So, I am a FTM, still in highschool. I came out about 4 months ago to almost everyone and am fully accepted by my family and most of my friends. I openly talk about my transition and have made it clear that I'm not very sensitive about it, so thus I allow my friends to make make non-offensive jokes about such things. I like to laugh along with them so I don't mind.

However, one's comments have gotten me sad as of late, which is a worry considering I'm already under a lot of stress. He's in a class in which a have a lot of friends, 3 close ones, and he happens to be one of my closest. Since I came out, he, as well as my other of my friends have not shown any hateful behavior towards me, and seem to have fully accepted me. Thus I joke around with them a lot. But recently his comments and 'jokes' have gotten worse and worse, even when it first, they weren't bad at all.

!!TRIGGER WARNING!!

His comments will include things like "You don't have a [penis]"
"You're not a man yet, so you wouldn't know about it."
"You can talk to me about that when you get a [penis]"
"Your therapist is probably a pedophile [because he's willing to help someone as young as you.]" ((Note: My therapist is trans as well))
"I'll call you/treat you like a man when you're a real guy."
And have more recently escalated to flat out things like.....
"You're not/will never be a real man."
"You're a girl/You're not a guy"
And recently, he's hit me as well ((phsysically)) and I'm still sure after the punch he delivered directly to my chest.

Even jokes from my closest friends are not nearly as bad as this, and it honestly hurts cause he used to be a friend. I usually just try to laugh it off and then tell him that it hurts and he should stop, but he never listens. He and everyone else knows that I'm dead serious about transitioning, but I'm not sure he knows when he's crossed the line. I've tried educating him on transgenders, and how his comments can have an adverse effect on some trans* people, but once again, he rarely seems to take it seriously.

I can't find it in me to tell him to stop in any way other than my current passive aggressive methods, and I hate myself for being such a pushover to those I consider/have considered my friends. Especially since I'm not normally like this about things that hit me so hard. So any suggestions? Is it a lost cause to tell him to stop? Can I find a way be more assertive? Anything helps!

That's rough. It never feels good for somebody that close to you to deny who you are. One thing I could suggest, is next time don't pretend to laugh. When it hurts, it hurts, and tell him. If he can't respect you, then he's not worth your time.

Also, I understand very well he's in your classroom and is probably friends with your friends. If it comes down to it, let it be known that you're shunning him.

Transitioning's hard and scary enough. You don't need ->-bleeped-<-ty people like that in your life. I hope the rest of your transition is smoother than that.

I suspect this guy is very insecure in his own sexuality and has not accepted himself. He is lashing out at you due to his insecurity.

I would tell him that if he was secure in his own sexuality then he wouldn't be acting in such an obnoxious way.

I would then try to avoid him and ignore him. If he does respond violently I would report it. He has no right to assault you. That is a criminal offense.

Quote from: MugwortPsychonaut on April 07, 2014, 02:09:36 AM
That's rough. It never feels good for somebody that close to you to deny who you are. One thing I could suggest, is next time don't pretend to laugh. When it hurts, it hurts, and tell him. If he can't respect you, then he's not worth your time.

Also, I understand very well he's in your classroom and is probably friends with your friends. If it comes down to it, let it be known that you're shunning him.

Transitioning's hard and scary enough. You don't need ->-bleeped-<-ty people like that in your life. I hope the rest of your transition is smoother than that.

Thank you, I'll certainly try to increase my efforts and just outright tell him, even if I have to do it in front of our friends.

I agree, transition is already hard enough, and even with how smooth my transition has been going so far, I also don't think I need anyone bringing me down. My fear is that of losing a friend, However, if it comes to that, severing ties'll be easier than just taking his comments.

Quote from: Cindy on April 07, 2014, 02:19:09 AM
I suspect this guy is very insecure in his own sexuality and has not accepted himself. He is lashing out at you due to his insecurity.

I would tell him that if he was secure in his own sexuality then he wouldn't be acting in such an obnoxious way.

I would then try to avoid him and ignore him. If he does respond violently I would report it. He has no right to assault you. That is a criminal offense.

That would actually not surprise me very much, he has occasionally proven himself to act at times more feminine than other guys, and has admitted more than once that he is bi-curious. I honestly hope it is that, because hopefully, if it is, I'll be able to connect further with him, and maybe he'll begin taking my words and worries to heart.

However, he is already at the worst I could possibly imagine, so I can't really say, 'If worse comes to worst' But I will keep that in mind. I will try to assert myself better this time, but I'm not giving him a second chance if he continues after that. As you said Cindy, he doesn't have a right to treat me in such away, so my best option would be to to sever our ties. If I do have to do that, hopefully it'll be easier to report him if he does do something violent towards me.

Quote from: Xenguy on April 07, 2014, 01:58:39 AM
So any suggestions? Is it a lost cause to tell him to stop? Can I find a way be more assertive? Anything helps!

"It hurts when you say that."

At this point it becomes up to him either to consider your feelings or no longer be your friend.

If you're having trouble pushing yourself to do that, pray for courage. (I'm not really big on god, so when I pray, I pray to my inner strength. Works just as well.)

When you are still in high school it's hard to get away from some people. That being said, why don't you just ignore him and remove him from your life? It may not be easy but I don't see what good can come from continuing a "friendship" like that. I went to high school in a small town, and even now ten years later I know just about everyone who stayed in that town. Before I left, I ran into a lot of then daily at the store and my university. I won't get into specifics but there were a large number that I cut off from high school while still going to the school (and many I shared classes with). In 27 years I've lost more friends than I will ever have in my life, and I think I'm much better for it.

Hey man.
I gotta agree with Cindy and say it's probably his own insecurities shining through. I'm just glad to hear you've got everyone else around you who accepts you for who you are and he's just one guy on his own. That stuff's dead harsh. Hope things get better with time.

Quote from: Xenguy on April 07, 2014, 01:58:39 AMEven jokes from my closest friends are not nearly as bad as this, and it honestly hurts cause he used to be a friend.

^ Read that bolded line Xen. I also read you still called this guy a friend of yours in another post above the OP post but you've already realized he's not your friend. (Even if only in subconscious) Friends don't do that to their friends, you've told him to stop, he hasn't and it's getting worse. I know you don't want to lose him but he's not your friend if he's going to do stuff like that to you. My best advice is either tell it to him straight and be forceful/accretive that "These things you're saying to me really hurt me and no friend would say such things to their friend'(s). Either you quit and respect me or you can leave me alone since we clearly aren't friends if you're going to do that stuff to me."

Let him know you're dead serious and if he still continues after you've said something along the lines of what I wrote, stop hanging out around him. Also, if he becomes a problem, get your teach/principal/parents/someone's help. Hope it all works out.

Wow, I'm sorry your friend is saying such things.  While it is an adjustment for everything and it takes time for people to really understand it, I'm getting the vibe that your friend is probably upset about you transitioning more than anything. I hope I'm wrong on that.  In any case, you don't need to be a push over, but you can explain to him why it hurts you and hope to educate him.  Maybe he really doesn't realize that you are getting hurt by his comments.  Maybe he thinks he's just joking around or maybe he doesn't really understand the situation all that well.  That's possible if you try laughing in response to what he says.  In the end,  the only way of discovering which is the case is by having an honest talk with him.  Good luck and I hope things work out for the best.

Oh yes, to add to what I said before. You're already a guy, whether you have the parts or not. Remember that.

It sounds as if he is starting to treat you like a male (even if what he's saying is directly contradicting this). He is exerting dominance over you, and as a male, you need to put him in his place. If you grin and accept it, it will get worse, since you are not dominant. This might be very difficult for you, but this male hierarchy is a very real thing, and you can either allow yourself to sit at the 'bottom' of the pack, or work your way up by extruding confidence, dominance, and power.

Although he probably doesn't realize what he's doing, and as a former friend, you could probably talk to him about it and tell him it hurts, but that isn't a very masculine thing to do. Coming from 26 years of pretending to be a male, I know exactly now how to deal with people like that, and it's as simple as teasing him right back (if he says you don't have a penis // reply my clit puts your dick to shame) or being very confident with him in general, lots of laughing and smiling, punch him in the arm, pat him (hard) on the shoulder when you meet up, or on the upper back, never show hurt on your face or what bothers you, be vulgar...

These are things I learnt when I was in high school, male pecking order is the most intense in high school and then starts to mellow out as you get older, when everyone begins to 'find their place'. You can prove yourself in different ways as well, such as being great at sports, or other male centric activities. Beating bullies or alphas up gives great cred (I went from middle pack to top pack when I beat up a bully who was giving me ->-bleeped-<-, day in and day out). Not respecting authority in general does good for your cred as well (then again I was in high school about a decade ago, so things may change, but gender behaviour is probably the same).

I can keep listing off things that may help, but you may not be interested in dealing with it in this way, since it is very confrontational. You will have to learn how to deal with males from a male perspective eventually though (the same way I'll have to learn how to deal with women as a woman, I only really know how to deal with them as a 'man').

What Nattie said about him treating you as a male is something to consider, but if it is getting too out of control you should tell him how you really feel , but you don't have to do it in front of everyone, do it in private

Quote from: Cindy on April 07, 2014, 02:19:09 AM
I suspect this guy is very insecure in his own sexuality and has not accepted himself. He is lashing out at you due to his insecurity.

I would tell him that if he was secure in his own sexuality then he wouldn't be acting in such an obnoxious way.

I would then try to avoid him and ignore him. If he does respond violently I would report it. He has no right to assault you. That is a criminal offense.

Completely agree. There are a lot of guys out there that are very insecure as to their sexuality. Most just hide it well. I would say be respectful and tell him how you feel about his comments. But as Amandaww said, it is best to do it in private... Guys tend to be very sensitive as to their sexual feelings and hidden desires so to speak. Be careful though it's a touchy subject to say the least.

Yeah it sounds like his comments are a primitive way of dealing with who you are. He doesn't get it and sounds like his confused so his saying ->-bleeped-<- that would make himself feel more comfortable with it. He might have a bunch of questions that he would want to ask you. So I dno maybe hit him up with that? I have a few friends who made comments which I wasn't so thrilled about.......one said
' So what? your gonna start talking like a ->-bleeped-<- now?'
I just told him that he didn't get it and his comment reflected that. Just explained to him that I wanted to sound female. This friend of mine is actually close to me and has been for years. I realised that (his a bit of a block head and probably feeling a little uncomfortable with my transitioning) that what he was really asking was hidden behind his comment.

Thou another friend said to me over the phone ' Ive been telling everyone that your a ->-bleeped-<- '  Im like huh?....He goes ' Yeah you know ->-bleeped-<- / ' It' . so ->-bleeped-<-' (and laughs and tells me to lighten up and that it was just a joke).
That one stung a little. so yeah some peeps are just jerks. I don't have time to educate the jerks of the world.

With your situation - I wouldn't be laughing along with him. Be blunt with him, tell him he doesn't get it. ( Or start spiking his drink with 'E'  Kidding, kidding kidding )

Well it's highly likely that when you said to your friends, they could make comments, it implanted the idea in him that he could say anything. Perhaps he has a hard time knowing what is not good to say to someone, but idk, cuz idk your friend and I don't wanna start assuming.
But if I were you, I would just take him in private, and be like "hey, I know I said you can say things, but you really are going to far with it. You are offending me with your comments, and I really have to ask you to stop. Because if you are my friend, you shouldn't be hurting me like you do."
Now, hopefully he will realize, "oops, I guess those where a little rude," and he'll stop. But if not, and he keeps doing it like a troll, then you really have to ask yourself, is he really that good of a friend to be with? Because I personally don't have friends who hurt me. Why would I want that, and why would you?

Kara is spot on.  If you want to be accepted as a guy, you need to start responding in a maculine way, at least if you want the tessing/rudeness to stop.  Next time he makes a comment like that, you need to put him in his place, eg tease him right back.  If he says something about your inadequacy as a male, say something back, like thanks for the advice, but I would really like a male's perspective on that, and by the way, that is a great shirt, does it come in men's sizes too?

Leave the emotional, communicating for a time when it is just the two of you, not when he is in front of a group acting like the top dog.

Just my two cents!

Best,
Caitlyn

It's been a while, I guess I should update. I am gonna call him K for simplicity's sake. When I came into class, K started with his usual offensive jokes, the way I responded was by simply not laughing and showing that I wasn't enjoying it at all, whenever he crossed the line I would simply say "Seriously, that's not funny." But I wasn't willing to give up on him just yet. Our friend, who is possibly the nicest person who can balance  our hyper with his calm, stepped in and said "[K's Name], that's not very nice." K in turn simply shrugged it off and said "Sorry, I just like pissing people off." This surprised me, and gave me courage to confront him about it.

After school I stayed with them ((Since they usually hang around)) and when K went to the bathroom, I excused myself and said I had to go as well. So I followed him ((I use the guy's bathroom whenever I stay after school)) and said "Dude, can you stop with some of those 'jokes you say about me? Seriously, some of them really hurt.". I'm not going to repeat what he said, but he seemed really embarrassed and half-apologized. It didn't really seem as legit as I wanted it, but I just told him to lighten up on on the offensive jokes and we would be fine.

Since that, I've sorta stopped being pushover and have finally begun enforcing my identity, I correct my friends whenever they use the wrong pronouns or name ((especially K)) and have started responding in more masculine ways ((Once again, especially to K)), while still being myself of course. I've seen results, and K has indeed been more careful about what he 'jokes' about now, however, I still keep him on watch, since he is still the one who seems less keen on accepting my identity. He's still my friend of course, we probably just won't be as close until he learns to  adjust though, but I don't mind.

Thank you all so much for the suggestions and advice, I'm not sure I would've had to courage to follow through on my own ;.;

That is really nice to hear! It's good that your friend understood; if he seemed embarrassed when you talked to him, it's very likely that he hadn't understood how badly he was hurting you. Many guys are daft when it comes to that.

Good on you for enforcing your identity as well!! That takes some courage at first. I am sure they will get used to calling you by the correct pronouns and name very soon, and correcting them can only help.

Well done.

I am glad this turned out well, congratulations.

you should have just kicked his ass.

Kidding.  Glad you got it resolved.