Quote from: Carlita on January 03, 2014, 09:20:22 AM
I was talking to someone in the British trans community the other day about the whole 'stealth' thing, trying to work out how public and out there I should be.

She said, the main thing is to be honest, both with yourself and the world in general. So, yes, you're a woman. But there are lots of types of women: single women, mothers, executive women, women of colour, gay women - tons and tons of different combinations of characteristics. We just happen to be trans-women ... or rather, 'trans' is just one of the adjectives that can be applied to us as women. And it's really healthy to acknowledge that and accept that and own that.

You don't have to go round shouting about it, she said. But you don't want to deny it - to yourself or anyone else - either. And then she told me a story about the dangers of going stealth.

An MTF she used to know had been a successful businessman: intelligent, affluent, and expert at planning and executing important projects. So when she transitioned, she did it really well. She had the best surgery, the best medical help, lovely new clothes - the works. And she came out the other end a beautiful, confident, totally passable woman.

She went totally stealth. Moved house, got a new job ... and fell in love with a great guy, who loved her too. She never told the guy about being trans. Why should she? So far as the world was concerned, she was a "real" woman. When they started living together, she took her stealth to such an extent, she even worked out a menstrual cycle, told him when she was having her period and bought tampons.

The relationship went brilliantly. The guy loved her and she loved him back. In fact, the guy loved her so much, he proposed to her. It was the ultimate trans dream (well, one possible trans dream, anyway - others are available!) - to walk down the aisle in a beautiful wedding dress and become the wife of a wonderful, handsome man.

Except she couldn't do it. She couldn't marry a man without letting him know the truth. It just seemed fundamentally dishonest. But how could she tell him now, after all this time, without making him feel that he'd been lied to and deceived?
Answer: she couldn't. She wracked her brain trying to find the right way to do it, but couldn't come up with an answer. She was stressed, anxious, hyper-tense ... In the end she had a complete nervous breakdown.

She lost her man. She lost her work. She lost it all. And the irony of it all was, if she'd told her guy the truth, when their relationship first became serious, he might very well have accepted her. After all, he loved her.

And that, sisters, is why a little openness, and a lot of pride are a male-to-female transsexual's best friend!

Or so I'm told, anyway ...

this is a very good view of the question. It's really a tough decision

Quote from: Zumbagirl on January 03, 2014, 10:57:16 AM
My life is very very rewarding thank you. I have hobbies and activities that I do, some friends but not many, an excellent career, a beautiful home. I am actually surprised at how much out of my shell I have become by my transition. It truly has made me into a much better person who really loves life. That's hard to knock and something that Id rather not jeopardize. My goal in life is to do as many things as possible in my lifetime. But that takes money, which means a career, which means keeping quiet. That's the choice I made. You might be different and that's okay too.

Like I said its up to each person to decide what they want out of life. If your goal is to be Mrs Joe The Plumber and get married settle down to a normal looking life, possible adopt a child and be a live at home mom, then go for it. It might be for you, but not for me. Of course there are all kinds of situations in between as well, that will all involve disclosing to some degree. Like I said, that's where real caution needs to be applied. Once it's said it can never be un-said. Once it's out you might as well assume that it will be spread all over town by the end of the week, because it probably will. People in town may be nice to your face, but behind your back you would be the butt of many jokes and would be a pariah in your own home base.

My transition gave me my freedom to live a life less ordinary and I intend to do that to my dying breath. But that's just me.

I'm really pleased that things have worked out so well for you ... and I totally understand the benefits - particularly the professional benefits - of keeping under the radar. And, yes, you're right - it's a a genie that never goes back into the bottle once it's let out and, yes, people will definitely talk. So I absolutely respect your decision.

But I'd just like to reassure you of one thing ... I can't see myself EVER being Mrs Joe the Plumber!

Quote from: Zumbagirl on January 03, 2014, 09:35:08 AM
Stealth is not really an option though for a long term relationship. In my opinion, and only mine stealth is a double edged sword. It depends on the end goal of the transition. If I wanted to transition, and get married and settle down then I would have to say it, and there would be no stealth. Plus once it's said it can never be taken away. If a relationship ended then who knows who else in town would know my secret if a jilted lover decided to spill the beans out of spite.

Real honest to goodness stealth is a very very quiet and private little life. In this world I don't have to explain my situation to anyone so there is no one to let down. If I want a one night stand, then I can hop in the car, drive a couple of hours away and do whatever I want, without having to worry about wrecking my home base. That's what stealth really looks like. It's not stocking up on tampons and living a lie.

Yeah, I see your point.  For me, I really want to settle down, get married, and have kids.  I don't want to be a stay at home mom, but I do want a typical family.  In a way, I feel like at some point I would have to disclose, even if I were post op, because of all the emotions invested.  Again, that's not a judgement on those that don't disclose, but I suspect I couldn't keep this from my partner.  The whole issue is when do you tell and what if things don't work out.  At that point, I suspect stealth is more of an illusion or at least compromised in some form.  It sucks that our lives have to be so complicated because of societal bs. We really shouldn't have to have some much restrictions to just live our lives like any other woman does.  Thanks for your posts because you gave me some food for thought.

There is no one right answer. I do dislike the idea that some promote that out and proud is necessary and the opposite is in and ashamed. I live as female and no one knows unless I choose to disclose. Being trans for me is personal and its no ones business. I would always tell a close friend or potential partner as I changed late in life and keeping up a consistent cover story would just wear on my nerves. I will say that the idea of actually marrying someone and not telling them and going to the extent of buying tampons to fake a period, that does not sit well with me. A partner deserves honesty and that just doesnt seem right.

I am 51 (7 months on HRT) and 6'3". I have no Idea how HRT will affect me but I wish greatly.

Now I am Mtf stealth Trans* in male cloths. What will I look like in 1 year. My hair will be on my shoulders and I will have obvious large breasts. I will not have an option of being a stealth female; I wish I could.

My new HR contact was supper great when I came out to her. Then she said, "it is no-bodies business what you do on your time" during the conversation. I took it as keep quiet and dress male. Perhaps she thinks I can just turn on and off being trans*. I proceed to the wrong bathroom at work at least 1/week when I am not thinking and not in a default bathroom location ( the pics on the door mess me up).  I know I read into the one statement of many welcoming statements. I think she was just supporting me and I am hyper on the subject.

If I dress in female cloths I will be trans at work or on a street. I wish I will be able to blend in at least some times.

My avatar is a sunset and has personal meaning. I will post my pic when I am out in public at work. I was told if I come out at work it must be done well. I took that to be method of delivery and presentation.

If I choose GCS I will lose my wife, which will probable happen anyway. My genitals always felt wrong, hard to explain why, they just do.

I would love to just be me which is my plan. Open, I will have no choice. Proud, I value my identity but proud no. I lied to my wife and I am affecting two lives. Being Trans* was not a choice. Sticking around and transitioning is a choice.  I just hope to enjoy life someday as me.

Quote from: stephaniec on January 03, 2014, 11:16:23 AM
this is a very good view of the question. It's really a tough decision

I should have said this earlier, but thanks, Stephanie, I'm glad I could be of help!

Quote from: amber1964 on January 05, 2014, 04:50:38 PM
There is no one right answer. I do dislike the idea that some promote that out and proud is necessary and the opposite is in and ashamed. I live as female and no one knows unless I choose to disclose. Being trans for me is personal and its no ones business. I would always tell a close friend or potential partner as I changed late in life and keeping up a consistent cover story would just wear on my nerves. I will say that the idea of actually marrying someone and not telling them and going to the extent of buying tampons to fake a period, that does not sit well with me. A partner deserves honesty and that just doesnt seem right.

Thanks Amber.  I agree and similar to the too simplistic binary of male and female there are many ways for us to express our self worth and pride without being on constant display.  Many of us reasonably resent being just another too consuming label and TS/TG can be that.  For folks like me that may have obvious gender markers that are not going to change (like being tall/short, shoulder/hips) we may never be that passable.  Accepting that, i prefer to be out and proud which is not a denigration of others who may wish to be stealth or never identify as trans after transition.  There's plenty of room for all of us here to realize our personal growth and goals.

Quote from: Tessa James on January 06, 2014, 01:53:24 PM
Thanks Amber.  I agree and similar to the too simplistic binary of male and female there are many ways for us to express our self worth and pride without being on constant display.  Many of us reasonably resent being just another too consuming label and TS/TG can be that.  For folks like me that may have obvious gender markers that are not going to change (like being tall/short, shoulder/hips) we may never be that passable.  Accepting that, i prefer to be out and proud which is not a denigration of others who may wish to be stealth or never identify as trans after transition.  There's plenty of room for all of us here to realize our personal growth and goals.

For me to ,I'm older , It would be great if no one thought .I doubt that's going to happen If no one asked I wouldn't go crazy and start a conversation, But at my age It wouldn't make sense to deny or worry about it. I've seen girls pictures on this site where I doubt very much that any body would even come close to think they transitioned. I guess it's a deeply personal decision each one has to deal with.

Its such a personal thing and it takes time to decide what works for you. We all find that place eventually. I remember, when I started living full time I really didnt look so great. Without thinking I went out of my way to out myself, I guess I thought it was better than having someone else do it. Time passed, I began to look better and it was my friend who pointed out to me I didnt need to do that anymore. It didt come all at once but i ended up with a compromise that worked for me.

Any body watch Katie today she had two Trans Beauties CARMEN CARRERA & LAVERNE COX. They are proud and out. Makes me feel great to be trans

If I really look like the gender I intended I wouldnt out myself to only ones I have a relationship and the people who already know me after transition. But I dont really see a problem with being openly trans. Its just something I feel I should not be doing because I have this need to feel legit. Some people may just deny me in their social circles for knowing my trans status.

I don't consider myself out and 'proud' per se but I am very, very out. I feel that, because I'm strong enough to take the flak for it (though there's very little of that) it's a responsibility to make sure that people see a strong, happy, and well-adjusted woman who isn't ashamed to be a transwoman. Being proud of something seems to imply that I take pride in being trans. I don't. If I could flip a switch and be GG, I'd do it in the blink of an eye but I am what I am and my history and perspective are part of who I am and I see no reason to hide that or be ashamed of it in any way.

Another aspect of why I'm 'out' is that it's an opportunity to educate people who may not know what's up with transwomen. I regard myself as very well educated about trans issues, the medical science behind our condition, and the cultural pressures which define our current situation. If I don't share that with people who might not otherwise be exposed to those ideas, then they might go on thinking that we're some kind of perverted child-molesting psychopaths, no matter how many times the talk shows have trans segments.

I've noticed a lot recently if I'm out minding my business no one bothers me. Each time I've gone out its gotten easier. If only I could fast forward laser so a quick trip out didn't require 20-30 minutes of covering my beard and chest with makeup. Getting faster with it at least.

Quote from: Victoria Mitchell on January 06, 2014, 05:13:18 PM
I don't consider myself out and 'proud' per se but I am very, very out. I feel that, because I'm strong enough to take the flak for it (though there's very little of that) it's a responsibility to make sure that people see a strong, happy, and well-adjusted woman who isn't ashamed to be a transwoman. Being proud of something seems to imply that I take pride in being trans. I don't. If I could flip a switch and be GG, I'd do it in the blink of an eye but I am what I am and my history and perspective are part of who I am and I see no reason to hide that or be ashamed of it in any way.

Another aspect of why I'm 'out' is that it's an opportunity to educate people who may not know what's up with transwomen. I regard myself as very well educated about trans issues, the medical science behind our condition, and the cultural pressures which define our current situation. If I don't share that with people who might not otherwise be exposed to those ideas, then they might go on thinking that we're some kind of perverted child-molesting psychopaths, no matter how many times the talk shows have trans segments.

I'd just like to say you have a very healthy attitude

I sort of feel the opposite. Very proud of what I have accomplished, it only came with a lot of hard work and sacrifice but not out at all. I also realise I had some decent advantages to work with so passing/living privately was at least a possibility for me.  I applaud those who work towards educating people but I simply dont have the patience for it. So many ingrained cis attitudes, its exhausting talking about it.

Quote from: Victoria Mitchell on January 06, 2014, 05:13:18 PM
I don't consider myself out and 'proud' per se but I am very, very out. I feel that, because I'm strong enough to take the flak for it (though there's very little of that) it's a responsibility to make sure that people see a strong, happy, and well-adjusted woman who isn't ashamed to be a transwoman. Being proud of something seems to imply that I take pride in being trans. I don't. If I could flip a switch and be GG, I'd do it in the blink of an eye but I am what I am and my history and perspective are part of who I am and I see no reason to hide that or be ashamed of it in any way.

Another aspect of why I'm 'out' is that it's an opportunity to educate people who may not know what's up with transwomen. I regard myself as very well educated about trans issues, the medical science behind our condition, and the cultural pressures which define our current situation. If I don't share that with people who might not otherwise be exposed to those ideas, then they might go on thinking that we're some kind of perverted child-molesting psychopaths, no matter how many times the talk shows have trans segments.

My approach is quite similar.

Kia Ora,

I guess choosing the option to be Out & Proud, would no doubt also depend greatly upon the environment in which one lives...

Metta Zenda

Perhaps I have no place to post here as I am a cis Mom of a trans* girl. She's been the most important part of my life since before she was born.  I still work with friends/colleagues that were around when I was pregnant with her. They know how much I love my son and have heard how he has grown.  I now refer to my child as "my kid" I haven't used the terms" my daughter" except in the trans community and when we're out together.  I have told a very few close coworkers that my kid is trans*. Technically as long as I live and work around folks that have known me for years and care anything about me, she can't be stealth. Strangers will be another story.
I respect her right to privacy.  I'm not running around broadcasting it. I wish to be viewed as an ally. And never want to embarrass or endanger her.
As I will participate as an ally in the trans community, I do not announce I'm a cis female, either.  I no longer care what kind of gender I am. Since I have a traditionally male name and career and dress very andro, I am comfortable with whatever anyone believes now. I wish my daughter and the community to be whatever level of stealth they wish. Obviously many trans* folk will have difficulty in being stealth when in transition.
Many will cut ties like a witness protection program for their own peace of mind.
Bless everyone for being who they are, safely and securely.  My heart breaks for anyone who is unable to be their genuine self without hurting themselves or the ones who love them.
One can only do what works for themselves.
Please forgive me if I offend or you feel I have stepped out of bounds.

Quote from: tbunny on January 08, 2014, 10:57:20 AM
Perhaps I have no place to post here as I am a cis Mom of a trans* girl. She's been the most important part of my life since before she was born.  I still work with friends/colleagues that were around when I was pregnant with her. They know how much I love my son and have heard how he has grown.  I now refer to my child as "my kid" I haven't used the terms" my daughter" except in the trans community and when we're out together.  I have told a very few close coworkers that my kid is trans*. Technically as long as I live and work around folks that have known me for years and care anything about me, she can't be stealth. Strangers will be another story.
I respect her right to privacy.  I'm not running around broadcasting it. I wish to be viewed as an ally. And never want to embarrass or endanger her.
As I will participate as an ally in the trans community, I do not announce I'm a cis female, either.  I no longer care what kind of gender I am. Since I have a traditionally male name and career and dress very andro, I am comfortable with whatever anyone believes now. I wish my daughter and the community to be whatever level of stealth they wish. Obviously many trans* folk will have difficulty in being stealth when in transition.
Many will cut ties like a witness protection program for their own peace of mind.
Bless everyone for being who they are, safely and securely.  My heart breaks for anyone who is unable to be their genuine self without hurting themselves or the ones who love them.
One can only do what works for themselves.
Please forgive me if I offend or you feel I have stepped out of bounds.

good luck to you and your family. WE are all family here and your very welcome to help with suggestion, I for one can use all the help I can get.

Quote from: tbunny on January 08, 2014, 10:57:20 AM
Perhaps I have no place to post here as I am a cis Mom of a trans* girl. She's been the most important part of my life since before she was born.  I still work with friends/colleagues that were around when I was pregnant with her. They know how much I love my son and have heard how he has grown.  I now refer to my child as "my kid" I haven't used the terms" my daughter" except in the trans community and when we're out together.  I have told a very few close coworkers that my kid is trans*. Technically as long as I live and work around folks that have known me for years and care anything about me, she can't be stealth. Strangers will be another story.
I respect her right to privacy.  I'm not running around broadcasting it. I wish to be viewed as an ally. And never want to embarrass or endanger her.
As I will participate as an ally in the trans community, I do not announce I'm a cis female, either.  I no longer care what kind of gender I am. Since I have a traditionally male name and career and dress very andro, I am comfortable with whatever anyone believes now. I wish my daughter and the community to be whatever level of stealth they wish. Obviously many trans* folk will have difficulty in being stealth when in transition.
Many will cut ties like a witness protection program for their own peace of mind.
Bless everyone for being who they are, safely and securely.  My heart breaks for anyone who is unable to be their genuine self without hurting themselves or the ones who love them.
One can only do what works for themselves.
Please forgive me if I offend or you feel I have stepped out of bounds.

Thank you for sharing your story, and thank you for being our ally!