Quote from: ChiGirl on February 06, 2015, 02:18:06 PM
Wow.  Thank you, Julie.  I feel for your pain and sadness.  I hope I can summon that courage for myself and truly be the woman I know I am.

Thank you to everyone who has listened to my ranting and raving.

You can, you have integrity, you have love.  Those are the two necessary ingredients to blend with infinite patience to seek yourself.

Wishing you Fair Winds,
Julie

Quote from: ChiGirl on February 06, 2015, 10:30:15 AM
RANT ALERT!  BE WARNED!  POSSIBLE TW!  SORRY!

I don't know what I'm going to do.  My wife has told me in no uncertain terms that she will kill herself if I even consider transition.  She expects us to grow old together and if we don't, and once our daughter goes away to college, she will have nothing and she will kill herself.  It feels more like manipulation than a genuine threat, but I gave told her, and I meant it, that if I cannot at least consider transition down the road and I have to go backwards and live as a man completely, I will go back to my old habits and probably eat myself to death. 

I know it's only been 3 weeks and I've been dealing with this for 35 years.  She needs time.  But I also know my wife.  She holds on to grudges.  She's mad at people for insulting her but she can't even remember what they said, only that she felt insulated.

I see my therapist in a few hours and she's supposed to see someone tonight.  But I feel like everything will still be the same tomorrow.  I just want to get away from her but I am afraid what she'll do.  Hurt me?  Hurt herself?  Out me on Facebook?  She's threatened all three.  I'm ready to check myself into the hospital to have time away.  That is how messed up this all is.

TRIGGER ANSWER

I'm not sure if you know this. But a response many help line people and psychiatrists use when someone uses the threat of suicide to manipulate people is to say.

"If that is your choice then you should do so. You have free will."

"She spent our therapy session (technically mine that she demanded to go with to) screaming at me that I'm a man, I've always been a man, and I will die a man.  Then she twice threatened to kill herself if I thought about transitioning. 

I cracked.  I told her I choose her and I would work on my feelings.  I told her I was worried I would come to resent her, but she swore she would work to not let that happen.

My wife has told me in no uncertain terms that she will kill herself if I even consider transition.  "

Ditch the bitch. Even if you werent going through tradition she sounds toxic. Your kids will be happy in the long run because you will be happy doing what you have to do. Theyll admire your guts. i would.

"So it goes.  I am the woman, friend, lover, person that I have always dreamed of being.  I am sixty-two years old and finally finding the voice of the girl within.  She is kind, honest, and she is me."

Bingo. im sure any kids would much prefer super happy loving supportive woman Dad to sad depressed upset current Dad. when they have troubles theyll need you to be on form. you owe it to yourself and them. all the best! xx

I feel so bad for you Chi-Girl. My wife is such a major part of who I am. A lot because I would not have achieved the spirituality I have, the love of life, nor the wonderful ways of looking at the world that I do without her as a shinning example of what it is to be a real person.

You say she needs time. Let's say that is absolutely true and in time she may come around. If you are a member of the "Transition or Die" club, time is not something you really have to spare. Since you are willing to go back to that "Through the shear force of will I can survive as a male" mode that sort of temporarily excludes you from that club.

So now we have, She needs time, and You have time. To me "Transition" is simply "To Change". Change for me was from the chronically depressed, soulless, lifeless thing I was into something resembling a for real person, whoever or whatever that was. Unlearning 50 years of unhealthy ways to look and think about myself takes time. After 6 years I am still working at it. Changing how you think of yourself, changing how you see the world around you, changing how you experience the world around you takes time. Changing how you treat yourself, from substance abuse, negative self talk, over-everything in that fruitless search for a moment or two of feeling alive, takes time. Changing so that you feel you really really do DESERVE TO BE HAPPY, can take a lot of time.

All those may not require wearing a dress. For me being all that while presenting as female just moves me from the feeling 90% genuine to 100% bar. 90% is far better then -20%, which is where I was, if not lower.

Thanks, Joanne.  I actually do consider myself part of the "Transition or Die" Club and I've made it clear to her.  Unfortunately, she's got her own club: "Stay with me or I die."  It's scary.  I don't feel I have much time, but I know I've got a lot of weight to lose and hair to remove before I even start hormones. 

The weird thing is she's taken a huge turn.  She spoke with a therapist yesterday and he encouraged her to take me shopping for some clothes and makeup to wear at home.  At first she screamed at me for the ride home.  Then she took at 180. She wanted to buy something.  She wants me to be happy.  However, I do know this is coming from the fear of losing me.  If it helps her through it and I move closer to transition, I'm all for it.

Any movement towards your goal is good.

My wife has often said "I did not marry a woman." etc.. As my emotional health improved she has also said she cannot imagine being able to live with anyone else.

I am really sorry to hear this, that is a really terrible situation.

IMO, "if you leave I will kill myself" is not a reason to stay with someone whom you would otherwise separate from. It's like a tantrum from a four year old. You will not fix anything by acquiescing to the demand. Especially if your spidey sense is telling you it's manipulation---you are probably right.

Keep doing your thing.  Show her your getting better with your transition, that the grass is greener on your side, so come and play over there;)

My wife and I were in close to the same boat.  I just told her it's my turn after 20 years of her and our son.  I don't wear dresses,  but about every other thing is done except srs which I've done something different and doubt srs..  but we go out to eat 2x a week at new places, we go shopping together.   I play equal.  I buy me at bra, and her one too.  We have always saved our pennies, last week was the first time she ever got a bra over 5bucks.  And yes 30 bras are still cheap, but alot better than $5 ones;)  we got our ears pierced, hers grew shut after 20 years.  I ordered a variety of nice studs for now.  I do metal working and plan on making pure gold jewelry as a hobby...  I made this cute trasgender symbol that will be remade out of silver and gold inlay..
It's my bday tomorrow,  40:(  but rounding up to 25!  We are going up to this town Ruidoso tomorrow to go shopping if all works out.  Hope to set us up w dual massages!
Basically I'm showing her I want to start over, but want her always with me.  If she can see nothing bad will come of it and these are our golden years, then it's going to work out!

You have kids still, just show her nothing will change.  Nobody who matters cares as long as your happy!  I've dumped a few people overboard already, but they were dead weight.  Over the years, I did more for them than they for me, so it was better to dump them.. 
Only family member who has a problem is my little brother.  He supposedly found god with his 3rd wife and 5th kid, so he thinks he can tell me what todo while he is begging for money..  I have been messing with his religion and homophobic tendencies, he will be seeing the light soon;)  if not, it's his loss.  He doesn't even know I buy his kids xmas and birthday presents while he is just lucky new mexico doesn't extradite him for child support..  opps, I think I have issues with him;)  but you get my gist..  don't give up, show its a better you.  Hopefully she doesn't have messed up morals, usually a god involved, but she will come around..  not picking on religion,  but I thought god supposedly loved everyone.  It's sad how people can distort a once good thing!
Good luck..  hopefully you got her a good gift today, and some nooky tonight;)

Thank you.  I am so conflicted right now.  I'm solid on my desire and need to transition.  But I don't know what to do with my family.

My wife has started to come around a little.  We made an agreement that I would not engage in any "gender issues" outside the house for 6 months.  Therapy is fine and maybe I can dress at home soon, but that's it.  For her part, she has to stop picking fights and stop with the insults.  All I had planned for now beyond losing weight was hair removal.  I'm nervous about waiting to start, but if it helps us, okay.

My wife is slowly coming around, but my teen daughter is not.  She's mad at my wife for "giving into me."  So my wife asked me to cut my hair yesterday for our daughter.  It wasn't that long, so I did it, but since then my GD has spiraled out of control.  It helped though that my wife actually bought me a pair of panties for Valentine's Day.  It was a huge step for her and meant so much to me.  But then she was upset I didn't buy her something sexy.  I feel stupid, but I also feel like I can't do anything right with her. 

I look to the future and I think we want different things.  She wants to grow together and have her husband take care of her.  I think she believes us getting through this means I don't transition.  She originally asked for 3 years before I do anything regarding transition.  I told I couldn't wait that long. 

I feel do guilty about wanting to leave.  I really feel like I won't be able to transition while we're together.  I know she needs me, but I'm not strong enough for the both of us.  She's driven away my family.  They're supportive of me, but they want nothing to do with her.  I feel like I've lost my friends trying to make her happy.  And I can't make her happy.  But now I have the chance to make myself happy, but it's at the expense of my wife's mental health.

I don't know how to leave.

Do you really want to leave?  Here's the part where from what she's saying,  she wants a man.  Women can be manly.  Is your gender thing going to make you completely helpless?  I lost my balls over a year ago, but not my spirit!  Be that man she wants in just taking charge..  take her out tomorrow if today didn't make her happy.  Feb 14th is just a day made up by Hershey to make money..  you can celebrate my bday tomorrow;)  but your daughter doesn't like your changes?  Tough, who makes the money, I bet as just being her parents you already embarrass her..  kids are just that way..  if you gotta cut your hair, then go all the way a while and shave it with a razor and use Rogaine on it, so the day you let it grow it is perfect.  I bet a bald drug dealing, axe murdering hairstyle may change their minds and let you grow it out..  be the man!  Either they work with you or give them boot camp!  Your daughter is a teen, she will be gone soon, but not really gone..  hopefully she goes to college,  gets that first lesbian experience out of the way and comes home and is on your side!
Now as for your wife, are you wanting a life with her.  Or were you a real man, did the right thing and just was there for the kids.  If so, I salute you too..  but this you need to know..  I don't see you answer here.  You already know the answer..
As for compromise, ever thought of subtle changes..  wear sweatpants of pastels and bright colors.  You may not get the full woman yet, but what's wrong with gender neutral to just start easing into the roll..  she wants a man to take care of her.  Show her you can be whoever you want and still that in charge person..  but upon writing this I do remember she wants whoever to take care of her and in charge..  soo, is that what you want to when you transition?   Both of you cannot play the weak roll.  2 can play the dominant roll, but I don't see that here..  be honest, do you want a man or woman to sweep you off your feet, you cook and clean while they work or is it the other way around..  2 people cooking and cleaning is a wife's dream, but who's making the dough and hard decisions?   I may sound like a male pig, but you already told us what your wife expects, I'm trying to tell you how to fill the roll if you wanna stay with her.  I'm not a therapist, I'm tired of them telling me what todo..  I'm telling you what I'm doing, and in my case it's working just fine! 
My wife doesn't want a lesbian lover.  I will still be the same man to her.  Just slowly transition into my part and play the dominant roll.  If down the line I'm not enough for her, I will give her more options.  I never have plans to cheat or leave her.  But the door is always open for her to leave and come back if she needs to see if there is better..  these are my plans.  It may hurt a little, but I see no other options.. Now what are yours;)  pm me if you wanna chat more someday. 

My wife just tried to commit suicide.  I had to take her to the ER.  I am so scared.  She told me she couldn't live without me.   She didn't take enough pills to do any real damage, but she's going to be admitted.  I feel like this my fault.  I know it's not, but I dumped this huge thing on her while she's dealing enough other garbage.  I don't want to hurt her.  I don't want to hurt my daughter.  I just have to be strong for her. 

Oh god, that is so horrible, I am so so sorry. Thank goodness she will be ok, and that you were able to help her to the ER. I have no words, except that this is not your fault. :-( Please be strong.

Thank you.

This isn't your fault. I don't know what to say except I'll say a prayer for you and pray for things to get better for you. My thoughts are with you.

As others have said, this is NOT your fault, any more than being trans is your fault.

Still, I'm sure this is shocking and painful, and my heart goes out to you...

Thank you, Eveline, Melanie, and Jeni.  And everyone else.  She's stabilized and alert.  Her parents and our daughter think she's here because she collapsed.  She's not in the psych ward (which I have mixed feelings about), but she's in a secure ward with a sitter all night. 

I could look at this crisis as an opportunity to ensure she gets the help she needs that I cannot provide her, but I feel that it's not and it's going to end up being brushed off.  I just to be strong for my daughter right now.  She is so scared mom won't be home, and she's still pretty pissed at me after my coming out. 

It's nice to know I have this place to come to and talk if I need it.  And right now, I NEED it.

I feel pretty bad about what i said re ditching the bitch, im sorry!
i hope this turns out alright. xxx

I am so sorry to hear this news. I won't bother with "It's not your fault". My wife has often been suicidal due to her chronic pain. I held off a dropping the T-Bomb on her because she was totally on the edge. Even today she has her bouts.

And through it all, I can not help but to think, to know, that It Is My Fault. Perhaps not all of it, certainly a good part of it. Like what sort of a future can she look forward to? She doesn't want to be married to a woman. Certainly is not having the life she desired. Now all this crap from me, Her Rock. Ole Reliable.  At the very least, if it weren't for all the extra crap I dumped on her, dealing with the other stuff would be far easier. She'd have Something to look forward to.

Be strong, for yourself, for her, for your daughter. You know what you need to do for yourself. You know being there for those you love is not mutually exclusive with being there for yourself.

Quote from: alexbb on February 18, 2015, 08:04:09 PM
I feel pretty bad about what i said re ditching the bitch, im sorry!
i hope this turns out alright. xxx

Thanks!  I forgot you said that and that made me laugh.  I needed that. [emoji5]

UPDATE: She is spending her 2nd night in the hospital, but she hasn't officially been admitted to the psych ward.  She's been in a secure ward with a "sitter."  She's barely talked to a doctor, but we're hoping to get some answers tomorrow.  If she has to stay, she needs to be somewhere she's actually getting help, not just stuck in a room all day.  She's blaming me for being in there.  No surprise.  She needs help that I can't give her.  And it makes me realize I need to leave this marriage sooner than later.  She's so terrified of being alone, she's ready to kill herself.