Quote from: WarGrowlmon1990 on August 21, 2016, 04:11:58 PM
You're not wasting anybody's time here. I'm in a similar situation. My partner's emotionally abusive too, but it took me a long time to figure it out. Yesterday was an emotional roller coaster but for the first time I started sticking up for myself. I'm not sure if you have social anxiety like me, but that causes me to think everyone's going to judge me and that I'm a burden that wastes everyone's time. Social anxiety can be paralyzing and cause you to back down and keep everything to yourself -- which can make everything so much worse. I don't have much advice to give but I wanted to let you know that you're not alone. I'm sorry you had to deal with other people putting you down when you were reaching out for help.

Sounds familiar. I just feel that I'm wasting people's time, I even got that impression when I was undergoing counselling. I find it incredibly difficult to stand up for myself and so just keep quiet so as to not rock the boat. The only outlet I have for my feelings is on the net and even then I feel as though I'm being judged.

I even went so far as to join Facebook in order to communicate with people, but that just seems to feed the self loathing and inadequacy, I see other people who are "out and proud" and feel useless by comparison, I want to chat to people but I just seem to get lost in the mass, then I post stuff basically as a cry for help and end up getting slated (again) as "attention seeking" or similar.

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 20, 2016, 05:45:46 PM
All I know is, I stay for the sake of my 10yo daughter, it worries me what would happen if I weren't here.

Consider this: what would it be like for your 10-year-old daughter if your wife weren't there? Because that's one of the potential outcomes if you were to speak to a solicitor and start planning for your future. Especially if she's being abusive towards you: you're far more likely to get sole custody if you can prove a pattern of malicious abuse on her part... and even if you don't get sole custody, you're still likely to get at least joint custody. There's nothing about being trans that makes you an unsuitable parent.

Consider what the current situation is like for your daughter. Is she happy? Does the dynamic between her parents provide her with a safe, loving, happy, nurturing environment? Or is that something you could better provide as a single parent? Wouldn't you be happier spending time with your daughter without your wife getting in your hair? Wouldn't your daughter be happier spending time with you without her mum having a go at you and/or her?

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 20, 2016, 05:45:46 PM
I've tried so many times to answer back, to stick up for myself, but something inside stops me, if only I knew what.

'Answer back'? 'Stick up for myself'? These are not things one should have to do with a spouse within a loving marriage. These are things you do with bullies. Or your parents. If you feel you need to react like this, it's because she's bullying you - as I'm sure you'll agree. Or perhaps she's treating you like a child, as some women are wont to do.

The thing that stops you from fighting back is most likely low self-esteem. Perhaps the world has told you for so many years that you're not worth defending, so you've learned not to even try. I'll get to that in a bit.

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 20, 2016, 05:45:46 PM
I'm sorry if anyone thinks I'm wasting their time.

Nobody thinks you're wasting their time. This is a support site, and we're all here to support each other. Including you. You deserve precisely as much support as any of us.


BTW I agree 100% with everything Joanne said in her reply. Your wife is using you as a cash cow so she can lead a cushty life at your expense. I doubt she loves you - at least, not any more (sorry) - and she's only in it for whatever she can get out of it. That's not a failing on your part, so please don't think of it that way.

Joanne got me thinking: you said you left your first wife for your current wife (presumably an affair?): this may well be the reason why she's never trusted you; why she emotionally abuses you; and why she's so threatened by the possibility of your transition. I don't know all the ins & outs of that situation, but is it possible that she saw you as a good provider to your first wife and decided she wanted some of that action? I note she already had a young son at that point and I'd imagine she may have been struggling to make ends meet, so she may have been looking for a partner who would comfortably provide for her & her son so she could sit back, relax, and do what she really wanted to do (this business of hers).

Of course, if it's true that you had an affair with her to end your then-marriage, she'll have insecurities over the possibility that you'll do the same to her. Hence the emotional abuse: the more down-trodden you are; the more insecure you are; the less self-esteem you have - the more difficult it becomes for you to pluck up the courage to dump her for someone who could offer you more than she has to offer. Which means she keeps hold of her cash cow, and she gets to take out her aggression and frustration on a non-threatening partner who'll take whatever she wants to dish out just to keep the peace. Win/win, as far as she's concerned.

That's a classic abusive relationship. Please, whether you're ready to leave her yet or not, please do leave her as soon as you're ready. It will help you enormously in the long-term if you were to make notes of exactly what she does or says to hurt you, every time she does it. Also note whether any of the kids were present (especially your daughter) and the effect it had on them. You could keep it as an online diary (create a Gmail account, and use the Calendar to note each instance - you can even link this to the Calendar app on an iPhone so you can record it on your locked private phone). Just update it after each instance, e.g. by popping off to the loo & updating it there.

I challenge you to do this for 3 months, and then at the end of that period go back through the diary and look at how many times she's hurt you. I bet you'll be surprised how often it happened, and what sort of things are repeatedly done or said. Then ask yourself: if this was happening to a friend or loved one, what would you advise them to do? Well... that loved one is you, so take your own advice.

If you keep your records ticking along, then when things finally come to a head you'll have built up a large body of evidence showing a persistent pattern of her abusive behaviour & the harm it causes both you and your daughter... and she'll have nothing but 'he sometimes likes to wear my knickers!!1!!', which isn't much to go on really, is it?. So you will have a much, much stronger case than hers when it comes to court. And if you keep your cool, calm head whilst doing so, you'll be far more likely to get sole (or joint) custody of your daughter... and then she too can escape this hell.

And you'll be free to start fully exploring your female side, and who knows where that might lead? Either way, you'll be free to discover it for yourself.

I have continued to follow your thread  along with posting a reply previously. I suggest you read the meaning of a true relationship, you and your wife obviously do not have one. Second suggestion, it is time to put on your big girl panties and pants, and show your wife that their can be two bitch's in your relationship and stand up for yourself. Cowgirl up, it is time you took control of your life, you will be better for it and so will your daughter.

A couple of things, first I went through a very similar spiral with my ex and we never got to the question of gender (it was accusations from her of infidelity, none of them founded on anything more than my wanting friendships). We were pretty classically codependent and ironically she was the one who wound up cheating.

A lifetime of chronic low level depression became acute in response to this and I managed to grow substantially as a result as she chose divorce. Addressing depression and self image has been key and one of the first things I learned was that I'm trans and had had no clue as it was masked by years of abuse. As a survivor of abuse I was also a ripe target for my ex's hypercritical treatment. I wish for my kid's sake that gender had come up then but I wasn't ready and by the time I even realized I was trans that relationship was dead in all but the legal divorce.

My current relationship has had its difficulties around gender but those have worked their way out and allowing myself to be trans without guilt was the first step. Being finally - 20 years later - may well be the best cure for depression, however there were other issues that also needed addressing and probably needed to come first.

A few concrete things for you:

Your spouse has absolutely no rights to know about your therapy. If you both agree to do joint sessions then she gets to be right there but that's about the relationship. Your therapy is about you and seeking a therapist better suited to what you need could be best.

For many people there's no better solution to dysphoria than addressing its roots. If you need to cross dress maybe you can do so only at work. If that's not workable, then maybe you need to simply put your heel down and tell her what you choose to wear is not her business. It's your body, I'm hesitant to suggest confrontation but when all other options have been exhausted then being simply assertive is necessary (and to reasonable people this isn't confrontational).

Seemingly more radical but probably in fact easier would be to get onto HRT. Many of us find that our response to estrogen is the final seal on knowing the path we need to follow. Of course this means back to therapy or possibly your physician for a referral to a gender therapist. Again, your medical treatment is your business and yours alone. When I started (weekly intramuscular injection) I simply did it at work where I was fortunate to have a laboratory with a locked door.

You can start on a low dose of estrogen, probably also wanting to block testosterone or just start out with a transitioning dose. I'd say the main downside would be if this is really what you need, going off of HRT isn't easy. I had considered doing only a couple of months to evaluate, by then I was already seeing  some breast development and I couldn't have stayed in a stealth mode for longer than 3 months. Of course a low - non transition dose could let you do this for a long time.

"I'm not a lesbian" is a pretty real thing and seems to be the first thing many of us hear. Easier to solve if you're not monogamous (we are not) but ultimately relationship for many people isn't only about sex. Ironically as I moved toward transition and especially after starting hrt, sex for me became less about a shared orgasm and more about a route to intimacy. That's not something I'd have imagined a decade ago, it's not an unhappy discovery.

"I'm not a lesbian" on the other hand can also be a code phrase for social discomfort which is to say transphobia and / or homophobia. I don't have much sympathy on that. In fact the most recently I heard that phrase  was on letting my gf know I need to pursue transition. Ironically, she had lectured a friend quite recently on trans / homo phobia and not let me get a word in edgewise.

Lastly, your daughter may be better off with you separated. I know my daughters are.

Welcome! Is this the person who called me on the phone a few days ago?

Quote from: Bob W. on August 11, 2016, 10:51:45 AM
I've been agonising for some time over posting this, in view of past experiences I don't know what to expect, but here goes anyway.

I'm 51, married with a 10yo daughter and 16yo stepson. My wife made it clear from an early stage in our relationship that she didn't trust me, consequently I rarely go out alone and have no real "physical" friends to speak of. I'd kept my feelings about my gender under wraps until last year, when at the prompting of a couple of people I told my wife that I had transgender leanings. To say she didn't take it well would be an understatement, we had 2 weeks of silence, accusations, recriminations, and ultimately it was made clear to me that my "issue" is Not To Be Spoken Of.

I have at various times joined (and subsequently left) any number of internet fora, I seem to have a knack of annoying people somehow... unfortunately whenever I open up to anyone about my problems the only suggestion anyone can come up with is "leave", but if I lost my daughter I would literally have nothing. I know I'm stupid for putting up with it (been told enough times) but I just have to keep going-I've always been the "cool" one, the one who has to be strong for everyone else, but I have nobody to lean on myself.

Then of course when I can't take the "advice" people offer me, they lose patience, stop communicating with me, my self loathing grows, and I become more and more desperate until I end up deleting everything in a fit of depression.

Sorry to have rambled on so, hope I've made some sort of sense.

You remind me of my father. He stayed for the kids. In the end, as one of the kids, I don't know that that was the right answer. Especially the younger ones got really messed up emotionally. Even partial custody probably would have been better. Why do you assume straight off that you would lose custody? Does your child hate you? At 10 years old she will have a say in family court as well.

I suppose in your mind you have made your bed. Fine. Lie it in. Make an eight year plan. Of course, that's a darn long time in dysphoria years. But you need to make it out alive if you care about your child.

I have a coworker who basically married a sociopath. He avoided the situation by being a workaholic but that didn't cure anything in the end. He finally ended the relationship when his so-called wife had an affair with one of his son's friends. He was totally devastated by the end of his marriage and his wife made his life hell in family court for a while until the judge got fed up and things stopped going her way. He was ruined financially but has picked the pieces back up AND reunited with his kids. Oh yeah, at first they wanted to live with "cool mom" but even teenagers see through people after a while.

There is life after this relationship. You will be a better person for it and you won't have to live with this depression and self hatred. That's all I can say. You may have to learn how to bury your own trans feelings if you want to stick this out because thinking about being trans is not going to carry you through eight years of self denial, my friend. You need to have such big important stuff going on that you never have time to think about dysphoria. Of course, it's hard to do that and stay balanced and in your kids' lives the way your kids surely want you to be. So I don't recommend this course of action. But can you survive this way? Yes.

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 22, 2016, 03:22:24 AM
I even went so far as to join Facebook in order to communicate with people, but that just seems to feed the self loathing and inadequacy, I see other people who are "out and proud" and feel useless by comparison, I want to chat to people but I just seem to get lost in the mass, then I post stuff basically as a cry for help and end up getting slated (again) as "attention seeking" or similar.

It's very difficult in this world to be out and proud and many trans people don't even try. Being secretive about being trans is pretty common. You are already stressed to the max and are just protecting yourself from more stress you don't need. I probably seem out and proud to some people but I frequently fail to say anything to strangers or stick up for trans stuff in social situations. It just all gets to be too much because it feels like my worth as a human being is on the line. I can and do fight but I can't just fall on my sword and be a martyr for others. It's completely fair to not be the poster child and banner waver.

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 19, 2016, 10:09:44 AM
She claims to still love me... But the words are rarely borne out by the actions. She's quite happy for me to work a 10 hour day then come home and cook and clean while she's on EBay and Facebook. My feelings towards her? I don't know, it depends when you ask. I certainly don't feel loved... But she manages to blame that on me, if she felt loved she'd be more willing to reciprocate... So I try, but my best isn't good enough then I feel resentful. I'm confused, to be honest.

WT*, my dad used to do that too. My mother has narcissistic personality disorder and is a user. I got robbed out of having a father. I could only spend time with him while he was up late at night repairing stuff in the house (after cooking dinner and cleaning up ... oh, and shopping for groceries or doing milk runs ... and cleaning baby diapers by hand and whatever else horrible job got dumped on him). My father sees it as duty before all else. But I am angry. Why was the quality time I got to spend with him so few and far between? While my mother sat on the couch all day eating, watching TV, and bossing us around. The irony? I'm grown now and barely have any relationship with my dad. I'm sure it's hurting him. It hurts me that it hurts him. But he still lives with mom and she still tries to control access to him. And even when I do talk to him, we hardly have anything to talk about. Because we didn't have enough of a relationship then. Yes, I knew and felt my father's love. But I didn't have him. And I've never seen what kind of person he can be outside of my mother's asphyxiating shadow.

Don't be my dad. Don't do that to your child, Bob. Seriously!

This is my story: 

It can be a spouse, a parent, a friend, a sibling.  But so many trans women have one person in their life who is an absolute obstacle to their transition.  It's only after the obstacle has been removed that one can realize how utterly pointless the struggle to meet their needs was.

And it's always the same message. "There's something wrong with you."

There is nothing wrong with you. There is something wrong with someone who can't or won't accept the real you.  The person you are when you go to bed at night and the person you are when you wake up in the morning.

But when you are inside of that relationship, you don't have the ability to look back at it and see it for what it really was.

A transition is all about time.  In the words or brother Mick Jagger, "Hours are like diamonds, don't let them waste."

Quote from: Jane Emily on August 22, 2016, 05:16:50 PM
This is my story: 

It can be a spouse, a parent, a friend, a sibling.  But so many trans women have one person in their life who is an absolute obstacle to their transition.  It's only after the obstacle has been removed that one can realize how utterly pointless the struggle to meet their needs was.

And it's always the same message. "There's something wrong with you."

There is nothing wrong with you. There is something wrong with someone who can't or won't accept the real you.  The person you are when you go to bed at night and the person you are when you wake up in the morning.

But when you are inside of that relationship, you don't have the ability to look back at it and see it for what it really was.

A transition is all about time.  In the words or brother Mick Jagger, "Hours are like diamonds, don't let them waste."

All my life I've had people telling me there's something wrong with me, starting with my family, school, relationships... my counsellor wasn't a deal of help tbh... Maybe the suggestion of an 8 year plan is feasible, it'll give me something to aim for which is feasible... In 8 years I'll be 59, I'll be able to retire with a decent occupational pension, and hopefully I'll still be reasonably healthy... Food for thought

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 23, 2016, 05:06:51 AM
All my life I've had people telling me there's something wrong with me

***hugs***

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 23, 2016, 05:06:51 AM
All my life I've had people telling me there's something wrong with me...

TBH, later in life, (Young adult onward) I was the biggest "Are you Nuts?" party.

Early on my wife would ask the rhetorical question; "Who in their right mind WANTS to be a 50 y/o woman?"; then followup with with a long laundry list of why nots. While she wasn't and still isn't thrilled, she also knows I don't really have a choice in being trans. I can only do what I can to manage my condition in order to do more then just "Survive" as that lifeless, soulless "Thing" I used to be

Quote from: JoanneB on August 23, 2016, 06:41:15 PMWhile she wasn't and still isn't thrilled, she also knows I don't really have a choice in being trans. I can only do what I can to manage my condition in order to do more then just "Survive" as that lifeless, soulless "Thing" I used to be

My wife still seems to think it's some kind of perversion which can be cured... Her cure involves never talking about it and never accepting that it's there. If I could take a pill to make things right-one way or the other- I wouldn't hesitate...

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 25, 2016, 03:12:41 AM
If I could take a pill to make things right-one way or the other- I wouldn't hesitate...

Wow!  You just described the plot of The Matrix - the epic transgender-themed film by transgender sisters Lana and Lilly Wachowski.  Have you seen it?  If not then definitely check it out.

My first wife did leave me some 37 years ago. We were married 3 years and dated for 5. But it was not because I came out to her. It was because I didn't and she found out about me. See I ignored her because I was in love with somebody else. Myself. I love to dress up and admire myself in the mirror. I have always felt different. That is the prevailing opinion of most the ladies here. I know I didn't get to choose. It was predestined. I remarried and my new wife and now my old wife of 31 years was informed early on in our relationship and she didn't accept it so much as tolerate it. We had two kids. I had pretty much repressed my desires for 17 years as we raised our family. About 4 years ago the desire came back and I resumed dressing. In April, in a desire to find out why I would allow the love o my life to leave me so many years ago. I went to the therapist for the 6th time. But this time I revealed my sexual preferences, No not those sexual preferences. The ones that apply to my gender dysphoria and how I perceive myself to be female in a mans body. I was finally able to explain to my ex. I came out totally to my wife and kids. If I got any kind of push back it was because the wife didn't think I should have told the kids. But they were fabulous. Long story short. The therapist issued her letter to the MD and 6 weeks later I began taking Estradiol and have been on it for 10 days now. For the relief from my own mind it has been great, No more hissing in my head. I am at least I believe I am more outgoing. No real body changes as I already had boobs due to taking Spiro for a heart problem for 25 years,but that's ok I am really seeking peace of mind rather than having a slammin body worthy of male attention. I really don't care if I pass. I am seeking a higher standard. Am I accepted.

Dawn,
Your personal history is moving, demonstrating the struggles we face and finally a path to overcome them. Your final conclusions are key:  it's not about the clothes, a striking figure, a pretty face, or even being passable in public.  It's about being true to yourself and those around you, living an authentic life with peace of mind.

This thread should be archived.  It contains incredible wisdom that will benefit many future readers.






Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 25, 2016, 03:12:41 AM
If I could take a pill to make things right-one way or the other- I wouldn't hesitate...

I would probably give it a toss since I wouldn't know which way I'd like to end up. Which puts me in the same boat I am today. I know too much. I know too little. Then there are the days I think maybe "Ignorance is Bliss" which is followed by seeing miserable cis people in action.

Maybe there is a reason why the movie "Harvey" really hit me as a kid and is still one of my top movies of all time. "Take a pill and be Normal" vs not taking it and being .... The what is left to the viewer

Don't know why I feel so down today... nothing extraordinary has happened... just been overwhelmed by a sense of inadequacy again. Maybe it's because I've been thinking too much about it being 2 years on Thursday since I had the opportunity to be Cathy.

Maybe I'll take some time away, try and fit into my "assigned gender role" a bit better. Thank you to everyone who has taken the time to reply.

Online, we can call you Cathy, that's not a problem at all. Yes it's a little living vicariously, but if it helps you feel better about yourself (a little), then that has to be worth a shot.

It's very hard, when we don't feel good about ourselves, and it's very easy when we have been made to feel bad about ourself, for any emergent confidence to be stripped away. It can take very little to reinstate beliefs about unworthiness, and a lot of effort to rebuild them, heaps of emotional work.

I lived with a mantra of 'you're not trying hard enough', 'you're hopeless', 'you're useless' ,'you're lying', and 'you're wrong' for 20 years. It's taken me a further 20-some years to work out just how abusive that was, and I am still living with the ramifications. I still don't feel worthy of any of my success, and I struggle to start anything, because in my mind that tape still plays, and I don't want to 'not achieve'. It still doesn't take much to make me feel a fraud, and retreat back to a place where I feel ok(ish) enough to be able to function.

We will always be here to listen, support and encourage you in thoughts and words; please don't forget.

Sno

Quote from: Bob Wascathy on August 15, 2016, 03:27:11 AM
I'd like to change but every time I try, something inside seems to stop me. If there's an option for comfort without change I haven't found it yet...

HI,
I just read through your post and wished to say, I"m sorry you're not getting the exploring time that I feel you may need, as in dressing to relief the discomfort and see how you feel. Is there anything you can do that you haven't tried to help with your wife's feelings towards this?
Marie