I will manage it by burying it, then nobody has to worry about it.

Quote from: jayne01 on June 16, 2016, 09:20:52 AM
I will manage it by burying it, then nobody has to worry about it.

At the moment, your tunnel vision is impenetrable, but I have confidence that you're capable of unraveling this. 

Quote from: jayne01 on June 16, 2016, 09:20:52 AM
I will manage it by burying it, then nobody has to worry about it.

There probably isn't a person on this site who hasn't said that to themselves at one time or another.

The dysphoria will never go away, Jayne.  I learned that after 50 years of struggling with it.  I buried my dysphoria for months, even years at a time, but it always came back.

Still, your decision is your decision, and a very personal one.  You alone can decide when the right time will  be to deal with it.

Blessings to you,

Terri

Quote from: jayne01 on June 16, 2016, 09:20:52 AM
I will manage it by burying it, then nobody has to worry about it.

I know I go through the ups and downs similar to what you are demonstrating.  This is a big change on your life and on her life.

Think of it like this.  (No bad intent)
If you were to suffer with a sudden life changing event (disease, illness, loss of limb, paralysis, blindness, etc)...  I'm certain your wife would not have not signed up for that.  She signed up for a healthy man.   Would it be selfish for you to expect your wife to accept it?  In any case, life as you know it would change...some ways more difficult, some ways just different, and many times it ends up better in some weird way.

I know being trans is not the same thing as some of the events I described, but the principle is the same.  Ultimately, we all have choices in life.  You and your wife have to make the choice.  Like I said, it will be different - difficult - and better in some ways, but you have to go through the process to figure it out.



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Quote from: Maybebaby56 on June 16, 2016, 10:46:06 AM
There probably isn't a person on this site who hasn't said that to themselves at one time or another.

The dysphoria will never go away, Jayne.  I learned that after 50 years of struggling with it.  I buried my dysphoria for months, even years at a time, but it always came back.

Still, your decision is your decision, and a very personal one.  You alone can decide when the right time will  be to deal with it.

Blessings to you,

Terri

I'm not expecting it to go away. I'm sure it will torture me for the rest of my life. It would just be selfish of me if I expected my wife to not be true to herself because of me. I would never ask that of her.

Quote from: jayne01 on June 16, 2016, 10:50:27 AM
I'm not expecting it to go away. I'm sure it will torture me for the rest of my life. It would just be selfish of me if I expected my wife to not be true to herself because of me. I would never ask that of her.

Have you expressed this to her.? if you did, you may be surprised at her reaction. To not be expressing yourself completely will challenge your relationship, and you will not be in a good space either.

In essence, you are trying to give everything up, because you love her so.

[big hug]

Sno

I cannot do that. She would want me to do what makes me happy, even at her own expense. I cannot let her do that for me. This is my curse, not hers or anybody else's.

Quote from: jayne01 on June 16, 2016, 02:47:50 PM
I cannot do that. She would want me to do what makes me happy, even at her own expense. I cannot let her do that for me. This is my curse, not hers or anybody else's.

Attempting to bury your gender dysphoria would also be at your wife's expense. Pain is a signal that something needs improvement. By burying your gender, you would just be ignoring inputs that would allow you to improve the status of your marriage.

As I explained earlier, you can't reduce your expectations to zero and stop receiving painful inputs. Therefore, if you want to be able to do what is best for your marriage, don't attempt to withhold valuable information from yourself.

In other words, stop looking for absolute solutions, when no such thing exists.

Everyone, including your wife, is acting in their best self-interest. Based on what you've told us, your wife isn't asking you to do something, but secretly wanting you to do the opposite, in order to prove your love for her, or is ill-formed of the situation. Therefore, you should have greater respect for your wife's assessment of the situation, and know that she believes managing your gender dysphoria would bring her more pleasure vs. pain, than you attempting to bury your gender dysphoria.

By attempting to self-abnegate, without accepting your wife's input, you're not acting nobly, but self-flagellating and capitulating to fear.

Quote from: jayne01 on June 16, 2016, 08:00:06 AM
I don't care about me. I care about my wife. She did not marry a woman. She is not a lesbian. How can I expect her to compromise her identity just so I can be happy. If my happiness requires her to be compromised in any way, then it is no longer happiness and becomes pure selfish greed.

I know I'm trans, and it sucks! But I will not be selfish and ignore my wife's needs to satisfy something that until only in the past year I didn't even know existed. It is not right.

Why let the world define you or her? She can be with you and to hell with labels. At some point, she has to value her opinion of herself without the lens of society. If she doesn't, then there's not much to be done. It seems like it's a journey for everyone involved.

Jayne,

You can't assign your fears and doubt to your wife, who you've said supports you and would want what's best for you. By claiming that "burying it" would assist her, you're actually denying her her say in all of this. If you truly want her to be happy then work with her on this.

Don't hide your own fears by claiming to be burying it for her. She can probably make her own decisions, can't she?

Please stop!!!

I tried deleting my account and it was denied. I cannot take this anymore! I'm not a strong person. This is killing me. I wish it would actually kill me.

I might have transphobia, I might be afraid, I am probably trans and I definitely am incapable of handling it. I look like a guy wearing women's clothes, I have zero chance of ever passing, I am not a good person. I have no sense of self. I do not relate to anybody because I don't even know who I am.

You are all very nice people, but I don't belong here. So please stop wasting your time with me, I am. It worth it.

Goodbye!

Have you considered that being just gender non-conforming and not fully trans might work better for you? Transitioning to being a woman isn't the only course of action...

Jayne,

First, do believe me when say I understand your pain.

If you don't mind, I'd really appreciate it if you could articulate something.

You recently realized and admitted something to yourself. From what you write it doesn't sound that you now think you were wrong.

Whatever course you decide to take is what you want to do now, at this moment. You've stated that you're making the choice for your wife's sake, and I do respect that. Speaking for myself only, I wouldn't even think of trying to change your mind. All I want to hear is that your plan is not a panic reaction but something you've thought through rationally.

Now for the question—what is it that you want to bury, and how you plan to do it?

Using a different approach—and please don't take this as flippant, as I don't at all intend it to be—were you an airplane, what would be the most similar issue, how would you go about doing what you want to do, and what precautions would you take to ensure the safety of the owner and passengers?

You belong here as much as every other nice person, as you too are a nice person - we've seen that time and again from your thoughtfulness and compassion to those who matter in your day to day reality.

I generally love the company of nice people, even when they are exceptionally hard on themselves.

I'm picky like that.

I also pick how I spend my time, and if I'm helpful, constructive, supportive, simply a good listener or just empathetic, then so be it, none of that time was wasted.

[hugs]

Sno.

I think this outbreak originated from your dissatisfaction with your appearance and a belief that to alleviate your dissatisfaction, you would need to ask too much of your wife.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, my gender dysphoria also makes me want to fully and immediately transition, but I can't now, because the ramifications would be too great. Therefore, to manage my gender dysphoria, I've been removing facial and body hair, losing muscle mass and growing my hair. I still won't dare to cross-dress, because it accentuates how I still very much look like a man, but if I appreciate my progress and continue to make compromises, then I can find peace and happiness, even though I'm so far from my ideal situation.

It can be arduous to manage gender dysphoria, but shrouding it with tenuous moral reasoning, won't be beneficial for your marriage. Therefore, in tandem with your wife, move through your fear, with dignity.

What tears us apart is the conflict between gender dysphoria and our circumstances. For many, including myself, now isn't an opportune time to learn how to live as the opposite sex and accept all of the available treatments, but when a transgender individual moves to the opposite extreme of the spectrum and doesn't accept any treatments available to them, a miserable existence, that metastasizes to those that care about them, awaits.

Sometimes, but with ever diminishing frequency, I still wonder, "WTF am I doing??? 9 months ago I was 170 lbs, bearded, short haired, very muscular, and immediately respected socially. Now I'm 150 lbs, my beard is almost gone, I have long hair, and behind my back, I hear whispers such as, "ogromna dziewcyna" (Polish for "gigantic girl"). Why do I want this???" As I continually drill into your mind, we don't choose what we like, and even though it requires us to make some sacrifices, if we listen to our pain, and refuse to capitulate to irrational fears, we can create a better compromise.

I empathize with you, because I also know what its like to ignore your emotions and live practically. I know all of this can seem ridiculous, but my life, as your life can, has improved in all aspects, in comparison to the melancholic existence I once gritted my teeth through. There really isn't a good argument for unnecessary repression. 

My wife, as well as myself, feel that we cannot stand between the other and their happiness. Doing so will only result in a lot of unhappiness, plenty of animosity, and even resentment & anger. Which she and I can readily attest to after my 30-40 years of relentlessly burying the walking, talking, breathing un-dead Joanne.

We are both some 7 years into my..... non-transition transition. I've changed a lot. I've grown as a person. I am continuing to grow and learn what it is to be me. Seven years still isn't enough to unlearn 50 years of hurt. My wife has seen many wonderful positive changes in me and in our relationship. We both have no idea what the future will bring

Jayne,

I've thought about you quite a bit. I just reread what I wrote yesterday, and realize I did not phrase my thoughts very well. If my words caused you more pain I apologize.

To me the "probably" in your earlier posts seemed very important. Does your decision to bury mean you now feel certain?

What I really wanted to say is that burying something and working around it are completely different things. What I really wanted to say is that burying something and working around it are completely different things. When I hurt my knee I suspected that the cartilage was torn, and a doctor confirmed it was. The choice I made was to not have an operation but to live with it, but that did not mean I could just ignore the fact. I learnt to move more gently and select positions that put the least stress on the joint.

Evidently there are biological reasons that those who are transgender feel the way they do. Self-acceptance does not mean one has to physically and socially transition. What it does mean is that one no longer just blindly strives to feel differently than one does.

The reason I brought up the airplane simile is that some things affect function. While discovering a non-standard engine may perhaps be immaterial to the passengers and doesn't require disclosure to them, you probably would not hide it from the pilot.

Quote from: zirconia on June 18, 2016, 09:23:22 PM
Jayne,

I've thought about you quite a bit. I just reread what I wrote yesterday, and realize I did not phrase my thoughts very well. If my words caused you more pain I apologize.

To me the "probably" in your earlier posts seemed very important. Does your decision to bury mean you now feel certain?

What I really wanted to say is that burying something and working around it are completely different things. When I hurt my knee I suspected that the cartilage was torn, and a doctor confirmed it was. The choice I made was to not have an operation but to live with it, but that did not mean I could just ignore the fact. I learnt to move more gently and select positions that put the least stress on the joint.

Evidently there are biological reasons that those who are transgender feel the way they do. Self-acceptance does not mean one has to physically and socially transition. What it does mean is that one no longer just blindly strives to feel differently than one does.

The reason I brought up the airplane simile is that some things affect function. While discovering a non-standard engine may perhaps be immaterial to the passengers and doesn't require disclosure to them, you probably would not hide it from the pilot.

Sometimes I think that the true self inside us is SWMBO, especially when we admit who we are to ourselves.