I'm feeling a lot of ambivalence lately. I've got my letter in hand and I could be on hormones as early as next Tuesday. I feel emotionally that it is what I truly want but at the same the logical side of my brain is trying to rationalize why I am not really trans. It's like a defense mechanism. My old rationale back at 18 was that "Oh, you're too old now. You already have a man's body." But I have since seen that that is a fallacy. Here's the new rebuttal that my brain is screaming at me:

1. "You don't have severe dysphoria (or any really)." I read a horrific story about a transwoman who hated her male body so much that she could not hardly even take showers, had to refer to her penis as "it," erections freaked her out, etc. I don't have a deep hatred for my penis or a similar hatred for masculine parts of my body. I even tried hyper-masculinizing myself to remove these trans thoughts. My male body has always been O.K. with me, it's just been subservient to a more desirable female body.

2. "You didn't always know you were a girl since you were a kid." A lot of trans people say that they had always known since they were a child that they had the wrong body. Although my very earliest memories are of daydreaming about being a girl and enjoying girl's clothing, that's different from knowing you are a girl trapped in a guy's body.

3. "You're not an effeminate gay guy." For a lot of trans women, becoming a woman is just the next step up from an already feminine life. Right now I live the life of a manly heterosexual guy. There isn't a particular "girl" activity that I would like to go out and do (besides the external appearance of clothes, hair, makeup, body, etc.). My favorite activities are uber manly such as cage fighting.

What I do have is a severe, insatiable desire to become a woman and have a woman's body and external appearance, and I have always felt this way. I use be content with expressing this in sexual fantasies but the desire is far beyond that where I can no longer satisfy it. When I wear woman's clothes or makeup, it's like I'm high. I've never tried an illicit substance or even alcohol, but the euphoria that I experience is what I imagine its like. I'm sure the high would wear off once being a woman became more mundane and part of my day to day life, but the happiness would always be there, I'm certain.

Does this make me textbook transgendered? I'm not sure. I know for sure that I fall somewhere on the transgender spectrum, but when I look at characterizations of trans people, there are some that I can relate to and others that I don't. It's like I feel "less trans" than some of the other women.

Those three things you listed are the same things I asked myself since I found that I wasn't the same as other transwomen.

I don't hate my penis, at all.
I didn't find out I was trans until mid-puberty.
and I wasn't an effeminate gay guy, I wore make up, but I didn't consider that "OMG SO GAY". I considered it a guy thing.

Don't let them get to you.

Honestly, I respond to those people with extreme arrogance and bitchiness. Like the gay men taught me.

I'm going to answer each of these points from my own point of view.. You may find it useful, you may not.. Make of it what you will..

Quote from: jdinatale on December 29, 2011, 04:30:22 PM
I'm feeling a lot of ambivalence lately. I've got my letter in hand and I could be on hormones as early as next Tuesday. I feel emotionally that it is what I truly want but at the same the logical side of my brain is trying to rationalize why I am not really trans. It's like a defense mechanism. My old rationale back at 18 was that "Oh, you're too old now. You already have a man's body." But I have since seen that that is a fallacy. Here's the new rebuttal that my brain is screaming at me:

1. "You don't have severe dysphoria (or any really)." I read a horrific story about a transwoman who hated her male body so much that she could not hardly even take showers, had to refer to her penis as "it," erections freaked her out, etc. I don't have a deep hatred for my penis or a similar hatred for masculine parts of my body. I even tried hyper-masculinizing myself to remove these trans thoughts. My male body has always been O.K. with me, it's just been subservient to a more desirable female body.

I've never had any real hatred for my body.. I know it's not right for me, but I don't hate it. I brought this up with my therapist, who told me it was fairly common..

Quote2. "You didn't always know you were a girl since you were a kid." A lot of trans people say that they had always known since they were a child that they had the wrong body. Although my very earliest memories are of daydreaming about being a girl and enjoying girl's clothing, that's different from knowing you are a girl trapped in a guy's body.

I knew, but simply couldn't accept it.. It takes an 'light bulb' moment for many to work it out..

Quote3. "You're not an effeminate gay guy." For a lot of trans women, becoming a woman is just the next step up from an already feminine life. Right now I live the life of a manly heterosexual guy. There isn't a particular "girl" activity that I would like to go out and do (besides the external appearance of clothes, hair, makeup, body, etc.). My favorite activities are uber manly such as cage fighting.

OK, I was a gay guy, but I was not terribly effeminate.. Reckless, foolish, confused, for sure.. But I was one of those 'straight-acting' gay guys..

QuoteWhat I do have is a severe, insatiable desire to become a woman and have a woman's body and external appearance, and I have always felt this way. I use be content with expressing this in sexual fantasies but the desire is far beyond that where I can no longer satisfy it. When I wear woman's clothes or makeup, it's like I'm high. I've never tried an illicit substance or even alcohol, but the euphoria that I experience is what I imagine its like. I'm sure the high would wear off once being a woman became more mundane and part of my day to day life, but the happiness would always be there, I'm certain.

Does this make me textbook transgendered? I'm not sure. I know for sure that I fall somewhere on the transgender spectrum, but when I look at characterizations of trans people, there are some that I can relate to and others that I don't. It's like I feel "less trans" than some of the other women.

There really is no such things as a textbook transgender or transsexual person, we all travel our own path.. Our own path to realisation and our own path during transition.

Well, my personal opinion is that you should do what makes you happy.

There are people more dysphoric than me, I read a story not all that long ago of a transwoman who tried to use a kitchen knife on herself out of frustration, I am nowhere near that point. None of this however, really matters, it isn't a competition.

I am unhappy with a male body and will not be happy until I have gone as far as medical science can possibly take me, I suppose even then, there will be a bit of unhappiness that I can't for example get pregnant, but I resolved to deal with issues like that when I am at that point.

As far as knowing since you were little, that doesn't really matter so much either. I mean some people do some people don't, but they aren't you, and that is what is important.

As far as your hobbies they too do not define who you are any more than you want them to, after all I know a few women into some male dominated interests and hobbies and I don't think that makes them any less of a woman. I know a guy who I talk with frequently about knitting, that doesn't make him any less of a man either.

You don't need to be gay before you are trans either, I mean for one thing, not every transwoman is into men, and even those that are, were not always into men before transition. Don't be hard on yourself for not meeting a stereotype, human beings have a significant amount of variation.

Basically what I am saying, is that being more or less trans, IMO is more of an abstract concept than something with tangible impact on your life. Not only are people different, but due to the nature of some of the gatekeepers, more people will claim to fit textbook definitions to their gatekeepers so that they can go ahead and get this ordeal over with. Unfortunately these gatekeepers report this in such a way, that many "textbook" traits of transgender people tend to be as best I can tell vastly over reported.

Whatever you do, don't let other people make you feel less than you are.

Well, here I am in the MTF forums again.
Lulz.



Yeah, eighteen is definitely not too old to transition, so I see why you're looking for other excuses even if it's simply to find any at all.  I think as people we're all different, but afraid of being "too different" because most of us have this tendency to find comfort in others. It doesn't really bother me when I'm not much like some other transguys, because there's some of them I really wouldn't want to be like....like at all. Plus, I don't really consider this my journey into becoming a FTM, but more of journey into becoming myself and finding what makes me happy. That's what really is important. Basically, you should realize you're not like all of the people in the community you may try to identify in, but that shouldn't something that holds you back from being true to who you are. I used to try to rationalize too.
I didn't particularly like my female body, but a lot of other people did, so to some degree, I started to think there was something deeply wrong with me for hating it. Not to mention, it doesn't really bother me as much to look at my body as it does some other transfolks I've talked to. I'm fine with my body as long as I cover my chest...well, for the most part anyway. I don't avoid showering for the sake of not looking at my parts. I never hyper-feminized, but I tried to be androgynous for a really long time, but I would exploit myself because I was insecure and feel terrible for doing so afterwards in a really feminine way. This was out of self hatred and denial. I've always wished I were cis...and actually cis-anything really, so I didn't have to deal with all of these problems. I feel for you.
       I didn't realize I was trans until I hit puberty. I never identified with being female much as a child, but I certainly don't think I identified myself as anything gendered really. I was just me. I don't thing someone's assigned sex really mattered to me all that much until I hit puberty. I seriously didn't even think about that stuff or why it would've been important beforehand, or at least not that I can recall.
   I actually suppressed my masculinity before I decided to transition, so I'm sort of in the same boat with you. It wasn't readily apparent that I was "manly" a couple of years back until people got to know me. As I said, I was androgynous. I don't think it's weird for guys to wear makeup though, especially if it's just coverup for a blemish or two I do that sometimes. I'm not a gay transguy. I'm totally into women. I don't associate trying to make myself look good for the people I want to attract as anything all that feminine really.

:]

Basically, your means of trying to rationalize this still doesn't work. Everyone is different. If you do decide to transition, don't let those petty things get to you. This isn't a cookie cutter world, m'dear.

I can relate as I've never had hatred for my body, though more and more I dislike my penis and unwanted erections (back when I had them), though I have to admit that once in a while I think about loosing it and it makes me pause and ask myself, "Am I sure?"  But, I don't want to use it for sex and I definately want to experience sexual relations as a woman and with a vagina, so maybe my hesitation is just (you can laugh) the fact that the only penis I get to hold lately is my own.

Didn't know I was trans since birth - took me a long time to get here and I'm still working on figuring out exactly who I am, but I've learned who I am not. 

Was not an effeminate gay guy either, though I was not macho.  Came out as a gay male in my mid 30's and thought I found myself, but I only found my sexual orientation, not my gender.

As others said, do what is right for you.  I'll just add to make sure you get plenty of good counseling - once you have SRS it is not easy to reverse, so best if you are sure.

Yes, all that intense rational questioning became a huge issue for me prior HRT, but really I kept coming up with the same kinds of dysphoric feelings.

I did try at various times to confirm my trans feelings before with a few other transsexuals, as well as a few people on-line, only to come away feeling quite perplexed. Everyone seemed to have their own take on gender dysphoria, how it's affecting them, different emphases on this, that. So in many respects I realised that the "how much thing" was only going to be found through my own honest insight, my own unique experience of what being dysphoric was doing over time, elusive though that sounds.

On your 3rd point, I recently saw the video "MtF" - an Australian production from around 2003 I think  - where one person was a car mechanic and another a naval officer and captain of a 19th Century tall sailing ship. With respect, they were quite far from displaying the "effeminate gay" quality you describe, but they were feminine in their own way. For me it just showed how unstereotypical some trans people can be.

Don't listen to them. What you are and what you want matters. Your life is your own.

Just do it.

What's the worst that can happen?

Quote from: spacial on December 31, 2011, 09:43:17 AM
Just do it.

What's the worst that can happen?

well the worst that can happen is you go on that journey, go through all the changes, lose friends/family/job, then get SRS -

only to your horror, you realize you were meant to be a man after all.... but your privates is gone!!! 

Quote from: MsDazzler on December 31, 2011, 10:50:59 AM
well the worst that can happen is you go on that journey, go through all the changes, lose friends/family/job, then get SRS -

only to your horror, you realize you were meant to be a man after all.... but your privates is gone!!! 

FEAR = False Evidence Appearing Real

This is precisely why the WPATH recommendations were written. To ensure this hypothetical couldn't happen. Substantially less than 1% of cases reported to date.

If both therapists won't sign off on you, plus a heap of other requirements,  No GCS, simply.

Huggs
Catherine