Today I had a conversation with a stranger which was pretty awkward...

I was in the community garden near my house with my almost-two-years-old kid.  Backstory: I was pregnant, now I'm around three months on testosterone.  A lady came up to me who recognized me from around, we had chatted once before very briefly.  She said hello to Gabriel (the baby) and then asked me some borderline-intrusive questions such as "So are you going to school right now? Working?" It wasn't the questions so much that were intrusive but the way she said them.  And then she asked, "So, where's his Mom? Working too?" I was a bit taken aback because I'm not used to being read as male, especially after a bit of face-to-face conversation. I stammered something like, "Oh... he doesn't have one..."

She immediately asked, "So you're single then?" I guess she thought that the mother had left or died. I am not single though, I actually have two boyfriends, one of whom is the biological parent.  I said, "Oh, he has another Dad..." She blurted "Oh, that's nice" but then she must have thought about it a bit, and judged that I look much too young to adopt a child (I remember telling her that I am 19 last time) and she said "Well, there's got to be a mother! Two guys can't just have a baby!" I just said "Oh, umm, don't worry about it..." She backed off at that.

I expect that similar things will happen in the future. Should I lie to people? Should I educate them on trans issues every time? What would you do?

My advice: Whenever something like this happens, politely but firmly state that it's a private matter that you prefer not to discuss. Be as polite or as brusque as you like. And then don't discuss it. Leave if you must.

Or I suppose you could ask a question like, "I'm afraid I don't understand. I hardly know you; why are you so concerned about my family situation?" But that invites further discussion, whereas a statement doesn't. (Of course, making a statement doesn't mean that the person will just go off and leave you alone...)

The other thing you could try is the creative response, but (again) it invites more questions rather than shutting people down. I'm thinking of something like "I'm afraid that the child's birth mother is no longer with us."

Unless you actually WANT to do Trans 101 every time, which I don't recommend...but whatever floats your boat.

She doesn't really need to know the finer details now does she? You could try something like - well obviously he had a mother at one time but he lives with his Daddies now, so yes two guys can just have a baby.. and leave it at that. Or tell her that it is complicated and that you'd rather not talk about it and she may again assume the boy's mother is deceased or no longer in the picture - which isn't too hideously far from the truth..

Worse comes to worst you can always just say his Mums at home! Or that you have full custody with your bf(s) and his mother wishes to have nothing to do with him, thanks for bringing it up and walk away! Its really up to you though mate.. How much do you need to explain to a chick in the park but!!? I mean clearly you don't walk up to people and announce you're trans!! Its a need-to-know basis - ask yourself, does this person really need to know??

Pick and choose the ones you educate.. Close friends and extended family etc, people who genuinely care, yeah I might educate them though they're probably going to already know the story! You can usually gauge whether someone is genuinely interested to learn or whether they're just being nosey.

j.

Kindy is such a female environment, woman want to show off their children and inter-relate with other parents that it can often become an inquisition.

I would sort of say that Child is with a happy family now, and leave it at that. It sort of stops the questions? Woman want to know everything about relationships as it is how we operate, guys don't. So be the man you are and close it down. Guys I know, taking their children to kindy just react to that sort of question with a dumb expression and just ask another equally dumb question. Is yours toilet trained, sleeps through the night etc etc etc. Guys really don't grab onto the female nuance, which in this case is called being a nosey bitch. Which is OK, it is part of the female social fabric.

Ignoring such people is the key Guy defence.

Men have learned to ignore female commentary as an evolutionary trait. I can talk to my boyfriend while we are watching TV and he remembers every word the commentator said and none of mine. Unless I say do you want a ->-bleeped-<- . I then hit him and go to bed. And there had better be flowers the next day 

Cindy

Oh wow lol, I would've just lied and said his dad left us (if I don't have a bf) or he's at home/work (if I do have 1). Don't say it's a private matter, that's kinda rude. Actually "I'd rather not talk about it" works okay.

I usually just say, "It's complicated."  Then give them a look that is impossible to misinterpret.  Which basically says, this subject is closed.  :|
Then leave it at that.  That is simply all they need to know.  I'm happy to talk about my kids but about my home life, not happening.  Let them draw their own conclusions.

My partner had trouble with this at the start.  It took him a long time to understand that you don't need to tell everyone, everything.  He thought it would be rude not to answer all the questions they might ask.  I had to teach him that it is perfectly fine to say you don't want to talk more about it.  That is not being rude, it is simply stating your own preferences, which are important.   He has aspergers so it takes him longer to figure out the social niceties.

For the most part I've had no trouble, so far.  I'm going to start taking my daughter to dance classes and I suspect it might get dicey then.  Ah well she loves to dance so I'm going to just see what happens and work with it from there.   

This happened to me as well.

I met this guy online and we started conversing, hit it off well, etc.  I did not disclose my status but told him (truthfully) that I had been in a 15 year relationship with another man.  I liked him well enough but not to the point of disclosure.

He would not let that subject drop a  bit.  Kept probing, and I kept deflecting.  We met IRL and it didn't work out, but I didn't see the need to disclose that right away to someone I barely knew.  He asked if I still kept in touch with the mother, and I said yes (LOL).

I mean, come on, in this day and age there are a gazilion ways two men can have children, and he should have backed off when I deflected the first time.

Anyway, the guy I'm currently seeing did not ask me where my kids came from, and I did disclose on the 3rd date.


Jay

Quote from: ~RoadToTrista~ on August 31, 2011, 05:22:57 AM
Oh wow lol, I would've just lied and said his dad left us (if I don't have a bf) or he's at home/work (if I do have 1). Don't say it's a private matter, that's kinda rude. Actually "I'd rather not talk about it" works okay.

I think it's rude to put someone on the spot and ask personal questions when you don't even know the person. And it's not rude to say that it's a private matter if you phrase it politely with all sorts of the verbal baggage that people seem to expect even when they ask highly personal and invasive questions of folks they don't know.

Actually, and this will sound odd, I don't think it's particularly rude to actually BE rude to someone who is being invasive or obnoxious. By this, I mean that it's not rude to use tactics that under normal polite circumstances would be seen as rude. If the other person opens the door, it probably means that he or she doesn't understand how to be truly polite and appropriate and might not respond to normal politeness from someone else. This woman clearly wasn't reading the signs and needed someone to explicitly tell her "not to worry about it." She was too obtuse for subtlety, in my opinion.

I go with what Cindy says.

Just do the GUY thing. "It's complicated!" and change the subject.
Most if not all straight guys don't like female kiddies talk it bores them to death --- unless they desperately want some help changing nappies.

Guys are more OK to be 'rude' in this way the females --- they often don't even realise that they are rude :-)

Something we/I also still have to learn when being TOO straight with the my truth and then get my butt wiped some time after the event.

Yeah! IT'S COMPLICATED! :-) ain't it?

Axelle

single men out with small children are always suspect

Have to agree with Arch on this one, there are so many people who just seem to not realise that what they're saying/asking is rude and none of their business, and I find a quick pointed look and a very unsubtle palming off is the best way to deal with it. If they won't drop it after that then the gloves are off, and I'll be as damn rude as I have to be to get the message across.

It wasn't like she was being excessively nosy about it. You guys are overreacting.

Quote from: tekla on August 31, 2011, 11:17:52 AM
single men out with small children are always suspect

This is the truth. Even though men get a free pass on generally most things but when it comes to small children, they are always suspect. Women think it 's their business to ask these questions even to a total stranger. Is it right? No. But it's always been this way.

IMO, she is rude and intrusive and politely being told 'it's complicated' is probably the best strategy.

Quote from: Cindy James on August 31, 2011, 04:08:35 AM
Kindy is such a female environment, woman want to show off their children and inter-relate with other parents that it can often become an inquisition.

I would sort of say that Child is with a happy family now, and leave it at that. It sort of stops the questions? Woman want to know everything about relationships as it is how we operate, guys don't. So be the man you are and close it down. Guys I know, taking their children to kindy just react to that sort of question with a dumb expression and just ask another equally dumb question. Is yours toilet trained, sleeps through the night etc etc etc. Guys really don't grab onto the female nuance, which in this case is called being a nosey bitch. Which is OK, it is part of the female social fabric.

Ignoring such people is the key Guy defence.

Men have learned to ignore female commentary as an evolutionary trait. I can talk to my boyfriend while we are watching TV and he remembers every word the commentator said and none of mine. Unless I say do you want a ->-bleeped-<- . I then hit him and go to bed. And there had better be flowers the next day 

Cindy

LoL I had to crack up at this. But it's SO true. My 'Girlfriend' (It's a weird situation I have) Anyway..she tells me all the time that I am absolutely male cause most of the time I am ignoring her. Unless she says something like you mentioned above then she says I finally look up like 'What?'...LoL

As for the kid situation. I have been thru it. I have 2 sons, they are now grown though but when they were younger I would get questioned by people I knew cause they KNEW I was gay..so they would ask, if you're gay then how do you have two sons. The thing I used to say was..well..I had a woman carry both my children for me. Which is true, I just didn't say who the woman was. And it leaves them to assume that some woman out there was kind enough to be a surrogate for my sons.

You can always tell the truth, but do it so that it sounds outrageous. When someone says, "Two guys can't just have a baby," you can say, "Yeah, I know--so, boy, was I surprised to find myself pregnant!!!"

And then I suppose she puts two and two together, having read about Thomas Beatie.

I do like Wes' approach. You can say that you made a private arrangement with the birth parent/mother, and leave it at that.

My wife and I usually just tell people that we don't like to talk about it if others get too nosy about the specifics. Most people start to realize that asking personal questions about the biological relationship of your family and your children is not their business.

Unless a child seems reluctant to leave with someone or is asking for help, I don't ever ask or question the relation of whomever is with the child.  I think it's rather rude and invasive to butt into other peoples lifes.

"Is that your son?"

"No, it's a carnival midget I pay $10 to play on the jungle gym for an hour every Thursday afternoon."

or my personal favorite:  "It's a new juvenile hall program they're trying out, pairing juvenile delinquents with ambiguously gender-ed people because of a lack of non-divorced, heterosexual couples in society."

Quote from: Epi on August 31, 2011, 10:23:13 PM
"Is that your son?"

"No, it's a carnival midget I pay $10 to play on the jungle gym for an hour every Thursday afternoon."

HAHA OMG That is great. My girlfriend looked over at me and said "What are you snorting at now?" when I read that. That is so something I would say to people. But I am generally a smart ass.

I think one of the key things with people when answering questions like this is to not ACT weird when answering. People will respond to you by how you respond to them. If you act like it's a big issue then they will...if you say something with a shrug like it's no big deal then most times...I won't say always...people will usually nod and accept it easier than if they think you're trying to hide something or are uncomfortable for some reason. And if you act uncomfortable or weird, they will want to dig more to see what dirt you're trying to hide...

Quote from: Arch on August 31, 2011, 09:20:59 PM
You can always tell the truth, but do it so that it sounds outrageous. When someone says, "Two guys can't just have a baby," you can say, "Yeah, I know--so, boy, was I surprised to find myself pregnant!!!"

LOL, Arch.  You could say this; most people will NOT put it together and think you are deflecting.

Kind of like I tell my kids:  Just tell people your mom is a gay man.  Because nobody is really going to believe it anyway.


Jay

A similar situation came up a few days later, actually! I said something along the lines of: "The mom isn't around anymore" But then everyone assumed I had went through some horrible tragedy and now here I am, a teenage boy stuck taking care of a two year old by myself! Haha.

I will get better at deflecting these in the future I'm sure, heh.