Quote from: mickie on February 07, 2008, 02:20:55 PM
so true berliegh, but it did kind of offend my wife when the one nurse did it while she was standing there..i know it kinda hurt her.


Mickie

I think it must be hard to be married to a female when you want to be a female. I couldn't handle that kind of relationship.......

I think it must be hard to be married to a female when you want to be a female. I couldn't handle that kind of relationship.......
[/quote]


You have to be married to a very strong person, to be married to another person of the same gender when they are not Gay. I believe that the older you are the better the chances of staying together. It depends on how long you have been married too. With all that it's still a crap shoot.

Knowing that you pass is like what all of you have said. If people don't flinch and call you by the right pronoun and they don't take a second look. When people are comfortable around you. I was asked by my new doctor when my last period was and how many children I had and how I had them. Then I broke the news. I know she was making me feel comfortable and giving me my uppers of the day.
Sheila

I have an experiment that people could do when they are ready, of course.

Get on a bus or train full of teenagers (when they are leaving school).  If no one takes a second glance at you, laughs or mocks you, then you definitely pass.  Teenagers tend to be extremely perceptive, and most of the time, if someone reads you, it is more likely to be a teenager.

tink

Quote from: Tink on February 07, 2008, 09:07:34 PM
I have an experiment that people could do when they are ready, of course.

Get on a bus or train full of teenagers (when they are leaving school).  If no one takes a second glance at you, laughs or mocks you, then you definitely pass.  Teenagers tend to be extremely perceptive, and most of the time, if someone reads you, it is more likely to be a teenager.

tink

Oh, I agree.  Early in my transition I would always hate riding the train during after school times. 

When a friend that I've hung out with at least 10-15 times in the last few months didn't know.  Someone told him and when we went out last nite he asked me if it was true and said he literally didn't have any idea.  He was dead serious too, not putting me on.  I told him the truth but maybe I should have just let him keep wondering.   >

Audrey

The group of teenagers test is absolute in its quality. Especially girls, They notice absolutely everything! If you pass among teens you pass. *laughing*

Quote from: Nichole W. on February 08, 2008, 06:21:12 AM
The group of teenagers test is absolute in its quality. Especially girls, They notice absolutely everything! If you pass among teens you pass. *laughing*

I think it's very easy with teenage girls........I used to find it was men aged around 20 which was much harder....

Whatever I'm doing these days it's working.....

Quote from: Tink on February 07, 2008, 09:07:34 PM
I have an experiment that people could do when they are ready, of course.

Get on a bus or train full of teenagers (when they are leaving school).  If no one takes a second glance at you, laughs or mocks you, then you definitely pass.  Teenagers tend to be extremely perceptive, and most of the time, if someone reads you, it is more likely to be a teenager.

tink

That is scary as all hell. 

Quote from: Tink on February 07, 2008, 09:07:34 PM

Get on a bus or train full of teenagers (when they are leaving school).  If no one takes a second glance at you, laughs or mocks you, then you definitely pass.  Teenagers tend to be extremely perceptive, and most of the time, if someone reads you, it is more likely to be a teenager.

tink

Little kids too. Plenty of times I'd pass around adults, but a young child would stare, and sometimes ask me directly which gender I was.

y2g

If your caucasian mtf,
try passing a bunch of teen african-americans
for some reason, which I think is cultural,
I've been read 30x more by them
than adut or teen caucasians.

I think that it comes from having very
narrowly defined idea in their minds
of what a women looks like and
that since we're a different culture,
they are more inclined to not looking
or recognizing gender cues in the face.
they are more
inclined to look at the body.

I'm the same, I often find african women
with very hard "male" face. But, its more
because I'm not used to seeing gender cues
in the face. So, I really more on the body too.

to Berliegh,

yes, it has been somewhat hard for us, but i was honest with her up front before we got married about everything. she and i have no secrets, i knew i could trust her when i told her and she didn't leave, she didn't think it was funny or at all wierd, disgusting or anything. most of the time she enjoys it. plus, at the moment i don't plan on having surgery. i have plans to finish before i ever become a completely physical woman. she is a very, very, very, strong woman. no pun intended, but they way we are, she picks me up and carries me, and i just so love it. never did i think i would have a woman who would carry me like that and enjoy it as much as she does. yes, i have had a few kids ask stuff, he's a girl right mommy? why do you have girl hair?....lol


Mickie

I think it also depends on the people in your area's world-view.

A girl told me that the biggest things that gave me away was my height, stature, and hands. (Just about everything in other words ) But no one would catch on in this town because people just don't look that deep, they don't look for the inconsistencies. Also, since my face is quite female and I carry myself with confidence, it makes people think that i'm female. Works for me!

As for the cultural test, I think that holds true. Its mostly the black and asian exchange girls who catch on.

When I first began in 2002 I was horrified of being read, the school bus full of teenage girls NO FREEQIN WAY I would have ever done that. Zoom 5 years later I have no issues, I don't get treated any differently in public (i.e. grocery shopping, clothes shopping, eating out whatever) then any other woman, no stares, no confusing looks, nada even last year in my bikini on the beach and bring on that school bus I have no doubts I wouldn't get a second look except maybe being judged like other women, her skirts to short is the one I get often LOL

Ah yes the question of questions. For me this is an easy one. My wife, kids and I go to the drive in all the time in the summer. One night I just slipped on jeans, gender neutral type blouse, and transparent make up. Our children are 7 and under 2 of whom are male, well 3 now that the baby is born. So since i usually have to take the boys to the loo as neccesary I tend to be conservative on my femine appearance. Anyways, I went to use the loo by myself. Since I was dressed subtly I felt best to go to the male loo as not to cause problems. LOL, everyone (male and female) stopped me to inform me the female room was across the hall. I acted like I couldn't see the sign through the crowd of guys (it was intermission) lined up and apologized and proceeded to the proper room. I felt if I passes when done up subtly then when I go all out with my appearance I must pass hands down. Next rip up to the drive in I decided to go as me. Soft wedge shoes, denim skirt, pink top, wig and make up done properly. Well, either I passed hands down or there was a lot of blind guys there. I had  guys make those rude comments they tend to make, had a couple give me their numbers and wanted me to come to their cars to watch the movie, or at least pull my car up to theirs etc. Yep that did it- i have no doubt, but still get nervous at times.
                                                Kim   

i'm still terrified of being read, but it happens less frequently than it used to  .  my confidence does really let me down though, i really panic if somebody looks at me in a loo and just stare at the floor - they must read me straight away or think i'm very odd!

jenny
x x

When i was pre name change, id ALWAYS get 'um, ma'am, is this your card?' when using my debit card, needless to say i went to cash fast!

When i was talking to a lesbian friend recently, she was talking about how she was worried using the womens room about being accused of being a guy (shes butch) i was all 'yeah i know' i could have SWORN she knew my past.... evidently not. because when i said i worried, she was why? i finally said why, and she was osh really?

then again, i finally got clocked at work... this lesbian barmaid on shift with me on fri night tricked me into admiting it confirming her hunch... but apparently it was because i was too feminine and played with my hair too much to be a natal female? whut? me? feminine? got to be joking!

I guess its funny, i pass wearing a baggy hoodie and baggy jeans n sneakers... so i guess thats passing when you can wear mens clothes and still be seen as female!
R >

Quote from: Rachael on February 10, 2008, 03:31:48 PM
When i was pre name change, id ALWAYS get 'um, ma'am, is this your card?' when using my debit card, needless to say i went to cash fast!

That used to happen to me before transition ......especially in ASDA......'ma'am, is this your card'? 'have you stolen it'?

Quote from: Rachael on February 10, 2008, 03:31:48 PM

I guess its funny, i pass wearing a baggy hoodie and baggy jeans n sneakers... so i guess thats passing when you can wear mens clothes and still be seen as female!

Me too......I pass with a black hoodie, jeans and trainers.....actually even more so than things that are ultra feminine...

Looking at most of the pics I have seen in avatars I would have thought you was genetic female. I don't pass well now. But a few years ago I could ride a bus without being laughed at. But I am not as thin as i was then but i am working on it. 140 pounds is my goal being 5'11 I think it will do for now.

I think that just trying to be ultra fem anymore is more of a dead giveaway than anything.  If you look around at what the majority of women wear you will find it is mostly, you guessed it, jeans and t-shirts or sweaters.  Sometimes nice dress pants and less frequently skirts and dresses and heels.

At my previous job (7 months HRT) even before I made the transistion I got called maam etc. quite frequently even while wearing my blue coveralls at work!! 

Audrey

I agree.  Going ultra glam is an almost sure bet for getting read.  I know what girls will be wearing where I go and just dress to blend in.  More often than not, that means jeans and a cute top.