There is a big problem, one of many but perhaps the largest, and that is the costs of transition. Imagine how nice it would be if you didn't have to go into debt. If you didn't have to wait years after the OK to get the results. Some of us have the money or enough but some of us don't, some have none, others barely enough. And this is a big factor. Because it is costly many spend the rest of there lifes in depression having given up hope, others struggle for happyness due to debts....

So whats the solution?

There are enough of us out there and plenty of bright minds perhaps there is a solution we can find and work to.

OK...Thats my attempt at an inspirational speech...more like a insperational memo maybe... 

Anyways lets think about this together what are solutions to this problem, and not just for an individual but for the community as a whole.

Are there lawyers amongst us or lawyers friendly to our people, to our cause, that could help us fight the system that allows insurance to excllude us?

Perhaps we could develop our own insurance company only for the transgenders! maybe there are some, if so can we help!

Maybe we could start up half-way-houses for those going through transition. That or some sort of system that can help people find work while transitioning. A system maybe that in itself produces work for only transgender people. A system that connects us transgender people even (maybe we could use a Transbook, or TransSpace to help) A system that connects to people so that people that can help can help and people that need help can get help.



Are there already any activist groups out there that are only transgender oriented?

If not lets start one, I'm for it, I got some time, and i got somewhat of a brain. I need to put it to use doing some activistish stuff.

Funny you mention that, because I have a dream of starting a transition house.  Where Transpeople could come and A) have a safe place to live, B) have a sense of family.  Now I just need the place to establish it.

This was a topic that came up between Sevan and I the other day.

Quote from: Robin. on April 06, 2010, 06:12:18 PM
only for the transgenders!

...

I would like to come back to this, but for now, please check online for cohousing.  There is extensive literature on it.  I have been interested from a couple of other financial and demographic angles.   

If I were to win the viking lottery, a portion of my money would go into a "Transition Support Fund" of some sort. Something that would be dedicated to support people in need with their transition.
I would probably put it in the hands of a more driven person. Someone who can drive fundraisers better and more often than I can... but ideally, I would like to see it grow, own and operate transition-homes, help people move from countries where they are likely to get killed for existing to countries where they can be safe, and to help pay for things for people who have no chance of affording them themselves.

'Course.. I'd probably bankrupt it in a week... because I'd wanna pay for "everyone's" SRS... :/... I'm not very good at saying "No"

I don't think the insurance company idea would work all that well. They make money by collecting premiums from the people who don't need treatment; it works on the concept that most people will put in more than they take out. If you only insured transpeople (who nearly all need treatments more or less constantly), the premiums would have to be enormous in order to cover the costs of the surgeries, hormones, therapists, etc (never mind the overhead). People would end up paying more to this plan than they would if they had gone for this on their own.

Not that I'm knocking the other ideas, but this one just doesn't fit with how insurance companies operate.

Perhaps some financial investment program like they have for college savings funds. The way I understand it working (and I am far, far from being an expert) is that you deposit funds into an account as they are earned, or for those who have sufficient funds all in advance, and those funds are invested in such a way that the funds are allowed to grow. As the money grows it can be put to use to help fund those who are unable to immediately pay - with the expectation that they commit to supporting the organization in some manner -whether financial or through contributing services.

Deanna

That would be amazing!
It would help me so much, and I could afford therapy,
and Testosterone,
and chest surgery...

That would make my life so much better...

I knew of one of these trans communes.  One particular wealthy MTF and her wife started to invite other TS into their home to transition.  Eventually they whole thing turned into a giant sex scandal with each of the people agreeing to be "subs" to the "dom" wealthy MTF, with each of the subs convinced to quit their jobs to rely only on the dom.

It was a mess.

I actually had an idea of a hotel, where there could be one or two people per room.  With classes rooms on the lower floor, and possible office space for a therapist and/or doctor.

If the gods of fate grant me the ability, then it shall happen.

So, Janet, there would be about 2-3000 rooms? One big happy transitioning family? You would also have to add a mall - gotta go shopping. Health club, maybe a hospital too. 

Oh, this could really get out of hand real fast - especially if you put me in charge. Money? what money?

it's nothing a powerball win couldn't fix.

Quote from: Laura Hope on April 07, 2010, 12:50:52 AM
it's nothing a powerball win couldn't fix.

ye, one for each of us.

Communes are pretty great things.  Some have lasted for hundreds of years though lots and lots of generations, but they share two things, both of which are in short supply 'round these parts.

1. You need people who are willing to devote themselves to the greater community and its guiding principals above themselves.

2. A strong work ethic capable of producing on-going sustainable subsistence plus a little bit more.

Quote from: Janet Lynn on April 06, 2010, 06:17:24 PM
Funny you mention that, because I have a dream of starting a transition house.  Where Transpeople could come and A) have a safe place to live, B) have a sense of family.  Now I just need the place to establish it.

Great minds think alike I feel... We have often talked of the possibility doing this on a very small scale at our home and or the other properties that we own in Cornwall. Not exactly a commune. More of an extended family. Problem is finding the right people - it's not like you can put an ad in the local paper, nor indeed will every transperson get on with every other transperson...

We are already private landlords owning at least one other property which we rent out so I guess this would be a rather similar venture in that the first obstacle would be finding a place to advertise where the right transitioners would see it, and second one would then have to find a polite way of intereviewing and referrncing people. Because of course it would be no help to anyone if you ended up with someone who was disruptive or didn't reliably pay their share.

Quote from: Luna! on April 06, 2010, 07:22:05 PM
I don't think the insurance company idea would work all that well. They make money by collecting premiums from the people who don't need treatment; it works on the concept that most people will put in more than they take out. If you only insured transpeople (who nearly all need treatments more or less constantly), the premiums would have to be enormous in order to cover the costs of the surgeries, hormones, therapists, etc (never mind the overhead). People would end up paying more to this plan than they would if they had gone for this on their own.

Not that I'm knocking the other ideas, but this one just doesn't fit with how insurance companies operate.

But this is exactly what we need and is the future. The way you described everyone else paying is how it works! I may never get cancer but pay for others that do.

I actually just went in front of the University Council at the University of Pennsylvania to urge them to consider inclusion of Transsexual related treatments, procedures and surgeries (including 'needed' ffs, etc). They were very receptive. This is something the LGBT center on campus has been working on. The cost per person for our insurance policy is $1 per year per person. Not a huge cost!

Just because one wealthy dom sets up a sex club shouldn't condemn an idea.  It merely councils caution.  There is a movement in US called "co-housing" that tries to put inter-generational, diverse populations together to form "intentional communities."   There are hundreds of these communities across US.  Some are very like communes, others place a much greater stress on family units that interact with the whole group.  There is no "wealthy dom."  Though often there are a great number of rules, worked out by the participants themselves, that form an internal, democratic governance.  Cohousing.org has a great overview.  It isn't a cult.  It tends to stress new communities and that can be quite expensive.  Near where I live, several have set up using existing low cost housing.  I have resisted because I would prefer moving from the "big city" to a more resort oriented area as well as finding a group of gays/transgendered people.  Few things that turn out well are easy.  Especially when you are talking about peoples lives and livelihood. 

Quote from: Dana Lane on April 07, 2010, 03:06:02 AM
But this is exactly what we need and is the future. The way you described everyone else paying is how it works! I may never get cancer but pay for others that do.

I actually just went in front of the University Council at the University of Pennsylvania to urge them to consider inclusion of Transsexual related treatments, procedures and surgeries (including 'needed' ffs, etc). They were very receptive. This is something the LGBT center on campus has been working on. The cost per person for our insurance policy is $1 per year per person. Not a huge cost!

That's not quite what I was saying. There's nothing wrong with having insurance pay for these things; it's that the original idea was that of an insurance company that only insures transpeople. There are no 'other' people to get the money from in such a model. Such an organization would be paying out huge amounts of money to every single one of its policyholders, all the time. There's no possible way the company could make enough money to keep itself afloat.

I'm not disagreeing with ordinary insurance companies covering trans-related things; it would be really helpful if they did. That's not what the earlier post was about, though.

I see a more substantial problem, and a couple/few people have indirectly addressed it already (except for Luna!, who is nailing it quite hard).

The answer to a (large) community of people that does not integrate TGs is not a community that does not integrate non-TGs.  You aren't going to kick SOs to the curb.  You aren't going to forbid "questioning" people, nor will you get rid of them out just because they determine they are not TG.  The standard for who is TG is not exactly clear-cut or permanent.  I don't think you want to separate yourself from non-TG open-minded friends.  There are even TGs who are anti-TG (or at least against some subset of TGs), so it is not as if keeping out the "outsiders" solves the problem of discrimination/intimidation/exclusion/etc.

I propose the idea of something that is both more ambitious and also simpler: Have a community where people across a broad spectrum of factors are accepted and integrated, whether they are a "minority" or not.  Race, ethnicity, sex, gender, gender expression, sexual orientation, hair color, height, etc, are not appropriate for discrimination/intimidation/exclusion/etc.  Corporations that do business here must also play by the rules we want (including insurance companies needing to provide SRS as appropriate -- unless we take the government-managed route).  Such a community in the US might only appeal to 20% of its population, and only 1-in-1000 may be willing to drop what they are doing to go there, but that's 60000 people.  It will probably be disproportionately loaded with "minorities" of several types, but that'll provide a little flavor that'll help TGs and others not feel so alone/isolated.

The whole idea is to have a community that makes sure its members are engaged in a fair and supportive way.  There are certain challenges, but it provides a reasonably integrated society and still provides the services you want.  And I imagine TGs would typically prefer living as their respective genders (as unique as that expression may be, and as bumpy of a road as it has been to get where they want) rather than as TGs.