eh, dang! last thing i need is someone telling me how to live my life.  how very ambitious of them! let's see, hubby knows (he's my husband legally btw) because we've known each other since the earth was flat but i'm stealth to the rest of the world.  why? because i CAN.  only a person who CAN can be stealth.  get it? got it? good!

Sure, everyone can do whatever they want.  I didn't mean  to start a war over this topic, though I should have known better.

Quote from: Ashley315 on March 07, 2009, 10:27:54 AM
Sure, everyone can do whatever they want.  I didn't mean  to start a war over this topic, though I should have known better.

Totally agree, the one part of this site I can't stand is all this bitching over these issues.

All this holier than thou sh*t is really not needed especially among adults. People get hurt by such attitudes and most of us are coming here with enough hurt in our lives already.

Time to grow up and show a little tolerance and acceptance of others, without tolerance we're totally f****d, end of.

Jesus, this stuff p*sses me off.

I think it's dishonest.  Telling someone or not is only a problem when there could potentially be a negative outcome from them finding out later on.  That is just my opinion.  At the very least, I think you should be up front with a person that you can never have children.  That is something that is very important to many people.

I live stealth by choice. I don't identify as trans, I'm a woman born with a birth condition that's already been corrected.  My fiance & family know about my corrective surgery, nobody else does.

It comes down to what every issue comes down to:

How do you feel about it from an ethical standpoint. Do you feel any need to disclose your identity to people you're relatively close to? Do you feel like it's dishonest not to? Are you willing to close off part of your past? Are you aware and willing to deal with any possible consequences of being 'outed'? Will you resent being coerced into going stealth if it's against your will?

I'm not saying there's a right or wrong answer to any of these questions. You simply have to determine how YOU (nobody else) feel about them and make a decision based on those feelings.

don't think we are talking about not being out to the general public.  Who wouldn't be?  It's not that difficult, as the majority of the public eye barely takes more than a glance or two at anyone else and most people just take things for general face value without much questioning.

What concerns me is people that try to hide it from loved ones or spouses.  To each their own, but in my opinion that is a little dangerous.   What happens if they find out 10 years down the road for whatever reason?  It can and has happened before.  What if they freak out and harm you or themselves over it?  Some people would feel very betrayed over finding something like this out after being together for several years.  Can you blame them?  I just feel like if you really love someone, you would be totally honest with them, and if they really love you, they will be understanding.  That is of course my opinion and I'm sure there are some that have a different opinion.

Are we all just women/men (whatever the case may be) that happen to be born with a specific birth defect?  Of course, but that is not the way the general public views it, and right or wrong, we do live in a world of sociological ideals and beliefs about labeling people.

The amazing thing about stealth and discussing stealth online...it's kind of like playing poker over the phone with a bunch of people you don't know.

Person 1: "Ok, lay your cards down, what do you have?"
Person 2: "Pair of Kings, 8 high"
Person 3: "Full house, Kings and Ace's"
Person 4: "I have four Queens"

Who knows what they all have? Does it even matter? Poker is best enjoyed for the company and the point of it wasn't really playing online with a bunch of people you don't know where you just assume what they say is correct. Appearances from pictures, discussions of stealth, IS, and anything else that transpeople tend to use a pseudo-ranking method online are just as accurate as playing poker on the phone with people you don't know.

If someone says the are stealth, it might mean different things to different people. To some it means "no one says anything to me, therefore no one knows so I'm stealth." To others it might mean "I don't tell anyone therefore I am stealth." Then you have "I move through my life not being apparently known by others and I don't tell" so that's stealth.  We bring all these different backgrounds and personalities to these forums. Many people get defensive about their positions on things.

In the end, it's the internet. It's online. What happens to people in public, what people think of them as they move through life, none of us will know. You could have the most passable people TORTURING themselves over appearance and perceived inability to not be read and you could have a completely unpassable transperson claiming stealth. In the end, what's it matter? We're here together trying to help each other through some pretty tough times. Those that have been through some of the same trials and tribulations are there to lend a hand to others. Those who are new watch and observe and wonder where their life will be in a few months or years.

I embrace you all as my sisters and brothers. I'm here for any of you if you ever need to talk. I don't care what you look like. I don't care if you think you are stealth or not. I don't care because I DON'T KNOW. It's what YOU tell me based on your interaction in society. You might be wrong. Is it important to what we talk about, probably not. I love people for being who they are, whether they can be stealth or not doesn't matter to me. Show me an open heart, show me compassion in the way you deal with others and I'll give and give to you until I can't give anymore. That's just me, that's how I am Meghan

Lovely post, Meghan.  Kudos.

Lia

Oh this again!

What I have never understood is why we all have to try to get people on our side with this.  We are what we are.  Why can't that be good enough?  Why can't we accept the fact that some people really need to be stealth, and some need to be out and proud?  I suspect a bunch of people fall in between somewhere.  So why do we seem to think that ours is the only right way to do this?  My own suspicion, which I have voiced before, is that many of us are basically insecure in who we are.  Therefore, we want others to do what we do to validate us. 

We need people out there helping change the world.  I am thankful that they are working hard.  That life, however, is not for everyone, at least not in this day and time.  We have a lot of hurdles to cross before we will cease to see any repercussions from being open.  Some are better at facing those challenges than others.  Some are great at doing the public work.  Some have professions that makes being "out" impossible because of the bias that is in place. 

There are zillions of life possibilities out there that go into each of our decisions.  No two of us are alike.  There is not a textbook.  There is no proper way to be trans.  `There is no letter from above directing each of us.  Rather, the answer is in each of our hearts.  If we are true to that, how dare anyone judge the choice we have made. 

I have seen people on here that claim passability and I just cringe.  But whatever floats their boat.   So long as they are happy, it is fine with me.  I have seen others who live in stealth and are just as feminine or masculine as they should be in their target gender.  They open up online and get trashed because no one believes them.  That is so counterproductive.  The message we seem to be sending is that it is OK to be successful but only to a point.  Why would we ever want to portray that kind of nonsense?

When I see someone living their dream of being their gender and being treated no differently because because of the configuration of their flesh, it makes me so very happy for them.  I certainly don't go around asking girls:  natal or neo?  I doubt you do either.  When I see others who are trying to change the world by being very public, I am so very thankful for what they are doing for us.  We need them to succeed and we need to support them however we can.  To those of us who are in that gray area trying to find the best course, I simply lend my support and open my arms.  There is no easy way.  There is no best way.  There is no one right way.

Be who you are.  Be it to the best of your ability,  Fulfill your dreams.  And please support those whose dreams are not identical to your own.

Peace, all!
Kristi

If you can and want to be out and proud and doing what you can, then maybe you should. For those than can't there should be no shame in it. Some can, some can't, we all have our place.

It's a big issue, and each person needs to make that choice for themselves. I am thankful for those who can.

Ok I just have to reply here.
Why would a person want to draw unwanted attention to themselves. If you are trying to live your life as normal as you can why throw any more information out there than needed for fuel. I always thought the main reason for transitioning was to blend into society and live the life you were entitled to.

Now if you have another adjenda and want go public with you life that is ok too, just don't drag the rest of us on the band wagon.

I do not call what I am doing "Stealth". My business is my business, and I am living my life as normal as one can.

This is just my opinion and I hope I have not offended anyone.

Deb

New topic and poll-- Should post-ops disclose?

QuoteI Now if you have another adjenda and want go public with you life that is ok too, just don't drag the rest of us on the band wagon.

I quite agree with Deb. I am a peer support worker at a local TS support group once a week and this is the only place who know my background. I am also facilitator for two *none trans related* meetup groups and work at a woman's shelter and they know me only as who I present, *Cindy* No more no less, if that stealth, then be it.

I don't give it much thought nor do I loose any sleep over it. I get up in the morning and just go out and do what I need to do. I could stay home and knit sweaters if I wanted to, I am retired, but I enjoy being around people and working with people. At least as Cindy I have a life.

Cindy

There has to be a reeeeely good reason for me to out myself to anyone anymore, sometimes even medically.  If they're not going to be looking between my naked legs carefully, they have no need to know.
Here's an example.........last week we gave blood.  A few days later, a Red Cross person called, and told Marcy he needed to "correct the gender on my records".  I guess someone finally looked at some older records, and saw the "M".
He said, "they have Michael Beverly listed as female, and....."
"That's right", Marcy said.  Female.  She uses her middle name, as it is on her donor card. 
"And you are..."
"We live together.  We both came in to donate."
"Oh"


So....why in the world should the Red Cross need to know my past?
They don't.
I'm me, a woman, donating my blood.



Bev

I thought we couldn't donate blood due to HRT?

Quote from: Ashley315 on March 20, 2009, 03:09:10 PM
I thought we couldn't donate blood due to HRT?

They take my blood as often as they can.
They take other women's estrogen-laced blood, and they never asked me if I were on HRT

Hmn... learn something new every day I guess.   

There is nothing on 3 of the biggest blood bank websites of the US regarding hormones, or trans.

Gay men are banned by some, some overseas travel, and various other things, but I never saw hormones or TG listed anywhere.

I understand why people are stealth.

I couldn't be though.  I would always be thinking about whether people knew or didn't know.  The easiest position for me is just not to care.  If people know, then it's fine.  If they don't, I'm sure after getting to know more more, they will.  My biggest anxiety is when people don't know, because they'll form these emotional bonds with me, and then it's like so awkward and annoying to disclose it to them.  So even online I'm as upfront as I can be about being trans.

Because honestly, if you can't look at me and see all-girl, even after knowing my gender history, then you're not someone I need hovering around my life.  So in some ways the trans issue is a great litmus test for weeding out the boring and dumb.

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,57669.msg362886.html#new