Quote from: galaxy on September 07, 2016, 04:32:02 PM
I will stop dutasteride. It has absolutely no effect in my case. I started a very low dose of CPA today. Next bloodwork in 2 weeks will show if it works or not.

Keep us informed.

So what is a good Dhea level for trans women? My most recent lab results show that my Dhea level is 235, which is in the normal range for females but it seems to be in the higher side.

In which unit is this result ?

Quote from: Lucie on September 11, 2016, 01:13:32 PM
In which unit is this result ?

Dhea is 235 ng/dl; and my testosterone is 5 ng/dl

Quote from: kittenpower on September 11, 2016, 03:14:39 PM
Dhea is 235 ng/dl; and my testosterone is 5 ng/dl

235 ng/dl = 2.35 ng/ml
It looks far below overall female range (350 ng/ml - 4300 ng/ml).

Thanks Lucie, do you think I should ask my PCP about taking a Dhea supplement or is my current level ok?

Quote from: kittenpower on September 11, 2016, 03:47:05 PM
Thanks Lucie, do you think I should ask my PCP about taking a Dhea supplement or is my current level ok?

Sorry, I am not a doctor. Your dheas and testosterone levels being very low you should talk to your endo, she certainly knows what to do in your case.

DHEAS and T are below the ranges. Perfect condition.

Too low T might be not so good.

Quote from: Lucie on August 26, 2016, 07:13:35 AM
Did you show the wikipedia page about bicalutamide to the doctors ?

Most scholars and doctors don't trust Wikipedia because anyone can edit it; I distrust it for the same reason.

With that said, I was able to persuade an endocrinologist to prescribe bicalutamide on September 1 and started it that night. So far, the results have been disappointing. Since starting it, I have seen an increase in spontaneous arousal, and have even had incidents in bed for the first time in months. I have also seen an increase in facial hair. At best, it has been neutral for scalp hair, and might even be causing a resumption of thinning and loss... all of this despite my orchiectomy last December. It has also reduced my energy levels, making me more dependent on estradiol for energy. I read it can take longer to work, but so far, the results seem to be overwhelmingly negative, although not nearly as bad as spironolactone. At least it does not cause abdominal fat gain, dry cracked skin, excessive urination, or interference to estradiol - all of which spiro did for me.

Maybe there is a reason so many doctors dislike it? It can raise FSH, or so I read. Then again, FSH should be harmless after orchiectomy, right?

Quote from: Lucie on September 13, 2016, 01:50:56 AM
Too low T might be not so good.

Even at female levels, T still has some androgenic effects. As long as estradiol levels are adequate, we do not need T for energy or bone health. I wish I had very low T.

Quote from: Steph34 on September 18, 2016, 09:44:47 AM
Most scholars and doctors don't trust Wikipedia because anyone can edit it; I distrust it for the same reason.

As of today there are 392 scientific references in support of what is said on the bicalutamide page.
You may distrust all that information, but IMO you and your doctors could benefit from reading it.

Quote
Maybe there is a reason so many doctors dislike it? It can raise FSH, or so I read. Then again, FSH should be harmless after orchiectomy, right?

LH and FSH are raised because bicalutamide blocks androgen receptors in hypothamus and pituitary.
In male body LH and FSH have an action on testes only, which ones you don't have any more. So no harm for you whatever is the level of both hormones.

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Even at female levels, T still has some androgenic effects. As long as estradiol levels are adequate, we do not need T for energy or bone health. I wish I had very low T.

Cis women have and need testosterone at a minimum level for their health and well being, though their main sexual hormones are estradiol and progesterone. I am not sure that having too low testosterone is good for trans women either.

Iam actually on a low dosage of bicalutamide and cyproterone. It seems to work a bit. My acne goes back a bit and hairloss was reduced. Its not on that point youve the feeling things will go better but its a better to let testosterone do its work.

I checked out my levels before HRT. DHEAS was always at levels around 270 ng/dl. I dont believe that my body will decrease it in anyway. That means antiandrogenes for a lifetime. And no feminization for a lifetime.

I saw a new endocrinologist yesterday, one who actually agrees with me that bicalutamide could be beneficial because DHEA-S at 439mcg/dl (an abnormally high level) and testosterone in the female range will still have harmful androgenic effects that could be reduced by blocking the androgen receptors. He still thinks it should stop the problem of unwanted arousal and improve my appearance, even though it has not done so in the first month. As for facial hair, he tells me that hair is very stubborn once it develops, and is unlikely to go away at this point. I never had a full beard (thank goodness), but I do have a number of highly visible hairs on one cheek and below my ears; hormones and anti-androgens have done little or nothing to reduce it. I am undergoing laser treatment for hair on my chin and lips, but that has been horrific for my skin. It would have been nice if hormones alone were enough - or if I had transitioned at 19 or 20, when I did not really have these problems yet.

Quote from: Lucie on September 18, 2016, 10:18:05 AM
LH and FSH are raised because bicalutamide blocks androgen receptors in hypothamus and pituitary.
In male body LH and FSH have an action on testes only, which ones you don't have any more. So no harm for you whatever is the level of both hormones.

My doctor and I agree; I no longer need to worry about LH and FSH. He did not even bother to test them again.

QuoteCis women have and need testosterone at a minimum level for their health and well being, though their main sexual hormones are estradiol and progesterone. I am not sure that having too low testosterone is good for trans women either.

What, exactly do cis women *need* testosterone for, that would be relevant to me? It increases their libido, which is certainly not something I want. It also turns into DHT, which can cause hirsutism, virilization, and hair loss. Since I am trying to feminize a body that had already developed as male, even small amounts of additional T could present a serious barrier to improvement.

Quote from: Steph34 on September 29, 2016, 10:04:45 AM
I saw a new endocrinologist yesterday, one who actually agrees with me that bicalutamide could be beneficial because DHEA-S at 439mcg/dl (an abnormally high level) and testosterone in the female range will still have harmful androgenic effects that could be reduced by blocking the androgen receptors. He still thinks it should stop the problem of unwanted arousal and improve my appearance, even though it has not done so in the first month. As for facial hair, he tells me that hair is very stubborn once it develops, and is unlikely to go away at this point. I never had a full beard (thank goodness), but I do have a number of highly visible hairs on one cheek and below my ears; hormones and anti-androgens have done little or nothing to reduce it. I am undergoing laser treatment for hair on my chin and lips, but that has been horrific for my skin. It would have been nice if hormones alone were enough - or if I had transitioned at 19 or 20, when I did not really have these problems yet.

It's great that you've found an endo who knows bicalutamide. Unfortunately there are not that many.

Quote
My doctor and I agree; I no longer need to worry about LH and FSH. He did not even bother to test them again.

Good.

Quote
What, exactly do cis women *need* testosterone for, that would be relevant to me? It increases their libido, which is certainly not something I want. It also turns into DHT, which can cause hirsutism, virilization, and hair loss. Since I am trying to feminize a body that had already developed as male, even small amounts of additional T could present a serious barrier to improvement.

It's true that women need a bit of serum testosterone for sustaining their libido but AFAIK they need it also for their overall well being (energy level, mood, etc.).
That said I agree that if you do feel right without any testosterone you don't have to bother with it.

New bloodlevels arrived:
DHEAS 340 ng/dl (was 270)
Testo 0,6 ng/ml (was 0,4)

Ive no idea. Its the worst case at all.

Quote from: galaxy on September 30, 2016, 08:34:50 PM
New bloodlevels arrived:
DHEAS 340 ng/dl (was 270)
Testo 0,6 ng/ml (was 0,4)

Ive no idea. Its the worst case at all.

Really strange. What do you endo tell about this ?

I will write him after the weekend. Maybe ive an tumor ... who knows 

Bicalutamide and cyproterone acetate both block androgens so really physically, results matter more and things seem to be improving, according to you. I wouldn't worry about numbers, there is some fluctuation with time, it's normal. Maybe bicalutamide has something to do with the increase, who knows?

Well, I just had my DHEA-S tested again and it went up dramatically to a record 550mcg/dl! That is three times a typical female level and borderline high for a male, which my endocrinologist admitted. He told me there is no way to reduce the level except corticosteroids, which are harmful because they mimic cortisol, which I already have a high normal range level of. He said the bicalutamide should block it even at that high level, but I can't help thinking that the bicalutamide is not working well enough, because I still have androgenic problems. Oh well. I guess it is all I can do, because unlike other anti-androgens, it seems to lack serious side effects in me. I also wonder if I still need dutasteride while on bicalutamide, since the bicalutamide should block DHT, too. Dutasteride has caused some unpleasant side effects (rough, dry, and not soft skin, plus minor swelling of one hand). With that said, my hair is in such a precarious state that even a tiny bit of active DHT could leave me bald. I just wish my hormones would balance themselves.

Quote from: Lucie on September 29, 2016, 11:53:48 AM
It's true that women need a bit of serum testosterone for sustaining their libido but AFAIK they need it also for their overall well being (energy level, mood, etc.).
That said I agree that if you do feel right without any testosterone you don't have to bother with it.

Testosterone is bad for mood; it increases anger and aggression and interferes with the mood-elevating effects of estradiol. Anger seems to run in my family. Estradiol is the most important hormone for energy level and mood, I think, although a full level of estradiol without progesterone may be a bit overwhelming for some.

My testosterone level has consistently been in the female range, but I wish I had less. I think I would look and feel better with a near zero level.

I think i found out whats the reason for the high dheas in some person is. Its called adrenal hyperplasie. That means one of the andrenal glances is for some genetic reason bigger than the other. This hyperplasie causes a little increase of the androgene production. If you are a male mostly its no problem compared to the high T. In women it could mean your T raises by 0,4 ng/ml or more.

The only way for treatment are antiandrogenes and cortisone.