I've been in transition for over 2 years now, am living full time as female, and am happier and healthier that i have been in a very long time.
Debbie Lawrence
Transsexual, Author of LGBT themed books for Kindle
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Northern Jane

When I was a child in the 1950s ANY support would have been greatly welcomed! The first psychiatrist I saw at age 15 (someone my mother found) had never heard of transsexualism and refused to even look into it. Instead he pronounced me homosexual and suggested to my parents that I be put on testosterone to "make a man of me". My insistence that I was/should have been a girl was considered a delusion and things like aversion therapy and forced incarceration was suggested. Not only did I not  have any support but they were going to "cure" me even if it destroyed me!  >:( I didn't give up - I kept pushing - but I was careful not to cross the line that was going to get me institutionalized.

But I survived. I found the help I needed but I had to knock on a lot of doors and educate quite a few doctors.

Do I wish it had been different? Of course! If I had been born in the last 10 years, I would be one of those youngsters in transition before puberty, but I wasn't. As it is, I am glad to have opened a lot of doors. Too many TS people were dying back then and I would like to think I helped change things.
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GinaDouglas

How could it not help?

50 years ago, it wouldn't have helped, because the docs would have tried convincing me to be male.  But today...  I'm jealous of kids who get to go to elementary school in their right gender, and who never have to go through the wrong puberty.
It's easier to change your sex and gender in Iran, than it is in the United States.  Way easier.

Please read my novel, Dragonfly and the Pack of Three, available on Amazon - and encourage your local library to buy it too! We need realistic portrayals of trans people in literature, for all our sakes
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Jamie D

Thank you, Debbie, for sharing your experiences.  I am a child of the 1950's as well.  We did not have much in the way of resources, even in college.  I remember going into the stacks at the main library on campus and reading issues of Psychology Today, looking for answers.

But you know what you, me, Northern Jane, Cindy, and others of our generation are?  Survivors.

Hope to see more from you on the boards.
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calico

My mother attempted some "intervention" at about 12 I think maybe 11, I don't remember, but that "intervention" left me with several emotional scar's so no the intervention didn't help, it just made me hate myself and being alive at the time which in turn led me to self harm, and more "intervention" and more scar's :(  no the intervention didn't help ..............actually , that's my input on this, and this the past is the past and can- not and will not be changed. looking back at it only leads to regret or depression, keep your eyes on the present and the future, which you can change and can be happy.
"To be one's self, and unafraid whether right or wrong, is more admirable than the easy cowardice of surrender to conformity."― Irving Wallace  "Before you can be anything, you have to be yourself. That's the hardest thing to find." -  E.L. Konigsburg
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stephaniec

Quote from: debbie1lawrence on January 21, 2014, 07:05:54 PM
I have frequently referred to my life attempting to pretend I was male as "Living in Stealth".  i've compared it to being a bit like a spy, an undercover cop in the mob, or a Jewish person in Nazi Europe.

Just before my father died, I found out how truly accurate this description was.  By the time I told my parents, the first time, I was about 6 years old.  I was in tears because my mother had unlocked the bathroom door and saw me in her clothes.  After she went to the bathroom, (which was why she unlocked the door, she came out and sat on her bed with me.  I cried, telling her how much I wanted to be a girl.  She seemed understanding and even took me shopping for a pair of tights.

A few days later, everything changed!  They told me that I should never get dressed in public and I shouldn't tell ANYONE about wanting to be a girl.

It turned out that my mother had spoken to her therapist about the issue, and she was told by the psychologist that the "treatment" for transsexuals was daily electroshock for 30 days in a row, "Aversion Therapy" (torture), and if those failed, then lobotomy.  There was not even the possibility of gender reassignment.  Granted this was in 1961, nearly 8 years before Harry Benjamin wrote his study of transsexuals.  Christine Jorgensen had written her book and her story had already been out for around 5 years.  Still, the AMA and APA did not endorse SRS or even HRT.  Doctors could lose their licenses and/or hospital privileges if they assisted a transition.  Castrating a man was considered worse than giving a woman an abortion.

My mother had already been through daily electroshock - 3 separate 30 day treatments, of daily shocks.  Back in those days, there was no anesthesia, no paralytic, and the patient was usually forcibly bound in 5 point restraints.

When I tried to bring it up with my father, he would tell me "I took a test in college and they told me I was 75% female".  At work, however, he dead-ended his career by wearing a pink tie to work.  He tried to encourage me to "pretend you're a boy".

Mom was even more covert.  We began devising a code to let me know which clothes I could take and which ones I couldn't.  She would tie a loose knot in her pantyhose, which meant I could wash them and then "throw them away".  We also had a "goodwill pile" - from which I could take what I wanted.

Even when she found a stash of stuff that included a sexy teddy I really liked, she didn't get angry because I had the stash, she only got mad because I didn't ask for it and just stole it.

When I was 11, she began taking me shopping, and asked me to help her pick out clothes for her.  She'd wear them once or twice then put it on the "goodwill" pile, from which i would take it.  She even bought a pair of Go-Go boots she couldn't possibly wear because a polio operation had resulted in an ankle the size of a grapefruit.  it was a miracle she could even get them zipped.  Those actually ended up in my closet mysteriously.  She even got a wig to cover a bad hairdo, even though she only wore it for about 2 weeks.

Due to asthma (stress aggravated), I was seeing a psychologist several times a week.  When I tried to tell HIM that I wanted to be a girl, he said "we know, and you probably should be a girl, but we aren't allowed to talk about that".  During a research study, they had put me with the girls' dorm house mother and my asthma improved so radically that they actually considered taking me out of the home.  However, when they put me with the boys' dorm house mother, my asthma got so bad i almost had to be hospitalized.

I was a bit different, having undescended testes, I barely met the minimum requirements to be a boy.  Even what I did have was significantly smaller than what other boys had.  There is even a scar that seems to indicate surgery on my scrotum.

When I was 11, my testes dropped, and I wasn't happy about it.  I knew that i would be changing into a man and it made me almost suicidal.  By the time I was 14, i had a deep bass voice and became self-destructive, turning to recreational drugs, alcohol, and prescription drugs that led to a misdiagnosis of epilepsy.  Before long I was drinking into black-outs where I either ended up in the coat room with my head between almost anyone's legs, or with everyone in the room ready to kill me and everyone I was with.

I tried to kill myself at least 40-50 times between high school and college.  Attempts ranged from drug overdoses to playing matador with cars on a dark curvy road to eating 1/4 pound of glass chips and ground glass.  Somehow, I survived.  Ironically, even though I was seeing a therapist, each time I tried to bring up the transsexuality, they refused to even allow me to discuss it.

It wasn't until I was almost 25 years old and was working a 12 step program that I finally shared it with a sponsor as part of my 5th step that I got ANY feedback at all.  Even then, it was very limited guidance.  I told my girlfriend and when she seemed to accept it, I decided to marry her.  I didn't find out until 12 years later that she never accepted, but she didn't want to lose me.

8 years, 1 marriage, and 2 kids later, we went for couples counseling.  This time, my wife brought up the gender issues, and the therapist arranged a one-on-one.  By the end he told me and my wife that I was a transsexual and would probably end up in an early grave if I did not transition.

I started transition and my wife and I got divorced.  It was only when my wife threatened to have my visitation revoked, showing me a letter from a social worker advising that visitation be revoked or at least supervised, unless I stopped the transition, that I aborted the transition.

A 170 lbs, a heart attack, a stroke later, my father's death bed wish was "If I give you nothing else, be yourself, even if that's Debbie".

I've been in transition for over 2 years now, am living full time as female, and am happier and healthier that i have been in a very long time.
Thanks so much for sharing . I had a minor encounter with aversion therapy. I don't know if my parents were being advised or they did it on their own. It was an incident of sending me to school in 1st or 2nd grade with girls snow books magic markered  to try to make them look like male boots. It embarrassed me so  , to the point of crying and screaming. I was an  extreme cross dresser from 4 on and I guess they'd figure to try to scare me out of it. Obviously it didn't work and their solution was to have me sleep in their room away from my sisters clothes. That didn't work either. I guess hopefully it's better these days with counseling I'm glad when I was a kid I didn't see a therapist because of my being extreme introverted and having a extreme case of cross dressing they probably put me in a chair and let the switch wide open. I doubt I would of opened up to a therapist any way. Maybe in these days it's possible to get caring help I hope so for the sake of kids. If I would had have a caring therapist that could of gotten into my brain I might have not gone through the hell I did growing up. I don't know. I do believe though that my gender problem is genetic and nothing could of changed me being female.
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stephaniec

Quote from: Laura Squirrel on January 21, 2014, 02:19:29 PM
Indeed. Worrying about what you could have done (but ultimately can't do) is self-defeating, pointless and will just depress the hell out of you in the end.
I'm sorry you must be referring to me twin , she moved to the Andes  And can't be reached by any means of communication , sorry
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Missy~rmdlm

I learned of my moms transphobia at eight years old before I had come out. I do not think it would have been a good thing...I wish it could have been a good thing.
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stephaniec

Quote from: Laura Squirrel on January 21, 2014, 02:19:29 PM
Indeed. Worrying about what you could have done (but ultimately can't do) is self-defeating, pointless and will just depress the hell out of you in the end.
well, I don't know, if your an educator or physician or have some involvement of some sort in children's   lives  you could make a big difference in how the child accepts his or her self.
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Aina

I am not sure if it would or not, yet I do find myself wishing I was growing up more in today age. It feels as if transgender issues are becoming more aware by society.

When I was really young personal computers were just becoming a thing, and the internet was just becoming a thing. It wasn't till my early teens that I had my own computer and by then I was locked up in my room playing videos games instead of dealing with my feelings. I also I never even heard of transgender. The closest thing I got was called a cross-dresser for wanted to always roleplay female characters in video games from someone I barely knew online. I remember getting in a fight with them and being really adamant about not being a cross-dresser.

Back then my dysphoria wasn't so bad. It wasn't till later middle and high-school that I really couldn't stop desiring/wanting to become female, but by then I was so walled up in denial I stupidly said. "Nope I'll never transition unless I can 100% become female". Now I am 30 nearly done with college and all I can do is think about how much time I wasted.

So here I am 30 years old, lack of any love life for 20+ years, socially awkward and struggling to find the courage to come out so I can finally find myself.

So no I am not sure if it would help, but boy I wish I got help earlier...
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stephaniec

Quote from: Aina on January 22, 2014, 11:00:04 AM
I am not sure if it would or not, yet I do find myself wishing I was growing up more in today age. It feels as if transgender issues are becoming more aware by society.

When I was really young personal computers were just becoming a thing, and the internet was just becoming a thing. It wasn't till my early teens that I had my own computer and by then I was locked up in my room playing videos games instead of dealing with my feelings. I also I never even heard of transgender. The closest thing I got was called a cross-dresser for wanted to always roleplay female characters in video games from someone I barely knew online. I remember getting in a fight with them and being really adamant about not being a cross-dresser.

Back then my dysphoria wasn't so bad. It wasn't till later middle and high-school that I really couldn't stop desiring/wanting to become female, but by then I was so walled up in denial I stupidly said. "Nope I'll never transition unless I can 100% become female". Now I am 30 nearly done with college and all I can do is think about how much time I wasted.

So here I am 30 years old, lack of any love life for 20+ years, socially awkward and struggling to find the courage to come out so I can finally find myself.

So no I am not sure if it would help, but boy I wish I got help earlier...
Well that's what I wish to , because it was a lonely hell with no where to turn. Hopefully things will get better. I spent a long time struggling with this by my self and it was hard, but I do feel so much better now on HRT so life goes on.
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Kaitlin4475

#31
Edit... Oops wrong topic
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stephaniec

To me questions are just a process of learning, growing, helping, healing and finding better ways to understand life's situations. For me learning is understanding which leads to healing and helping. The intention of questions for me is never to disrupt or harm , but just to try to understand . Sorry
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EllieM

I wish I had found the courage to speak out when I was a child. I don't know that things would have gone any better. I suspect that things would have gone worse. That was back when they were still doing electroshock and kids who were "out of control" could be committed to psych hospitals (read "prison") for being incorrigible, well at least up here in the Great White North. I have come to terms with the notion that I was born too early. I said somewhere else, late is better than never.
-ellie
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EllieM

Quote from: Kaitlin4475 on January 22, 2014, 12:06:35 PM
I generally dislike topics like these because they cause us to reinforce the negative body image that many of us have about ourselves. I wasted a lot of time saying "I wish" to myself, which is a toxic way of thinking. Instead I could've invested that time learning to love myself, finding the features I do love about myself. I feel I am just starting to she'd away that mindset or at least the bad parts about it. Hey a girl can dream but make sure it's just that, and not dwell on it. Hope I'm not coming off as mean.

I see no mean here. Nice pic, by the way.
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Alaia

Quote from: Jill F on January 21, 2014, 01:15:57 PM
I really hate playing the "what if" game.  It always seems to end with negative thoughts and emotions.  My path is my path, and what has happened cannot change.  I'm here, in the now and things are finally going my way.

What Jill said. I don't care for playing 'what if' either. Do I wish I was afforded the same privileges that kids today with progressive parents have and are afforded the opportunity to live as their self-identified gender? Yeah, I'll admit I am a bit envious. But that wasn't my lot and no amount of wishing is going to change it. However, it may take me into a dark and non-productive place that I don't want to be in. So I just choose not to dwell on the 'what ifs' and 'could have beens'.

I was raised in a very conservative and religious family, before the internet and before there was real awareness of trans issues. It's been one hell of a journey getting to where I am now. I'm just glad that I finally feel happy about the path I am on now... as in the present, where I can really affect and see change.



"Let yourself be silently drawn by the strange pull of what you really love. It will not lead you astray."

― Rumi
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Kyra553

Everyone's story is abit different from one another.

While growing up I always wanted to ask or talk about being a girl. But I knew if I tried that, my family would have a hard time with it and I could be disowned or just ignored. So I was always a little curious on what would happen if I did tell someone... Heck my school even offered me counseling on other matters and I attended a few sessions for depression. But I never brought up my real thoughts because they would be reported directly to my parents... I guess either way I would get the same result then as I have received now. That result being complete dismissal of my thoughts in my family and no support to be mentioned.

But at least now, I dont have to be dependent of my parents to pursue my own dreams.  :eusa_shifty:
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Allyda

When I was young and knew I was female it was as others have said, back when kids were given electroshock therapy and given that my adopted parents were very religeous I feel it would have done more harm than good. As others have said too: I was born too early.

I also agree with those of you who feel bringing up the past isn't a good idea for most of us. It's best to live in the now and for the future. I'm finally living as me, transitioning, on hrt and loving it. I feel better than I can ever remember feeling, and I have all of you wonderful new friends here on this website to talk to about things when I need to. Yes I won't lie to anyone I do wish I'd have transitioned sooner instea of waisting the best years of my life in misery. But what's done is done, I can't change it. Only move on from here. ;)
Allyda
Full Time August 2009
HRT Dec 27 2013
VFS [ ? ]
FFS [ ? ]
SRS Spring 2015



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stephaniec

Quote from: White Rabbit on January 21, 2014, 06:33:26 PM
I regret now that my mother didn't push me into therapy when I was younger, it might have allowed me to accept myself at a much earlier time in my life. I might have been able to spend most of my life as a woman or even reduced the emotional melt down that I am still suffering from.
yea, that's the point to help with transition. This person I am is so totally integrated into my being that the only solution besides death is life as this person. If there would of been enlightened thinking when I grew up and proper care was given to be free with who you were it would of saved a lot of struggle. For me the relevance  now of thinking of the past is to help the future.
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