Quote from: Cindi Jones on April 14, 2007, 03:33:47 AM
God hasn't been very clear on a number of current issues in his "word" has he?  I suppose that's what you get when you have a gentile emperor put the little book together for you.

Cindi

Ahhhhh...derision of mine [and others'] faith, eh, Cindi??   >

Harsh retribution [a bag of doggie poo left in flames on your porch, perhaps  >] is clearly in order.

Seriously, it does not need to be addressed in Scripture; it's not an 'issue'. Neither are 'palsy', infirmities, leprosy, epilepsy, et al  and these are "mentioned" in the same Scripture.

Why should these be an 'issue'? If anything, such are simply acknowledged to exist and occur.

God expects one to actually use good sense and to love Him and others enough to make proper discernments.

"And this I pray, that your love may abound still more and more in real knowledge and all discernment,..." Philippians 1:9, NASB

These ministers and christians know this verse [and numerous others] but if they are either intellectually lazy or are not interested in truth, they put on the rhetorical 'blinders' and pretend such like these simply do not exist [or have no force].

And then we are made to suffer accordingly and I would gently ask,

"Does their maltreatment of us emanate from God or man"?

Quotemaltreatment of us emanate from God or man?

I hope that is actually never EVER in doubt.

Believe me, if you piss off 'God' you will know. YOU WILL KNOW.

But that's the thing, ^*smile* she realizes you are children. To the good fortune of many MANY of those I have met I must say.

^*shrug*

In blindness walk the faithless.

he sewed his eyes shut because he is afraid to see
he tries to tell me what I put inside of me
he got the answers to ease my curiosity
he dreamed a god up and called it christianity

god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

he flexed his muscles to keep his flock of sheep in line
he made a virus that would kill off all the swine
his perfect kingdom of killing, suffering, and pain
demands devotion, atrocities done in his name

god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

your god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

(your god is dead) god is dead
(and no one cares) and no one cares
(drowning in his own hypocrisy) if there is a hell
(see you) I'll see you there (you there)

Quote from: LostInTime on April 14, 2007, 09:28:19 AM
he sewed his eyes shut because he is afraid to see
he tries to tell me what I put inside of me
he got the answers to ease my curiosity
he dreamed a god up and called it christianity

god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

he flexed his muscles to keep his flock of sheep in line
he made a virus that would kill off all the swine
his perfect kingdom of killing, suffering, and pain
demands devotion, atrocities done in his name

god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

your god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

god is dead and no one cares
if there is a hell I'll see you there

(your god is dead) god is dead
(and no one cares) and no one cares
(drowning in his own hypocrisy) if there is a hell
(see you) I'll see you there (you there)

I have heard a number say to the effect, over the years,

"I want to go to Hell, because all of my friends will be there!"

But it is an ignorant [as in, deficit of knowledge] statement based solely upon the experiences acquired while living in the corporeal state of existence. Death is 'merely' a translation from state to state, from the corporeal to the spiritual, a completely different mode of existence.

Corporeal life experience is meaningless in that realm; the 'rules' are totally different.

And once that translation from state to state [physical death] is made, there is no going back to change things.

And it is an eternal realm.

transsexuality is a sin.  im a sinner, any questions? 

Quote from: Katia on April 14, 2007, 07:56:58 PM
transsexuality is a sin.  im a sinner, any questions? 

Well, that makes two of us, sweetie.

In this case, "Repentance is Futile" - and quite unnecessary.

Quote from: Kiera on April 15, 2007, 05:30:12 AM

Quote from: Elizabeth on March 10, 2007, 01:11:29 AM. . . and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

Oh, I see - so as long as we're celibate - achmm, like a lot of Catholic priests - then we're OK huh?

Doesn't confession fix a lot of sins? 

But hon, that verse [Matthew 19:12] bears no application to us, neither is it a justification for religious celibacy.

Nothing in Scripture applies to our plight nor lot in life - nor should it.

If God made you a man, it's a sin to change into a woman is the same kind of logic used when saying, "if God had wanted man to fly he would have given him wings," isn't it? If that's true we better stop flying or were all going to hell!

Quote from: Jonie on April 15, 2007, 11:01:46 AM
If God made you a man, it's a sin to change into a woman is the same kind of logic used when saying, "if God had wanted man to fly he would have given him wings," isn't it? If that's true we better stop flying or were all going to hell!

Good one Jonie

Quote from: jeri on April 13, 2007, 11:41:54 PM
So he sent two of his disciples, telling them, "Go into the city, and a man carrying a jar of water will meet you.......
Why was this man carrying water? Why was he acting outside of the prescribed gender roles? It must have been rare or else the disciples could have followed any number of men instead of this one.

Jeri, I happened to be in a position today to pose this question to four ministers (three lesbian, 1 straight) and they were all rather startled in that they had never thought of it from this point of view.  Of course they were all familiar with the verse in connection with Easter.  But when I pointed it out to them that the man was acting against gender roles of the time, they all agreed that it's well within the realm of possibility that the person was TG.

Beverly

Thank you for bringing this up again Beverly. I must admit I scanned over some of the posts and missed Jeri's reference to the man carrying water. Very interesting. I'll have to mention it to some of my pastor friends too.

Debbie

Quote from: Katia on April 14, 2007, 07:56:58 PM
transsexuality is a sin.  im a sinner, any questions? 

Quote from: rhonda13000 on April 15, 2007, 05:11:09 AM

Quote from: Katia on April 14, 2007, 07:56:58 PM
transsexuality is a sin.  im a sinner, any questions? 

Well, that makes two of us, sweetie.

In this case, "Repentance is Futile" - and quite unnecessary.

That makes three of us! I am just sick and tired of this non-sense!   If I go to hell when I die, so be it!!!

tink

Bah, if anyone 'goes to hell' (closer I think is to be left behind) it will be for your totality of existence upon this planet, not just the actions of any single life.


But, transsexualism a sin? ^*cough* Uh, no.


Any situation you find yourself in that is not of your doing is no sin; How could it be?


Hug those that call you a sinner, and sorrow for them for they do not understand.

Quote from: Jonie on April 15, 2007, 11:01:46 AM
If God made you a man, it's a sin to change into a woman is the same kind of logic used when saying, "if God had wanted man to fly he would have given him wings," isn't it? If that's true we better stop flying or were all going to hell!

I have been assailed by this objection, myself.

But it is a specious and overly simplistic 'argument' based upon mere emotion and neither logic nor ratiocination.

My brother was born male, but also with epilepsy; why should his neurological issue or 'birth defect' be 'acceptable' and be treated with compassion and legitimacy, whereas mine is somehow 'morally unacceptable'?

Lo, with force and conviction I would ask "WHY??"

Not one Christian to date has adduced solid and substantive Scriptural evidence where God 'legislates' against what I have barely survived through for over forty years. My answer to these?

"Either adduce solid and substantive Scriptural evidence which Divinely militates against what I [and many others] are fighting to live with, or 'get out of my face' with your viscerally and irrationally generated objections."

Quote"Either adduce solid and substantive Scriptural evidence which Divinely militates against what I [and many others] are fighting to live with, or 'get out of my face' with your viscerally and irrationally generated objections."

Thats right! Oh yeah!!  You tell 'em!!!!!

I'm imagining a lot of blank stares after that line. It's great.

Isn't it true though, that most of the wanks (I really don't know what that word means but it sounds good) that give us a hard time about this are actually pretty shallow in their faith and their intellect and would have a difficult time even understanding what you're asking for.

But then again... That's probably your point. Duh!!

I'm slow too.

Debbie

Quote from: rhonda13000 on April 14, 2007, 07:21:42 PM
I have heard a number say to the effect, over the years,

"I want to go to Hell, because all of my friends will be there!"

But it is an ignorant [as in, deficit of knowledge] statement based solely upon the experiences acquired while living in the corporeal state of existence. Death is 'merely' a translation from state to state, from the corporeal to the spiritual, a completely different mode of existence.

Corporeal life experience is meaningless in that realm; the 'rules' are totally different.

And once that translation from state to state [physical death] is made, there is no going back to change things.

And it is an eternal realm.[/color][/font][/size]

That is not what the song is saying, you might want to go back and re-read it again. Lyrics that do assert what you have written can be found in a song by Billy Joel though, "I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints..."