Quote from: Veera on May 20, 2010, 04:02:09 PM
Therapy body image? Haha. It's not like that I'm crying whole day "oh my ribs oh my ribs". I am frustrated and very hateful towards myself when I see my whole body in the mirror. It's just a horrible experience for me.

I'm sure if you look hard enough you can find a surgeon that will remove your ribs and promise a more curvy you.  I've done some minimal research and have found some surgeons will do this in conjunction with an abdominoplasty.  Let us know if you have the surgery, I think it's fascinating and would be curious to find out if the results are worth it.  Although I probably wouldn't have it done myself.

Unrealistic one? I don't think so. I have seen on YouTube Nina Arsenault videos and she had such surgery. So I think unrealistic is a bad word. I am telling you hundred times, I don't want to be ideal, I have cellulit, I have spreads and many, many more! And I'm totally OKAY with it! My only complex is the rib-cage.

How can You call surgery, which will make me happy and more feminine STUPID? Well It's my choice, and if I am not happy with it, still feel like a man, and masculine, what's the problem? It's my choice. And I don't think it's stupid, I'm frustrated.

QuoteRemoving bone sections from your metacarpals and proximal phalanges will give you smaller hands.

Really? Who does do it?

Andream, I know that there are women with bigger thorax, but they have proportionally built body-parts. And there's one other thing... I don't want to be like them. I don't want to pass as a woman. I want to be happy with myself. I don't want to be fat-mumma with big tits, ass and thorax. I thought about the dresses which will optically change the proportions but... It's still not that. I want to feel proud and well when I'm looking at myself in the mirror naked.

Lightvi, it can sound strange but in my country don't exist ladies who do corsets I really tried to find in internet but no results.

Buixe(?), I am not crazy about numbers, I am crazy about the size, I told You numbers for you to try to imagine it.

BlackMamba, I'm not looking for surgeon who will REMOVE my ribs, just will remove proportionally some part of all ribs.

Hmm, well I know amazon.com has some and they ship internationally so you might check there. There's a great place in Portland, OR that does them but they are kind of expensive. Though if I'm going to be wearing it 24/7 I want it to be nice lol.

Quote from: Veera on May 21, 2010, 04:23:05 AM
I have seen on YouTube Nina Arsenault videos and she had such surgery.

I like Nina Arsenault too, but she didn't have the upper rib surgery you're talking of. She only had her lower ribs broken and bent in, which really only affects the mid-section. It was possible for her to do this because the lower ribs are 'floating' ribs. From what I understand of your post, you want to do your upper ribs. I want to do this too - I'm not happy with the upper section of my torso. The ribs of the upper thorax are connected driectly to your sternum, and form a critical part of your anatomy, and to break them and then fuse them together again in smaller dimensions would probably be so invasive that it would be VERY challenging for any surgeon to get it right, if it is even possible. There are so many variables involved - the organs, the cartilage, the flesh, the awkwardness of the dimensions. If you look at the anatomy of a skeleton, you won't be able to just break these upper ribs and reset them in a smaller circumference anyway. You'd need to remove slices of the ribs, and then have some form of apparatus - most likely a great metal thing which screws into the ribs themselves - to hold them fast while the bones fuse over the course of a number of months. There's no guarantee that the bones will fuse properly, and there's no guarantee that the apparatus will stay in place while the bones are healing.

As I said, if you want to do this then go to China, find the most egotistical doctor you can find, and present him with a proposal for this new procedure - they do all kinds of surgery there. I reckon you could get it done for free, if you're lucky; egotistical surgeons love to give surgeries for free to their guinea pigs, and even if he does ask you to pay it should be affordable - it's China after all where I hear you can get a blepharoplasty for $200. Tell us if you're successful and I will come. I'd love to reduce the size of my upper thorax, not to mention my shoulders. You may think I'm kidding about this, but I'm not. I mean it sincerely. If you have the resources, go to China.

Whereabouts on your thorax are you measuring 88cm anyway? Underbust? Under the armpits? Also, how tall are you?

The big problem with this whole concept is that over time the bodily organs grow to accomodate the chest cavity - if you suddenly placed them in a smaller capacity I'm not sure that they would react well.

In any case I dispute the idea that it is not possible to look normal with those measurements I have a bigger chest measurement than you and although I am at the "large" end of things there are plenty of women in the UK who are as big as me and indeed quite a few even bigger - including one or two who live quite close by.

So unless you live in a country where women are all midgets I think you may be being just a tiny bit prefectionist here.

I understand your point about this surgery being something which you feel would make you happy and of course that is what we would all say about our SRS. So I'm not in a position to criticise - but I do think that whereas SRS is thankfully practical and possible, your surgery would be difficult and may even be impossible. Be very careful about things you see on the net too - as an ex video editor I can tell you that such things are often manipulated and retouched. It may not be real.

Okay.
This thread is going in circles.

No surgeon will break the Upper ribs and reduce the size of your Thorax.

None.
Zero.
Nada.

Unless you go to a third world country and bribe a guy in a bar, and he'll just kill you.

This is the same guy as does the finger surgery.

Quote from: Veera on May 21, 2010, 04:23:05 AM


Really? Who does do it?

I'm actually super entertained by this response, because this is exactly what was going through my head when I read "I want to have surgery to make my chest smaller."

Quote from: Miniar on May 21, 2010, 06:24:00 AM
Unless you go to a third world country and bribe a guy in a bar, and he'll just kill you.

This is the same guy as does the finger surgery.

This place in Thailand does finger lengthening surgery:

http://thailand-plasticsurgery.com/plastic-surgery-prices.html

Scroll down to "Other Body Procedures" and you will see the finger lengthening surgery for $2,400 US. They even do toe-to-thumb transfers for $2,600 US. Amazing!

I don't think Thailand is third world...

Veera, dear, everyone here has sympathy for you, but can't, in good conscience advocate things such as bone-breaking that are medically unsound, and therefore dangerous to your health. Everyone has things they don't like about themselves and their bodies... that's life - nobody's perfect. IMVVHE broken, and even cracked ribs only hurt 2 times - every time you inhale, and every time you exhale. YMMV.
     As was mentioned above, changing rib cage circumference does not change the shoulder width, so i guess then your next body mod project would be to get the scapula [shoulder blades] broken and re-set??   Go with the tightlacing idea, girl, corsets are sexy!
     Wishing you all the best in your journey,
         humbly,
             hugs,
                 jannelle
    'a lady in the drawing room, a wh**e in the bedroom.'

Thank you very much for the information andream! I will try to ask in sime chinese forums on surgery, maybe I will find something. Yea, 88 underburst.

You are still and still and still talking about women that have 88 and even bigger cimcuference. Don't I know it? Look, your goal is to pass as a woman in society, I don't want to be "oh, okay, it's normal, it's normal, yea, let's say it's a woman". I want to look like a woman in MY AGE. Normal, not fat, not very big, just 75/80 underburst.

As I told You... I have problem with my RIBS, not arms. My arms are small, and proportional to my height - 178. I want to do thorax, and that's all!

Miniar... look, I want to be happy with who I am. Actually, I'd rather not be woman with 88 in circumference, I think I'd rather be dead. Because I won't live this way. I will be thinking every second "did he notice that? did she notice that?! oh my god!" and second thing, when I'll be looking to the mirror, I will just take hammer and hit it as much as I can what I did many many times before.

I am very grateful for andream that she understands me. Thank you for the information and link! Maybe for others it's just horrible and unethical but... It's better than a suicide Thank You!

Quote from: Veera on May 21, 2010, 09:00:04 AM
You are still and still and still talking about women that have 88 and even bigger cimcuference. Don't I know it? Look, your goal is to pass as a woman in society, I don't want to be "oh, okay, it's normal, it's normal, yea, let's say it's a woman". I want to look like a woman in MY AGE. Normal, not fat, not very big, just 75/80 underburst.

I think I could find that mildly insulting if I wanted to For a start my own mother - who gave birth to me - and therefore WAS a natal female had an underbust of 96!

My underbust is very similar to hers - but I assure you that in nearly 30 years of living as a woman no one and I do mean NO ONE gives me a second look! That's because in the UK lots of women have dimensions ranging from 90 to 100 cm.

I may not be slim these days but I'm over 50 and, as those who have been on here for some while know, I have posted pics of myself when I was a young newly postop girl of 24 or so and back then I was far from fat - but my underbust was still well over 88 even then.

At the end of the day we are absolutely not going to fall out, because life is far too short to worry about such things, but I really do think you have a seriously distorted view of what constitutes the normal dimensions of modern womanhood.

Anyway let's agree to differ. I hope you find the solution you are looking for, but I do fear that the results may not bring you the peace you seek.

Quote from: Veera on May 19, 2010, 04:00:03 PM
I would be delighted if you would tell me any information about rib-cage (thorax) surgery. I am 88cm in circumference of thorax. I dream of being 75cm in circumference.

I think 88-cm chest circumference is normal for women here in my country.

Many men here have chests of > 100 cm circumference.

To my eyes, women with wide shoulder look more sexy if they have small waist. Women with narrow shoulder look weak and unhealthy to me.

When I was at 20's, I once fell in love with a girl. Her shoulder was very wide, and it seemed that her wide shoulder was a kind of stigma to her. As my narrow trunk had been a stigma to me, I envied her wide shoulder. Also, she envied my slim legs.

My trunk circumference is 78 cm, and I have never seen any man who has narrower chest than me. My narrower chest looked bizarre, and that had been the source of an untolerable sense of inferiority to me. I always wore baggy tees to hide it. However, once I started crossdressing, that suddenly became a valuable advantage in looking feminine.

Anyway, 88 cm is within the range of normality for women here.

Barbie~~

Thank you both for the answer, but You still don't get the point. I don't get how could you have complex of small thorax.

I don't like to repeat but I will do it to make it very clearly now.

I know that in the world are very different types of women, they are small, tall, fat, thin, 100 in circumference, and 75. I know that it seems to be normal. However, I just don't want to be that type of woman. I just dream to wear clinging shirts, that will show my tits, no big thorax as now. It won't be for me full-tasting of life if I can't wear what I would like to because of bone-structure. I want to make my dream come true... It sounds maybe idealistic, but NO! I don't want to be ideal. I just want to look as a girl in my age - Eighteen. I want to feel attractive, to feel well and comfortable with myself.

One of my friends, a cis-girl, has a bigger thorax than I do. Even bigger than you do.
She's 17.

88 isn't fat, it's not "not your age", it's Normal

Even for an 18 year old.

Quote from: Veera on May 21, 2010, 09:00:04 AM
I'd rather not be woman with 88 in circumference, I think I'd rather be dead. Because I won't live this way.

OK Veera, I strongly recommend that you seek professional psychological help, because this sort of thinking is mentally ill (I speak from experience, autism). You've been told by nearly everybody here that your chest size is perfectly normal but you wont listen because your paranoia is creating a justification for  you to butcher yourself.. There is nothing anyone can say to change your mind becuase you need to correct your frame of mind first..

Jenny ,can you re post those pics
Veera,I have a 83 cm underbust and my dream size would be 76 cm, but I'm at peace with it.What are your shoulder and hip measurements?

I am a ftm and Im 5'5" my ribcage is not 88cm not by along shot and im not on t.
I measured my ribcage and it was around 102cm at its smallest and at its widest was 105cm so ur ribcage is very small in my book. I am only 167 cm tall and I'm 16.

I dont even know how it is physicaly possible to have a ribcage of only 88 let alone 75. I dont think youd be able to breathe at 75.

You could also try losing weight ,I lost 8 pounds and lost half an inch from my under bust.

Quote from: tori319 on May 21, 2010, 03:29:11 PM
Jenny ,can you re post those pics
Veera,I have a 83 cm underbust and my dream size would be 76 cm, but I'm at peace with it.What are your shoulder and hip measurements?

Sure Tori - there you go - there is my favourite one of the 24 year old me. As you can see the biggest problem I had was not my chest and shoulder size but my tree trunk thighs which even today I dislike! So you see we all have things which are less than optimal...

It's MTF or Genetic Girl? Because she looks totally like a recycling for me from male to female. She can be genetic, but my big rib-cage isn't a complex because it's not feminine, just... I don't want to have such a big thorax. If this surgery is impossible, my life will be just horrible, thinking all the time about it, feeling bad... No everyone is supposed to be happy.