I'm a genetic male, but I've known for a long time that I'm mtf to some degree. I am thinking about completely transitioning to living as a woman, but I think there is also a possibility that I'd be happy presenting as a man but having a more feminine shape and outlook.

Has anyone else done this?

I think a few of us would desire something similar but I think getting the hormones legitimately will be difficult. Also I suspect that passing as a male would become difficult with facial changes and breast growth. The transitioned MtFs would know more about this as many have taken hormones for some time before going full time as a woman. I know a few people here have transitioned then backed away some - perhaps they will have some advice.

But I think it would be good to take a look at why you want this. Is it to feel better but avoid the pain of publicly changing (people are going to notice though)? Will it be enough without the public recognition and will it be worth it? You would be kidding yourself if you think you could hide this from your wife, she will know (I'm assuming this is one motivation for still presenting as male - slap me if I'm wrong, no offence meant but if there was some sure way to have it all and keep the wife then life would be much better for many of us)

Another option is to look at low dosages of hormones to get some of the psychological benefits (if there are any) without too many physical changes, or at least very slow change. I don't know if this is healthy or possible and again I very much doubt this would be easy to obtain legitimately through the 'system'.

EDIT - Sorry I'm being a downer. I have heard of people that are males in their working life but female when they get home. So I guess why not. If you mange it and it will work for you then it is a definit possiblity.

QuoteI'm a genetic male, but I've known for a long time that I'm mtf to some degree. I am thinking about completely transitioning to living as a woman, but I think there is also a possibility that I'd be happy presenting as a man but having a more feminine shape and outlook.

Has anyone else done this?

You might be able to do this but breast growth is going to be a problem. What you will find is
that once you start HRT it is really hard to stop if you are really TS. 

I think you could hide everything but the breasts.

Amanda

Quote from: AlwaysAmanda on April 28, 2008, 10:59:40 PM
[What you will find is
that once you start HRT it is really hard to stop if you are really TS. 

Amanda

I promised myself I would stop HRT for reasons I have given in other posts. That promise lasted about a week. I felt really ragged and depressed and knew then that stopping it would not be easy, so I started again. You are right, once started it becomes progressively more difficult to function without estrogen. At the moment I love how I feel and what's happening to me, but still am a bit afraid of the consequences as I too present as male most of the time at work and at home, where my GID is a banned subject almost.

I'm not the best one to offer anyone else advice, but to Johnnie I would say, think hard about your reasons for wanting to do this and the consequences. See a counsellor or therapist or doctor and talk it through - unless you really are transsexual you could be making a bad mistake by starting any form of medication without advice.

Quote from: Johnnie on April 28, 2008, 10:05:43 PM
I'm a genetic male, but I've known for a long time that I'm mtf to some degree. I am thinking about completely transitioning to living as a woman, but I think there is also a possibility that I'd be happy presenting as a man but having a more feminine shape and outlook.

Has anyone else done this?

I don't know of any studies or expert opinions concerning the question of the possibility of being happy presenting as a man but having a more feminine shape and outlook.

Personal experiences on the other hand are easy to find. I think of the TSes that have to take the 2nd route are the unpassable ones. I don't know of the success rate of femininized body vs living male. Nor how many continue towards full transition drawn by polar gender.

Though someone with natural androgynous gender traits or identity might find such area comforting. Feeling at home with both.

Gender neutrals, might find it uncommfortable.

I don't know what your "mtf to some degree" meant compared to such advise however.

Can one feel comfortable in between? For me yes. But I am not TS. My feelings go back to having gender identity and body dysmorphia back to a very young age. The in between body feels natural to me.

Quote from: Johnnie on April 28, 2008, 10:05:43 PM
I'm a genetic male, but I've known for a long time that I'm mtf to some degree. I am thinking about completely transitioning to living as a woman, but I think there is also a possibility that I'd be happy presenting as a man but having a more feminine shape and outlook.

Has anyone else done this?

This I'm afraid to say is not that easy, even though a low dose is being taken changes are going to happen, may take longer but will take place, and you will hit the point of no return (where its getting rougher to pass as male) and now the question what do you do when you reach that point?....Trust me chest binding is a whole lot more uncomfortable then tucking, I'm sure any of the FtM guys will tell you of the problems of chest binding. Johnnie please understand I'm not giving you a rough time, but I want you to understand the negative aspects of a choice like this could be. Please give it good thought and counseling would be an excellent start. 

gina

Now that my wife has agreed to let me start hormones, this looks like it will actually happen.. Just thought I would try to jump start the conversation.

Since I was reading this yesterday (for the umpteenth time, but each time it seems to be with a new perspective), I though I'd share this:

Quote from: Andrea JamesYou can hide the effects of hormones from others for as long as you want in virtually every case. Those who say they can't seem to want people to notice.

link




God bless Andrea James for her stellar web site and all her other work.

--

Also: from the SoC (version 6, page 14):

QuoteCan Hormones Be Given To Those Who Do Not Want Surgury or a Real-Life Experience?
Yes, but after diagnosis and psychotherapy with a qualified mental health professional following minimum standards listed above. Hormone therapy can provide significant comfort to gender patients who do not wish to cross live or undergo surgury, or who are unable to do so. In some patients, hormone therapy alone may provide sufficient symptomatic relief to obviate the need for cross living or surgury.

I have done that very thing for many years, without elaborating as to how and once the girls grew to a certain point I wore a binder, but those days are gone now

Quote from: marriedtgdad on April 28, 2008, 10:05:43 PM
I'm a genetic male, but I've known for a long time that I'm mtf to some degree. I am thinking about completely transitioning to living as a woman, but I think there is also a possibility that I'd be happy presenting as a man but having a more feminine shape and outlook.

Has anyone else done this?

My case is a little different from yours. I'm also a genetic male. I never think about gender issue too seriously. My gender expression is generally a mixture of both masculinity and femininity although feminine side is stronger. I'm happy with my male presentation. I don't want hormone replacement therapy, but I want sex reassignment surgery; I want a vagina. Then I can be happy without being too masculine. Besides, I want a relationship with a man in which I can make love to him like a genetic woman does without being a woman

Does anyone think that I'm out of my mind?

Minh

Quote from: symempathy on November 03, 2010, 10:35:45 PM
My case is a little different from yours. I'm also a genetic male. I never think about gender issue too seriously. My gender expression is generally a mixture of both masculinity and femininity although feminine side is stronger. I'm happy with my male presentation. I don't want hormone replacement therapy, but I want sex reassignment surgery; I want a vagina. Then I can be happy without being too masculine. Besides, I want a relationship with a man in which I can make love to him like a genetic woman does without being a woman

Does anyone think that I'm out of my mind?

Minh

If you are, there are two of us. Up until now, I thought I was the only one. 

Quote from: symempathy on November 03, 2010, 10:35:45 PM
My case is a little different from yours. I'm also a genetic male. I never think about gender issue too seriously. My gender expression is generally a mixture of both masculinity and femininity although feminine side is stronger. I'm happy with my male presentation. I don't want hormone replacement therapy, but I want sex reassignment surgery; I want a vagina. Then I can be happy without being too masculine. Besides, I want a relationship with a man in which I can make love to him like a genetic woman does without being a woman

Does anyone think that I'm out of my mind?

Minh

You can want that but it would be difficult to do, If you get SRS you will loose your Testis... Its possible you could take T shots to replace what you've lost or would you take nothing?

Quote from: spacial on November 04, 2010, 07:02:17 AM
If you are, there are two of us. Up until now, I thought I was the only one. 

This was exactly what I wanted too before I started down my path towards surgery.  I have my consult scheduled and I have a tentative timeframe as to when my surgery will happen.  PM me if you want to know further details.  I will not publicly post as I do not wish to offend the administrators of this site for posting information being not to the standard path everyone is familiar with.

I should perhaps clarify my position here.

I responded to demonstrate that my current aspirations are similar to symempathy.

However, my motivation is that my situation makes full transision difficult if not impossible.

I have minimised my aspirations down to removal of my ugly bit. Though there seems little prospect at this time, sadly.

While this would result in a loss of male hormones being produced, it would make it necessary to have some HRT. It is equally possible to use male HRT as female, in these circumstances.

Ashley. Thank you. I am sending you a pm and will be very interested. However, I don't believe that the administrators of Susans' would have any serious objections to you posting these. This is, after all, a site for people with gender issues, however these are expressed.

Quote from: spacial on November 04, 2010, 10:24:59 AMI don't believe that the administrators of Susans' would have any serious objections to you posting these. This is, after all, a site for people with gender issues, however these are expressed.

With the administrators of this site, one can never be too certain or too safe. 

To lose your testis means your T production is slashed considerably. The Adrenal glands still make both T and E though. At the most, you'd need a low dose of E (like the kind post-menopausal women get) to maintain bone health. A low dose like this may induce some feminization, but it will be mild and will take some time (I'd guess 1 year before any real change occurs.)

Quote from: pebbles on November 04, 2010, 07:46:42 AM
You can want that but it would be difficult to do, If you get SRS you will loose your Testis... Its possible you could take T shots to replace what you've lost or would you take nothing?

Right. I acknowledge that I will lose a significant source of testosterone production. I don't know whether I need to take testosterone pills. I may lose my sex drive or most of it, and I'm willing to take that chance. Being a Vietnamese and raised in a traditional society for 18 years before coming to the US, I have not had sex yet although I'm almost 26 years old. Now I'm much more open about sex, but I will not just jump on some guy. I want love, and I want good intimacy. That's why I want to have a vagina. To be honest, I don't feel embarrassed to say that I mirror heterosexual couples. After all, I don't identify myself strictly as man or woman. I accept the fact that I was born a male, but I'm pretty much an androgyne, a feminine but not effeminate one.

As a male, my sex drive is generally low but not too low. I don't have huge urge to have sex with anyone, and if I really do it, I will do it out of love, not just for some temporary physiological satisfaction. Therefore, I think losing my testicles won't make a huge difference.

Minh

Quote from: Aidan_ on November 04, 2010, 12:19:42 PM
To lose your testis means your T production is slashed considerably. The Adrenal glands still make both T and E though. At the most, you'd need a low dose of E (like the kind post-menopausal women get) to maintain bone health. A low dose like this may induce some feminization, but it will be mild and will take some time (I'd guess 1 year before any real change occurs.)

I get your point although I don't know that adrenal glands can make estrogen. I know from my anatomy & physiology that they make androgen, but I have not heard it can make estrogen.

I'm happy with my male presentation although it may not be an ideal one because I'm quite feminine, so I don't think I will need estrogen. Testoterone maybe.

Quote from: symempathy on November 04, 2010, 03:38:06 PM
I get your point although I don't know that adrenal glands can make estrogen. I know from my anatomy & physiology that they make androgen, but I have not heard it can make estrogen.

I'm happy with my male presentation although it may not be an ideal one because I'm quite feminine, so I don't think I will need estrogen. Testoterone maybe.

Oh duh, you're right. Estrogens are made by the liver, not the adrenals. Sorry!

Quote from: spacial on November 04, 2010, 10:24:59 AM
I should perhaps clarify my position here.

I responded to demonstrate that my current aspirations are similar to symempathy.

However, my motivation is that my situation makes full transision difficult if not impossible.

I have minimised my aspirations down to removal of my ugly bit. Though there seems little prospect at this time, sadly.

While this would result in a loss of male hormones being produced, it would make it necessary to have some HRT. It is equally possible to use male HRT as female, in these circumstances.

Ashley. Thank you. I am sending you a pm and will be very interested. However, I don't believe that the administrators of Susans' would have any serious objections to you posting these. This is, after all, a site for people with gender issues, however these are expressed.

So you actually want to become a woman, don't you?
If so, I'll say go for it. It may be difficult for you at first, but I think it will be worth it. After all, you must have had a female in you who is waiting to come out but can't due to some circumstances.

I want a vagina for a different reason. And for the sake of lacking of words, I use the word vagina because I don't know how to call it. It's more like I want my genitalia to be inverted instead of exposing out like normal biological males. I don't care if it looks like a real vagina. I simply don't like the way my genitalia is.