So like a good portion of the rest of the testosterone-riddled FtM community, I take my testosterone through gluteal intramuscular injections.  Generally, it isn't a huge problem.  However, sometime earlier on in my transition, my girlfriend injected the testosterone too high and really did a number on my pre-existing neuropathy, especially in the area that she'd accidentally injected.  The area bruised over within an hour, and the next day I was sporting a huge dark splotch across the entire upper part of my left cheek.  I've brought this up with a couple of my doctors and they didn't seem especially concerned.

Ever since then, getting injections on the left side burns like hell.  The injection itself is just a tad more painful than on the other side, but after I get up and walk around, it feels like the injection site is tearing open with the flexing of my muscles (sometimes it's bad enough that it envelopes my entire left leg or the left side of my body, but I believe that's a fibromyalgia-related complication).  If anyone knows about this sort of thing, I'd appreciate hearing it, but for now I'll move on to my primary point.

Typically I'm given 1.5" needles from the pharmacy that I go to, but they'd be having a bad run of giving me 21 gauge needles (owie).  So my girlfriend requested 23 gauge the next time that she went in and they recommended 1" needles.  I'm concerned because I'm not sure that they're long enough to be assuredly getting into where they need to.  I tried to do a generic search online, but I couldn't come up with any information beyond 'needles between 1" and 2" depending on fat distribution'.  The pain is definitely exacerbated with the use of these shorter needles, though there's no visible reaction; I'm wondering if it's a matter of the injection being in the proper muscle but not being embedded deep enough to be comfortable.

I do intend to ask my doctor, but she has proven to be incredibly unprofessional and is only facilitating my transition in the loosest way.  I try to avoid asking her anything related to transitioning, because aside from biological comparisons to menopause she can give me less information than the internet.

(I don't know if this information is too detailed and could constitute a rule violation, and I'm sorry if it is; I'm really not sure where else I can ask this question, though.)

1" is probably enough however if you Google IM injection and needle length you can find charts for height, weight gender that will say for sure.

Also it seems subcutaneous works virtually as well as im however having been told to use Im, I'm not the type to deviate - and have had the annoyance of having to use 18 ga for some of my injections and having the wrong length (5/8") provided by my doc

All I could find about testosterone being injected subcutaneously were some pilot studies done in 2013 and a few videos of people doing it on Youtube; nothing substantial enough to look like a good option.

I appreciate the suggestion for keywords, too.  I do wonder, though, with regards to finding the charts and variations for gender, which one I would really be looking at for reference?  I'm two years into my hormonal transition, so my fat distribution is incredibly androgynous.

I did find a basic form of the answer to my question in an image from a website training people to give vaccinations that states, "Longer Needles: Hurt less, cause fewer local reactions, and assures proper use and a valid dose[...]"  It's referring to injections into the arm, but I've been told there's no difference in supplies used.

However, I still have the issue that generally I'm finding 'one inch minimum' and 'one inch should be long enough' and that 1.5" is the standard ideal, especially if you have any additional fat back there (which I certainly do).  So I'm figuring it'd probably be best for me to just get the 1.5" needles and be done with it, since that one at least doesn't have the uncertainty or potential pain factors.

I use 1.5", but I inject in the quads because of back problems. I had problems with the pharmacy giving me needles and tried to find what needles to use by googling it, but I didn't find a clear answer either.

I've got neuropathy to varying degrees in both legs, and one leg always hurts when I inject in it while the other doesn't bother me. I find waiting awhile before moving around after the injection gives me less pain from it though.

I have fibro as well. I use 1.5" needles in the thigh. I think the 1" ones you've got/are getting should be fine, but I suppose it would really depend on how much meat you're working with. Like someone mentioned, you could try to inject subcutaneously if you're worried about not reaching the muscle with the shorter needle. There are videos on YouTube about how to do it, and I imagine you could use the same needles you've got now.

I've found that I have no injection-related pain if I follow the following routine on shot day: long run 4-5 hours before shot, massage leg 5 minutes before shot, massage leg immediately after shot, ice pack immediately after shot, and then a leg workout the next day (usually 10-12 hours after the shot). Maybe give this (or something similar) a shot if you feel up to it before your next shot and see if that helps.

I prefer to hit the quads also because I do it myself and it's easier to get to, even though they're a bit more prone to soreness. That seems best minimized by always injecting to the same spot.

I wasn't able to find my original reference for needle length, however it's not hard to tell when I hit the muscle which seems to be at about 5/8" depth for me. At that point I just sink the needle to its full 1" and *slowly* depress the plunger, making the injection faster has definitely meant more muscle soreness the next day.

Oh and I wouldn't want the longer needle, I'd fear for going too deep as you experienced, something no longer than necessary seems proof against that.

I do subcutaneous injections. Aside from a slight recent issue with my RBC count being elevated (which is now under control), I've had nothing but positive results.
AT the last check, my T count was 875 and my E was sitting at 18. I've been on T now for about 10 1/2 months and I 100% pass as male (voice, as well). I've got a decent chin strap going on, tons of body hair, greatly increased muscle mass and everything else that goes along with the whole process.
My endocrinologist said that subcutaneous injections were pretty much exactly the same as IM injections with less discomfort typically occurring after a shot. My leg never gets sore after a shot, honestly. I really don't even feel it going in.
I use a 1" needle and I stick it 3/4ths of the way in to my upper thigh.

I just wanted to hop on and say that if you end up injecting into the fatty tissue, it's not the end of the world and you'll likely see the same results.

I do thigh injected, tried to inject too high (towards groin) and there was burning pain. I guess it's best to stay lower.

I didn't know the needle was supposed to be pushed all the way in?

Quote from: AnxietyDisord3r on August 20, 2016, 04:41:55 AM
I do thigh injected, tried to inject too high (towards groin) and there was burning pain. I guess it's best to stay lower.

I didn't know the needle was supposed to be pushed all the way in?

I inject about midway between the knee and the hip, and I get the needle a little more than 3/4 of the way in before injecting.

I appreciate all the advice and suggestions.  For a little more detail (however relevant/necessary it might be), I have someone who does the injections for me currently and still don't pass due to general body shape.  I got my 1.5" from the pharmacy and, as before, it definitely drops the pain to almost nothing to have the longer needle (aside from my gut, the fat I have is all leg and butt meat).  Unfortunately the pharmacist made it a huge, unpleasant pain, but that's a story for another day.

Overall I want to say that I'm not going to 'just do' anything given the amount of health problems I have, both hormone related and not.  I'm certainly not going to start giving myself SubQ injections with the process and dosage information being different and also in high debate online (though it sounds like the subcutaneous injections are going to be a better idea for me overall).  Currently, I'm not going to change anything since my last injection made it apparent that my dose is too high, as I was hit by the Estrogen A-Train within 24-hours.

Unfortunately, my doctor is clueless about trans*health and I have until December before I see my new endo (there are two in the city, and I was permabanned by one).

@Mal : I typically try for the same thing, re: staying still for a while afterward.  For some reason that doesn't always help the left side, especially since I have to stay laying on my stomach for a good five minutes, but it does help when I can manage.

@FtMax : I get where you're coming from, but I think you're mostly identifying the resulting muscle cramping that can come with the injections.  My pain isn't that so much as an unusual and intense burning sensation that definitely is not aided by any kind of touching/stretching.  I'd also worry about just 'trying SubQ' injections since online it says that they're done weekly, so I assume it's a different dosage.

@SadieBlake : I believe you misread, because I went too shallow, I've never experienced having a needle go 'too deep', but I can say for sure that I have enough meat on my haunches that 1.5" can't hit anything vital (unless my injector is completely off-course).  I definitely agree on the slower injections, though.  We have a system where when I hiss, she slows down the plunger speed, and as a result I no longer deal with any kind of cramping/knots in the place of injection; it also helps to massage directly on the point of injection to distribute the medicine some.

Try 23 gauge, 1". Intramuscular in quads (easier to see than glutes). Two finger widths outside the mid-line to avoid the femur. Use a quick darting jab. Remember to breath. Shift your weight to the off side and alternate sides each time. Avoid any area with varicose veins. 

@ Jin : 23 gauge 1" needles were what I was given that I was having problems with, that's what I was asking about -- whether 1" needles causing a burning pain was normal or meant anything when 1.5" needles barely cause pain.  I prefer 23 gauge needles but can't be picky when the pharmacy has nothing else.  Again, I have been getting injections for almost two years -- I am aware of all the basics.  I also have someone injecting me, so there is no issue with seeing my glutes.  I appreciate the sentiment, and this would probably help someone just getting on testosterone, but your post doesn't address my predicament.

Quote from: WithKeyLymes on August 23, 2016, 12:59:09 PM
@FTMax : I get where you're coming from, but I think you're mostly identifying the resulting muscle cramping that can come with the injections.  My pain isn't that so much as an unusual and intense burning sensation that definitely is not aided by any kind of touching/stretching.  I'd also worry about just 'trying SubQ' injections since online it says that they're done weekly, so I assume it's a different dosage.

You can do subcutaneous injections weekly or biweekly. The dosing may or may not change. It should be dependent on your levels. I've seen a pretty even split between guys staying the same and guys going down in dose when they switch. I'd ask your doctor about it at the next visit. It sounds overall like it would be a much better option for you.

You can also look into ordering syringes online in bulk in the size you want. I'd have to look back and find the post, but quite a few guys here get them from the same site and recommend it. I don't think you even have to provide them with a prescription.

@FtMax : I'll definitely be bringing the possibility of subcutaneous injections with my doctor when I see her again, but as I said, she's pretty clueless in the realm of trans*care.  It's highly likely that she'll just tell me to bring it up with the endocrinologist in... four months.  Plus, my testosterone levels are without-a-doubt in some kind of err at the moment.

I would very much appreciate that website, since I'm sure that would be a whole butt-ton better (no pun intended) than having to pay over a dollar for each syringe.

Quote from: WithKeyLymes on August 23, 2016, 03:59:43 PM
I would very much appreciate that website, since I'm sure that would be a whole butt-ton better (no pun intended) than having to pay over a dollar for each syringe.

That is highway robbery!

Just looked back through, it is allegromedical.com. They sell a lot of home health supplies.

And I just checked and they have some kind of 60% off + free shipping coupon right now. I'm seeing the exact 23g 1.5" that I use in a box of 100 for $18.05 plus free shipping. I usually pay $8 for 24. Time to go shopping!

Woo!  I talked to my doctor today (and a bit over the last week; she was out of town) and she set me up for subcutaneous injections!

So no more worries about the length of my needles so long as they're technically functional.  Instead I now get to deal with the fact that I can get injections just fine -- but giving them myself, and in my belly fat?  That's definitely going to be a work-in-progress for a while.  Thanks for all the advice and support everybody.

@FtMax : Oh glory, that's an amazing website.  D:  Thank you so much.

@ftmax, thanks here also for that link!! I'm spending $30 each refill of 10 because in their infinite wisdom my hardware is 2 scripts, one for the syringe, another for the correct needle. $32 for a two year supply will be a welcome savings!

@withkeylimes (I love your name, my mouth waters Everytime I see it) great news, I see my endo in a few days and will check on how real the need is to continue (ab)using my quads.