How do I fit in with other girls without them knowing I am bi or trans? Okay, what I mean is, I'm a physical born male. But inside I am a woman. What I'm asking is, how can I make friends with girls without someone thinking I want to date them, and without them thinking I am gay? I mean, the people I am around are only people in my youth group at Church, and they would all most likely judge me for who I am, and I don't want that. Any advice or help is appreciated.

Unfortunately, if you are presenting as male they will see and regard you as male. I often had the same issue - and even though I fitted in quite well with many women, and was even in jest referred to as an "honorary woman" from time to time, women will still generally keep certain barriers up and there will be exclusions. No doubt they will appreciate the friendship but if you're not acting "like a man" around them then they probably will perceive you as "gay" too. I'm finding it hard to give you advice since I failed on those fronts on a number of occasions...

Yeah. To be honest that was what I expected. It sucks because I have a very hard time being friends with guys since I'm not one and I guess that would explain why I only have two friends. My best friend who is a girl, I also have a huge crush on, and she does me too but things get in the way of us being together (mostly our friendship and us not wanting to mess it up) so its a little tough to not feel like we are just friends when we both really want to be more. Anyway, I just wish I could fit in with other girls. It hurts honestly. Thanks for your help though.

Before I start its important to define the type of person you are in interactions socially. Are you a loner or a gregarious person? I have been a gregarious person my whole life and have many friends both male and female, and can onll relate from this perspective. When I was a male it was easy to hang with males but I also had many female friends who considered me a potential no matter what I thought. Today, in the closet but having come out to over 60 friends, mostly females,  I find that I am surrounded with female friends who include me in their most intimate convesations however the male, especially the younger ones have changed in how they interact with me. i'm told it has a lot to do with the pheromones we emit which has changed over time on HRT.

Quote from: JackieFox on August 03, 2015, 12:14:18 AM
How do I fit in with other girls without them knowing I am bi or trans? Okay, what I mean is, I'm a physical born male. But inside I am a woman. What I'm asking is, how can I make friends with girls without someone thinking I want to date them, and without them thinking I am gay? I mean, the people I am around are only people in my youth group at Church, and they would all most likely judge me for who I am, and I don't want that. Any advice or help is appreciated.

I dated them.
Once in love, we go blind.
So it wasn't odd when truely interested in what they were doing
even including playing with makeup & dressing. Ya uh can I borrow a piece of yours 
When making friends I doubt you'll be seen as a threat when you're a guy going along with it.
I never really explained it much. I try to be neutral about it and say it's an interest, or a like... Curiosity... Fun...
But that only goes so far untill they notice you show a little bit too much interest.

Like I was hanging out with this artsy type and I kinda attract that stuff. So we ended up having makeover x) but in her eyes it was a jest, in my eyes I want to look nice!

So I was angry at her for not applying it properly making me look ridiculous. Which is funny in retrospect because I must've looked silly nontheless 

That way people really start getting confused or think you're gay. I don't think they understand what's going on unless you tell them. So yeah for blending in without disclosure of how you feel people will make labels no matter what.

Muh.

I've met a few of my old girl friends in the city not too long ago. One of them I dated. They wondered if I was gay.
I just said no, I don't like men, why even question that whilst I used to date you XD.

Find people outside your group who take you as you.

I'm a loner generally because I feel generally like a bother to others and because its next to impossible for me to make friends because I live in the country, am homeschooled, and because I'm just intimidated generally. To be honest I really don't expect to have friends or to fit in at any point in my life. :/ (sorry if I'm being overly negative, I'm a little depressed at the moment..)

Hi Jackie, I have a few TG who are transitioning and the reason why I asked about your social side it is because a very good TG friend is similar to you. She has few friends and can count them on one hand, her family rejects her and she is bullied by her brother and sister despite being the oldest. I met her thru my speech therapist who has this buddy system where you talk with others. We have become very good friends and I would like to think that it is because of me that she has come out and become alot stronger. She will be visiting me in Bangkok Thailand.

Meet someone who is outgoing and force yourself to meet others who are kind and safe. Transitioning in a countryide is more difficult but get a phone buddy. You can PM me if you wish.

I have tried with being more outgoing and my one other friend is very social and from time to time introduces me to people but I NEVER bond with any of them at all and lots of times he will go and spend more time with them then he ever does me, but regardless I'm just not very.. Compatible? With friendship. I can't be friends with guys because I feel very awkward around them and I can't be friends with girls because everyone thinks something of it because I'm a guy physically. Not to mention being pansexual doesn't help when I get a crush on just about everyone.. I'm just not sure what I can do.

Have you started on HRT? I ask that because females can sense the change in you.

I'm sorry, but what does HRT mean?

Quote from: JackieFox on August 03, 2015, 02:19:42 AM
I'm sorry, but what does HRT mean?

https://www.susans.org/wiki/Hormone_replacement_therapy

Okay, no, I am unable to pursue anything to help me be me at the moment because my parents are anti-trans and homophobic (my luck. :/)

Quote from: warlockmaker on August 03, 2015, 02:17:11 AM
Have you started on HRT? I ask that because females can sense the change in you.

My experience so far shows that they dont sense a thing

Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on August 03, 2015, 03:09:10 AM
My experience so far shows that they dont sense a thing

Well it might be subtle...
people have reported men starting to hit on them after some time...
and women getting more open and communicative...


hugs

Quote from: JackieFox on August 03, 2015, 12:14:18 AM
How do I fit in with other girls without them knowing I am bi or trans? Okay, what I mean is, I'm a physical born male. But inside I am a woman. What I'm asking is, how can I make friends with girls without someone thinking I want to date them, and without them thinking I am gay? I mean, the people I am around are only people in my youth group at Church, and they would all most likely judge me for who I am, and I don't want that. Any advice or help is appreciated.

This is one of the issues that prompted me to transition in the end. There was no way to get people to understand that I was female - anyone with eyes or ears would quickly decide I was male. The interest in being connected with one's own gender is wired into our brains - It's part of gender identity and we know how powerful that is. Things have been much better now that I've transitioned. Even women who know my history see me as friendship material now.

I do not think that women "sense" HRT, although your smell and body scent does change on HRT and the "male musk" smell disappears. I notice this smell from men whereas previously I did not.

HRT does change behaviour somewhat and the act of consciously transitioning also stops the repression that many of us use in male mode to hold everything in. I think that once you start becoming your more natural self and the HRT helps the dysphoria lift then others do respond to that. Your inner self begins to shine.

Having said all that, I recall that at my support group there was one person who had been on HRT for a while but still presented in a very masculine way. Strangers still used male pronouns to this person and as a result she could not form female / female friendships because women saw her as a male. She refused to feminise her appearance and mannerisms and was adamant that society should accept her. When I was introduced to her I assumed that she was either very early in MTF transition or possibly FTM. I was shocked to discover that she was several years post-op.

Quote from: vcjhyt on August 03, 2015, 05:40:44 AM
I do not think that women "sense" HRT, although your smell and body scent does change on HRT and the "male musk" smell disappears. I notice this smell from men whereas previously I did not.

Well imo people notice subconsciously.
There are people who say friends started hitting on them whereas before they were only buddies.
Their behaviour changed.
Imo they kind of notice a scent change, and of course further changes...

hugs

Quote from: Swayallday on August 03, 2015, 01:05:37 AM
But that only goes so far untill they notice you show a little bit too much interest.

That way people really start getting confused or think you're gay.

Maybe, not not always. I had two different girlfriends who indulged my "girlie side," who helped me transition. Oh, and I'm still close friends with both of them.

As the goal is friendship with girls, you first have to forget about what they think you are. People have to know how to relate to a person so at first they may think you are boy friend material or gay. As time goes on you will be reclassified as a friend and they won't worry about why.

You need to be polite, friendly and have a smile on your face when you are around them. If you have a conversation with them try to listen more than you speak and make the topic about them and not you. Show an interest in them and what they are doing. It is female to share but as you have had a male upbringing, the less you say about male things, the better.

Before I had my awakening, the female side of me caused me to do many of these things naturally and I learned indirectly from my mother and teacher that the girls in my class had voted me the nicest boy in my class. They do notice even if they don't say it to your face.

Quote from: Dena on August 03, 2015, 09:42:00 AM
... try to listen more than you speak and make the topic about them and not you.

I agree 200% on this one. Men seem to have to "win" the conversation. It does not work in female circles.