Okay, so this year has been eye-opening in many ways. I began to see myself as trans. It was like a lot of things clicked. When I was younger, I was always attracted to females (still am!). And I despised everything that had to do with girls clothes! I remember wishing I could just dress in jeans and a t-shirt. I'd also wish at night to have male genitals. When I started developing breasts, it was like a nightmare. So basically, since I was young, I have had a deep dislike of my breasts. I have never looked at a woman and thought to myself, I want to look like her. However, I have looked at men and thought, I'd love to have their body.

I like the idea of being daddy, and husband. Nowadays, I'd love to have a penis, but I know I will never have a fully functioning one even with surgery. And quite frankly, I'm okay with the genitals I do have. My only real problem is my chest. I can't imagine how happy I would be to have a flat chest and be able to walk around without a shirt on. The idea of a deeper voice and facial hair, also seems fantastic to me. I do want those things. So basically, I have been thinking, I must be FTM.

Here is where things get tricky. I don't particularly get angry when people call me by female pronouns, names etc. In a way, I see it as "well, this is what I am physically." I guess it doesn't bother me at all but you see so many FTMs that are completely opposed to it that I sort of latched on to that idea. Also, I don't completely hate the idea of being a female/lesbian. I love the lesbian community and I feel an incredibly strong bond to it. Also, I think that by getting on T, I would never want to get pregnant. It would just be uncomfortable for me. But without T, it is something I would want.

I guess it sounds like I'm really confused. Because it hit me yesterday that I don't think I want to take T. Not with all the side-effects that I'm already predisposed to. My family has a history of certain things and T would only increase my chances of that. Honestly, I think I'd be happy JUST getting my chest surgery done. I wouldn't even bother changing gender markers or anything like that. I think that I can honestly say I would be 100% at home with my body. And I honestly like my name. I mean it's been my name my whole life and I don't have any particular hate for it.

I would just like some opinions on what you think I am. I'm leaning toward genderfluid but then again, maybe I don't even know what that word means! I saw this video today that described this person as genderfluid and it honestly felt like I was hearing my story. But maybe that's just their one opinion.

And as a side note, I have always had this aversion to being seen as a butch woman. The word itself just bothers me. I wonder how that plays into things. There are so many negative stereotypes about this

Thanks to anyone who actually took the time to read this! I really appreciate it! I know it might seem like a mess of things but that's how my mind is working at the moment!!!


I posted this in the androgynous section but that section doesn't seem to get much traffic if you will lol But anyway, I would love to hear your opinions on this. I'd never given these things much thought since the idea of being in an in between state just didn't seem real or possible to me.

If you don't have an aversion to the female pronouns, like your name, etc. I'd say explore what you can (ex. the chest surgery) to make you feel 100% at home in your body.

I personally avoid slapping a term on myself, because much like you I have multiple things going on. I can't say I'm ftm because I'm not transitioning either. The thing is, I could use a half dozen descriptors but none of them fit 100%. The most important thing though, is that you're HAPPY, not that you find the correct term to refer to yourself with. So what if you identify as male internally, hate your chest enough to want to have surgery, but are ok with keeping your name and moving forward with your life?

I beat myself up for many years struggling with this same type of thing. I wanted to badly to just come across one thing where I just went, "YES! That's totally me ... now I know ... whew!" But it never happened. So many areas of my life are like that (religion for example) where I just pick and choose the things that I like or that DO resonate with me and then incorporate those into my life.

Hope that helps.

IMO, it sounds like you are a woman who just dislikes her breasts.  You say you like your female name, you don't mind female pronouns, you don't want T, to me that doesn't sound like someone who is questioning their gender.

All these labels make me cringe, lol.

At the end of the day, you gotta be comfortable with who you are, don't feel as if you have to fit in a category/meet certain criteria to be part of a community. You gotta do what's best for you. I think you should take some time just to be yourself, find yourself, explore everything and anything, life is a constant learning process.

Plus, not wanting to take T, not objecting to female pronouns, etc, doesn't mean that you aren't transgender. The situation of an individual greatly varies from another individual. This whole thing is a spectrum and you know what, maybe you are going to find that you're just 'you'. Know what I'm saying? You don't have to have a label. Don't let anyone else label you either. Some transgender people adapt to their original pronouns due to the people you're around or simply because that's one thing that you just don't mind. Just remember, that no matter what some transgendered people think or say, your situation does not have to completely match theirs for you to qualify as trans. Anyone thinking people are less 'trans' for certain ideas are completely ridiculous.

I hope you get what I'm saying, lol. Just be yourself, find yourself and totally do what's best for you. Only you have the rights to your body. Do what is necessary for you to feel comfortable within it.

Sorry, I usually answer questions like this on the androgyne forum, though my computer has been a little odd until yesterday.

Hah good luck, re: helping you understand this! I am very confused by the whole thing. I started out thinking I was genderqueer or androgyne (somewhat the same thing, maybe aren't exactly). The more male I am presenting the more I feel like I am ftm. It has been a source of a lot fo confusion, exploration, and thought. I am just exploring the whole thing, with the whole idea of I don't know where it might lead.

Like you I recall childhood experiences. The thing that really stands out is insisting to my mom that I was really a boy and making her call me Billy. (Don't want to be called Billy at the moment).

As I have found there are people who identify as females who hate their chests. She does very good videos and identifies as a straight 'tomboy". (She may androgyne, but...)
intro: non-trans female with chest dysphoria
I think disliking even loathing this is MUCH more common than is thought of. I think common might be more like it. Yes, you can have chest reconstruction without transitioning at all. (There is a post to that order lately.)

You may be trans and not transition. Everybody has their own journey.
I believe some of the confusion is because this is something that none of us was allowed to consider. If we were allowed from day 1 to explore this it might be a very fluid life of taking on and discarding different roles, etc. (what might be called genderfluid).


--Jay Jay

Hey Androgyn/bigender/Non-binary sort of person here to weigh in...

Ya notice how I used three different "identities" tehre? That's because they all fit...but none fit quite *perfectly* So I throw some around. My trans* support group created a glossary of terms and the top paragraph seems fitting here.

"The politics of definitions
This is one of the most volatile subjects in our community, and rightly so. A definition by nature is
simultaneously inclusive and exclusive. There's a lot at stake any time someone tries to include or exclude a
person or group.
You will find very strong opinions any time there's a discussion of definitions. Terms can be a good way of
defining a community, but they can also be limiting. Few topics are more contentious than how to define those of
us who do not conform to gender expectations.
Ultimately, we each have the right to define ourselves. Whether others agree with your self-definition or not is
another matter entirely."

Here's the link to the glossary if you'd like to see what we had to say about specific terms: https://www.dropbox.com/s/6h69y2q63g0nas2/Trans%20definitions.pdf

Fitting into one definition would be awesome...but the more I think about it (IMHO) the less they stick. I think that it sounds like you know who you are, and who you aren't. You've obviously put alot of thought into what you dig, what you don't dig, what suits you, and what doesn't. What steps you'd like to take...and what you don't. It's ok for that to evolve over time, or not!

My thought...is to stick with one of the umbrella terms, and break down how you define from there. These things are often conversations because no one person can be described fully with just one word! It's not possible. (Would be nice though..yea?) Come on over to the androgyne boards and see if we suit you.

Quote from: Andy8715 on June 27, 2012, 03:37:59 PM
IMO, it sounds like you are a woman who just dislikes her breasts.  You say you like your female name, you don't mind female pronouns, you don't want T, to me that doesn't sound like someone who is questioning their gender.

If you read carefully you'd see that I would want to be a man if it were possible for me to have T without all the side-effects.

Part of me doesn't want to accept the Trans definition if I wouldn't take T because my voice would always give me away.

Quote from: Sevan on June 27, 2012, 07:29:07 PM
Hey Androgyn/bigender/Non-binary sort of person here to weigh in...

Ya notice how I used three different "identities" tehre? That's because they all fit...but none fit quite *perfectly* So I throw some around. My trans* support group created a glossary of terms and the top paragraph seems fitting here.

"The politics of definitions
This is one of the most volatile subjects in our community, and rightly so. A definition by nature is
simultaneously inclusive and exclusive. There's a lot at stake any time someone tries to include or exclude a
person or group.
You will find very strong opinions any time there's a discussion of definitions. Terms can be a good way of
defining a community, but they can also be limiting. Few topics are more contentious than how to define those of
us who do not conform to gender expectations.
Ultimately, we each have the right to define ourselves. Whether others agree with your self-definition or not is
another matter entirely."

Here's the link to the glossary if you'd like to see what we had to say about specific terms: https://www.dropbox.com/s/6h69y2q63g0nas2/Trans%20definitions.pdf

Fitting into one definition would be awesome...but the more I think about it (IMHO) the less they stick. I think that it sounds like you know who you are, and who you aren't. You've obviously put alot of thought into what you dig, what you don't dig, what suits you, and what doesn't. What steps you'd like to take...and what you don't. It's ok for that to evolve over time, or not!

My thought...is to stick with one of the umbrella terms, and break down how you define from there. These things are often conversations because no one person can be described fully with just one word! It's not possible. (Would be nice though..yea?) Come on over to the androgyne boards and see if we suit you.

thanks so much! I really appreciate your input!!!

aleon515, I have seen her videos and LOVE THEM!!!!

Jack, I hear what you're saying and I can DEFINITELY appreciate it! Thanks!

Quote from: Andy8715 on June 27, 2012, 03:37:59 PM
IMO, it sounds like you are a woman who just dislikes her breasts.  You say you like your female name, you don't mind female pronouns, you don't want T, to me that doesn't sound like someone who is questioning their gender.

This gets kinda sticky. Because I see trans guys who are fine with things like their female downstairs parts and they're still accepted as trans guys. I'm sure there's other trans guys out there who aren't as offended by female names or pronouns. But how is that different from not being offended by (pardon the term) a vagina in your pants? And of course the "don't want T" thing ... I know it seems like the majority of trans guys have that as number one on their want list but oddly enough there's people who really don't want the side effects or have different viewpoints about their health or have tried it and didn't want it after trying it. It's great if things are really cut and dry for you in that you know you're male and you'll do anything, no matter the cost to your health or body to have others see you that way, but not everyone fits the mold, ya know?

I personally cringe internally every time I'm referred to as a woman, but it's my choice the way I'm living and the way I identify. That also isn't the main hot button for me. Yeah I don't like it, but just because someone calls me a woman doesn't change who I really am. I have less of a choice when it comes to how my body is in some respects. I can change some things ... I can work on other things.

I think the clear cut delineations like you're not male if you don't want T only ADD to the confusion if you're already questioning a lot of things about your gender or sexuality. You feel like, well I can't be that because people say I can't if I don't also want this, this and this.

Quote from: Stewie on June 27, 2012, 08:01:56 PM
If you read carefully you'd see that I would want to be a man if it were possible for me to have T without all the side-effects.

I did miss that part, sorry.

I just floated past this and the title looked interesting.
I like Julia Serrano's quote " there are men with vaginas and women with penises and the world is just going to have to get used to it."  I feel like adding, "and bloody well like it!!"

I like to think of the Gender Spectrum not as a line between two points, but more the shape of a sphere with man and woman at opposite poles.
Masculine/feminine and male/female are also opposite poles, and we can be anywhere in or on the sphere.  We can move around over time too, so it is all really pretty fluid.  There is nothing wrong with being fluid, it just means you won't let others pin you down.

There are quite a few girls on here who are non-op and non-HRT because it suits them personally, so if guys want to do similar they will have nothing but my full support.

I don't hate my genitals, I would just rather they were different.  I am still deciding whether to have SRS, due to possible problems  in recovery, with chronic pain from a back injury.
I may decide on an Orchi instead.  If that is the case I won't be totally satisfied, but will be happy enough to stop there.  Any woman who doesn't like that is not going to be invited to visit down there. 

Karen.

Stewie!  I think you'll find that there are SO MANY people who can relate to what you've said.  In fact, being able to write that sentence to you makes me feel better too because I genuinely believe it to be true but this is something I am struggling with as well. 
Language is useful because it helps us to understand and contextualize the world around us, but it is SO limiting as well.  I loved the glossary entry that was posted because it spoke to that reality so well.
Be vigilant about guarding yourself against all of the "trans* enough" ideals that float around the non-cis community.  Keep discovering the little pieces that feel true for you and stand with confidence in your own journey, knowing that it isn't going to look just like the journey of any other person.  I know this is an exceptionally challenging task when you don't even have the benefit of any language around your gender expression to quickly sum things up.

I am a FTGQ person who has no desire to change my delightful birth name   The vast majority of people in my life use female pronouns for me and my dearest folk mix up the pronouns with male ones which I also enjoy.  If there were a widely used non-gendered set of pronouns I'd be all over it but I haven't personally connected with "hir/ze".  I have quite "generous" sized breasts and am looking VERY forward to having an extreme reduction so that my breasts won't be at all noticeable to the world at large.  I spent some time feeling out the FTM pathway but realize that transitioning to male isn't me, just as much as being a girl isn't me.  I wear mostly male clothing (though I have a FABULOUS inner drag queen that pops up a couple of times a year and can't get enough glitter or fishnets... but believe me, it feels like DRAG and NOT like being feminine as a girl!) and I get happy butterflies when the occasional moment occurs when someone in the world takes me for a guy.  Some days I feel like I'd love to have a penis and many days I'm perfectly fine with the bits I was born with.  I'm putting all of this out there because not only does my feeling about my gender contain a degree of moving fluidity, but there is definitely confusion at times for me and I'm trying to piece it all together without burdening myself with labels or pressure from the rest of the trans* community.  I want you to know you're not alone and that there are other wacky and wonderful gender explorers out there
BIG HUGS!!!