Hello. I am a 20 yo Male from India. It is very difficult to find Transgender therapists in my country and people who transition are looked down upon here. So this is my first time posting here. Sorry in advance if I made some mistakes.
I wanna talk about my goal. I am 6 foot 3, Weight 80k. I think I have high A levels which is the reason I get acne. For years I wanted to look more feminine and less masculine. I don't want to be a total female but I want to be more androgynous looking. I don't know how to express exactly how I want to look like. But there are these two models called Andreja Pejic and Erika linder. I want to look exactly like them. I do not want breast at all which is I know next to impossible if I take estrogen. I want soft skin like that of a female.  I know that taking Anti androgen will not stop my facial hair growth but I have very thick facial hair and I would like them to disappear haha! If anti androgen wont help then I will probably get laser hair removal. I want my face to look exactly like a girl without any stubble or hair. I want my face to look more fuller and skin to be softer( I heard that estrogen increases fat, makes skin softer and cheeks more fuller). But estrogen also causes breasts development so that's a no no for me. So my question is, If I take anti-androgen like spiro without estrogen, will it make my skin softer, cheeks fuller and help in reducing facial hair? I know its dangerous to take A blockers without e because it can cause bones to be extremely fragile but E may cause breast development which I don't want. So what I thought of doing was to take a very low amount of Estrogen and normal amount of A blockers to get the results I want. Is it possible to get fuller cheeks, soft skin, reduction in facial hair with small dose of E and normal dose AA? It doesn't matter if it takes a long time to see the results .

Thank you so much.

Hi Ihateacne

Welcome to Susan's. I hope you enjoy your time here.

I understand what you want to do and in order to really try and fine tune it the best you can, then getting a Dr involved to help monitor your heath while this is going on would be a great start.

Are you asking "can I have Hormone replacement therapy and get all the feminie effects except the breasts."

I highly doubt that is possible to have no development but the thing is everyone is different  and they react differently so it may well be manageable. In relation to HRT you will always see the caveat YMMV (Your Mileage May Vary) "things could be different for you than they were for me"  , I developed A cup simply because of Low T, Breast tissue is one of the first things to be impacted.

Many of the early things people experience are some slight fat redistribution, breast tenderness and sensitivity, better skin, change in the way they smell. Softer skin and reduced hair seem to be much further down the track for those on Low dose HRT. But I am sure someone jump in with their experience. Oestrogen does not reduce facial hair or change the voice

So you are able to get the very best from being here there are a couple of links we give to all our new members

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Regards
ElizabethK
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Hello ElizabethK. First of all, Thank you so much for replying. I kind of want what you said. I want feminizing affects without developing breasts. I don't mind very tiny breasts but not more than that. I want soft stubble free hairless face like that of a girl. What can I do to achieve that?

Also I cannot find a good doctor here because I am from a small town in India and there is no transgender therapist. But I can get medicines, any type of medicines. I am trying to self medicate by gathering as much info as I can.

Quote from: Ihateacne on July 02, 2017, 04:22:58 AM
Hello ElizabethK. First of all, Thank you so much for replying. I kind of want what you said. I want feminizing affects without developing breasts. I don't mind very tiny breasts but not more than that. I want soft stubble free hairless face like that of a girl. What can I do to achieve that?

You need to have it removed either via laser or Electrolysis. Laser is the fastest and most probably the cheapest however the results vary wildly depending on your hair and skin colour combination, Laser works by using the pigmentation in the hair to heat it so if you have dark hair and light coloured skin then the laser targets the hair better. Some lasers target dark skin and dark hair combinations but you need to do your research depending on what combination you have. If you have any grey in your beard this can only be removed via Electrolysis.

Electrolysis is different and a probe is inserted into each follicle and the hair is removed because the follicle is destroyed where as in Laser the follicle is damaged and cannot produce a hair. The skill of the Electrolysis technician is paramount in order to reduce scarring and effectively destroy the follicle. This can take 100's of hours and requires many sessions. 

Hope that helps...Google is your friend when it comes to understanding hair removal and what is involved

Quote from: Ihateacne on July 02, 2017, 04:25:00 AM
Also I cannot find a good doctor here because I am from a small town in India and there is no transgender therapist. But I can get medicines, any type of medicines. I am trying to self medicate by gathering as much info as I can.

We can not assist you with self medication. This is against the site policy. We can talk about all sorts of things but as to specific dosages and what you need to take that is not the type of support this site provides. I appreciate that you don't have access to a Dr however we are not Dr's and no one here is qualified to advise you on how and what to take. We are a support site and will support you in any way we can and do not judge the decisions you make. If you have a look at the links I gave you it will help you see what we can and cannot discuss on this forum.

Take care

Liz

If you want to fill out your face without any risk of breast growth, one option is medical-grade filler applied by a cosmetic surgeon.  I had Bellafill injected into my face a year ago and it's is semi-permanent - hasn't changed in the past year.  Note I said "cosmetic surgeon" - this needs to be applied safely by a correctly trained specialist, and if you don't have that in your town I wouldn't recommend it (or you could travel to a larger city). 

Facial hair removal.  In my own case, laser worked great for body hair but didn't have much effect on my face - required over 200 hours of electrolysis.  Permanently removing a thick beard takes quite a commitment, and the best method for you depends on your hair type and skin color, but I can say from experience the benefits are definitely worth it.  After the initial shock (literally), electrolysis has made my skin much smoother now that the craters from thousands of thick hair follicles are gone.  I also had my eyebrows permanently re-shaped with electrolysis. 

I didn't have bad acne but did previously get a few pimples.  One surprise is I found nearly all pimples seem to be connected to facial hair.  If I get a pimple at all now, it's from the rare remaining hair root which is then removed through electrolysis.  I never realized how many pimples were caused by ingrown hair.

Traditionally, women who take good care of themselves have a daily skin care routine but this can apply to anyone regardless of gender.  I apply body lotion, and also a facial oil which includes Vitamin E.  This has definitely softened my skin, I now understand why women do this every day.  I have also found a small amount of pure Moroccan argan oil works great on dry skin.

Just some things to consider without any changes to hormone levels.

Sorry for late reply everyone. I had no access to internet. I have been thinking and I think what I want is to be more androgynous looking. Is it possible to just feminize face? like I don't want any hair on my face, i want it to be feminine  like softer skin with fat. For some reasons I can't have FFS. Is it possible to just go on hrt and not have breasts or curvy features but just feminine face?

Quote from: Ihateacne on July 05, 2017, 01:12:04 AM
> Is it possible to just go on hrt and not have breasts or curvy features but just feminine face?

Sorry, but no.  HRT is distributed throughout your entire body.  If levels are high enough to feminize your face, you can't tell it to stop at your neck.

Correctly applied laser or electrolysis doesn't just solve the hair you shave above the skin - it also eliminates the roots which can cause pimples when hair grows sideways (ingrown hair).  Skin without roots is smoother skin.  As you get older, facial hair removal is still possible but becomes more difficult. 

I see how it is. If I tell a doctor to put me on the lowest dose of estrogen possible and normal does of AA, then what will happen? Will the breast growth be smaller? And also if one stops taking anti-androgen, does everything goes back to the way it was before taking AA?

Quote from: Ihateacne on July 05, 2017, 02:52:56 AM
I see how it is. If I tell a doctor to put me on the lowest dose of estrogen possible and normal does of AA, then what will happen? Will the breast growth be smaller? And also if one stops taking anti-androgen, does everything goes back to the way it was before taking AA?

Depending on how long and how much you take it. After a certain point some things will not be reversible by simply stopping, Breasts become as permanent feature if you take the HRT for long enough and you also will become infertile. Some other side effects are loss of night and normal erections...what this means is that when you do get one it hurts, So you need to keep it limber. Mood will change and after awhile things will mostly but not entirely go back to where they were is my understanding.

If one becomes infertile on AA, will that person be normal and become fertile again after stopping AA? And thanks for replying so fast. YOu guys are amazing!

Quote from: Ihateacne on July 05, 2017, 03:06:09 AM
If one becomes infertile on AA, will that person be normal and become fertile again after stopping AA? And thanks for replying so fast. YOu guys are amazing!

I thought it was the Oestrogen responsible for the infertility but I am not qualified and do not Know that for sure...I don't take an AA and I know very little about them.

I see. If I want to get fuller cheeks, what will help? Anti-androgen or estrogen? Sorry I am asking so many questions but I have very less knowledge and want to know as much as I can.

You are trying to target specific area's for improvement As Kendra mentioned in her post

Quote from: Kendra on July 05, 2017, 02:36:08 AM
Sorry, but no.  HRT is distributed throughout your entire body.  If levels are high enough to feminize your face, you can't tell it to stop at your neck.......

MRT Medication do not just target on specific part of the body they do not work like that when you start HRT it is like starting female puberty, you don't know how much change you will get but you do know you will get some.

Surgery is the only thing that can specifically target a feature

Okay. I get it now. I really want softer skin and the fuller cheeks(fat i know that makes cheek looks fuller) that comes with estrogen. However, breast is something that i dont want. Can i get breast reduction later?

Quote from: Ihateacne on July 05, 2017, 07:34:49 AM
Okay. I get it now. I really want softer skin and the fuller cheeks(fat i know that makes cheek looks fuller) that comes with estrogen. However, breast is something that i dont want. Can i get breast reduction later?

Can you? Up to you, your choice

Can androgen blockers alone distribute fat on my cheeks and give me more androgynous look? I  am going to a big city and there is a doctor and i will ask him to put me just on AA for sometime if it can distribute fat on my cheeks and give me more androgynous look but i want to if its possible just on AA

Quote from: Ihateacne on July 05, 2017, 07:34:49 AM
> Okay. I get it now. I really want softer skin and the fuller cheeks(fat i know that makes cheek looks fuller) that comes with estrogen. However, breast is something that i dont want. Can i get breast reduction later?

If you consider the cost, complications and risk of a surgical scar from breast reduction surgery you might find a semi-permanent facial injection filler to be more practical if handled by a qualified medical specialist.  Some people require breast reduction for their well-being (for example FTM) - but intentionally changing your body's hormone levels for breast growth and then having them surgically reduced is not something I would do. 

Since you seem determined to change just the appearance of your face with no other changes, I believe your reasonable options are:

• Laser and/or electrolysis
• Daily skin care with a high quality moisturizer, preferably one that contains vitamin E.  And drink plenty of water,
  this helps your skin. 
• Medical grade filler applied by a qualified, licensed specialist.

After all beard stubble is permanently removed (might require 1 to 3 years of fairly intensive work), skin rejuvenation by a qualified specialist.  Some have had success with fractional laser resurfacing although that has some risk.  I have used micro-needling at a cosmetic surgery clinic with great results.

An androgen blocker is part of HRT, and will allow your existing estrogen levels to be more effective for developing breasts and other areas of your body.   

My skin used to be so oily it would drip off my nose 

One of the great affects of taking an AA was stopping stinking like a guy and my skin drying out. About the only time I get any pimples is when I have more then just a little bit of poison, I mean High Fructose Corn Syrup Sweeteners,  An almost universal substitute for real cane sugar here in the US and almost anything in the supermarket contains it.

I've been on low dose E several times over the decades, starting for the much needed brain reset. After a few weeks to months I had to stop as the physical affects started to manifest and come into conflict with The Prime Directive of being a guy