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Vanity Threads

Started by Shantel, June 24, 2013, 11:25:04 AM

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Shantel

I don't post my mug shot on the vanity threads for a lot of personal reasons as I'm sure is the case for many here at Susan's, besides that I know I don't pass or look pretty so why assault everyone with my mug shot and set myself up for hurt feelings. I think "Do I Pass?" should be replaced with "Do I look female?" The reason I'm suggesting that is that there is no way anyone can say someone passes simply by looking at a few photos. Passing is all about body language, tone of voice and inflection and how one carries themselves. You might look great in a photo, but if you walk with your feet shoulder width apart like a fullback on a football team, touch your crotch, or have a basso voice, then no of course not! Then there seems to be a lot of dishonesty in the replies like, "You look just darling dear!" when you really think the person is a dog. Those posting photos almost daily for months on end only serves to tell everyone of either their insecurities or of how truly self absorbed they are and it is pathetic and tiring for everyone.

"You Look Fabulous Darling!" Speaks for itself and rules out about 80% of the membership who are not and never will be fabulous looking. It's ok though, and we should all grow up and get over it. If you don't look fabulous please don't post your photo in that thread, it only serves to undermine the intent of that thread. I know this comes off like a rant, but a lot of nice women are either getting bad advice from others or have their feelings tromped on by being dissed and it doesn't come across as supportive in either case. I'd be interested in having others air their feelings about these threads. ~Shan~
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Nero

Well, I've never posted in these kinds of threads. Even early in transition. I just don't have a need to get anyone's opinion on my appearance or passability. If I'm passing, I know it. If I'm not, I know it. Though it may be more definitive to ftms, since if you're not passing, everyone just takes you for a butchy woman and nobody feels the need to humor you with a 'sir'. Whereas with mtfs, even if you're not passing, you may still get 'ma'ams' if you're obviously dressed as a woman.
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Jamie D

This is the guidance from the first page of the "Do I Pass?" topic:

Could I Pass One Day? - for those who are questioning, and wondering if they might have the ability to physically pass as "female."

You look Fabulous, Darling - for those who are finished, or nearly so, with their transitions.  A celebration of change.  "It was meant to be a place to celebrate being fabulous and enjoying life...not to be another thread for others to pick faults and put you down" - Rock_Chick

Before and After - a place to show where you were when you started and how far you have come in the process.

Do I Pass? - THIS TOPIC, for those who are in the process of transitioning.  A place to seek advice, reassurance, and constructive criticism.
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Alainaluvsu

Well... that took guts I suppose! lol!!
To dream of the person you would like to be is to waste the person you are.



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Devlyn

If I had my druthers, we wouldn't have stickied passing threads. They are contentious, and if interest in the threads wanes, they would slide off the front pages. Also, it's important to remember that people are offering their opinions in these threads, if you choose to take an opinion as fact, it's on you.
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Sarah Louise

Nameless here for evermore!;  Merely this, and nothing more;
Tis the wind and nothing more!;  Quoth the Raven, "Nevermore!!"
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Devlyn

Quote from: Sarah Louise on June 24, 2013, 12:20:27 PM
Un-Sticky them.

The Pass threads are Jamie's baby, I'm not touching them!
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BunnyBee

I guess I look at those threads differently.  Two of them give people a place where they can post pictures to get criticism and feedback, which can be very helpful I know because I lack the capacity to evaluate myself.  It's always in flux how I feel about myself, and when I wasn't sure, and wasn't public, I am sure that would have been a great resource for me.  I think/hope everybody understands that the judgement is just of the picture(s), and passing in a picture is very different from passing in public.  But the feedback is not useless because of that.  First, it's a safe place to get other people's thoughts about how you look even if it is surfacey, also you if you know you pass in a picture, it tells you that you are doing some things right.  The unrealistically positive feedback also has its place because it can make somebody feel a little better when they feel so bad about themselves.  More good than harm imo.

I see the other two "vanity" threads to be more inspirational, which also has its place imo.   When I was first starting out, seeing people (also hearing their stories) that had made a successful transition was one of the things that helped me hold on and have just that little sliver of hope which honestly saved me.   Realizing that it was possible to come out on the other side and have a normal life was so powerful for me.  And you know what was, and still is, the most important thing for me to see?  It's the smiles and joy that is present in people's eyes.  Nobody has to be drop-dead gorgeous to show that, and I don't think anybody should feel excluded from or hesitant about posting anywhere.  It's the inner beauty that is so wonderful and encouraging to see.

We can talk about the vanity threads and whether people that post there are just narcissists or insecure basketcases, and maybe... but I think that is just pessimistic.
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barbie

Yes. We all know very well that vanity always becomes vain, eventually.

barbie~~
Just do it.
  • skype:barbie?call
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peky

Quote from: Shantel on June 24, 2013, 11:25:04 AM
I don't post my mug shot on the vanity threads for a lot of personal reasons as I'm sure is the case for many here at Susan's, besides that I know I don't pass or look pretty so why assault everyone with my mug shot and set myself up for hurt feelings. I think "Do I Pass?" should be replaced with "Do I look female?" The reason I'm suggesting that is that there is no way anyone can say someone passes simply by looking at a few photos. Passing is all about body language, tone of voice and inflection and how one carries themselves. You might look great in a photo, but if you walk with your feet shoulder width apart like a fullback on a football team, touch your crotch, or have a basso voice, then no of course not! Then there seems to be a lot of dishonesty in the replies like, "You look just darling dear!" when you really think the person is a dog. Those posting photos almost daily for months on end only serves to tell everyone of either their insecurities or of how truly self absorbed they are and it is pathetic and tiring for everyone.

"You Look Fabulous Darling!" Speaks for itself and rules out about 80% of the membership who are not and never will be fabulous looking. It's ok though, and we should all grow up and get over it. If you don't look fabulous please don't post your photo in that thread, it only serves to undermine the intent of that thread. I know this comes off like a rant, but a lot of nice women are either getting bad advice from others or have their feelings tromped on by being dissed and it doesn't come across as supportive in either case. I'd be interested in having others air their feelings about these threads. ~Shan~


Good point Shan...we should change to do I look female...I hate the word "pass' as it has fraud connotations....yeah I continue to stir the pot lol

Now, having said all of that ^^^...I found most of the pictures showing a good looking female...there are many cuties in this forum, I also found most of the dudes dashing...LOL

I guess the old adage "beauty is on the eye of the beholder" works for me..LOL


One more thing my dear Shan..."Vanity" is my middle name...you know: "Friends will forsake you but Vanity will never let you down:..... >:-)
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Shantel

Quote from: Jen on June 24, 2013, 12:34:27 PM


We can talk about the vanity threads and whether people that post there are just narcissists or insecure basketcases, and maybe... but I think that is just pessimistic.

You have good points and I know I intimated that in your statement on the bottom, but I think that it's a shame that so many people enjoy looking at the women on those threads and yet refuse to comment at all leaving some very fragile types with feelings of even more worthlessness than before. I am equally guilty, but we should all reconsider how such an innocuous oversight by us may seem like a smash in the face of someone who had the guts to put up their photo in the first place. I realize that there was a super full moon yesterday but I got pm's by half a dozen women who were lamenting about how dissed they felt because of it. Something is wrong when that happens on a support forum. This isn't about me, it's about everyone here.
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Alainaluvsu

Quote from: Shantel on June 24, 2013, 01:07:55 PM
I got pm's by half a dozen women who were lamenting about how dissed they felt because of it.

Welcome to the wild world of estrogen. It's full of emotions and insecurities!!!
To dream of the person you would like to be is to waste the person you are.



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BunnyBee

Quote from: Shantel on June 24, 2013, 01:07:55 PM
You have good points and I know I intimated that in your statement on the bottom, but I think that it's a shame that so many people enjoy looking at the women on those threads and yet refuse to comment at all leaving some very fragile types with feelings of even more worthlessness than before. I am equally guilty, but we should all reconsider how such an innocuous oversight by us may seem like a smash in the face of someone who had the guts to put up their photo in the first place. I realize that there was a super full moon yesterday but I got pm's by half a dozen women who were lamenting about how dissed they felt because of it. Something is wrong when that happens on a support forum. This isn't about me, it's about everyone here.

I see what you mean.  I know I usually just comment on people's pics whom I have been talking back and forth with in other threads and there is that small connection, but I'm sure people I don't mention could take that to mean that I am ignoring them for an unstated reason, and imaginations run wild.  I guess I should recognize and be aware of that.  I think everybody that has posted in those threads is so amazing, btw.

It's weird that usually the people that have said something in the thread about being overlooked are so beautiful.  I guess that is just their misplaced insecurity, but everybody on earth has their insecurities, and trans people have more than most I bet.  So that is just part of being human.  I know I have to deal with mine daily.  If I ever judge somebody for being insecure, go ahead and throw me in hypocrite prison.
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BunnyBee

Quote from: Alainaluvsu on June 24, 2013, 01:19:21 PM
Welcome to the wild world of estrogen. It's full of emotions and insecurities!!!

Qft!
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kariann330

I know i personally haven't been on them here and probably won't. Sadly i have herd of someone who i thought was beautiful and ready for full time get bashed so bad by other girls on that forum that she was later hospitalized for attempting to hurt herself. Thankfully that forum is no longer active or even on the internet along with the dating/social media site it was part of.

Yes I know that's a little extreme and wouldn't have gone as far here because of our mods, but i still wouldn't take the chance of having someone in a catty mood bash a pic of me. Plus our threads being sourced by search engines doesn't help me to feel comfortable with it either.
I need a hero to save me now, i need a hero to save my life, a hero will save me just in time!!

"Don't bother running from a sniper, you will just die tired and sweaty"

Longest shot 2500yards, Savage 110BA 338 Lapua magnum, 15X scope, 10X magnifier. Bipod.
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Lorri Kat

If all replies were 100% truthful to 'Vanity Threads' I mite not have such an aversion to them...  To be honest the first time I clicked into the TS MtoF section here and saw them at the top I thought I had been linked to the wronge area(past experience on some other sites).    Those that love them love them and those that do not won't.   For me too little is known about the individuals state of mind or situation a lot of the time and Overly critical responses could drive someone to destruction just as overly positive responses can also cause someone to be over confident in their appearance and put themselves in harms way..  Sorry but I've seen both happen. 

There is a stark difference between honest supportive, critiquing feedback and pandoring or visceral comments.       :)
=^..^=
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Jamie D

Quote from: Devlyn Marie on June 24, 2013, 12:24:10 PM
The Pass threads are Jamie's baby, I'm not touching them!

Well, some of the newest versions are mine.  Earlier versions were made by Forum Admin, Osiris, Helena, and others.  Some are on their second, third, or fourth versions.  They are among the most popular topics we have on the Forums and have been "stickied" as long as I can remember (with the exception of Mahsa's topic).  Though they can be contentious, I know that I drew great strength at seeing what could be accomplished.  Many other members have said that these topics, especially "Before and After" were inspirational.

Of course, "support" means honesty, and members who post here need to know that all the suggestions and commentary may not be what they want to hear.  But sometimes, the comments can be life-changing. And, I suspect, they bring new members to the site that might otherwise drift aimlessly.

I trust our membership to post and comment responsibly.
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Jamie D

Quote from: kariann330 on June 24, 2013, 01:38:16 PM
I know i personally haven't been on them here and probably won't. Sadly i have herd of someone who i thought was beautiful and ready for full time get bashed so bad by other girls on that forum that she was later hospitalized for attempting to hurt herself. Thankfully that forum is no longer active or even on the internet along with the dating/social media site it was part of.

Yes I know that's a little extreme and wouldn't have gone as far here because of our mods, but i still wouldn't take the chance of having someone in a catty mood bash a pic of me. Plus our threads being sourced by search engines doesn't help me to feel comfortable with it either.

Kariann, we do have a picture-sharing topic in the "Just for Us" section that is not crawled.  It is a safe locale for the shy types, like yourself  ;)

Quote from: Miss Bungle on June 24, 2013, 01:24:54 PM
I don't think I have ever posted my pic in those threads. (although I have used a pic of myself as an avatar from time to time.) If someone honestly looks good then I say so. If they don't then I say nothing at all. But on the other hand, there are some people that may have looked great and I never mentioned it simply because I was working on something else while online and never got around to commenting.

Myself? I'm a frumpy dork and I don't care about how I am seen online. If someone says I look good. Fine. If they say nothing. Fine. I'm more interested in showing off my Dotty and Portia plushes than myself, really. :D Because they ARE friggin' cute!

Foo!  You are as cute as Portia, and you know it!
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BunnyBee

Quote from: Lorri Kat on June 24, 2013, 03:26:03 PM
<snip>overly positive responses can also cause someone to be over confident in their appearance and put themselves in harms way..

I guess I don't understand how this happens?  Can you give an example?
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Devlyn

Quote from: Jamie D on June 24, 2013, 03:33:56 PM
Well, some of the newest versions are mine.  Earlier versions were made by Forum Admin, Osiris, Helena, and others.  Some are on their second, third, or fourth versions.  They are among the most popular topics we have on the Forums and have been "stickied" as long as I can remember (with the exception of Mahsa's topic).  Though they can be contentious, I know that I drew great strength at seeing what could be accomplished.  Many other members have said that these topics, especially "Before and After" were inspirational.

Of course, "support" means honesty, and members who post here need to know that all the suggestions and commentary may not be what they want to hear.  But sometimes, the comments can be life-changing. And, I suspect, they bring new members to the site that might otherwise drift aimlessly.

I trust our membership to post and comment responsibly.

My point is that important things like Staff guidelines, HRT Policy, and the suicide hotlines are worthy candidates for being sticky topics.

"Look at me, everybody" , not so much
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