Susan's Place Logo

News:

Visit our Discord server  and Wiki

Main Menu

Please prove to me that God exists.

Started by Alyx., March 21, 2009, 09:43:39 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Alyx.

I'd like to believe that my life isn't so pointless, and that my friends aren't all just stubborn, but I can't. It always comes down to that I can't prove that God DOESN'T exist, the same way I can't prove that Unicorns don't exist.

Besides, I like argueing. :)
If you do not agree to my demands... TOO LATE
  •  

KarenLyn

You can't prove unicorns don't exist because they do exist. I can't confirm the god part though.
  •  

Alyx.

Quote from: KarenLyn on March 21, 2009, 09:45:46 PM
You can't prove unicorns don't exist because they do exist. I can't confirm the god part though.
Nya?

Sence when?
If you do not agree to my demands... TOO LATE
  •  

TamTam

Lack of god doesn't mean life is pointless.

And anyone who proves the existence of god must then prove the existence of Santa Claus. ;)
  •  

KarenLyn

Since always. There's one who visits my back yard every few weeks. He has a thing for millet sprouts. I hope he keeps coming back cuz everything in my garden grows so much better since he started visiting.
  •  

Osiris

If you need proof of God then you've lost the entire point in believing. :P
अगणित रूप अनुप अपारा | निर्गुण सांगुन स्वरप तुम्हारा || नहिं कछु भेद वेद अस भासत | भक्तन से नहिं अन्तर रखत
  •  

Janet_Girl

Just look in the mirror.  There is proof of God.  Look at a sunset.  Look at a smiling child.  And it is said, seek and ye shall find.  Goes for God, unicorns and life on other worlds.

Quote from: TamTam on March 21, 2009, 09:55:49 PM
And anyone who proves the existence of god must then prove the existence of Santa Claus. ;)

Wait... you mean he doesn't exist.... Dang.  ???

Janet

  •  

JakeGrimm

Quote from: TamTam on March 21, 2009, 09:55:49 PM
Lack of god doesn't mean life is pointless.

And anyone who proves the existence of god must then prove the existence of Santa Claus. ;)

Proof of god: the universe (what are the odds that Earth would be in the one perfect spot to hold life, yaddayaddayadda)
Proof of Santa: He leaves presents under the tree every year! And he signs his name! ^.~
  •  

TamTam

Quote from: Jake Grimm on March 21, 2009, 10:20:31 PM
(what are the odds that Earth would be in the one perfect spot to hold life, yaddayaddayadda)

Quite good, actually. ;)
  •  

Alyx.

Quote from: TamTam on March 21, 2009, 10:22:07 PM
Quite good, actually. ;)
Accually, 100%

If it hadn't worked out that way, nobody would be here to observe it.
If you do not agree to my demands... TOO LATE
  •  

V M

I was talking to God just the other day and asked the very same question.
Noting that I'm the Easter Bunny, God replied, "Why of coarse me dear lass. now hop along and paint up some hard boiled eggs to celebrate the death of my only begotten son. Be sure to hide them well....Quick like a bunny." I replied,"Eggs again? Damn!" Just then a bolt of lightening singed my cute lil' cotton tail.  :laugh:
The main things to remember in life are Love, Kindness, Understanding and Respect - Always make forward progress

Superficial fanny kissing friends are a dime a dozen, a TRUE FRIEND however is PRICELESS


- V M
  •  

tekla

"Faith" means, "no proof available" - by definition.  And you can't prove a negative, you must have been on a field trip for that fifth grade science class.
FIGHT APATHY!, or don't...
  •  

imaz

Proof is not the point, one either believes or does not. One is free to do either.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayat_an-Nur
  •  

Genevieve Swann

Maybe God (she) is an extraterrestrial. My chances of seeing an E.T. are much better. As far as the planet earth being in a near perfect position in this solar system to support life, it's impossible for here not to be this and other planets similar. Think of the odds. We are talking billions to one however there are trillions of solar systems. Spirituallity makes people feel good and keeps them somewhat moral. If we did not have the threat of Satan we may be alot worse. Would a good and loving God allow people to treat each other the way we do? Many wars have begun and continued for many years simply over religious beleifs.

Sandy

Quote from: Heartwood on March 21, 2009, 09:47:27 PM
Nya?

Sence when?
Since the rhinoceros.  Warriors returning from the crusades referred to an animal somewhat like a horse, but had a horn on its snout.  The middle east had no unicorn myth.

Also most dragon myths seem to come from China and far east because of the likelihood of naturally exposed dinosaur bones and the extrapolation of those bones into actual animals.

And as has been said, you cannot prove a negative anymore than you can prove innocence, only lack of guilt.

The main article of religion is faith in the unknowing.  Belief without proof.

Your life has meaning only if you say it does.  And your reasons for that could be anything.  As long as you believe you have a reason for being, then you do.

-Sandy
Out of the darkness, into the light.
Following my bliss.
I am complete...
  •  

Lisbeth

You can't prove that god exists. You can't prove that god doesn't exist.
"Anyone who attempts to play the 'real transsexual' card should be summarily dismissed, as they are merely engaging in name calling rather than serious debate."
--Julia Serano

http://juliaserano.blogspot.com/2011/09/transsexual-versus-transgender.html
  •  

Nicky

You can apply some cold logic to it and suggest the existance of god as written in the bible is very unlikely (though the christians have also done some nifty logic to prove the existance)

For example, In the bible God is said to be omnipotent and benevolent. Logic suggests god can't be both because there is suffering in the world. If it was benevolent and omnipotent would there be suffering? Absolutely not. Therfore it either is not omipotent or not benevolent. (unless some suffering is good for humans, perhaps a benevolent god would allow it for that reason..hmmmmm  :D)

Personaly I think belief in the existance of god comes down to faith. I don't have any, you are not going to prove god exists to me. I don't think anyone is deluded for believing in it, I think a lot of humans have a need for 'spirituality' in their lives and it fills a gap. I fill my spiritual hole in other ways like altruism and good food and gardening. I do think it is idiotic to believe in a religion......
  •  

Miniar

Simple.
The word "god" exists.
The concept of "god" exists.
So regardless of whether or not there is a god out there, god "exists" as a word and as a concept.



"Everyone who has ever built anywhere a new heaven first found the power thereto in his own hell" - Nietzsche
  •  

Suzy

Personally, I am glad I do not believe in a God who is controlled by anyone's human logic.  If we see a paradox, then perhaps the limitations are ours.  Unless you truly believe YOU are omniscient.

Some of the best known philosophers, such as St. Anslem of Canterbury argued the existence of God (often called the ontological argument) with statements such as:

    1. God is the entity than which nothing greater can be thought.
    2. It is greater to be necessary than not.
    3. God must therefore be necessary.
    4. Hence, God exists necessarily.

or,

   1. God is something than which nothing greater can be thought.
   2. God exists in the understanding.
   3. It is greater to exist in reality and in the understanding than just in understanding.
   4. Therefore, God exists in reality

You might also look to the works of René Descartes.  Here is a wonderful quote by him.

Whatever method of proof I use, I am always brought back to the fact that it is only what I clearly and distinctly perceive that completely convinces me. Some of the things I clearly and distinctly perceive are obvious to everyone, while others are discovered only by those who look more closely and investigate more carefully; but once they have been discovered, the latter are judged to be just as certain as the former. In the case of a right-angled triangle, for example, the fact that the square on the hypotenuse is equal to the square on the other two sides is not so readily apparent as the fact that the hypotenuse subtends the largest angle; but once one has seen it, one believes it just as strongly. But as regards to God, if I were not overwhelmed by philosophical prejudices, and if the images of things perceived by the senses did not besiege my thought on every side, I would certainly acknowledge him sooner and more easily than anything else. For what is more manifest than the fact that the supreme being exists, or that God, to whose essence alone existence belongs, exists?

Of course, neither of these is perfect, and and it is a large subject, the source of centuries of debate and the spilling of much ink.


Personally, I am more convinced by the teleological arguments, often classified as arguments by design.  These take the form of something like:

(1) Entity e within nature (or the cosmos, or nature itself) is like specified human artifact a (e.g., a machine) in relevant respects R.
(2) a has R precisely because it is a product of deliberate design by intelligent human agency.
(3) Like effects typically have like causes (or like explanations, like existence requirements, etc.)
Therefore
(4) It is (highly) probable that e has R precisely because it too is a product of deliberate design by intelligent, relevantly human-like agency.

The discussion gets much more complicated from here.  But this will get you started if you really want to.  If you are looking for something quick and easy, it is not going to happen.

IMHO, in observing this world with my human mind, I believe it is vastly more probable that God exists than not.  That is as close to proving God as logic will ever take us.  The rest is faith, but it is not, for me, a faith that is contrary to reason.  Rather, reason simply gives us a springboard for talking about the things of faith.  This is theology, "faith seeking understanding."  But now we are into a different argument for a different discussion.

Kristi
  •  

Lisbeth

It would be better to start with something simpler like proving your own existence. But that's not easy either.
"Anyone who attempts to play the 'real transsexual' card should be summarily dismissed, as they are merely engaging in name calling rather than serious debate."
--Julia Serano

http://juliaserano.blogspot.com/2011/09/transsexual-versus-transgender.html
  •