Quote from: Marta on August 19, 2011, 02:53:03 PM
So my guy friends know now that i am a pretty good guitarist because i helped my friend Derek compose some guitar tracks for some songs that my band is writing. I am ok with playing keyboard since i really love adding my own sounds to it since my band is suppost to be a mix of a lot of things -hardcore, black metal and symphonic and i just love the symphonic part of it although a lot of times keyboards in metal bands simply just enhance the sound by adding a sort of atmosphere to the background. I really enjoy making the music a little bit more dark anyways since i a pretty big fan of goth bands- mostly 80's (bauhaus, joy division, sister's of mercy, etc.) although i feel like female keyboardists are a dime a dozen in metal- they are more common than  guitarist's, drummer's, etc at least from my experience. I appreciate all of the info and comments on this thread and i know that female musicians are pretty common and just as good as male unfortunately in the music scene that i come from us girls make up like 10% of 100 compared to how many guys are metal fans and in metal bands, i just feel like ive had to prove myself a little bit more than any guy who is in a metal band- 1. because i started playing music at age 14 and 2. because of the fact that im female, so the mix of being a teenage girl in a music genre that is like totally male dominated has kinda worked against me- sometimes i feel like a gimmick (some say women are added to bands to garner more attention towards the band) which i think is complete crap but you would be surprised at how many people actually believe in that and it certainly doesnt help that some women who play in metal bands look reallly slutty. I however am very certain that my bandmates do appreciate the musical part of me  anyway you all added some interesting stuff to this topic

It kind of is a gimmick. Particularly because there's just not that many like you said. I think that's largely why Arch Enemy does so well. I'd say you are definitely at an advantage in that case. Especially since you are good the instruments you play. But, I definitely agree with not falling into the slutty crowd. That's one stereotype I would never want to fall into!

Quote from: Samantharz on August 20, 2011, 01:23:34 PM
As I promised, here is some jazz Piano.

I love you

If they treat you differently because you are a girl, can you really call them friends?

Now if they are just band mates and your position in the band is keyboards, well thats what it is. You can always find a band looking for a guitarist if thats what you want to do.

They way I see it, people are going to treat me however they deem appropriate, and likewise, I will respond appropriately.  I am done wasting time on people who selfish and bigots.

sorry, dont mean to sound attitudey but I had a day. 
 

As your pro rep, let me say that if that's your music, don't quit your day job.

And if you like arguing about who's who in the band, you'll love kindergarten, it's the same thing, except you're not required to produce anything.

Tekla who are you directing that at exactly?

a) anyone who left an mp3 here.

b) everyone else who thinks that being in a band means playing other people's hits at the Pink Pig Room of the Boom-Boom Motel on Friday nights.

c) anyone playing their greatest hits to less money than I make a night.

Quote from: tekla on August 20, 2011, 07:09:43 PM
As your pro rep, let me say that if that's your music, don't quit your day job.

And if you like arguing about who's who in the band, you'll love kindergarten, it's the same thing, except you're not required to produce anything.

wow, someone feels like being a bitch.

Although I have to agree with the whos, who in the band, but I dont think thats what she was saying, and really, who the frik made us any purveyors of how people are supposed to act?

I do believe what she was asking was: Have we noticed a difference between the way people responded to us as male, versus now as female. Simple enough.

I agree with Jillian. You're cruel for no other reason than to be cruel. No one left any MP3s btw, it's all youtube, and I was the only one who posted any. BTW I am already professional and have even won awards; you're approval is insignificant to my success. Have fun continuing to be cruel.

I've got lots of friends with gold records on the wall.  Of their kitchen.  Of the bathroom.  Don't matter, can't eat 'em, and they don't pay the bills.  In the end, most bands pay more money to people helping them make the music then they actually ever pocket from doing it themselves. 

Well, I can't disagree with you there. Still, you came across as insulting. Did you mean that?

To hop back on topic for a minute:

Male-to-female musician here.

Ha ha, yeah, girls are usually the ones singing or playing the keyboards, huh? People have such deeply rooted preconceptions of gender roles, especially when it comes to popular music styles, and especially in the traditionally male-dominated world of metal music. There are notable exceptions, and those exceptions are usually seen as both unexpected and cool. Both trans- and cis-females have a huge opportunity to break into styles like metal playing something like guitar, especially if they are really, really good at it. That said, I'm not saying people should take advantage of gender expectations to be successful. It's just how it is.

In terms of my music, I'm very much focused on finding ways to be successful as a musician while not shooting for fame and fortune, the concepts of which are quickly evaporating in today's failing music industry. Right now, I'm writing music for a rock musical that's being performed at a local college, and the music kind of veers between symphonic metal like Nightwish or heavier Queen, and more indie/alt-rock based piano stuff like Keane, Kings of Leon, and lighter Porcupine Tree. I know it sounds bizarre, but it works. It's kind of a tongue-in-cheek play, so the mish-mash of styles clicks. Anyway, I would love to work on minor productions like this, and maybe do some work for television or commercials, while maybe having a band on the side for fun. I think there are definitely ways to "make a living as a musician" today in a responsible, sane manner, and not always hoping for some big break that will probably never happen.

Pretty much.  It's in part a definition problem.  I wish we had a distinction like we do for cooks and chefs - or even better the distinction between boats and ships.  Because you make some Kraft dinner for your kids you get to be a 'cook', but it does not make you a chef.  Musician to me, is someone who makes their money making music, not just anyone who can strum the chords to Michael Row the Boat Ashore.  If it's not your prime source of income, it's a hobby (albeit a very expensive one), nothing more.

Of course I am the person who when a band asked me once what they could do to attract more fans my first thought was "stop playing those songs."

BTW, most of the 'girls' of rock play bass.

And like any metal band they want a girl in the group so that there will be at least one in the hall when they play.

Quote from: tekla on August 21, 2011, 12:26:33 AM
BTW, most of the 'girls' of rock play bass.

I keep thinking of Kim Deal.  She plays guitar with the Breeders, but I'll always think of her as a bassist.  I love all her music.  Also, she kicks ass.

I like her Pixies work more than the Breeders work, still.  And my fav is still Kim Gordon.  30 years and Sonic Youth is still going strong.  But more people have heard Carol Kaye than any other female bass player, even if they don't know it.


Carol Kaye professional (meaning they paid) credits.

"Good Vibrations" (The Beach Boys) [note - although she played on several sessions for this song, the released version didn't use any of them]
"Soul Reggae" (Charles Kynard)
"Andmoreagain" (Love)
"Homeward Bound" (Simon and Garfunkel)
"California Girls, Sloop John B, Help Me, Rhonda, Heroes and Villains" (The Beach Boys)
"Natural Man" (Lou Rawls)
"Come Together" (Count Basie)
"Feelin' Alright" (Joe Cocker)
"I Think He's Hiding" (Randy Newman)
"Games People Play" (Mel Tormé)
"Cantaro" (Gene Ammons)
"Wait 'Til My Bobby Gets Home" (Darlene Love)
"Goin' Out Of My Head/Can't Take My Eyes Off You" (The Lettermen)
"Go Little Honda" (The Hondels)
"Hikky Burr" (Quincy Jones & Bill Cosby & TV theme)
"I'm a Believer" (The Monkees)
"Indian Reservation" (Paul Revere & the Raiders)
"In the Heat of the Night", "I Don't Need No Doctor", "America The Beautiful", "Understanding" (Ray Charles)
"It Must Be Him" (Vikki Carr)
"Little Green Apples" (O.C. Smith)
"Midnight Confessions" (The Grass Roots)
"Mission: Impossible Theme" (Lalo Schifrin)
"Mannix Theme" (Lalo Schifrin)
"Out of This World" (Nancy Wilson)
"Wichita Lineman" and "Rhinestone Cowboy" (Glen Campbell)
"River Deep - Mountain High" (Ike & Tina Turner)
"Scarborough Fair/Canticle" (Simon and Garfunkel)
"Sixteen Tons" (Tennessee Ernie Ford)
"Something Stupid" (Frank and Nancy Sinatra)
"These Boots Are Made for Walkin'" (Nancy Sinatra)
"This Diamond Ring" (Gary Lewis & the Playboys)
"The Twelfth of Never" (Johnny Mathis)
"The Way We Were" (Barbra Streisand)
"Soul & Inspiration" bass, "You've Lost That Lovin' Feelin'" guitar (The Righteous Brothers)
"Suspicious Minds" (Elvis Presley) - some sources & Musicians Union contract
"Carry On" (JJ Cale) - JJ Cale Styles Book

Album credits on bass  Selected highlights include:
Pet Sounds (The Beach Boys)
Light My Fire (Gábor Szabó and Bob Thiele)
Song of Innocence (David Axelrod, 1968)
Songs of Experience (David Axelrod, 1969)
Release of an Oath (The Electric Prunes, 1968)
There's A Whole Lalo Schifrin Goin' On (Lalo Schifrin, 1968)
Dirty Harry (score by Lalo Schifrin, 1971)
Northern Windows (Hampton Hawes)
Big Man (Cannonball Adderley)
Reelin' With The Feelin' (Charles Kynard)
Cameo (Dusty Springfield, 1972)
Hugo In Wonder-land (Hugo Montenegro)
Your Good Thing (Lou Rawls)
You've Made Me So Very Happy (Lou Rawls)
The Funky Organ-ization of Henry Cain (Henry Cain)
The Zodiac : Cosmic Sounds
Pride (Pride) (1970)
Thumbs up (Ray Pizzi, Carol Kaye, Mitch Holder)(1999)
Picking Up On The E-String (Carol Kaye) (1995)
Freak Out! (Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention)1965
Absolutely Free (Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention) 1966
Cosmic Brotherhood (Bill Plummer, 1968)

Recorded credits on guitar
"Then He Kissed Me" (The Crystals)
"Danke Schoen" (Wayne Newton)
"Johnny Angel" (Shelley Fabares)
"La Bamba" (Ritchie Valens)
"Let's Dance" (Chris Montez)
"Needles and Pins" (Jackie DeShannon)
"The Beat Goes On" (Sonny & Cher)
"You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling" (The Righteous Brothers)
"The Birds and the Bees" (Jewel Akens), with a Leslie speaker effect
"Mannix Theme" (Lalo Schifrin)
"The Daily Planet" (Love)

Quote from: tekla on August 21, 2011, 12:53:11 AM
I like her Pixies work more than the Breeders work, still.

Yeah, no doubt.  Though I love the Breeders too.  I love Sonic Youth too.  I haven't listened to them in a long time.  Good idea!

They just did their 30th Annv. show last week on the pier in Brooklyn.  They are out on tour now. 

So Tekla you are either;

a) A producer.
b) A manager.
c) An elitist that has no place judging other's music because you're not producing any yourself.

And just because you can run a soundboard does not mean that you know your stuff.

Now, let's look at this cute picture of a hipster kitty.

The idea of being a gimmick in a band is pretty upsetting, but its understandable in a genre like this. I think because girls make up a small percentage of the fans or even of people in metal bands they are at times put in a band for the image effect or to gain interest and its true i think for the most part that people do gain interest but most of the time it's more interest in the woman in the band than for the band's music itself. There's various bands that have a female member/s that people will say "those girls are the only thing selling any records for that band" and sometimes i believe its true because even if a band sucks guys will still say "the singer is hot" or "the bass player is hot" regardless of any talent they might have. Although there have been times where im insecure of my position in this band my band members for the most part have proven to me that i am a serious member of the band and not just the girl. they have also been long time friends of mine ive kinda seen them more as my brothers than just friends or band members. Since i do talk to my friends about a lot of things i brought up this conversation and they are all pretty diverse about their opinions about this topic- but all of my band members said the same thing- transwomen dont count as "true female" musicians since they were brought up as boys and most of them learned their music in their life as males, my band members also said that they believe that transwomen and ciswomen are not in the same category as musicians because transwomen were born male. I disagreed with them because i do believe that transwomen have always been women but their opinion is based more i guess on the genetic part of being trans. I think that women do have a different understanding of situations like this and males can be more bigoted and less tolerable or understanding- at least in this situation because we have a couple of friends that are gay and lesbian and they are completely ok and tolerable of them, ill even go as far as saying that my band members are probably transphobic. Getting back to the topic though i do consider myself a real musician and music lover yes i have made my own music as well and who knows if ill ever go far and as hard as it is for some people to believe i really am a big metal fan even though i am a girl and i would never go farther than playing music. Sometimes i think its dangerous to be a only girl in the band since sometimes there are 0 girls in the crowd and in those situations its like "all eyes on me" and as someone who is pretty shy thats not a good thing. Also one time during set up some guy got passed security at this little theater we were playing at and tackled me. It's just stressful sometimes but im cool with it. At this time my band has no video's but we are going to get mp3's soon and maybe ill post them up somewhere but as of now im greatful for your replies

He tackled you? o.O lol well, I think the whole female band member attracting attention thing is more true if she's the lead singer.

Music is a difficult business to be in. You can be very good but attract no attention. I'm serious about the being very good part. I attended a concert in the park last night. A local bluegrass band was playing. I'm not really into bluegrass but I've played bass with them on their jamming weekends when they invite everyone over for a BBQ. I had to admit that they were excellent musicians. Their vocals were flawless, their arrangements were solid, and their pickin' was very, very good. But they'll likely never make any money at it.

I do play professionally from time to time. Oddly enough, it isn't on the bass. It is on the cello. I've got like 10 basses and a cello.

I don't know that it matters all that much in general whether you are male or female as an instrumentalist any more. I'm sure that some genres may stray from that gross generalization. If you are good, people will want you to play. Whether you'll make any money?  Who knows. Who cares. We do it because we like to do it. And if we happen to get noticed... well that would be icing on the cake.

Cindi