I came out to a close, accepting friend. He is a kind man, and my wife and I both cherish him. Cut to the chase, he started talking about coming to church and that might help "get rid of those feelings." I believe in God, I believe in His unconditional love, no matter how we identify. I don't know quite what to say to my friend. He doesn't get it, and I want to help him understand without alienating him. Thoughts? 
Thank you,
Katie

Quote from: WaterGirl on December 18, 2015, 05:13:32 PM
I came out to a close, accepting friend. He is a kind man, and my wife and I both cherish him. Cut to the chase, he started talking about coming to church and that might help "get rid of those feelings." I believe in God, I believe in His unconditional love, no matter how we identify. I don't know quite what to say to my friend. He doesn't get it, and I want to help him understand without alienating him. Thoughts? 
Thank you,
Katie

Unfortunately, certain Christian churches have been feeding their followers lies. They're told that we're sinners and that we've chosen this lifestyle.

I'd suggest two things.

1. Explain to him that transgender people are born that way - that all evidence points to the fact that our gender is wired into our brains. We face crushing dysphoria unless we address it, and no one has ever shown that any type of therapeutic or religious intervention can change our gender.

2. If that doesn't move him, you may have to put distance between you and him - nothing else you say will probably change his mind.

If he wants to understand, he will.  If he doesn't want to understand, nothing you can do will make him understand.  It is up to you to decide how valuable your friendship is under the circumstances. 

However, friend or not, you need firm boundaries about this.  Tell him firmly, "No, thank you.  This is not something that can be prayed away."  Tell him what you believe about God's undonditional love.

If he chooses to alienate himself from you for having boundaries, that is his choice, not yours.

If your friend will listen to reason, then you will be able to win him over. If he won't listen to reason, you either need to leave him out of your life or accept him with his flaws. The real question is how important is he to you. My parent took a long time to accept me but they were important enough to keep in my life. Unfortunately the transition always seems to have problems and this is one of them.

Quote from: suzifrommd on December 18, 2015, 05:44:14 PM
Explain to him that transgender people are born that way - that all evidence points to the fact that our gender is wired into our brains. We face crushing dysphoria unless we address it, and no one has ever shown that any type of therapeutic or religious intervention can change our gender.

Some people respond to this with "God doesn't make mistakes."

Ask them about the babies born with missing limbs, or eyesight, or holes in their heart... are these "not mistakes" too? Presumably if they are not mistakes then humans shouldn't operate to correct the problem.

You beautiful women help quell the waves of uncertainty and self doubt. Thank you. I pray that I may get inspiration and resolve from your strength and determination.


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Quote from: Ms Grace on December 18, 2015, 06:19:27 PM
Some people respond to this with "God doesn't make mistakes."

And if she does exist (no proof) she obviously created a bunch of transgender people.

Those with the faith can speculate why.

Quote from: WaterGirl on December 18, 2015, 06:32:21 PM
You beautiful women help quell the waves of uncertainty and self doubt. Thank you. I pray that I may get inspiration and resolve from your strength and determination.


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You will learn. We took the wisdom that was passed to us and added to it. This is what we teach other on the site. Some day not to far off you will be passing what you have learned on to somebody else. You will do fine but at the moment you are a bit overwhelmed by all the the new information you are learning from the site.

Water Girl,
Ask him to try to take some time to listen to you explain who you are inside and be willing to think outside the box. If he loves God enough and want to follow His example of unconditional love closely enough he will accept you as you are and love you just as much - even if he is not fully convinced (at least for now) that you cannot change what you are. Jesus loved everyone and was impatient with others for having a feeling of superiority over others who in their minds they considered to be the outcasts of society.

Sorry if this is trite, but you could quote Genesis22-23 (James Bible)

'And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man'

Which is a pretty clear statement that Eve was a trans sexual woman with XY chromosomes. Which raises the question of where did ciswomen come from?

Actually it wasn't a rib, Adam was both sexes til God took the female part out of Adam to make Eve. That's why intersex happens every so often.

Tell him you will be happy to go to a Methodist or Episcopalian church, both of which have clearly defined and articulated doctrinal positions of LGBT tolerance.  If he belongs to any other church, tell him you will consider attending when that church decides to join the 21st Century.

When I was a teenager and battled with GD I told my parents about this problem I did not want to go too school and my mother met this one Christian friend of hers. She reckoned I have a deamon in me and this is what is causing my feelings. They later tried to perform an exorcism on me.

guess what I am still trans to this day

Carlymcx,

You may want to double check on Methodists.  They have a very limited idea (according to the Human Rights Campaign) of GLBT inclusion.  You could add United Church of Christ (UCC-Church I grew up in), Unitarian, 3 of 4 Quaker sects and maybe the 4th., Metropolitan church, and the two largest Jewish sects in USA,(Conservative and Reform). I may very well be leaving other inclusive churches out.  Many of the mainline Protestants are reexamining their positions and this list will almost certainly grow.  I think that this movement for reappraisal is a good sign that there is an underlying groundswell of support.   

Quote from: Ms Grace on December 18, 2015, 06:19:27 PM
Some people respond to this with "God doesn't make mistakes."

I agree, "God doesn't make mistakes."

Being trans isn't a mistake.  (Neither is being gay or lesbian, etc.)

Quote from: Cindy Stephens on December 19, 2015, 08:05:57 AM
You may want to double check on Methodists.  They have a very limited idea (according to the Human Rights Campaign) of GLBT inclusion.  You could add .... 3 of 4 Quaker sects and maybe the 4th.,...

I'm only aware of 3 main groupings (I wouldn't call them sects), at least in the US (and Canada?), generally known by which North American Quaker umbrella organization they belong to: FGC (Friends General Conference, considered the most liberal),  EFA (Evangelical Friends Alliance, the most conservative), and  FUM (Friends United Meeting, somewhere in between.)

The last I heard, FGC was completely LGBT+ friendly, EFA anything but, and FUM is at best uncomfortable with LGBT+ people -- their attitude seems to be don't-ask-don't-tell.

I think the Anglican Church in English-speaking countries is fairly open, too, for a mainline protestant church.  My family was Episcopal ( = USA Anglican), though I haven't been for about 45 years, but I know they had (have?) a gay bishop, women priests, etc.  The African Anglican churches are another story, though.

Quote from: Cindy on December 19, 2015, 12:36:05 AM
Sorry if this is trite, but you could quote Genesis22-23 (James Bible)

'And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man'

Which is a pretty clear statement that Eve was a trans sexual woman with XY chromosomes. Which raises the question of where did ciswomen come from?

OMG thank you for a hearty laugh.  Nothing liking using their sources to raise questions and have fun too

Oh my. I know some "born again" Christians who independently used the "God doesn't make mistakes" line on me. Where do they learn that line because I've heard it from many sources?

As for being "Christian" some of them have the most closed minds I've ever met. So much for accepting the teachings of the Bible which often preached love, forgiveness and the acceptance of others.

Oh, I'm not a "mistake". I was made to be this way by my Creator. :-)

Love,
Clare

Hi:

Disclaimer: I'm completely "areligious" for a variety of reasons.  It seems to work for some and others . . . ?

This will be an interesting time with your friend.  About all I can say for sure is that devoutly held religious beliefs seem pretty impervious to any and all sound reasoning, probably because of the component of faith involved but I'm not sure.  Show your friend kindness and love, and be sure they clearly know where you stand and what your boundaries are.

Keep us informed . . . it's an interesting subject and we care about you.

Take good care,

Rachel

Thank you ladies.
I'm sort of nervous, he's coming over for dinner tonight with me and my wife. I realize being trans has been a huge part of my life, I've always just compartmentalized it and ignored it beyond a fetish/"my secret thing." With that realization, I am ready to explain it more than ever. Heck, I even put up an avatar, sans face. (Need to learn how to do my makeup a bit better first!) I just don't want to get diarrhea of the mouth (which I am infamous for)
Thank you for the suggestions and kind words.
Katie