I think I started a post about this a while back, but... even though top surgery isn't for a while for me, I keep thinking about finally being able to wear a male swimsuit and go swimming again. I keep worrying about how long it will take the scars after top surgery to heal though. How long might I ask does that take before the scars are barely noticeable? Also, about packers. You don't need to wear them when swimming, right? I mean, it's not totally noticable that you're not a bio male when you walk into the pool right? I have also had scoliosis surgery a year ago so there is a big scar going down my back but that seems to be healing pretty well. However since I always wore a one piece swimsuit people couldn't really see the scar (on my back). But now I worry because with a guy's bathing suit the entire back obviously shows. Should I be worried about this too?

My knowledge is pretty limited, but from what I've seen, it looks like they stay fairly distinct on a lot of guys.  Of course, it depends on genetics, post-op care, and surgery type amongst other things.  I've seen pics of a few guys who tattooed over them too.

There's always "Oh I have weird ribs and needed surgery."

I'll duck out now and let guys with more experience with it post. 

Alright so like Lee said I also have no personal experience but looking up ftm top surgery on youtube or looking at pictures on transbucket can give you a general idea.

Quote from: Lee on December 12, 2010, 01:49:20 AM
Of course, it depends on genetics, post-op care, and surgery type amongst other things.

Exactly, plus every guy scars differently and different surgeons will have different skill level. I have seen some guys who end up having scars you can't see unless you are looking hard for them so it's possible. As for the scar on your back don't stress. If someone is going to say something about it they are immature. I personally wouldn't let that keep me from being shirtless if I wanted but that is just my opinion.

Yes everyone heals differently ... and it depends on what type of surgery you have too.

I went to a trans health conference and there was a show and tell about different surgeons and procedures...guys who had surgery took their shirts off and showed off their chest.   The guys who had key hole were obviously the best regarding scaring.  However, with the double ... those who built up their chest and had good pec muscles you could hardly tell -- the muscle kinda hid it.  So much so unless you were looking for it or intimate with the person you probably wouldn't notice.

However, the guys who didn't have built up muscles .. it still looked like a guy's chest and they could go shirtless.  I think people are conditioned not to ask why you have scars.

Maybe relevant, I found this on tumblr:

Quote from: anonymousyo everyone heads up, if you see someone with chest scars and they look exactly like DI scars don't assume that's what it is. most embarassing thing happened to me. a dude at my gym who i swam with the other day had scars that looked just like my DI scars. i ended up approaching him privately and came out to him and asked who did his top surgery cause it looks great. BAD MOVE! the guy had NO idea what top surgery was or what i was talking about. turns out, he was in a car accident and needed surgery from that, i think it was on his lungs or something. i felt really stupid

So, yeah, there are other explanations for scars like that. Most people don't have a clue what top surgery is, so it wouldn't even cross their minds.

I've been reading this thread and trying to think about how to respond. Or rather, how to say what needs to be said. I'm just going to come out with it.

Stop apologising for being here. Stop it now.

You don't need to explain scars or anything else. If you think you do, then people will pick up on that. If you think you need to apologise then people will want to know what you're apologising for.

Stop thinking about scars. Stop apologising. If someone asks you, tell them to kiss them better. And to kiss your ass at the same time.

Jacky, that's really interesting.  I didn't know that there actually were other surgeries that caused similar scars.  I also wouldn't have thought about using pecs to hide them.  Guess I should get to the gym more.   

I'm 2 years post op and still have obvious scars.  I am told, however, that from about 10 feet away you can't tell that they're there at all.  Its safe to say that people would notice in a pool situation if they were standing much closer than that.  I did go swimming shirtless at the beach this summer.  I can't say if anyone noticed.  I doubt it.  I spent most of my time alone in the water, and when I was on the shore I was only shirtless until I got to my towel.  Everyone at the beach is pretty involved in their own ->-bleeped-<- though.  It felt a bit odd the first time, but it was nice not to be weighed down by a t-shirt in the water.  [Since like middle school I've really just worn a boys bathing suit and a t-shirt no nasty one -pieces for me bleck] 

My mom was discussing joining somewhere with a lap pool.  I'd definitely swim shirtless there and just leave my shirt at the end of my lane to be put on immediately after my swim.

Quote from: spacial on December 12, 2010, 01:03:08 PM
I've been reading this thread and trying to think about how to respond. Or rather, how to say what needs to be said. I'm just going to come out with it.

Stop apologising for being here. Stop it now.

You don't need to explain scars or anything else. If you think you do, then people will pick up on that. If you think you need to apologise then people will want to know what you're apologising for.

Stop thinking about scars. Stop apologising. If someone asks you, tell them to kiss them better. And to kiss your ass at the same time.

I don't think I was apologizing in this post (I notice I have a tendency to do that, but not on this thread)? Did I come across that way?

Also what about packers? Would I need to wear one?

I'm also 2 yrs post op (as of yesterday!) and my scars are fading but still noticeable.  IIRC the scars on my arm from an old injury took 3-4 years to fully fade, so that's what I'm expecting with my current scars.  Based on what they look like now that seems reasonable.

In the meantime I have gone topless on a beach (empty) and in my yard.  If I don't want to show the scars I just wear a rash guard, which is what I've done in water parks and most recently on a pseudo-date (that led no where  ).

I was hoping I'd grow enough chest hair to hide them but no such luck yet.


Jay

If you're wearing board shorts you shouldn't need a packer.  I'd think it risky that it'd fall out especially in ocean waves.

Quote from: Josh T on December 12, 2010, 01:58:02 PM
I don't think I was apologizing in this post (I notice I have a tendency to do that, but not on this thread)? Did I come across that way?

Also what about packers? Would I need to wear one?

Josh love, sorry that that came across blunt. But I'm just trying to tell you ad this is the truth, that these things only matter when you think about them.

There different reasons you can come up with, if you feel like you need it.  Like you busted a rib or two. 

Personally, I don't care what someone thinks about scars and probably won't after I have top-surgery.  Then again, I'm also riddled with scars so two more aren't that big of a deal to me.

Quote from: spacial on December 12, 2010, 05:42:04 PM
Josh love, sorry that that came across blunt. But I'm just trying to tell you ad this is the truth, that these things only matter when you think about them.

Ah now I see what you were getting at. Well. I suppose you're right (about things that only matter when you think about them). I know it shouldn't matter to anyone else either, but still. Someone a while back suggested getting a tattoo to cover the scars. Would that work?

Josh, I'm looking around, but I can't find a lot of the tattoo images that I've seen before.  Here's one that did pop up, though.

Quote from: Lee on December 12, 2010, 07:16:27 PM
Josh, I'm looking around, but I can't find a lot of the tattoo images that I've seen before.  Here's one that did pop up, though.

Ah so then tattoos seem to work pretty well from looking at that pic. Thanks man 

There's some things one should keep in mind if trying to cover a scar with a tattoo.

http://www.alternativelook.net/tattoo-over-scar-tissue/
http://en.allexperts.com/q/Tattoos-3028/Tattoo-Scarring.htm

That's just two articles: I didn't do anything in-depth. Worth pointing out though.

Basically though it's not as simply as just "covering them up" -- there's some considerations one needs to keep in mind, and it sounds like a situation where working closely with a tattoo artist would be more beneficial than the average joe (or jane, let's not forget the ladies) might think at first.

It really depends on the guy how lont it takes for the scars to heal.  I have noticed some guys heal faster then others, plus if they develop pec muscles the scars dont show as much, or if they are super hairy they arent noticible.

I plan to just tell people I had lung surgery, or had to get man boobs taken off (that would be comical)

I would think that packers would b more nessisary with swimsuits because when the suit is wet it clings to your thighs, and it would be totally flat with no buldge.  Peronally though, when I do plan to swim again after surgery I'm not going to pack, I don really care what random people think.

I am a little over a year past surgery. Just went to Maui and swam with my shirt off the last couple of days at the beach. The more populated beaches I always wore my rash guard while on the beach and then took it off to swim. At the more private beach at my resort I did more swimming with my shirt off and was on the beach a little more with my shirt off. I still have pretty Major scars from DI. I think it just depends on your comfort level. It was great to swim without a shirt on!
Myles

Quote from: Josh T on December 12, 2010, 06:53:08 PM
Ah now I see what you were getting at. Well. I suppose you're right (about things that only matter when you think about them). I know it shouldn't matter to anyone else either, but still. Someone a while back suggested getting a tattoo to cover the scars. Would that work?

Josh

What I'm thinking is, a tatoo is just going to draw attention to you.

I've spend most of my life watching men and trying to be like them. I've learnt they like to keep a space around them. If another guy gets too close, that's gay. If a woman gets too close, she fancies you.

Now, lets be honest, gay men are not very common. Most gay men don't jump into bed with every gay man who comes along. More importantly, gay men, generally, try to find out if someone is gay first. It just isn't done to chat up a guy on the off chance of him being gay. (A punch in the nose can often offend as they say.)

In the case of a girl coming onto to you, men generally play them along. They don't open up. They do a bit of teasing, play the girl along for a while.

What I'm trying to say is that, anyone who asks a guy about something as personal as body scars needs to be told to mind their own business.

That only leaves you. How you feel about it.

Now another thing I've learnt about men is they don't tend to fret too much about these things. Most men are basically peacocks. They exibit their perfect bodies, telling the world this is what they have. Few bodies are perfect. But if you don't believe yours is, then no-one else will.

In other words, relax. You don't have anything to hide or be ashamed of. This is what you have to offer. If they don't want it, then move alone for those that do.

Addition.

If it is really bothering you and you will feel better doing somethign about it, then do.

Thing is, I don't want to stop you talking about it, or tell you what to do. I'm really just suggesting that how you see yourself is how others will see you.

Tatoos are permanent. They generally fade with time and end up looking like a blotch.

But with guys, people look at your face first.