I admit I'm a coward. If it wasn't for my wife, my kids, my job, my relatives, my friends, etc. I would go on hrt. For diagnostic purposes firstly. I'm still afraid of finding out I may want full transition. Part of me does. I try to ignore that part of me.

Same old thing as others have found, you can turn your life upside down on a suspicion of needing transition. I'm going slow and taking baby steps. I must be sure. I don't want to upset my current world, just in case it's what my life is supposed to be. Disrupt everything to in the end find out you were wrong? Nope. Won't do it. I'll stick my toes in the water. If it feels good, I'll stick my ankle in...

Quote from: amandam on November 17, 2017, 10:22:28 PM
I keep asking myself questions to try to pin-point myself on the spectrum. A recent question I'm trying to ask is, if I see a really beautiful woman, do I want to be her or have sex with her. Usually, the answer is be her. But, many times it's desire her sexually while I'm a man. I'm trying to nail this down. How much of a man am I? Is my sexual desire for her just because I'm in a man's body with male sexual urges? Or is it the core of my being?

Both... kinda sortof.  A lot of women are sexual attracted to women, or so I hear    Now, think back to younger days, hanging around a bunch of guys and listening to them "express" their desires for some woman/girl and what they would do to/with her. Was it anything remotely like your own? Even when you had raging teenager hormones?  How much of the desire for her is still a reflexive response, perhaps born out of the shame & guilt of being trans? Is there the "I'll do her in an instant" desire or "OMG she is sexy"?

QuoteCould I transition if I was beautiful like her, yes. If not, I don't know. Should I remain a man? I don't know. Do I like being a man? Meh. Sometimes. Rather be a woman multiple times throughout the day.

Need vs Want...
For many of those that do transition socially & medically, it often was the only viable option left. Unknowns are scary, especially when you have spent a few decades working at making some sort of a comfortable life for yourself. Like the word, or not, you are transitioning. You recognized that SOMETHING needs to change, and are actually doing/experimenting/discovering, what you can do to restrike a balance between the female aspect of yourself, the male aspect, as well as all the other aspects of your life which are equally, if not more, important as the gender stuff.

The dreams of being all different types of women is an expression of that path of discovery you are on. You don't know who or what you are. After 8 years of trying to crack the same nut I am not much better off then a toothless squirrel working on a coconut. I've been various types of women as well as out and open trans-women in my dreams. My wife is sometimes in them, other times various male love interests. It is all very confusing.

In a perfect world, I know where my true joy lies. Alas, I am as imperfect as the world is.

Joanne,
Your reply was eloquent, emblematic of why I love this site.

Steph

Took me an hour to write responses. Lots of thinking.

Quote from: JoanneB on November 18, 2017, 07:44:18 AM
Now, think back to younger days, hanging around a bunch of guys and listening to them "express" their desires for some woman/girl and what they would do to/with her. Was it anything remotely like your own? Even when you had raging teenager hormones?  How much of the desire for her is still a reflexive response, perhaps born out of the shame & guilt of being trans? Is there the "I'll do her in an instant" desire or "OMG she is sexy"?

I very much admired women, even when young. When I hit puberty the sexual desire started in force. I became a "player" for awhile. I wanted them sexually but also envied them. I think the sexual desire trumped the envy at first. The envy grew as I grew older and is stronger now. I still don't envy women I don't feel are attractive. But, my envy has extended to some older women, not just the young chicks. There is a pattern of change here. The driving force went from admiration, to sexual desire over envy, to envy over sexual desire. It coincided with puberty. What does this mean? I don't know.

Quote from: JoanneB on November 18, 2017, 07:44:18 AM
Like the word, or not, you are transitioning. You recognized that SOMETHING needs to change, and are actually doing/experimenting/discovering, what you can do to restrike a balance between the female aspect of yourself, the male aspect, as well as all the other aspects of your life which are equally, if not more, important as the gender stuff.

Ok, you scared me, I could feel it in my spine. I guess I am in transition. At least partial transition. My big thing right now is hair removal with my Tria. I am also working on accepting myself as I am currently, "I am like Frank Dillane, I am not John Wayne. There is nothing wrong with Frank, and nothing wrong with me". Stuff like that. I am also intent on thinning out like Frank, no more extra muscle or fat. I guess I am going beyond Frank Dillane, moving into David Bowie territory.

Quote from: JoanneB on November 18, 2017, 07:44:18 AM
The dreams of being all different types of women is an expression of that path of discovery you are on. You don't know who or what you are. I've been various types of women as well as out and open trans-women in my dreams.

Hmmm, I had a couple of trans dreams too. I was an obvious crossdressed individual, maybe trans, but they were dreams like everybody knew and I felt scared. I didn't look like me in those dreams either, I was someone else.

Quote from: Steph Eigen on November 18, 2017, 08:44:38 AM
Joanne,
Your reply was eloquent, emblematic of why I love this site.

Steph

Thank you Steph.  This site and maybe(?) helping others wrestling with the same issues I am is what is keeping me from running head long into that "Jersey Divider" at some 90+ MPH vaporizing myself and the car on that stretch of interstate I have staked out.

Oh yeah, I also get to express my non-engineering, "Master of the Electron", it must be totally logical and "Spok-ien", spiritual/artistic/human half of me.

Quote from: amandam on November 18, 2017, 11:57:44 AMThe driving force went from admiration, to sexual desire over envy, to envy over sexual desire. It coincided with puberty. What does this mean? I don't know.

In light of the hindsight I have after investing a LOT of time sorting through all the trash in my head, I cannot honestly say today, that I ever had a true "Sexual Desire" for other women. It was envy, "Living up to expectations", and hormones. Which is why I asked compared to guys you hung with.

QuoteOk, you scared me, I could feel it in my spine. I guess I am in transition. At least partial transition.

My exact intent.

I view "Transition" exactly as the dictionary does, "To Change". I spent a good 50 years expending a TON of energy, being a human wrecking ball to others that I loved, in fighting the GD. As they say in AA, I needed to hit "Rock Bottom" and I did with Everything that I used to define me as Me, along with all my crutches, the Diversions, Distractions, and Deniability, ripped away from me. I was left with too much "Quality Time" with myself and my.... thoughts. Something needed to "Change".

A good 90% of the changes I made have been internal. How I think of myself. How I now see the world and me in it. Loosing (most of) the Shame & Guilt about being trans that ruled every aspect of my life. I tried, and succeeded in some ways, to discover who and what I am. The more I learn, the more I know I need to learn. But, is or was it worth it?

My trial (by fire) is far from ending. At least on most days I feel that there is still "some" hope to keep on struggling, rather then just give in to the "Dark Side". I believe, as messed up as my life is is today, it is far better then it would be if I didn't take on the Trans-Beast.

I think I sexually desired women as any man. I am, or at least was, highly sexed. I don't want to seem a braggart, but I could have sex for a long time back then, as long as needed until she had her fill and we were a mass of hot, sweaty flesh. I have good control over my male orgasm. I tried to emulate a key idea from I think Don Juan. Never leave a woman unsatisfied. And the sex for me was very good. Very enjoyable. Maybe it means I'm mostly a guy with gender issues. Maybe it means I tried overly hard to "prove" I was a man and women would validate me if I could perform better than my peers. Maybe I was trans-phobic enough, or even gay/bi phobic so much, that I overcompensated, "proving" I was a virile straight male. Things to ponder.

Quote from: amandam on November 19, 2017, 12:44:31 AM
I think I sexually desired women as any man. I am, or at least was, highly sexed. I don't want to seem a braggart, but I could have sex for a long time back then, as long as needed until she had her fill and we were a mass of hot, sweaty flesh. I have good control over my male orgasm. I tried to emulate a key idea from I think Don Juan. Never leave a woman unsatisfied. And the sex for me was very good. Very enjoyable. Maybe it means I'm mostly a guy with gender issues. Maybe it means I tried overly hard to "prove" I was a man and women would validate me if I could perform better than my peers. Maybe I was trans-phobic enough, or even gay/bi phobic so much, that I overcompensated, "proving" I was a virile straight male. Things to ponder.

thank you for your post and sharing all this.  I am married and in the last few weeks i have had a storm break loose in my mind.   I can't figure out what caused it or where it started or why it started. all I know is that I have struggled now with gender identity. I can relate directly with almost everything you posted. is this place of limbo or you realize that everything you thought maybe is wrong or maybe you're just crazy. I found this forum in other web pages and I'm spent hours and hours now reading trying to clear things out in my mind. it's comforting to know that I'm not alone and feeling these things and worrying about these things.

I did tell my wife pretty quickly after I started feeling these things. she's the only person I have to talk to and so we spent hours sitting in visiting about it. she says that she's perfectly okay with it and that you have to do what you have to do. she's willing to stay with me even through any kind of a transition. I don't know if that makes things better or if it just makes things more scary. knowing that I could do it and not lose my immediate family is a relief but it also enables me to think more wildly about it than I ever have. I just wanted to share a little bit of my information my story and express how much I can relate.

Thanks, Marcus. It's so funny. We try to so macho. We try to be green berets, bikers, body builders, MMA fighters, world's greatest lovers. And we still don't really know why. it could be cause we don't like "liking" femininity, or it could be because we really are women. It's one convoluted mess.

Hi Marcus,

Welcome!

That moment when our real self can scream loud enough 'let me out' for us to hear is scary and we've all had it.

You're going to need help sorting through the baggage, and that's where a therapist comes in - a very worthwhile investment in you if nothing else. How this journey evolves, is entirely up to you but you have the support of all of us here, however you decide to proceed.

I'm sure a mod will be along soon with a list of links etc, but have a (hug), you're not alone.

Rowan

Hi Marcus.

I'm Laurie. I see that you are new here. So please let me say, Welcome To Susan's Place! Come on in and take a good look around.  Perhaps I can even get you to hop on over to the Introductions Thread and  create a post to tell us a little bit more about yourself so we can get to know you a little better and greet you properly.

  Also I'll add some links and information below that can help you get more out of our site. Please take time to become familiar with them especially the RED one as we are always getting questions that are answered there.

Laurie
Global Moderator

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I'm wondering if I should delay therapy with the new long-term therapist. We've had one meeting and she was a bit perplexed on why I came in because me and my previous therapist made a plan: incorporate more femininity slowly and see how I feel. That would be a long-term process of discovery. It seems like the therapy is not of much use at the present time. I could go in multiple times in a year, did you grow your nails, yup, did you shave your pits, yup. Kinda boring conversations to have with a therapist.

Perhaps, I should just spend time in self-discovery and delay therapy for awhile. Maybe pick it up later if I continue toward a likely transition. I'm just not seeing how I can get more value at this point since my first six-session therapist helped me immensely and helped me discover what I needed to know about myself. That I'm transgender, I accept it, and the journey begins.

The goals I set out will also take a long time. One goal is to lose weight since the muscle mass and spare tire mark me as a man. Well, I'm not losing weight. I think I need to get a handle on this goal before I go to a therapist. I take care of my nails now, don't beat myself up over being trans, realize I can be Frank Dillane and not John Wayne as a male. I mean, that's progress? I'm using my Tria and will continue to do so.

I feel like if I go to a therapist now, it's just kinda like being monitored as I journey, not seeing how I can add value to the valuable knowledge I already have. What do you think? Wait a year?

Quote from: amandam on November 24, 2017, 12:45:42 PM
I'm wondering if I should delay therapy with the new long-term therapist. We've had one meeting and she was a bit perplexed on why I came in because me and my previous therapist made a plan: incorporate more femininity slowly and see how I feel. That would be a long-term process of discovery. It seems like the therapy is not of much use at the present time. I could go in multiple times in a year, did you grow your nails, yup, did you shave your pits, yup. Kinda boring conversations to have with a therapist.

Perhaps, I should just spend time in self-discovery and delay therapy for awhile. Maybe pick it up later if I continue toward a likely transition. I'm just not seeing how I can get more value at this point since my first six-session therapist helped me immensely and helped me discover what I needed to know about myself. That I'm transgender, I accept it, and the journey begins.

The goals I set out will also take a long time. One goal is to lose weight since the muscle mass and spare tire mark me as a man. Well, I'm not losing weight. I think I need to get a handle on this goal before I go to a therapist. I take care of my nails now, don't beat myself up over being trans, realize I can be Frank Dillane and not John Wayne as a male. I mean, that's progress? I'm using my Tria and will continue to do so.

I feel like if I go to a therapist now, it's just kinda like being monitored as I journey, not seeing how I can add value to the valuable knowledge I already have. What do you think? Wait a year?

Hmm,  i like this vlog. When you talk about lose weight, you mean exercise right? Nice to see your plans for the future.

If there is not much going on for you trans-wise at the moment, then it does make sense to scale back on the therapist visits. 

It's been about 10 months since I saw mine, because there's just not that much happening for me other than enjoying RLE.  I am going back (to a different therapist) shortly, but that's because I want to get into the queue for SRS and will need the appropriate referral letters.

Quote from: amandam on November 24, 2017, 12:45:42 PM
I'm wondering if I should delay therapy with the new long-term therapist. We've had one meeting and she was a bit perplexed on why I came in because me and my previous therapist made a plan: incorporate more femininity slowly and see how I feel. That would be a long-term process of discovery. It seems like the therapy is not of much use at the present time. I could go in multiple times in a year, did you grow your nails, yup, did you shave your pits, yup. Kinda boring conversations to have with a therapist.

Perhaps, I should just spend time in self-discovery and delay therapy for awhile. Maybe pick it up later if I continue toward a likely transition. I'm just not seeing how I can get more value at this point since my first six-session therapist helped me immensely and helped me discover what I needed to know about myself. That I'm transgender, I accept it, and the journey begins.

The goals I set out will also take a long time. One goal is to lose weight since the muscle mass and spare tire mark me as a man. Well, I'm not losing weight. I think I need to get a handle on this goal before I go to a therapist. I take care of my nails now, don't beat myself up over being trans, realize I can be Frank Dillane and not John Wayne as a male. I mean, that's progress? I'm using my Tria and will continue to do so.

I feel like if I go to a therapist now, it's just kinda like being monitored as I journey, not seeing how I can add value to the valuable knowledge I already have. What do you think? Wait a year?

When I started with therapy, though it was trans related, transition of any sort was off the table. Been there, tried it twice. Both utter fails. I needed help with un-learning a lifetime of self-education in how Not to handle being trans. Help with my self-esteem, total lack of self-worth, and especially hopefully maybe loosing a bit of the Shame & Guilt that ruled my life. I needed to learn new and healthier ways to think of myself, how to move about in a world where everything that goes goes is my fault, and I know exactly why... being trans.

Quote from: amandam on November 24, 2017, 12:45:42 PM
I'm wondering if I should delay therapy with the new long-term therapist. We've had one meeting and she was a bit perplexed on why I came in because me and my previous therapist made a plan: incorporate more femininity slowly and see how I feel. That would be a long-term process of discovery. It seems like the therapy is not of much use at the present time. I could go in multiple times in a year, did you grow your nails, yup, did you shave your pits, yup. Kinda boring conversations to have with a therapist.

Perhaps, I should just spend time in self-discovery and delay therapy for awhile. Maybe pick it up later if I continue toward a likely transition. I'm just not seeing how I can get more value at this point since my first six-session therapist helped me immensely and helped me discover what I needed to know about myself. That I'm transgender, I accept it, and the journey begins.

The goals I set out will also take a long time. One goal is to lose weight since the muscle mass and spare tire mark me as a man. Well, I'm not losing weight. I think I need to get a handle on this goal before I go to a therapist. I take care of my nails now, don't beat myself up over being trans, realize I can be Frank Dillane and not John Wayne as a male. I mean, that's progress? I'm using my Tria and will continue to do so.

I feel like if I go to a therapist now, it's just kinda like being monitored as I journey, not seeing how I can add value to the valuable knowledge I already have. What do you think? Wait a year?

I went because my thinking was all over the place and i wanted a sanity check.  I get the feeling that now I've got the confirmed diagnosis I'm getting dimishing returns.  I spent so much time online reading other people's stories and posting on the other site, i've got a rough outline of where i need to go and the timeline to get there that minimizes the disruptions to my stakeholder's lives.  So I think I'm going to cut it back to every other month as checkpoint meetings.  She seemed surprised to learn I had a plan that included considering minimizing the impact others, and was stretched over long term.  In a year or two I need to switch to Kaiser to take advantage of their services.

Have you considered joining a tg support group and attending en femme?  Or going out amongst the muggles?  For me, walking into a mainstream, crowded restaurant en femme helped confirm being out and some degree of transition is right for me.  Talking to other trans people on varying points on the spectrum helped as well, to see where I fit.

On the topic of therapy I think it can be important and helpful when transitioning. So many new emotions and reminicsing of what could/should have been in the past. It's all very depressing for me.

Trans people are so brave sometimes I doubt if I'm as capable

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

I don't mind therapy. My six sessions with the first therapist gave me immense insight, a bit of an epiphany, and a plan of action. I'm at the point where I need to move forward with self-acceptance and take my baby steps. Until I take those steps, I won't see if it becomes a juggernaut of transition. Until that happens, it seems like seeing a therapist is so anti-climatic.

I think I'll keep my January appt. I want to relay my thoughts to the new therapist. I feel that I want to try low-dose HRT. But, I'm deathly afraid of too much of a body change. The women in my family have very large breasts. And I work with some very anti-whatever people. It would not go over well. I work very close with two guys who would probably not accept it. HR could force them, but it makes for a very difficult work situation. I'm VERY worried about this. At my job, if you complain about others, you are also labeled a problem employee. I have 2 kids in college, etc. I have to protect my job.

It's like a choice of stressors, you have to choose one.

I also had another dream about being a woman last night. Didn't sleep well, woke up about 5 times. I was a tall, thin woman with short black hair. Kinda like a model. I was out and about in public. I was dressed in tight black pants, a black top, and black boots. Very stylish. I was very happy and feeling good. It wasn't a type of woman I am normally attracted to, and she didn't resemble me. I do remember all the people being nice to me and I felt really good about it.

You do have the power to choose. You can opt for just an AA and see how that works out for you after a few months. Spiro does take time. It is amazing what T can do to your emotional (un)health. You can also go with low dose E, a good 1/4 to 1/2 of transitional dose.

As with all things... YMMV. Again, breast growth is under your control. Slowing or stopping is (relatively) easy, you just do it. Plus it usually takes time. Hiding the girls is pretty easy if you aaren't the type to wear tight fitting clothes, or sweaty Tee's to start with. I have an almost B and in loose fitting dress shirts they are unnoticeable, except perhaps by my wife who is hyper aware of such things