Quote from: onep1ece7 on February 07, 2011, 02:56:04 PM
Im debating wehther to wait to have kids to start hormones or take a break...thomas beattie is probably a good reference..that seems to be what he did. 

The danger with that is your body may not give you a choice.

yeah...which makes me wonder to have kids first...or possibly adopt later in life...I just know I don/t want kids yet not for another few years, but I want to transition within the next year...so I think I will have to take the risk that I may not be able to have kids after I transition and look into adoption...has anyone heard of having their eggs frozen to be used later for infetro (sp)?

You can have your eggs frozen for use later on.

Note that you will need to take hormones for this, because the standard IVF procedure is that they use hormones to stimulate egg production and then they can extract more than one egg from your body at once.

It is unclear what the odds are that the eggs will survive after extraction/freezing to create viable embryos for implantation in a surrogate later on. If you know who the sperm donor would be (e.g., you have a male partner), then you can have them freeze embryos and not eggs, which have a better survival rate (I believe). A third process is to save ovarian tissue, but this is a new technological development, and it doesn't have any history of success for IVF yet.

This is all expensive - the drugs, the extraction, and then paying for the storage of eggs and/or embryos. It's also not clear how good a chance you have that this will work. You can probably get more information from an IVF clinic. There are women who freeze eggs or embryos because they have to undergo treatment for illness (e.g., cancer), so they should have some idea about how much it costs and the percentage of eggs/embryos that are successfully implanted either in the original egg donor or a surrogate.

There are counselors who can speak to your specific concerns about this, whether they are gender therapist, reproductive endocrinologists or other qualified people. They can help you evaluate whether this is right for you and go through the pros and cons more clearly.

I think the hardest aspect is that you don't know how you feel about having kids post transition. There are people who don't want kids and then after transition, decide they DO want kids, they just didn't want to be a Mom (or for MTFs a Dad). There are people who do want kids, and then after transition, realize that their ideal concept of a "family" unit - which always had kids - won't have a place in the same communities that they envisioned participating in (especially because transition changes how people view your orientation).

Quotethen you can have them freeze embryos and not eggs, which have a better survival rate (I believe).

that is creepy! i wasn't aware that they did that already.

edit: alright, i did my homework and read up on it seems that they are sort of a "by-product" of in-vitro fertilization, meaning if you already had some embryos implanted and are keeping the rest for later so to speak. i hadn't heard of anyone just keeping embryos frozen to get pregnant at some point in the future....so maybe it's not done in europe.

Quote from: hyenateeth on February 01, 2011, 12:19:04 PM
Just adding to what Nygeel said, I've also heard things about creating psuedo-sperm from bone marrow... but I don't know much more about it, or how far into the research they are. Still, it's exciting news for us, isn't it?

I read up on this and it's actually not exciting for us as much as I thought.
The project still needs 5 years of experimenting, and even then it may be banned because it is considered "artificial life".
But the reason its displeasing is because they have to take the bone marrow from a male subject, and I'm pretty sure they mean biological male.
The process is to take stem cells out of the femur's bone marrow, manipulate them in a petri dish, and then inject them into the testes where they should develope into mature sperm cells.
And if a transman did accomplish this, they would have to have working pipes down there. Or a pipe, I should say.

This is the only research so far on it, but it looks bleak. I hope it isn't (as a transman who would love to have my own biological child). However, any child of mine, biologically or not will still be loved.

Quote from: emil on February 08, 2011, 02:49:07 PM
that is creepy! i wasn't aware that they did that already.

edit: alright, i did my homework and read up on it seems that they are sort of a "by-product" of in-vitro fertilization, meaning if you already had some embryos implanted and are keeping the rest for later so to speak. i hadn't heard of anyone just keeping embryos frozen to get pregnant at some point in the future....so maybe it's not done in europe.

In the US, there are people already doing it for future pregnancies, not just saving "left over" embryos. It comes up most often when someone is sick and not sure they will be fertile after treatment.

I already have 1 child, a 2 year old daughter. My fiance had her shortly before we met. Her biological father in not a part of her life and  never has been. I'm the only dad that she has ever known. I am going to adopt her after my fiance and I get married. I love her more than anything. She isn't my blood and I wasn't there through the pregnancy or for the birth, but I feel such a strong connection with her that it doesn't matter. I'm her daddy.

My fiance and I have also decided that we want to have another baby. We went through a sperm bank. It's awesome how you can choose your donor. I put in all of my characteristics, interests, and ancestory and it found donors who matched. I was able to view family history, activites the donor was interested it, height, weight, shoe size, hate size...everything. I was able to hear his voice. It had all of his medical history (all the way through his grandparents). After finding someone who fit my personality pretty much 100% we ordered his lifetime photos and were able to see the donors baby pics all the way through his present picture. Weirdly enough, when we got his pictures, he looks so much like me you would think we were related! I'm so excited to start the process, go through the pregnancy with my fiance, hear the first heart beat, find out the sex, cut the cord, and hold my baby in my arms the day that it's born. It will be the most amazing experience of my life, and I don't care one bit that the baby won't be biologically mine. It will be my son/daughter and I will feel as much of a connection with that baby as any biological father would.

emil --

I know how my friend suffered. I know how she was told by her parents that they didn't want her. They told her she was a worthless cripple, a broken down nothing and they didn't want to raise someone so substandard as to not be a real "human". I know she had to hear this as a small child and again when she was older, because her bio egg donor (not even worthy of being called a mom in my book) would pop into her life unexpectedly just to harass her. Can you imagine your own parent referring to you as the "it" or the "thing" and laughing and taunting you? So, no I do not believe that woman deserved to have children. People like her are sick.

My own egg donor/womb renter should have aborted every child she had, including me, because she was not fit to be a mother, either. Some people aren't but she was so desperate for love, she decided having a kid and making them love her was her own viable option at being loved. Unfortunately, you cannot force another human to do as you wish and therefore she has spent her life making all of us so dysfunctional it is going to take years of therapy to even try to repair the damage that has been done. Some people should not have kids. I know first hand, just how many parents should not have them.

If you really want to be a parent you will love your child no matter what. I have a son who is not biologically mine, but I do not care. He's my son. He has bi polar and Aspergers Syndrome. I don't care. I love him anyway. People put so much emphasis on blood relations. I've found more love from people not blood related to me than those who are. We are allowed to make our own families and often are better for finding those who truly love us. Blood does not guarantee love or bonding. In fact, I have found blood does nothing but dictate where you have to live until you come of age and until you can make your own family of those that truly love you.

Hi--more and more ftms are having kids. In fact where I live there is even a new parenting class for transguys who want to have kids. In my own case, my partner gave birth to our son. We were a same sex couple, female, and then she began to identify as trans (no surgery or T then though). But when I couldn't get pregnant we switched to her, and she got pregnant and had our son. We were both worried s/he'd have some sort of gender trauma for obvious reasons, but really it seemed like some amazing body project (maybe because we had a lot of clinic visits). So now my partner has had top surgery and is now on T, and is ftm. In other words, it's a new body project. We had our son before my partner's full transition, but I can totally see how someone could stop the T long enough to get pregnant and have a kid, and then go back on. And our son, who is 4, seems fine about all this. We just explain as we go along. I am sure it will be harder once he starts first grade and has to deal with transphobia, which is why I am getting involved in the school system now. Being a parent is the best thing ever, and more and more trans people are choosing to have kids as transpeople. You would not be alone!

BigDevs,  I don't think I ever denied there are people who are unfit for having kids. What I said was it's a ten times harder task to raise a special needs kid and I should know, I did part of my practical program at a school for special needs kids. But let's just agree to disagree there. Even by your standards I would certainly be fit to raise a child, but I just don't demand that from other people because I do know how hard it is.

Quote
Can you imagine your own parent referring to you as the "it"

certainly. "it" is what my mom calls me since i came out to her as trans.

Ok so I'm an FtM who had kids the natural way. I never expected to have kids nor to be a good mother but what do you know? I'm not bad and my kids are terrific.  I have seen my share of bad people and bad times. I'm not going to get into a pissing contest about heart aches that can never, and should never, be quantified. Just take my word for it.
Now, sure there are some people who should not be near kids. These folks are rare though. They are the exceptions to the rule. As little comfort as that is to us that had a crap childhood,  most people by far will make decent parents. Not everyone but if you sit there wondering and worrying about it, that's actually a good sign. Kids do not come with instruction manuals or aptitude tests for parents to be, but most people work it out. My suggestion would be to wait until you are out of school college university but then if you want kids, your own or adopted, go for it imo. Also if you are very worried, talk to a therapist. Someone in your corner is never a bad thing. If most the parents that give their kids a hard time in childhood could and would have sought help a lot of lives would have been better.
Go for what you feel is right, don't be too hard headed to ask for help.

Emil - Yes, this is where we differ, because rather than studying about raising children with special needs, I am a person in a wheelchair raising a child with special needs (he has bi polar, Aspergers, OCD, and ADHD). Trust me, I know that special needs children come with unique challenges, but that does not make me any less willing to raise my son. These past eight years have taught me a lot. I cannot imagine giving him away just because of who he is. He isn't even biologically mine, and yet he is my son. The past eight years of being his father have been some of the most rewarding. I can't imagine any parent, especially a biological one, turning away from their child, but then I simply do not have that kind of mentality.

also if you have a brother he can donate his sperm. i think thats wat i mite do in the future

Quote from: hyenateeth on February 01, 2011, 12:19:04 PM
Just adding to what Nygeel said, I've also heard things about creating psuedo-sperm from bone marrow... but I don't know much more about it, or how far into the research they are. Still, it's exciting news for us, isn't it?

Sorry for skipping through everyone else's posts but I saw this and had to make a comment.

WTF!?!?!?!?



I can make BABIES?!?!?!?

I hope they figure this out in the next ten years, it would make my LIFE for my girlfriend to carry MY children. HOLY CRAP. Bone babies!! I would REALLY be their daddy!!

*ahem*

Anyway, back to the topic at hand. Yes, I'd have children. But I have no interest in giving birth, although I do respect those who do decide to do so. I'd also adopt, especially from another country with thousands of hungry orphans. I think I would both adopt and have my own children.