i hate this old debate...
'u are trans thus u must embrace it and love it'
'be out and proud'
the belief that because you feel trans is a big part of you, doesnt mean it is for everyone.
a TS man or woman are not the same as a gender variant person, or a crossdresser, or a trasvestite. there is only one link between those, that is gender, not being TRANSgender, or that all share some lovely little club membership.
Transexual people CAN leave this behind, and not be obsessed with it being a part of thier personality, or important to them.
Yes the issues gender variant people face are important, and difficult, but they are different. and only gender variant people can truely understand them. I admit freely that i cant understand it.
Kate is right, the transgender community is its own worst enemy. a vicious cycle that traps and marginalises. there isnt a transexual community, there are men and women and the community community... REAL LIFE. not every transexual is in that, but a lot are. The trans community in its veil of acceptance and frilly friendlyness,  is nothing more than a smiling assasin.
You may feel you want to shout from the rooftops, gain accpetance, and help people understand you. Dont assume that its something that is required of people, or that more people being out would actually help... i dont think it would tbh...
I dont want aceptance, i dont need it, i recive it automatically as female, people have understood what i am for all of human kinds existance, woman. If you feel you need to explain that. well, dont expect me to need to also.
R

i also believe that as people, we deserve the courtesy to state our opinions/views/feelings whether we are men, women, gender bender, global moderator, staff, non-staff, the president of the u.s., cleopatra queen of the nile or god.

Hi Claire
Queer? Well I prefer weird, I'm use to that one. Well they are only just labels some people need to tell the tomatoes from the potatoes. Lesbian? Yes, although I would not have thought to labeling my partner and I that. I made the decision 5 years ago to seek a relation ship with another Trans woman. My soul mate and I have lived together now for going on 3 years, but it is intimacy that is the real cement in our relation ship. As far as sex goes, I have no interest in it, for reason's I prefer not to talk about.

The work I am working to start is very much like what you do. I am not afraid to go out in public I worked with people as a social worker for 20 years the last 7 years as Cindy, and the thought of going out to work among people doesn't bother me. Outside of working with Trans folks, I will also be working as part of the team for a local Renfest. So my mug being under public scrutiny is certainly an every day event and I love it. I may not be the prettiest woman to look at but people like me and that's all that maters. Being stuck indoors in a rocker knitting sweaters is not in my plans for growing older.

Cindy   

Quote from: ell on January 01, 2008, 01:00:13 PM

Quote from: Kate on December 31, 2007, 08:27:07 PM
The people in my life know who I am. That's as far as it needs to go for me. I'm just not looking for acceptance "as a transsexual" as the TransGENDERED Community seems to insist and want I do. There IS no TransSEXUAL Community - there are only individuals, mostly mainstream, who just happen to have changed their sex.

I used to view the Transgendered Community as an annoying, though harmless entity. More and more though I'm realizing it's my enemy, as ruthless, impersonal and agenda-driven as any right-wing religious group, determined to alienate me from the very Mainstream Society that I count as my home.

~Kate~

i don't understand this remark coming from a global moderator at Susan's.

on behalf of some very sweet people i know who are gender variant, i take great exception to this remark.

whether there is a Trans community or not, there is a Susan's community, and i think you've offended alot of the people in it. don't know if an apology is in order or not.

Yes, an apology is warranted. I phrased that poorly and WAY too loosely. I do apologize.

I mentioned this in another thread (now deleted)... that the TG community I was referring to is the agenda-driven, political and organized effort to legally and socially classify people who change their sex as "transsexuals," as a special and separate third gender.

I DIDN'T mean the informal "community" of TGs overall, either here or in general, or the community of people in my life. My frustration and fear is only with the political wing aspect that I see as doing more harm than good... at LEAST for transsexuals who are just trying to blend in again.

I DO understand the need for legislation and whatnot to protect people who exist outside the gender binary or heterosexuality. But for someone who is doing everything she can to fit back INTO that binary, it doesn't make sense to include myself in that group. I'll *support* those efforts, but I don't want to be misrepresented... any more than an androgyne would want to be included in a group representing TSs. It's not bigotry, it's not "better than," it's just *inaccurate* and misleading.

My apologies to you and those whom I offended.

~Kate~

Hi -ell hun
I consider myself as just me. I had my humble beginnings here on Susan's 7 years ago then I was off and busy living a productive life as a social worker. I was also involved in a couple other message boards for intuatives, but these boards for what ever reason appeared to just die off, like overnight practically. So here I am one day cleaning out my email box and "lo and behold" Susan's Transgender staring up at me like a big neon sign with all these colors and sparklies and all with a big red arrow pointing to it.  So here I am, back to my humble beginnings, but I am truly happy to be back here, my old home with many wonderful young adults young enough to be my kids. At least this is giving me purpose until I get set up her for my next job.
I'm really glad I came back because it's not what's in it for me, it is what can I contribute.

Cindy   

Posted on: January 01, 2008, 01:58:34 PM

---

Hi Kate, your apologies are accepted, I didn't really think you were like that. For me I haven't been on any teams after I left here 7 years ago, I was just me. In this board I am a trans woman looking to see where she can give some support where ever needed.

Cindy

Okay, Kate.

I totally misjudged you as N said. I am sorry for that. I know that you meant your comments about no one here. I hope you'll forgive me.

N~

sigh. damn

we gotta remember we're family & we dont agree w/each other sometimes.  that's cool. everythin is cool. 

happy new year 2008!

sometimes I worry.

Awwwwwwwwwwwww, shucks, Cindy blushes, and here I didn't think I had any family.
Tanks Chris. Sending a telepathic kiss. "hee, hee, hee." 

Cindy

Quote from: Kate on January 01, 2008, 01:53:55 PM
My apologies to you and those whom I offended.

~Kate~

Kate,

Thanks for your apology. I wasn't offended, we all have our opinions. I'd written a response to the now deleted other thread, however it got locked just at the time I tried to submit it. Oh well. Although we might live in different worlds, and don't always agree on everything, I often find your comments about life as Kate to be enlightening and inspirational in my own journey of discovery.

To me, one of the things that keeps me active in this community at Susan's is the real feeling of community here. I often learn more about myself by participating in discussions, and share about my own experiences in the hopes that it will help someone else not feel the isolation that I felt for so long.

Happy new years everyone!

zythyra

Hi y2gender I do so agree with you and I did what I could to keep emotions from reaching escape velocity. And that other topic and it's creator have appeared to have taken a hike, thank goodness.

Cindy

i must be blind, i never saw the seething emotions going on...
kate, your completely right, as a woman your revolution is to be as whole complete and happy as possible.

Old, but a good conversation. Which myths in our community need to die a quick death?

Quote from: FA on June 12, 2014, 11:36:35 AM
Old, but a good conversation. Which myths in our community need to die a quick death?

Well I'm not going to go back and read everything. Here's my list:
* Transgirls are just super-gay guys.
* We all knew at a young age
* We all couldn't stop ourselves from cross-dressing
* We're all women in a man's body (or vice-versa).
* We all hate our genitals
* Most of us don't pass
* Most of us are sex workers
* Most of us get SRS
* We're neurotic
* We're not real men/women for the purpose of dating
* We were abused/babied/coddled/mistreated/etc. as children
* We grow out of it.
* We're often mistaken about our gender and need to transition
* We regret our transitions and surgeries
* Transwomen are overly concerned with fashion, etc.
* All transwomen are caricatures of women
* Transwomen are pushovers and easy marks
* Transwomen couldn't make it as men
* Transmen just want to be men for the "privilege" it brings
* Transwomen feel like women "inside". Transmen feel like men "inside".
* Transition is easy. There are lots of resources that help us transition.

There's more, but I don't want carpal tunnel.

"Trans men and women are inherently supporting the gender binary in a bad way just by existing."
"Non-binary people aren't really trans."
"Every person who transitions does so because of gender roles."
"All trans people need to adhere to gender roles or they are not really their gender."
"Trans people who like some of or many of the roles that are attributed to their gender only like them because they're attributed to their gender."
"Gender doesn't actually exist."
"Gender is the same as gender roles."
"Brains are not real, biological organs that can be found in our skulls that happen to be sexually dimorphic."
"Brains being sexually dimorphic automatically means there's a biological reason for gender roles despite there being no evidence of this."
"I don't need to back that up with facts because more research needs to be done. This somehow negates all research that has been done so far."

I can probably come up with more.

Quote from: Edge on June 12, 2014, 11:55:40 AM
"Trans men and women are inherently supporting the gender binary in a bad way just by existing."
"Non-binary people aren't really trans."
"Every person who transitions does so because of gender roles."
"All trans people need to adhere to gender roles or they are not really their gender."
"Trans people who like some of or many of the roles that are attributed to their gender only like them because they're attributed to their gender."
"Gender doesn't actually exist."
"Gender is the same as gender roles."
"Brains are not real, biological organs that can be found in our skulls that happen to be sexually dimorphic."
"Brains being sexually dimorphic automatically means there's a biological reason for gender roles despite there being no evidence of this."
"I don't need to back that up with facts because more research needs to be done. This somehow negates all research that has been done so far."

I can probably come up with more.

I was going to list the same myths, so I'll add some different ones I've encountered to the thread.

"If there weren't gender roles, we'd all be comfortable with our bodies."
"Most trans men transition to take advantage of male privilege."
"Most trans women transition because they have a fetish for lesbians."
"Trans men are a conspiracy to eradicate strong women."
"In a society without gender roles, we wouldn't exist."
"If you don't want all the surgeries, you're not really transgender."

How about my favorite of late from the nutjobs: 

Transwomen are nothing more than sexual predators and perverts who get off by using the ladies' restrooms.

Quote from: Jill F on June 12, 2014, 02:15:39 PM
How about my favorite of late from the nutjobs: 

Transwomen are nothing more than sexual predators and perverts who get off by using the ladies' restrooms.

Yep. I confess. You caught me. Nothing gets me hot like walking into a stall and seeing bloody tampons or piss on the seat from a "hoverer".

I Think we need to Get rid of the myths on what makes something a good or a bad place to be trans, specially when we Think of something as gay Rights.

a gay friendly country is not nessesarry the same as a transfriendly country and we have to notice hos we jugde these standards.

Giving you an exemple. Lets say a country who Got really good gay Rights, and gay marrige, and have hate crime Laws With options of treatment for trans People. Sound like a good country to be trans?

But then lets go into details saying gay People are only acceptere because trans arnt, they do have marrige but Nobody asked for it and maybe it not something special in there culture. the hate crime law they Got is very limited and only work for very few caises, and the threatment transgender Can Get are horrible. then its not a good place to be trans.

People who live there are also told they Can "just" move, which is certaibly not always the caise and never easy.

In general we just nede to realise that the stander and Way we experience trans is not the same anywhere, and we Cant jugde a society simply because there are Many fact which need to be considered.

Quote from: Laura Squirrel on June 12, 2014, 02:25:08 PM
Yep. I confess. You caught me. Nothing gets me hot like walking into a stall and seeing bloody tampons or piss on the seat from a "hoverer".

Bahahaha, that's perfect.