Quote from: Keira on December 08, 2007, 02:16:03 PM

Serano can coin anything she wants.
Words are only accepted through use
and in my circles, these words are not liked
at all.

In a smaller circle, they may gain
acceptance, but I don't believe it will
ever spread to the whole community.

Regardless of whether one wants to use her terminology, I believe Ms Serano's analysis of deep rooted issues underlying trans oppression are spot on. One could express these things using other terminology.

y2g

Posted on: December 08, 2007, 05:46:26 PM

---

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 05:08:48 PM
Myth = My identity is not valid.                 


Truth = I'm the one who knows myself. No one else does.



I'm holding back a lot of anger right now.

Agreed. Only each one of us knows how we feel inside. Nobody can invalidate who you are, although it can be extremely frustrating when they try to put us down! I also feel that anger, let's figure out how we can channel it towards creating positive results.

y2g

Quote

Serano can coin anything she wants.
Words are only accepted through use
and in my circles, these words are not liked
at all.

In a smaller circle, they may gain
acceptance, but I don't believe it will
ever spread to the whole community.

QuoteRegardless of whether one wants to use her terminology, I believe Ms Serano's analysis of deep rooted issues underlying trans oppression are spot on. One could express these things using other terminology.

Well, like you said the ones who need to read the book won't read it.

In reality, Serano's terms have gained acceptance by many  in the trans community. I have no idea about "circles" the only trans MtFs I know are on Susan's or other forums. I know of very few trans women however who are happy with the terminology that is currently used to describe our experience.

grs is "not" a need
a transsexual person "chooses" to transition
the term non-op applies to "transsexuals" that "don't want" to have surgery
grs is "elective or cosmetics"
mtf transsexuals are "only" attracted to men

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 05:08:48 PM
Myth = My identity is not valid.                 


Truth = I'm the one who knows myself. No one else does.



I'm holding back a lot of anger right now.

sorry, I can't seem to get past this.

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 08:57:06 PM

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 05:08:48 PM
Myth = My identity is not valid.                 


Truth = I'm the one who knows myself. No one else does.



I'm holding back a lot of anger right now.

sorry, I can't seem to get past this.

does anyone mind if Rebecca just totally vents right now?  she's quoting herself.

OK R., let'er rip!

-ell

Quote from: ell on December 08, 2007, 09:07:16 PM

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 08:57:06 PM

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 05:08:48 PM
Myth = My identity is not valid.                 


Truth = I'm the one who knows myself. No one else does.



I'm holding back a lot of anger right now.

sorry, I can't seem to get past this.

does anyone mind if Rebecca just totally vents right now?  she's quoting herself.

OK R., let'er rip!

-ell

Yes, please Reebs, go head. get it out. we are not here to judge. n loves and understands you. so do others here. we are here for you, my dear friend.

-everything that implies a fascination with being "trans" should die in a fire
-transsexuality is a lifestyle
-"we" should be out and proud   excuse me?
-every trans person has an obligation with the tg community
-every trans person should turn into an activist for trans rights
-a pre-op mtf transsexual "shouldn't" use the ladie's room
-ladie's rooms should be used by cd's, tv's, gender variants and everyone that "dresses like" a woman
-transsexuals should be included in the LGBT
-gender dysphoric ppl are transsexual.  wrong! a gender dysphoric person is just that, gender dysphoric.  that doesn't make them transsexual.
-the soc don't apply to "me"

Quote from:  link=topic=22906.msg173224#msg173224 date=1197169879

Quote from: ell on December 08, 2007, 09:07:16 PM

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 08:57:06 PM

Quote from: Rebis on December 08, 2007, 05:08:48 PM
Myth = My identity is not valid.                 


Truth = I'm the one who knows myself. No one else does.



I'm holding back a lot of anger right now.

sorry, I can't seem to get past this.

does anyone mind if Rebecca just totally vents right now?  she's quoting herself.

OK R., let'er rip!

-ell

Yes, please Reebs, go head. get it out. we are not here to judge. n loves and understands you. so do others here. we are here for you, my dear friend.

One more vote for "let er rip", Reeb! We want to hear what you have to sayl

Feel free to PM me if you want to talk.
y2g

1.  Peeps can't know their true gender at age four
2.  Peeps that transition young don't lose much
3.  Advanced nations are very open-minded about transsexualism
4.  The only transsexual peeps that get killed on the street are those that work as prostitutes
5.  Transition is harder for older peeps
6.  GRS makes us women or men

Nuff said for now!

1. All trans women are selfish, delusional bitches. 

LOL only some of them are.

FFS is not needed to pass.  For some of us it is needed.

Quote from: Katia on December 08, 2007, 07:11:50 AM

Quote from: Seshatneferw on December 08, 2007, 06:44:44 AM
The categories TS, TV, AG etc. can be defined clearly, are absolutely separate, and the criteria do not overlap at all.



  Nfr

yup.  outside you can define yourself as you want.  while you are here, you must include yourself in any of these terms:

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,14714.0.html

plain and simple.

Excuse me?

I don't MUST include myself in anything.

YOU CAN NOT STRIP MY IDENTITY.

I. Will. Not. Let. You.


Biggest Myth Ever:

QuoteMyth = My identity is not valid.

Myth: Identifying as or being out as non-binary is pointless, you'll never be accepted. 

My real life friends are all cisgender (as far as I know) apart from one m2f TS.  They all accept me just fine.  I hang out on a few trans support IRC channels online and the vast majority of people there accept me too (in fact, I'm staff on more than one so I am not just tolerated).  Nor do I have any problems with people I don't know, in fact since figuring out what I am and transitioning out of male role I've become one of these people who ends up in conversations with random people on the street.

'You'll never be accepted' needs the word 'here' adding to the end of it, it doesn't apply to my life one bit.  If you seem friendly and comfortable with yourself most people feel they can relate to you and don't care what equipment you have or what clothes you wear.
(Mind you, it does help to live in a country that isn't full of bigots)

That can't be your piccie.  You look like a genetic girl

Transsexual girls don't look like GG's.  (too universal..some don't but some do)

I didn't do much to achieve a passable feminine voice.  I was kinda born with it
.
My hands and feet are smaller than the average biological male.  I must be some kinda intersex (N is going to love this one )

Transsexual men don't like men (too universal.. some don't but some do)

Estrogen makes me feel like a woman.  Really?  you mean you weren't a woman before HRT.

Primary transsexualism is a myth >

Quote from: Andra on December 09, 2007, 04:01:14 AM
(Mind you, it does help to live in a country that isn't full of bigots)

Andra,

What country is that? The one I live in is getting overrun with them 

y2g

Quote from: Jeannette on December 09, 2007, 06:41:09 AM

I didn't do much to achieve a passable feminine voice.  I was kinda born with it

Jealous?  My voice sucks but my SO used to get ma'amed on the phone long before they came out or transitioned (without trying).  Go figure...

Quote from: y2gender on December 09, 2007, 07:26:42 AM

Quote from: Andra on December 09, 2007, 04:01:14 AM
(Mind you, it does help to live in a country that isn't full of bigots)

Andra,

What country is that? The one I live in is getting overrun with them 

y2g

Not sure about countries, but there are definitely more accepting places out there. . .

Any statement that starts with "Everyone" or "Noone" is a myth...

"everyone needs ffs"

"noone needs ffs"

"everyone can pass"

"noone can pass"

etc.

Quote from: Alison on December 09, 2007, 03:57:43 AM

Excuse me?

I don't MUST include myself in anything.

YOU CAN NOT STRIP MY IDENTITY.

huh is someone here trying to do that, alison? do they actually have the power to "strip your identity"?  did you even click on the link?  every possible identity is described there.  oh but what am i saying?  you're a mod, you should know.

Quote from: Alison on December 09, 2007, 03:57:43 AM


I. Will. Not. Let. You.

of course you wouldn't.  who would.  if someone were trying to strip my identity, i'd be angry too & would leave that place in a flash.  it's called dignity.

Quote from: Alison on December 09, 2007, 07:35:48 AM

Not sure about countries, but there are definitely more accepting places out there. . .

"more accepting places" than??

Quote from: Katia on December 09, 2007, 08:10:12 AM

huh is someone here trying to do that, alison? do they actually have the power to "strip your identity"?  did you even click on the link?  every possible identity is described there.  oh but what am i saying?  you're a mod, you should know.

The fact that you think a list like that can encompass every possible gender identity is amusing to say the least.  Even more so when certain identities fairly common among non-cisgender people are actively derided on this site.

Quote from: Katia on December 09, 2007, 08:10:12 AM
huh is someone here trying to do that, alison? do they actually have the power to "strip your identity"?  did you even click on the link?  every possible identity is described there.  oh but what am i saying?  you're a mod, you should know.

Nope, no one has the power to strip it, no matter now hard people try.  I wonder why I threaten them so badly, I'm fairly innocuous.

And how can every <i> possible </i> identity be described on a webpage on the internet?     Seems rather impossible to me.

Quote from: Katia on December 09, 2007, 08:10:12 AM

Quote from: Alison on December 09, 2007, 03:57:43 AM
I. Will. Not. Let. You.

of course you wouldn't.  who would.  if someone were trying to strip my identity, i'd be angry too & would leave that place in a flash.  it's called dignity.

Are you suggesting I leave Katia? 

Quote from: Katia on December 09, 2007, 08:10:12 AM
"more accepting places" than??

Than less accepting places, duh

*edit* - 8:30am and no sleep makes Alison spell bad