How does a store clerk for instance wrap their heads around that one? What's going through their minds to sir someone showing the women bumps?

If you're being sir'd showing cleavage, I'd think you have some serious passability issues. 

it could just be too soon into HRT, or your voice, or what you were buying was typically male.  They can be so busy at times they probably didn't even look up and really notice who they were talking to.  Don't sweat passing yet.

My wife gets sir'd with her 42DDs all the time.  She's tall and pretty andro, but cis nonetheless.

It seems wierd to me for someone to sir a person who has boobs...

if anything dont use gender specific words at all...

jesus...

Being that I am a store clerk, I don't gender someone I have any doubts about whatsoever and if they seem to be clearly presenting as a woman, I will gender them as such and vice versa. I have one person in there occasionally that does appear to have lady bumps, but they also have a pretty unshaven face and they are obviously male appearing aside from the lady bumps, but they seem to have been wearing a bikini top under their shirt today. I just treated them as normal and didn't gender them at all and was very polite.

^^ I think you being a trans woman you'll be quite cognizant of all the subtle gender markings to gender quite accurately.

But to the average Jane and Joe they are not trained and will rely on instinct. I would think breasts are a woman's strongest gendering asset. It's near eye sight level how can that be avoided. And I'm not referencing the occasional obese man with very large gynecomastia.

If you're wearing obvious female clothes and showing lady bumps then you are infinity presenting more female than an obese gynecomastia guy. And yet if you are *still* getting sir'd then either that's a symptom of extreme prejudice from the store clerk, or FFS is in extreme order.

Either way I still don't get it misgendering in the face of actual cleavage.

I don't know.  I have a noticeable chest and have an andro appearance, but I can and do get gendered male.  Maybe it's cause I'm covered up, but I think overall presentation matters. 

Quote from: Jill F on May 05, 2014, 03:01:07 PM
My wife gets sir'd with her 42DDs all the time.  She's tall and pretty andro, but cis nonetheless.

Sir'd from behind maybe? Does she have short hair? Baggy clothes?

Quote from: Evelyn K on May 05, 2014, 04:15:39 PM
Sir'd from behind maybe? Does she have short hair? Baggy clothes?

Nope, to her face.  And she has long hair she usually ties up. 

Anyone getting sir'd showing cleavage with form fitting female clothes?

Quote from: Evelyn K on May 05, 2014, 04:18:05 PM
Anyone getting sir'd showing cleavage with form fitting female clothes?

Oh well, the world is full of idiots.  My wife does give off a pretty masculine vibe though.  She's dudelier than I ever was and embraces her androgyny.

this topic just made me want to say I <3 boobs, well other peoples, mine can go away haha sorry to take this off track

I get sirred all the time despite (somewhat) visible breasts. Gaining weight has really helped in that department, as the fat conceals them nicely, but I still think they're visible enough. I even have had airport security think that my chest looks "suspicious" and then the male officer pats it down lol. I just don't think breasts are that important in gendering, weirdly enough.

But that said I certainly didn't show cleavage! I think they probably just didn't even glance at the chest area and went based on other things. Work with enough customers and you do become oblivious.

Quote from: Evelyn K on May 05, 2014, 04:18:05 PM
Anyone getting sir'd showing cleavage with form fitting female clothes?

I wear form-fitting female clothes most of the time and have boobs but I never get sir'd like that. Or at all. The most I can manage when presenting as male is I can--male clothes, shoes, no makeup, hidden breasts, etc--cause people to say WTF. Is this a hypothetical question or did it happen? I mean if you're presenting obviously female and have boobs, as long as you don't have a beard, I think you'll be gendered correctly, at least where I am from.

Chromasomes? I thnk that no matter how one looks or sounds or acts everything about how some people gender poeople might just be a scale of masculin and femanin leading to a tipping of the scale in the direction of either XX or XY. And for some chromasomes are the difinition of male and female is decided by this subcontiously.

But for some chromasomes are not a desider and completelly irelavent and preffer to go by how the scale ends up, but the weight of each atribut is different for everybody, exanple I feel that transitioning doesn't make me more female, but I want it because I am? But for some I'm not a woman at all untill I do.

So those two are a what and a who? I know who I am is what's important, but to others its a what that is a colection of physical attributs? And visual and audible presentations?

I had a conversation with my seven year old nephew and tried to exsplain the situation, and even at a young age he showed an ability to think for himself, when I first started presenting as female full time he looked at me and said why you got girls clothes on? I said because I am a girl. So he looked puzzled but asked how? So I said your a boy arnt you? Yes he said, and that no matter how you look or act or like that you still you? Yes. And that you would still be you? And so he smiled and said so Inside you a girl but just look like a boy on the outside

The one thing he did that surprised me was ask how his older brother just luaghed and said you still a boy. And his older sister was it doesn't matter what you are to me. And his younger sister 5 just wants to do make up with me and never once struggle with the name change or pronoun differences.

So even in the same house hold opinions can be exstreamly contrasting.

It's happened to me simply because the cashier doesn't even look up and from there peripheral vision sees that I'm tall and gender me male. One morning i was dress in a tight turtleneck showing off my boobs, long red hair tied very feminine in the back and passing 100%. I was at Dunkin'Donuts and the woman cashier didn't even look up and called me sir when taking my order. (She never looked up once.) The woman (who was tall, but not as tall as me) next to me looked at the cashier like she was crazy. I looked at the woman next to me and just shrugged my shoulder like WTF. The woman next to me responded the same way. Then when it was her time to order, she did it again calling her sir. She looked at me and said that we must all be sir today or something. Then the next woman in line had pink hair and she gets ma'amed. The person handing us our order call us both miss, but it certainly left us wondering how much this cashier was paying attention and we both just laughed it off.

Quote from: learningtolive on May 05, 2014, 04:13:43 PMoverall presentation matters.

yes very important .. not just about clothing & appearance .. but manner too

That's just rude..

Quote from: Pinkie on May 05, 2014, 10:43:57 PM
That's just rude..

Unfortunately there is a lot of rude in NJ and it has nothing to do with being transgender. There are also a lot of nice people here too, so I don't want to bash the state too much, it's too easy, LOL

Seriously though, I an glad that transgender rights are extremely strong in this state in terms of discrimination.

I can only think voice is the culprit. That or, yeah, somebody has some serious passability issues.