Quote from: wheat thins are delicious on December 14, 2013, 08:25:01 PM
Can I get a source for that?

You can look it up yourself I don't know how to share stuff on here, As men were not fully mature that's why were not legally men until 21 only girls because they mature quicker, It's on the internet everyone knows that, My dad is the first one who brought to my attention until I looked for myself

Age of majority is the same for men or women as discrimination by sex is illegal. different states have different ages as the link below shows. The age of majority for the US federal is 18.

http://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Age_Majority_by_State

For further information on some exceptions:

http://minors.uslegal.com/age-of-majority/

Yeah I'm finding nothing.  Other than in a few states the constitutional law is 21, meaning that in that state you are not technically legally an adult until 21 (in that state, any other state, you go by their constitution), but that doesn't outweigh federal law, meaning you would still be able to vote and join the military, but for something like buying tobacco, you would have to be 21. 

Quote from: LordKAT on December 14, 2013, 08:50:32 PM
Age of majority is the same for men or women as discrimination by sex is illegal. different states have different ages as the link below shows. The age of majority for the US federal is 18.

http://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Age_Majority_by_State

It's not th same its is true tha women mature quicker than men

AFAIK, there are different legal ages: candidacy (when you can run for office); consent (when you can have sex legally); drinking; working; smoking; voting; working; etc. Some of these in the US have tended to go to 21, but of some are 18 and even 15 or 16. Sometimes WHERE you live in the US is a factor (like driving in rural areas). There is only one age that was specific to men and that was the draft, since we don't have a draft (in the US), I don't know where you get the legal age differing for men and women. Obviously the age of consent is more of an issue for men (in most cases), but just because it is more often pushed by men than women. If it IS pushed by women, there are serious consequences.

--Jay

Nevermind.... its what ever I'm done going on about it

This is gonna sound weird but I think there is an age identity and that age, as opposed to what we're taught and what is expected from us, can be fuild and is definitely non-linear. Mentally speaking you can have any age, a fluid age (which changes depending on circumstance), many ages at once, or  no age at all. It's just a label, a social construct like any other. We do have a linear developpment biologically speaking but our biological age says nothing about our intellectual, psychological, emotional, or social state; nor about our feelings, behaviour or identity in general. Just be who you are and feel how you feel. In  my case I feel like I was never a kid and will never be an adult, independently of gender identity.

Quote from: Brandon on December 14, 2013, 08:53:10 PM
It's not th same its is true tha women mature quicker than men

I have a feeling your dad was talking about insurance rates. It's still legal to discriminate on the basis of gender on insurance rates and companies consider men a higher risk factor, particular up to the age of 21, but I think some might continue to charge men higher rates up until 25.

Quote from: dalebert on December 15, 2013, 07:15:00 AM
I have a feeling your dad was talking about insurance rates. It's still legal to discriminate on the basis of gender on insurance rates and companies consider men a higher risk factor, particular up to the age of 21, but I think some might continue to charge men higher rates up until 25.

No he wasn't, And if you don't know that women mature quicker than men then that's a shame, I'm around guys and girls who are 18 all the time no one can just say , I'm a man you gotta act like it, Theirs still an age

Male puberty generally begins and finishes later than female puberty, so in that sense they mature later. Emotionally, I don't put much stock in ages, being a certain age doesn't guarantee maturity for any gender.

There is no difference in legal ages for men and women, at least in the UK or anywhere else as far as I can see. Here we can't even use gender for car insurance, even though it's just a statistic like age is. I find it hard to believe that you're the only person who knows of this apparent law, and are adamant that it exists but cannot provide any source for it.

Quote from: AlexanderC on December 15, 2013, 08:18:26 AM
Male puberty generally begins and finishes later than female puberty, so in that sense they mature later. Emotionally, I don't put much stock in ages, being a certain age doesn't guarantee maturity for any gender.

There is no difference in legal ages for men and women, at least in the UK or anywhere else as far as I can see. Here we can't even use gender for car insurance, even though it's just a statistic like age is. I find it hard to believe that you're the only person who knows of this apparent law, and are adamant that it exists but cannot provide any source for it.

Yea that's because I don't know how to share anything on here I think I already stated that

Quote from: Brandon on December 15, 2013, 08:42:44 AM


Yea that's because I don't know how to share anything on here I think I already stated that

If you've got a link source, all you need to do is click the hyperlink button (the one that looks like an earth with a paper in the corner) and then paste your link in between the [ URL ] and the and the [ / url ] that it'll put there.
And yes you can do it from a phone, I'm posting this from my phone and looking at the hyperlink button right now.

Quote from: Brandon on December 15, 2013, 08:42:44 AM


Yea that's because I don't know how to share anything on here I think I already stated that

Sorry I assumed that it was something you'd have to do to reference stuff at school etc. Either do it the way that Dean said, or simply copy the URL from the address bar. Even if it doesn't automatically turn into a hyperlink people can copy and paste.

Quote from: em444 on December 14, 2013, 11:04:21 PM
This is gonna sound weird but I think there is an age identity and that age, as opposed to what we're taught and what is expected from us, can fuild and is definitely non-linear. Mentally speaking you can have any age, a fluid age (which changes depending on circumstance), many ages at once, or  no age at all. It's just a label, a social construct like any other. We do have a linear developpment biologically speaking but our biological age says nothing about our intellectual, psychological, emotional, or social state; nor about our feelings, behaviour or identity in general. Just be who you are and feel how you feel. In  my case I feel like I was never a kid and will never be an adult, independently of gender identity.

I think Em have a point on our age identity who do not need to match up with our current age, I think I somethimes feel younger and older than what I am, but I also belive it because of how my life have developed. in a way I have less experience than my classmates in the typical "school life and party weekends" on the other hand I have more experience with something more adulty stuff.

like with gender where it can be put in diffrent categori of biological sex, social gender, gender identity and so on I belive you can do the same with age.

theres biological age and social age for exemple.

Biologically, I think it would chock most people to realise we grown up when we we hit puberty which means biologically we can be grown up for a age of 12, Yet we sure develope future on the body and brain, The most dramatical changing do general stop around 16-18 for girls and 18-21 for boys (I do not remember the exact number and it sure diffrent from person to person) however it sure not stop complitely as we keep aging and developing the rest of our life.

Social age on the other hand is more constructed on whats expected on us for a certain age and it change all the time and depend on where we live. Age laws of drinking, age of consent and so
may be infected by the biological fact But as I see it it much more infected by the culture norm and rules.

In my country its not unusual to  go out drink alcohol when you are 15 when I visit my friends in sweden I must show ID to buy something because I have to be 21.

I can't say I read everything in the thread, especially once everyone started going back and forth with Brandon  but I'll reply my thoughts to the OP.

I just turned 32 last month, my one year on T day will be December 18th, and honestly I feel like I've only matured into manhood this year. I ended up taking an extended leave from this site in fact because I needed to figure myself out. I found that I was really starting to get stressed out and a little depressed when I was constantly talking about trans stuff. I just needed time to be a guy...not a 'different' guy who deals with issues that a cis male doesn't face on a day to day basis. It did me a world of good.

Besides feeling emotionally stunted because of not having the correct puberty at a certain age, I think that some of us (I did this myself for awhile) tend to see ourselves differently. I found myself trying to live up to a stereotype of masculinity, then I was unhappy with that, it started to mess with my identity, I questioned if I was gender neutral...or what was going on. I was driving myself crazy for no reason at all. Once I accepted that I am a man (a man who has to live up to nobody's expectations except my own) I was a lot happier all around.

I look at it this way, grown cis men who are 20 or above tend to get irritated when they're called a boy (unless it's by an elder relative). Being called a man is a sign of respect. You're seen as an adult, your opinions are validated far more, and you're seen on the same level by other adults. Why would I want to be a boy? I have no desire to be viewed as a child.

It's true that girls mature faster than boys, but it doesn't have any effect on legal ages.
A legal age is before the eyes of the law, I don't know of any US state that allows differences like that, but there may be countries.

--Jay

Girls might mature faster than boys but legally speaking, both girls and boys are adults at 18 so I don't know where Brandon gets his ideas.

As to the original post...I still grapple with the terms boy and man but I do appreciate being called sir. I'll catch up with manly man later.

I'm sort of hovering between full-on FTM and genderqueer, and part of that is not feeling like I fit the cultural ideal of manhood.  I'm 37, but "guy" sounds more appropriate to me than "man".  I've talked to some of my cis male friends about it, and most of them don't feel like "men" either, despite being around my age.  Some of these guys are married with teenage kids and still feel uncomfortable calling themselves men.  It made me feel better to hear that they struggle with masculine ideals; not because I like that they struggle, but because it means being compared to stereotypes is unpleasant even for cis guys.  I have good friends, that I can talk about this stuff with them...

Going back to the girls mature faster than boys comment. I feel like being raised as a female has matured me faster than other guys my age. Even though I am pre-T and haven't even hit my 20's, I do feel more comfortable with "man" than "boy". Also, for me personally, I've matured in the process of self-reflection through my transition, trying to figure out who I am and looking deep down. I think a man is just someone who has looked past the need of himself and surveyed the world around him.

For many, puberty definitely indicates a part of childhood and perhaps that may play a part in the self-identification of man vs boy.

Quote from: verkatzt on December 15, 2013, 10:50:37 PM
I'm sort of hovering between full-on FTM and genderqueer, and part of that is not feeling like I fit the cultural ideal of manhood.  I'm 37, but "guy" sounds more appropriate to me than "man".  I've talked to some of my cis male friends about it, and most of them don't feel like "men" either, despite being around my age.

I find that really interesting that cis males in their 30's would struggle with the term 'man' too. Stereotypes of masculinity have really screwed with all of our heads, hasn't it? Who are we trying to live up to? Clint Eastwood or John Wayne versions of manhood? If only the super masculine have a prayer at manhood then probably 75% of men would be out of the loop.

I wonder if this is more of a male than female issue. For example, my wife isn't feminine. She falls somewhere between tomboy and butch. She has no problem seeing herself as and calling herself a woman though. I can't recall ever hearing adult age females questioning if they were girls or women. Why does manhood seem so much less obtainable to males than womanhood does to women?