Quote from: Justarandomname on December 01, 2017, 10:08:00 AM
I guess my thing is this, if you are now truly attracted to "x" gender, maybe you always were but never gave yourself permission to do so.

I don't think it's the same with transgender people as with repressed gays. If I am trans, really a woman, and I am suppressing my attraction to men, am I not suppressing part of my female identity?

Quote from: amandam on December 01, 2017, 12:20:02 PM
I don't think it's the same with transgender people as with repressed gays. If I am trans, really a woman, and I am suppressing my attraction to men, am I not suppressing part of my female identity?

See, that's the problem though.  Gender identity has nothing to do with sexual orientation.  I mean I totally understand that sexual orientation might change (who am I to tell anyone who they are attracted to) but it just seems like when people conflate the two, they are undermining the identities of cis lesbians and mtf lesbians because it subtly implies that they are not really women.

Yeah equating the two is problematic and maybe one of the biggest things the world at large, does not get about us. One option on sexual preference other than giving it a label as a construct (which we know is false) is that it is actually a continuum and that continuum has a slider on it. We sometimes move that slider based on changing desires, chemicals, circumstances, age or other things i am not thinking of right now.

How is that different? I see it as more representative of a wide swath of humanity and it means that there are a lot of pansexual, bisexual, etc people out there. Sometimes we choose to move that slider around a bit, but there are some for whom that is a totally fixed thing. My therapist once talked about how some people for instance only interested in men their entire life, suddenly meet a woman and fall in love. They say i normally don't like women but i really like that woman.

The slippery slope and ramifications about conversion and religious doctrine etc, need not be recognized as part of that because ultimately forcing someone, coercing them, or guilting them into moving their slider or not moving their slider is morally wrong. 

I think that we are running into another issue in differentiating between sexual orientation as a ascribed/innate attribute and sexual orientation as a self proclaimed identity.

For instance, someone can be innately bisexual in the sense that they have the ability at least on some level to be attracted to both genders, but only identify as straight or gay, and that is perfectly valid. Then suppose that person undergoes hormone therapy, and they modify their personal identification (in the sense of gender of attraction) because of changes in their life. Perhaps they just really like the binary dynamic and that is what drives them along their own range of sexual attraction, so going from a straight male (attracted to women) to straight female (attracted to men) makes perfect sense.

In such a case, you have two "different" definitions of sexual orientation at play. Their identity changed based on circumstances and life changes. Their innate orientation most likely did not change and they always had the ability to be attracted to both me and women, and thus the concept of sexual orientation changing due to HRT invalidates the "genetic" predisposition to innate sexual orientation.

My point is -
If an mtf transgender has always been transgender, then s/he could never have been a gay man, even while in a male body. S/he has always been a straight woman. But, she could be a lesbian pre and post-op.

Great topic and I thought I might be alone on this. I was really stuck on women initially but, have shifted in my attraction. I am feeling more bi-sexual than on the lesbian side of the attraction. It makes sense to me that there would be a shift since the hormones affect brain chemistry. Of course this does not mean it affects everyone the same but, it affect us to some extent. I saw this shift, now for me I don't go for the men that are like super buff, or hairy. More of the pretty boys or even some rugged qualities. Sexual orientation is as complicated as gender. Great question though!!!!!!!!

Tl;Dr I'm pansexual so my thoughts may be a bit moot on orientation, but strongly lean lesbian so who knows, maybe useful.

For better or worse I've thought a lot about this as well as listened to my feelings.

There is little question that initial attraction is olfactory and there have been some pretty cool findings about biological / selection advantages conferred thereby. It's also known that women rely more on scent than men in the flirting / pairing dance and also that as transexual women, hrt enhances up our sense of smell significantly (as well as changes our own scents.

So it's not unreasonable to think that as we transition, we're going to begin to feel more open to men and certainly that's reported here, if not yet in any literature.

For me, I remain pretty selective about men I'm interested in, essentially I'm socially only in men who have a pretty strong feminine aspect. I've never paired off with a male in anything but casual / exploring / fwb contexts and I don't feel that changing.

That said, I've had my share of oral sex with guys (giving, never wanted receiving) and I have a pretty strong semen / body fluids fetish and I was open to the option of receptive penetration before surgery but mostly after so many good things had happened due to hrt that many if my negatives about males had eased due to feeling more positive about ME.

And now post op while I'm seeking out women by preference, I expect the odds of hookups are better with men and in some very real sense I just do want to get laid more often.

And a *big* barrier has been lifted, while I'm still open to anal play, vaginal has always been what I hankered for and so I'm far more interested in PIV (with women or with men) than I was in PIA pre-op.

So yes my bias point has been shifted but then I was fundamentally bisexual/pansexual already. And then again my consideration of exploring bisexuality originated after my realization I was trans.

Yes, more attracted to males. Very picky about what I find attractive. The change orientation is not upsetting to me at all. Seems rather natural.

Denise

Yeah I definitely like men more now.  Still like females sure. but certain guys OMG....

Quote from: SadieBlake on December 02, 2017, 10:47:25 AM

There is little question that initial attraction is olfactory and there have been some pretty cool findings about biological / selection advantages conferred thereby. It's also known that women rely more on scent than men in the flirting / pairing dance and also that as transexual women, hrt enhances up our sense of smell significantly (as well as changes our own scents.

This has always been interesting and a change for me as well. The other day i was sitting with my boyfriend in a movie and as his kids were with, was not being particularly affectionate, but i was sort of nuzzled against him. He was not wearing any fragrance but his own and i have no idea if he showered before the night out or not, but his smell was literally distracting me from the movie in a good way  . I remember thinking "i just want to stay here another hour and smell him"...lol pretty funny but true

i told him about this later and he thought it was funny. He notices fragrances on me like vanilla and others, but it seems as women, we are more in tune with pheromones or natural fragrance or the like.

Quote from: amandam on November 18, 2017, 12:03:19 PM
So, did the guy come back? What happened?

He did, sorry it's been a while, busy with electro and work schedules and Christmas. He did come back, I am married so I only let him hang out and I told him from the get go nothing more than friends. Well he kissed me that night and it honestly took me a minute to push him off. It was my first experience with a man.... well I kinda melted in his arms, I liked it. What scared me is I was only and I mean only women oriented before, this hit me like a ton of bricks, I was caught off guard by this attraction for sure. I told my wife about it and she basically told me good job for pushing him off and getting away(he was warned ahead of time) and welcome to being a girl. So yes I'm full on bisexual now. I would probably only date men if I were single though. I'm completely happy with who I'm with though. So yes I learned more about myself and my sexuality.