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Can we ever be "one of the girls"?

Started by Carlita, December 18, 2012, 04:10:41 AM

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Sarah Louise

Nameless here for evermore!;  Merely this, and nothing more;
Tis the wind and nothing more!;  Quoth the Raven, "Nevermore!!"
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Annah

Quote from: Stephe on December 27, 2012, 02:23:34 PM
Well I know me and my BF have talked a lot about different things we did as children. And like I've had even casual friends talk about being in the girl scouts or being a brownie or other childhood stories. I was in the boy scouts and enjoyed going camping etc. I guess then I should never be able to share that experience with my life partner? Maybe some people had a very boring childhood and there isn't anything to talk about. And for me being able to share my childhood or things I did as a young adult with my life partner is important. Many of these things would out me as they are thing women rarely would do. You put too many check marks in those boxes and "questions are raised".

exactly,

When transwomen hide this from their partners then they hide SO MUCH more.

They have to hide their families, their entire lives prior to transition, their friends. Everything.

That's not a relationship. That's employment level B-3 and above at the Central Intelligence Agency.
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Ave

Quote from: Annah on December 27, 2012, 02:27:28 PM
exactly,

When transwomen hide this from their partners then they hide SO MUCH more.

They have to hide their families, their entire lives prior to transition, their friends. Everything.

That's not a relationship. That's employment level B-3 and above at the Central Intelligence Agency.

So what if they want? It's not anyone else's problem...

And I'd love to work for the CIA
I can see me
I can see you
Are you me?
Or am I you?
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Stephe

Quote from: Annah on December 27, 2012, 02:19:13 PM
You continue to not tell the men you date and further the stereotype that transgender women "trick" men.
I will continue to tell the truth to the men I date.

That is it in a nutshell. Thank you for making the point clear and concise.

Like you said earlier,  9 paragraphs of transgender theory doesn't change this.
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Annah

Quote from: Ave on December 27, 2012, 02:31:53 PM
So what if they want? It's not anyone else's problem...

And I'd love to work for the CIA

it may work for a one night stand.

it doesn't work in a relationship. Keeping secrets of that magnitude  never work in a relationship.

I've led enough pre marital counseling to know this type of behavior will kill a relationship faster than infidelity.
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Emily Aster

After this, I'm done with this thread, because like Annah says, we will never all agree and need to just agree to disagree.

Quote from: muuu on December 27, 2012, 02:16:11 PM
In a serious relationship sooner or later thoughts about children would maybe come up

This is very age dependent and is also a slippery slope. At younger ages in my own experience, people tend to not talk about it up front and they just kind of assume it will eventually happen. How would you feel if you were with someone for a long time and when it came time to talk about kids, they told you they couldn't have any without a word about being trans? I'm sure you wouldn't like it. I know a lot of people that were married for 5-15 years before deciding on whether or not to have kids. It's not uncommon.

When you're dating in the 30s, it's always one of the first questions brought to the table. Some people don't want kids and want to know if you do right away. Some are dying to have kids and want to know if you want them too. Time's running out for a woman to safely have kids at that age and they don't want to waste any time on someone that doesn't share their views.


Quote from: muuu on December 27, 2012, 02:16:11 PM
It shouldn't be a big deal to them, because it's just social stigma, and if they do want to be serious with you and do really love you... Such a minor thing shouldn't be world ending. If it isn't serious, then they don't really need to know you that well anyway.
What's so horrible for them to have had sex with a trans-woman? Because she isn't a real woman? That's just degrading... There's been no real harm done what so ever.

Kids are a different animal. A a lot of people want to have their own kids and do not want to adopt. But kids aside, what you stated is the way it should be. It just isn't. People are brought up on the stereotypes and prejudices that their parents have and react badly when they are trampled on. It takes a LONG time to get that out of the system. Hell I AM trans and it took me 38 years to be okay with it. Look at racism. It's been 200 years since slavery and while racism has declined, it's still present. The trans phenomenon is very new to the mainstream public and their first encounters with it was from movies and media that blew it completely out of proportion.
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Annah

Quote from: muuu on December 27, 2012, 02:35:12 PM
This is assuming there has been a life prior to transition, a 6 year old haven't really had much to call an "entire life".

the odds of a person fully transitioning prior to the age of six has yet to happen and probably will not happen.

That argument is moot.
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MariaMx

Quote from: Annah on December 27, 2012, 02:19:13 PM
Maria, it's not assumption when 0_0 states the men she dates just want to have sex. It's black and white....there was no assuming anything.
Did she say that? Then it must have been in a previous post somewhere because the post you quoted in reply #139 she says "The last guy I dated".

Quote
You continue to not tell the men you date and further the stereotype that transgender women "trick" men.
Who? Me? I'm married to a guy who knows and I've been so for almost 7 years now. His family doesn't know though and I have no plans to inform them.
"Of course!"
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Annah

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MariaMx

Quote from: Annah on December 27, 2012, 02:48:43 PM
but you told him didn't you?

mhm
Not really. He already knew as we first became friends while I was still fairly early in my transition.
"Of course!"
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Annah

Quote from: MariaMx on December 27, 2012, 03:00:05 PM
Not really. He already knew as we first became friends while I was still fairly early in my transition.

So he knew. Interesting
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Annah

Quote from: muuu on December 27, 2012, 03:16:36 PM
There are early transitioners nowadays, the world does actually change. Besides, there's really nothing to change at that age, no hormones have kicked in etc. Obviously they won't be done with their transition until later, but they'll always live as girls prior to that.
Well, yes, I guess it's very age dependent...
I don't really want kids...


I'm still curious what that "important information" is, why being trans is such a big deal... Oh well...

1. I'm sure you would be an excellant parent. You showing concern already puts you ahead of many other parents

2. No doctor would give a five year old srs surgery
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Stephe

Quote from: muuu on December 27, 2012, 02:35:12 PM
This is assuming there has been a life prior to transition, a 6 year old haven't really had much to call an "entire life".

Who transitions at 6 years old? Is this some hypothetical and even if not, I would venture to guess 0.1% of stealth TS's transitioned before the age of 20 and some much later.
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Stephe

Quote from: TessaM on December 27, 2012, 07:51:46 PM
Plenty of children transition at a young age.

We are still talking about a tiny percentage of trans people who would have been "transitioned" at the age of 6. Clearly only a moron would assume then they had a childhood of a boy. No one is saying that but again, this example of why it's OK to not tell  A: Does not apply to anyone posting in this thread.  B: if in the future society is so OK with people being trans, why any need to be stealth?
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Anatta

Kia Ora

Re: Can we ever be "one of the girls"? If you are 'out of the closet and proud' then the simple answer is no....

::) However if one goes from one closet to another=[stealth or semi-stealth] then it's possible....

Metta Zenda AKA "Just one of the girls"  ;)
"The most essential method which includes all other methods is beholding the mind. The mind is the root from which all things grow. If you can understand the mind, everything else is included !"   :icon_yes:
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Annah

Quote from: TessaM on December 27, 2012, 08:27:18 PM
Im not quite sure what your trying to say here, I really don't want to come off as stupid or rude but were you calling me a moron?  I don't quite understand what you mean by claiming to have had a childhood of a boy (I suppose I agree because I do not believe I had a boys childhood since...I AM A GIRL!)

I dont think anyone should be stealth BECAUSE the future where everyone is completely accepted will come sooner rather than later, but to each their own.

She wasn't calling you a moron.

She is saying that there are hardly no people who transitioned at the age of 6. And she is right. As of today there has been 0 people who has transitioned at the age 6.

And 19 years old is a way bigger difference than 6. Also, if you were taking hormones illegally at 19 I would not call that having transitioned. I would call that experimenting with your transgender self and starting that process.

Now, if you said, you live as a girl, had everything switched over legally as female with your legal name as your female one, HRT, and completed transition at age 19, then I would say you transitioned at 19.

And since you fully transitioned at 19/20 (I am assuming you are non op) then that is still a big difference than 6.

And yes, I know Jazzy. I brought her and her family to my church one year. They even stayed in my home for a weekend. Even she will tell you she has not finished her journey to be a girl yet. She will be the first one to tell you she still has a long way to go. If anything, yes, Jazzy can get away with this.

But I know Jazzy. Jazzy would also be the first one to tell her boyfriend about her past too.

That little girl has more wisdom than most of my fellow transisters three or four or five times her age.

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BunnyBee

I feel people should handle their own relationships however they feel is best, and when, why and to whom they tell somebody that, in the distant past, they had to pretend to be male should be their own business.  That seems pretty simple.

Just because a lot of present day society wants to tell us we used to be men doesn't make it true.  Our consciousnesses are tied to our minds, not to the bodies we were born with, not to how we were raised, or to how we made ourselves act in the past out of fear.  We are our minds and our minds were born female.  Even science is bearing that out.  It is never a lie to say otherwise, unless when you were in the male role it wasn't an act, I guess.

As long as society is going to see women with our history as "previously men," when we reveal those little, almost always unnecessary, details about our past that cause them think of us that way, we have corrupted the truth.  Doing so causes them think of us, and treat us, as though we are (or were) something we never could be.  The truth is we have always been female, the lie is that we ever were men.

I'm not saying you should never tell anybody.  I personally would not be with a man that couldn't handle knowing about my past.  I'm just saying that, in my opinion, it should be up to you when and whether you do, and that you should never feel guilty for not doing so.

Regarding the original subject, act like a woman, be a woman, and people will treat you as such.  For reals.
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O_O

Quoteif one goes from one closet to another=[stealth or semi-stealth] then it's possible....


Not necessarily in reply to the person who wrote this, but in reply to the people who believe just being male or female without disclosing teh tranz after transition is a lie, a deception or a half-truth, a masquerading, a hiding, a pretending or dishonesty...


If you have always been female, if you were born with GD and transition to having a female body and a female life then what kind of closet is that?  Is a closet a wide-open space where you can truthfully and honestly be who you really are?  If so the World is my Closet and it is Wonderful, I have never experienced such Liberty and Freedom.  Doesn't seem like a "closet" in any sense of the word to me, doesn't feel like a prison, I left my prison behind.

^_^

Feel free to test out my "closet" to see if it makes you feel claustrophobic, if it does then you and I are very different and I find it impossible to relate to you because your description of transition sounds way too much like my life prior to transition and I really don't know what happened or didn't happen to cause you to feel that way.

O_o
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O_O

Quote from: Annah on December 27, 2012, 02:19:13 PM
Maria, it's not assumption when 0_0 states the men she dates just want to have sex. It's black and white....there was no assuming anything.

Quote from: O_O on December 27, 2012, 03:50:40 AM

The last guy I was with, all he was ever interested in was having sex with me.  He took me to movies, restaurants and we hung out together and all he was concerned about was having sex with me, that was the only thing on his mind.


Anyone who is willing to do even just a little research will find that you are flagrantly lying about what I have said in this thread Annah.

Why don't you address things I have actually said instead of making up BS for the sake or proving me wrong?

O_o

And you accuse me of lying?  Shame on you Annah.
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Alainaluvsu

Quote from: O_O on December 28, 2012, 01:20:13 AM
If you have always been female, if you were born with GD and transition to having a female body and a female life then what kind of closet is that?  Is a closet a wide-open space where you can truthfully and honestly be who you really are?  If so the World is my Closet and it is Wonderful, I have never experienced such Liberty and Freedom.  Doesn't seem like a "closet" in any sense of the word to me, doesn't feel like a prison, I left my prison behind.

I'll venture to guess what the poster meant by "in the closet". "In the closet" or "being closeted" refers to hiding a piece of yourself out of shame or fear of something. I think you're a strong believer in that it's best for you to live your life without telling ANYBODY that you are trans for any reason. So for that, you're totally in the closet in every context of that post if I am correct. You are actively not sharing a part of your life with somebody. You may think it's the same as "well it's none of your business... kinda like my health records" ... well if you're ashamed of your health records then you're in the closet about that.

And if your closet is all nice and open and stuff... cool. I feel sorry for the guy that trusts you if he is not cool with being with a trans woman.
To dream of the person you would like to be is to waste the person you are.



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