QuoteI remember in high school i was trying super hard to please my parents by getting straight A's (anything else was considered fail...even an A- would get a sigh of disappointment from my mother)

Oh gawd, the sigh of disappointment, how many Asian teens were crushed by that one.  For me it was the silent look of disapproval.  The funny thing is I started doing that when I started being a martial arts instructor, to non-verbally let my students know when they were goofing off to much. 

I get the feeling my mom is still not over me not sending in my application to Yale, though see never brings it up.  Unfortunately, whenever I exhibited behavior even closely resembling male or took pride in having boyish attitudes she was quick to squash it.  I still remember asking her stupid questions about super-heroes as a little kid, and her telling me "girls don't ask things like that."

Quote from: JosephKT on December 19, 2010, 04:02:33 AM
Oh gawd, the sigh of disappointment, how many Asian teens were crushed by that one.  For me it was the silent look of disapproval.  The funny thing is I started doing that when I started being a martial arts instructor, to non-verbally let my students know when they were goofing off to much. 

I get the feeling my mom is still not over me not sending in my application to Yale, though see never brings it up.  Unfortunately, whenever I exhibited behavior even closely resembling male or took pride in having boyish attitudes she was quick to squash it.  I still remember asking her stupid questions about super-heroes as a little kid, and her telling me "girls don't ask things like that."

OMG i SO SO know that look. It's kinda like when i told my mother i didnt want to be a doctor...i'd rather be a teacher and shes like.."WHAT?? teacher make no money!! Be like your brothers...be doctor/dentist/pharmacist!" I was like...ummmmmm NO. She didnt make me go to Yale, i went to UCLA instead. It was the same thing with boys...whenever i told her i met a guy she would immediately ask if he was white...if i said yes she would throw her arms up in the air and start asking god what happened to her daughter. If he was asian she would ask if he was tall/smart/handsome/educated...if he does not fit the bill then i would have to scratch that and try again. My current boyfriend she adores and loves him, so after a million years she is finally satisfied with one guy that i actually love.

Quote from: lilacwoman on December 19, 2010, 03:39:35 AM
there is no gender binarism,

What? You're have a history on here of being binaristic and touting the gender binary as absolute.
Are genderqueer and androgyne people just 'pretending'? Is that what you're trying to say?

Quotehowever every Saturday afternoon the shops are full of females choosing pretty things, and there are more of these shops than shops selling plain stuff that males buy, and the vast majority of females buying the pretty things do look stereotypically female and the males buying male stuff do look and act like stereotypical males.

This is due to something called 'socialisation'.

Quote from: KillBelle on December 19, 2010, 03:55:27 AM
I think everyone is guilty somewhat of filling in those stereotypes whether we like it or not, i mean, why deny it?

Having an awareness of why we do certain things and analysing the root cause (Is it socialisation? Is it habit? Is it to pass? Do I really like this activity?) is the critical thing here. If you are fulfilling a stereotype for the sake of appearing more female to others, then that's a little questionable. If you're enforcing stereotypical behaviour because you think men and women have specific roles which they should act out, then that's plain ugly.
There's nothing wrong with being 'girly' and doing 'girly' things, so long as we understand that nothing is inherently 'girly' - any more than drawing eyebrows on a dog makes it inherently more 'doggy'.

Quote from: insideontheoutside on December 19, 2010, 01:53:05 AM
You know, I just have to comment on the pocket thing. WTF is with pockets in women's jeans? You can't even fit your whole hand in there. Do they just assume women don't use pockets for anything?

I'm pretty sure that women's jean have pockets that are intended to give a certain look and fit with the fabric (from the detailing and whatnot). The theory being that women won't buy jeans that don't make them look good (in butt or otherwise), whether the pockets are functional or not. As a result, most pockets in women's jeans are about the decoration and how the detailing draws the eye in a particular way. This might not be as necessary for men, due to the differences in body shape.

I know it's a stereotype, but if you pooled a bunch of women and asked: would you rather have jeans that make you look better but have no useful pockets or would you rather sacrifice on shape/look for pockets, it would be clear what they would pick.

If you told a guy, here is a pair of jeans that makes your butt look a bit better, but you get no pockets, he'd prob be all WTF.

yeah there are some hot T girls that I've met. I donno. I'm in a happy relationship so at this point in time I'd have to say no.

Ummm.. Girls clothes make me feel disgusting.

Q 1 Do I find T girls attractive. Well, in a romantic or sexual sense no because I'm gay but attractive yes.

Q 2 Guys clothes, I find more practical and comfortable and the cost seems based on the quality of the material, women's fashions you get charged for aesthetic detailing like pockets and trim. Women's pockets seem to be put there for show not for holding anything but I guess its all about showing the female figure off as being shapely not covering it up with lumpy bulging pockets. For me men's clothes is also saying something about myself like self-confidence. In an ideal world  gender wouldn't matter and anyone could wear whatever they feel good in.

I've lived more than 50 years but my head doesn't know that  You are as old as you feel so on that score I'm about 27. I'll talk to anyone on my wavelength regardless of age. Very unmasculine huh. I've done some macho sports, when I was younger and fitter but I'm not a macho guy. I'm just me.

For me at this point, I am only attracted to bio women (in womens clothing!).

I'm older than all of you!

Girls/womens clothes always bugged me and I've worn them as little as possible for most of my life. I have no waist to speak of (hips and waist about the same size), and all of the pants would be so narrow in the waist--to get the waist comfortable, the butt/hips would have to be so big!! So they never fit me right. I agree with whoever said about the ruffles and bows and crap...I was always crazy as a child to just get plain, tailored clothing and none of that flowery crap. Nowadays I wear mens clothes almost exclusively whether I'm trying to pass or not. I just think they're so much more attractive, and I look better in them. The colors and practical nature are way more ME. Actual working pockets, buttons on the correct side, etc. I do rough outdoorsy stuff a lot, and I can't picture doing any of it in womens clothes. Ugh.

This made me remember a time when I was about 8, I had a very wise aunt who "got" who I was before I even did and gave me an army uniform for Christmas! Best present ever to this little 8 year old girl/boy!

1) My sexuality is still kinda undetermined yet, so IDK if I would find a T-women attractive. I find T-women to be the exact same as cis women.

2)It's been almost a decade since I wore femanine clothes but I find mens clothes more comfortable. Not only that but my build is more masculine. Womens jeans=epic wedgy. I need crotch room and butt room. I think the crotch in my jeans is approx. 6 in from the actual crotch. Also women wear there pants up to there boobs so the shape of the jeans is all off. My jeans are just above the pubes, right below the crack. Mens shirts have larger armpit holes IDK if I could even find a womens shirt that had big enough armpit holes to fit.

And underwear, female underwear is the skimpiest thing ever even the granny pannies, there just an all day wedgy. Mens underwear are so much more comfortable and allow for more room and don't ride up as bad.

1. I find T-woman attractive. I find all genders attractive 

2. Mens clothing...comfier, and they have cooler t-shirt designs. Though pants are limited when it comes to short heights...

I even like T-girls more than the biological ones. They unsderstand me and are much more open about differences (most of the time)

I wear male clothes cause i like it more, i feel more like myself with them. Also, it's hard to find female clothes when you're not in great shape.

    socialisation

Quote from: Marcelo Caetano on December 19, 2010, 02:13:21 PM
I even like T-girls more than the biological ones. They unsderstand me and are much more open about differences (most of the time)

Funny, I get along best with FtMs.  If I had to choose between them and bio males, I would choose them all day, every day.

more the happy to answer your questions :]

1) I'm not attracted to anyone (or anything) in general but I can see a T girl and find her to be aesthetic very pleasing to the eye. Just in the same way I can find cis girls pleasing. So is all gud to me.

2) girl clothes are ugly and make me feel crappy, they accurate my female figure to what I'm highly dyshoric about. I just hate wearing girl stuff in general. Besides being uncomfortable ... I just feel really ridiculous and the anxiety jumps tru the roof.
I'm so glad those days are over, where I can wear a snappy shirt and mens jeans and go out of the house without my mind going in overdrive.

Quote from: regan on December 19, 2010, 02:18:35 PM
Funny, I get along best with FtMs.  If I had to choose between them and bio males, I would choose them all day, every day.

They are much more funny, I really like my t-girls friends.

1. Too hard for me to answer because I'm only attracted to one girl and she's not a trans girl.

2. When I put on girl clothes I feel like I'm cross-dressing (no offense to people who cross-dress) and I'm not the kind of guy who likes cross-dressing. I feel weird, exposed, and just down right miserable if I even have to wear socks that are womens.

Quote from: KillBelle on December 18, 2010, 03:17:01 PM
Ok so hey guys, i hope i dont offend anyone by what i am going to be posting next. I dont know many transgendered men and every time i have ever ran into one...i've always felt too shy to ask.

1. Have you ever found t-girls attractive and, would you ever date one?

2. How does it feel to wear guy's clothing vs. girls clothing?

1. Im open-minded with my sexuality, so I like people for who they are. But yes I have been attracted to Tgirls, and yes I would date one doesnt matter where they are in their transition I would still see them as the woman they are just like I hope they will see me as the man I am even if im pre-op pre-t.

2. Guy's clothing is way more comfortable, rommier, looser, less form fitting. The only girl clothing ill wear is skinny jeans, cause I like em tight, and briefs for the same reason.

I always thought the deep pockets were so that others couldnt see what u were doing with your hand

Quote from: KillBelle on December 18, 2010, 03:54:00 PM

Ive always thought guys clothes are so bland, too big, too heavy, too masculine, too black, too stiff, too simple...and no pretty colors.
It's amazing how different men and women are...hmmmm

Lol! Too true! I find this funny because I'm almost the exact opposite. I've always passed right by the women's section because I find it all boring and too bright and cheery!   When I was a kid I always wanted to wear the boy clothes because they had awesome dinosaurs and ninjas and cool stuff on them, while my mother tried to shove me in pink shirts with Strawberry Shortcake on them. ^_^;

As to the poll:

1. N/A Not attracted to folks of either gender really...though I do think trans girls are just as pretty (and often prettier, because of the extra effort/awareness ) than bio girls.

2. To me, Men's clothing is much more comfortable and better fitting. It always seemed to me that women's pants were cut too low, crotch too short, pockets to small, and the shirts too flimsy and low. Men's pants and shirts fit me perfect, and I don't have to be paranoid that my wallet is going to pop out of my back pocket.   Of course, I think the concealment factor adds to it...men's clothing is much more forgiving of feminine curves! hehe

1. I have found t girls attractive, but I am gay so no, I wouldn't date one.

2. I feel naked in most girl's clothing and high heels are the work of the devil.

Quote from: KillBelle on December 18, 2010, 03:54:00 PM

Ive always thought guys clothes are so bland, too big, too heavy, too masculine, too black, too stiff, too simple...and no pretty colors.

No such thing as too black. :3