I've read about men (and women?) who pursue trans people for relationships, sexual and otherwise, even some who do so exclusively. I've always wondered if this was urban legend, or if not, what these people are really like and if some of the members here ever had any experiences with admirers they'd be willing to share.
Besides hoping to satisfy my own curiosity, I'd like to get some material I can use in our Wiki.
thnx!
Emelye
Let's just hope it isn't what I am thinking......
tink :icon_chick:
hmm - we have a ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<- in our town - she has been booted out of our group. I will telll you more about her later - but I do not know what makes her tick.
Alice
I just know them from a distance, and from other's experiences. Some of them have gender identity issues of their own. Some are seemingly quite hetero, but are males attracted to the femininity of trans-women, as well as some male traits. I bet it's a mixed bag. Like Julia Serano says, TS's are badass!! Why wouldn't we be admired?
:)
Blessings, Tara
I've been in a relationship with one (an admirer) for a little over eleven years, since shortly after I transitioned. We've been married for almost a year.
As to what makes them tick... There are as many motives as there are admirers. For my husband, he's attracted to natal women as well as MtF trans people, and feminine guys. I think when we met, he was attracted to me because I combined female looks with male genitals.
However that doesn't mean he's got a genital fixation, and he was totally supportive about my SRS. He's atracted to natal women too, after all.
I've seen all sorts of admirers over the years. Some are slightly scary. Some have no idea how to relate to people. Some (many) have gender issues of their own. Some are pretty nice. Like people generally.
id say its a closet homosexuality, wanting sex with a 'man' while having female deniablity, both mental, and social...
I only know about people who seek mtfs. There are different types of "Admirers." Some have gender identity differences of their own and prefer to be with others who they regard as more understanding of their differences. These people tend to be different than most of the men who are into "->-bleeped-<-" porn or whatever you call it.
Those type of men are 99% straight. People like to call them gay or bi, but if you talk to them on a one-on-one level or examine where the porn can be found in a porn store, you will realize that most of them identify as straight. Now... why would a straight man desire a woman with male genitalia? There are many different reasons.
For one, men tend to associate their manhoods with lust, power, and other positive characteristics. A woman who has male genitalia is thought to have these traits which they (mistakenly) think can only be found in the male domain. I have a transwoman friend who worked as a[n online sex worker] on the web and she said that most of her clients IDed as straight men and wished to be dommed by her. They saw her [penis] as a source of power.
Other men assume that a woman with a cock would be lustful like a man and not have the hangups that most cisgendered women have about sex due to their oppressed upbringing. I've noticed that most of my tswomen friends are more open to trying out new things sexually or are willing to do things that their counterparts won't. I talked to one male admirer about this and he said that this was why he preferred transwomen.
There's also the fact that vaginas can be confusing and scary for some straight men. Have you ever heard of vagina dentata (http://"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagina_dentata")? It's a myth about a vagina with teeth. As for confusing, most men don't have vaginas to practice on and many women don't tell men what to do in bed so some guys feel hopeless when they encounter them in real life. They have [penises] and they figure they know how to please a person with a [penis] (since they can please themselves) so they prefer women with [penises].
I'm sure there are other reasons I haven't mentioned, but these are the ones I have observed and confirmed.
Which way do admirers tend to go?
That is, do they like to be the "aggressor" and take the TS, or do they like being "taken" by the TS?
(sorry, I gotta be careful to not be explicit as this isn't the sexuality forum)
~Kate~
Well I would like to throw out the ->-bleeped-<-s who are in fact TS. Generally speaking TS who seek out other TS, be it transwomen who chase transmen, or transwomen who seek out other transwomen, do so because they are seeking out somebody who shares similiar experiences and understands their issues on some level.
The other ->-bleeped-<-s...the scary creepy straight guys. Who knows what makes them tick. I do know I don't like them because they tend to objectify transwomen in the worst sense.
The women who chase...umm don't know exactly.
Depends on them. I've seen some that like to take and some that like to be taken. From reading the forums where ones who like to be taken hang out and talking to some of them, the vast majority of them still ID as straight and consider transgirls to be women. One of them described transwomen to me as "beautiful women with an extra special part." I think the common misconception that most of these men are gay or bi originally steams from the misconception that tswomen are gays who went "too far." You know, it used to be that they would "treat" gay men by giving them female hormones. It was very barbaric and we lost one of the greatest minds of our time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Turing) to forced hormone therapy.
My attraction and love for Brooke has zero to do with TS.
I've seen transfans before and they can be a scary bunch. I avoid them like the plague. For what motivates them? I have no idea although most seem to be primarily concerned with sex.
I think that the apparent strangeness of the situation is a real mind bender. That in itself can be erotic.
Cindi
Quote from: Cindi Jones on May 30, 2007, 03:20:43 PM
I think that the apparent strangeness of the situation is a real mind bender. That in itself can be erotic.
Cindi
yeah. I go with this one. Also, I think it presents an opportunity to get around the taboo of sex with other men because the outer packaging is different.
I've never encountered a '->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-' who seeks out MtFs. I suspect that they are like 'chubby-->-bleeped-<-s.' I am a chubby-admirer, too married to do the actual chasing. I like big women because they are usually lively and full of fun with a vitality and beauty that is disconnected from vanity and pretension, they often have wonderful skin and great breasts, and they feel great in bed. I have a bio-male friend who feels the same way. There are a thousand valid reasons a big strong soft girl who can and will carry a beer in her cleavage makes us drool. BUT we don't like other chubby-->-bleeped-<-s, because most of them are not like us. They don't really admire big women, they just want sex and they think that big women are lonely and desperate and will roll over and spread their legs for any lame-o who flatters them. They're guys who don't have the balls to seek women they genuinely find attractive, and they think so little of big women that they feel it's okay to manipulate and abuse them.
Probably there are '->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s' who see characteristics in transwomen that are deeply appealling for relationships and for sex. Transwomen are great. And there are probably '->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s' who see a weakness they can take advantage of. The first type is a great partner, the second a dead-end and a jerk.
The FtM ->-bleeped-<-s I've met have been bisexual people. They've said they're looking for 'guys with pies' and seem to be utterly honest about that -- they want relationships, they like to play with a vagina, but they find that they feel closer and better connected to people with 'guy' personalities and that partnerships with 'girl' personalities don't work well for them.
I've had a guy who saw my pics on a site and has been chasing me. Thing is, I know who he is. We used to hang around some together way back in the day. He has no idea who I am, though. But never would have expected it from this guy. What makes him tick? I think the forbidden nature of TS in general. But just a guess.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi
topic wins official : weird topic award.
\o/\o/\o/
Having only encountered one, I can only describe him one way. Obsessive and creepy.
I'm openly submissive and outwardly frail... plus my femininity is obvious even pre-transition. He's masculine and geeky. An engineering student to boot! He's openly bisexual, so there wasn't some closet desire to have penis without accountability.
At any rate, he'd follow me around, nigh-stalker like, and even though I was still technically married (still technically am for 7 more days...) he'd try and get me in bed. But I was afraid of him because he'd never let up and let me think -- so I couldn't let it go anywhere. Ideally he'd probably have been the perfect man for me, as he actually liked my insane eccentricities and had no problem with my identity, but he had this habit of always reminding me that I've got a dick and that he could have any "real" woman any time he wanted. Kind of control-freaky, if you ask me. Like one of those guys that's good-looking and well-built that dates an overweight woman so he can insult and control her. That's just how he came across.
After he was gone (he just... disappeared, it was bizarre) I found out through some of his friends that he's done the same thing with other transwomen, and he found someone in GA that was more receptive.
it is all about sex and nothing else. A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who themselves have a repressed sexual fantasies of being in a submissive role, at least 90% are that way. This will allow them to think of themselves being on the recieving end from a woman with "somehting extra" allowing them to think they are having a sexual relation with a woman instead of a guy. In there head this would be considered okay so long as it is not with a genetic male but someone that is mtof.
Maybe we should define just what this *->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-* person is...
I am in love with a transsexual, I did not know in advance that she was a transsexual, my desire for her is the same as before I knew. Would I be with another transsexual in the future? Who knows. It wouldn't be like I was specifically looking for one. People are people, right?
Can a person desire another person with honest intent and feeling without it being labeled as something else?
Quote from: togetherwecan on May 31, 2007, 02:48:50 PM
Would I be with another transsexual in the future? Who knows. It wouldn't be like I was specifically looking for one. People are people, right?
Awl TWC, you're definately not a TS ->-bleeped-<-. Like you say, I assume TS ->-bleeped-<-s specifically look for TSs for whatever reasons, sexual or otherwise.
For what it's worth, one of my online friends is very much interested in "ladyboys," which I guess is similar? And this person is one of the sweetest people I know. Nothing "creepy" about them at all.
On the other hand, I've IM'd with some people who totally weirded me out, completely focused on sex and in a very dark, scary way. I try and talk with them about themselves, and just get back one-word answers... and it feels like they're just STARING at me through the screen with this predatory patience, trying to lure me into their trap... THAT's creepy.
~Kate~
We live in a cynical world TWC and TS are often NOT seen as humans, because of that, the lovely souls that would be open to date a pre-op TS are not let the chance to express their feelings.
I think, the ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- label comes from men (mostly) going into places where pre-op TS are known to be and specifically targetting them on the internet or in gay clubs. Knowing men... How sex is a driving force in them and that many don't want to be seen as gay for whatever reason and like the plausible deniability we offer.
Unless someone is unpassable, I don't think there is a big chance of randomly meeting a T-->-bleeped-<- on the street. So, if you meet somebody there, you tell your "big secret" and they shrug it off, there is a good chance they like you for you, not because of the dangling bits...
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
Quote from: Keira on May 31, 2007, 03:10:51 PM
We live in a cynical world TWC and TS are often NOT seen as humans, because of that, the lovely souls that would be open to date a pre-op TS are not let the chance to express their feelings.
I think, the ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- label comes from men (mostly) going into places where pre-op TS are known to be and specifically targetting them on the internet or in gay clubs. Knowing men... How sex is a driving force in them and that many don't want to be seen as gay for whatever reason and like the plausible deniability we offer.
Unless someone is unpassable, I don't think there is a big chance of randomly meeting a T-->-bleeped-<- on the street. So, if you meet somebody there, you tell your "big secret" and they shrug it off, there is a good chance they like you for you, not because of the dangling bits...
There is a big difference between people who are open minded for whatever reason, and those who are specifically ->-bleeped-<-s. There are open minded folks out there (togetherswan is one of them) who fall in love with the person not the parts.
Quote from: togetherwecan on May 31, 2007, 02:48:50 PM
Maybe we should define just what this *->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-* person is...
I am in love with a transsexual, I did not know in advance that she was a transsexual, my desire for her is the same as before I knew. Would I be with another transsexual in the future? Who knows. It wouldn't be like I was specifically looking for one. People are people, right?
Can a person desire another person with honest intent and feeling without it being labeled as something else?
I think that's a good point, TWC. I used the word "admirer" without defining it because I wasn't sure of what the definition is. I wanted to see how others defined the term. And I perfectly agree that the motivations of the person who looks for relationships with a trans person is key to that definition.
I suggest that the term, "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-" has the same kind of negative connotations that the term "she-male" often has and that an "admirer" is someone who respects and truly appreciates the things a trans person can bring to a romantic relationship so they seek out trans people specifically. Going further then, I propose that an "ally" would be someone who accepts trans people and supports their desire to live as they want but does not have any romantic inclination towards them.
The term I would use for a person who falls in love with another human only to find out they are trans after the love has grown and then continues to love and support that person? I would use the word "Angel" :angel: but I think "SO" is easier to type. ;)
hugs & smiles
helen
This is an interesting thread for me. I think that regardless of their tastes, men are either good to be with or complete jackasses. Just because a guy likes TS women doesn't automatically make him a creep like so many of us are quick to assume. When they are overtly perverted and come on way too strong then they are creeps. It is my opinion that many of us dismiss "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s" on the premise that they actually accept us as TS women. To some people that less than validates their self-image on personal femininity and therefore causes a self-defense reaction of "What a f'n jerk?!?" when it comes to these guys. Could this be why when a "straight" guy falls for one us he is not as creepy as the "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-"? I have had plenty of straight men say some off the wall stuff concerning their affection towards me. The creepy thing is a "guy" thing period. Most of them can't help themselves as it is not only born into them but usually encouraged.
Most of us weren't ever on the receiving end of cat calls and locker room humor until wee chose to live in our preferred gender roles. All the crazy stuff men say to us is the same stuff they say to natural women as well. It isn't a matter of avoiding "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s" as much as it is avoiding jackasses altogether.
Quote from: Renae Lupini on May 31, 2007, 08:46:55 PM
It isn't a matter of avoiding "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s" as much as it is avoiding jackasses altogether.
Bravo.
Quote from: Jeannette on May 31, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
I have to agree with Jeannette here. Almost all "->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s" get their sexual kicks by being aroused by the presence of male genitals (i.e, penis, testicles) in a female body (i.e, soft, hairless skin, breasts,). Just kinky, disgusting behavior IMO.
tink :icon_chick:
Quote from: Tink on June 01, 2007, 10:14:55 PM
Quote from: Jeannette on May 31, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
I have to agree with Jeannette here. Almost all "->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s" get their sexual kicks by being aroused by the presence of male genitals (i.e, penis, testicles) in a female body (i.e, soft, hairless skin, breasts,). Just kinky, disgusting behavior IMO.
tink :icon_chick:
Oh No. What if it turns out to be a legitimate sexual preference? Then we'll have people fighting for their rights to be ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s. Since they're not Gay, not straight, but maybe Gay or Maybe straight, they'll call themselves May and will demand we put the 'M' in LGBT. >:D
Quote from: RebeccaFog on June 02, 2007, 10:24:34 AM
Quote from: Tink on June 01, 2007, 10:14:55 PM
Quote from: Jeannette on May 31, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
I have to agree with Jeannette here. Almost all "->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s" get their sexual kicks by being aroused by the presence of male genitals (i.e, penis, testicles) in a female body (i.e, soft, hairless skin, breasts,). Just kinky, disgusting behavior IMO.
tink :icon_chick:
Oh No. What if it turns out to be a legitimate sexual preference? Then we'll have people fighting for their rights to be ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s. Since they're not Gay, not straight, but maybe Gay or Maybe straight, they'll call themselves May and will demand we put the 'M' in LGBT. >:D
Since they do view themselves as straight men, we don't need to worry about them having their own pride parades anytime soon. :)
Quote from: RebeccaFog on June 02, 2007, 10:24:34 AM
Quote from: Tink on June 01, 2007, 10:14:55 PM
Quote from: Jeannette on May 31, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
I have to agree with Jeannette here. Almost all "->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s" get their sexual kicks by being aroused by the presence of male genitals (i.e, penis, testicles) in a female body (i.e, soft, hairless skin, breasts,). Just kinky, disgusting behavior IMO.
tink :icon_chick:
Oh No. What if it turns out to be a legitimate sexual preference? Then we'll have people fighting for their rights to be ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s. Since they're not Gay, not straight, but maybe Gay or Maybe straight, they'll call themselves May and will demand we put the 'M' in LGBT. >:D
I dunno, I'm uncomfortable calling anyone's behaviour "disgusting" and poking fun of them just because they're different than me. I'm sure some of them are real jerks, but some TSs and CDrs are too. I don't know if it necessarily correlates with being a "->-bleeped-<-." People have all sorts of kinks... I mean if you think about it, it's really not ALL that different than heterosexual men who get turned on wearing women's clothes. There's that taboo, that exotic contradiction that seems to be arousing. And as long as no one is getting hurt, physically or emotionally, then so what?
It's ashame, I'd really love to hear from people who feel this way... try to learn something... but I doubt anyone would dare admit it here for fear of being "disgusting" and "creepy."
~Kate~
Quote from: Tink on June 01, 2007, 10:14:55 PM
Quote from: Jeannette on May 31, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
I have to agree with Jeannette here. Almost all "->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s" get their sexual kicks by being aroused by the presence of male genitals (i.e, penis, testicles) in a female body (i.e, soft, hairless skin, breasts,). Just kinky, disgusting behavior IMO.
tink :icon_chick:
Exactly. There's nothing wrong in a man who is attracted to a MTF transsexual, but when this attraction focuses exclusively on the incongruity between the genitals and body of the transsexual person, then it becomes kinky and disgusting.
Quote from: Kate on June 02, 2007, 10:37:59 AM
Quote from: RebeccaFog on June 02, 2007, 10:24:34 AM
Quote from: Tink on June 01, 2007, 10:14:55 PM
Quote from: Jeannette on May 31, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
I have to agree with Jeannette here. Almost all "->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s" get their sexual kicks by being aroused by the presence of male genitals (i.e, penis, testicles) in a female body (i.e, soft, hairless skin, breasts,). Just kinky, disgusting behavior IMO.
tink :icon_chick:
Oh No. What if it turns out to be a legitimate sexual preference? Then we'll have people fighting for their rights to be ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s. Since they're not Gay, not straight, but maybe Gay or Maybe straight, they'll call themselves May and will demand we put the 'M' in LGBT. >:D
I dunno, I'm uncomfortable calling anyone's behaviour "disgusting" and poking fun of them just because they're different than me. I'm sure some of them are real jerks, but some TSs and CDrs are too. I don't know if it necessarily correlates with being a "->-bleeped-<-." People have all sorts of kinks... I mean if you think about it, it's really not ALL that different than heterosexual men who get turned on wearing women's clothes. There's that taboo, that exotic contradiction that seems to be arousing. And as long as no one is getting hurt, physically or emotionally, then so what?
It's ashame, I'd really love to hear from people who feel this way... try to learn something... but I doubt anyone would dare admit it here for fear of being "disgusting" and "creepy."
~Kate~
Kate, you are awesome. I <3 U lol ;)
Well I think there is a real difference between "admirers" and "->-bleeped-<-s." I've only have experience with the ->-bleeped-<-s. Honestly, they make me sick, as if they get off on something they consider abnormal. I don't consider myself a freak. And, my (limited) experience with them is that they are intentionally obnoxious and think I should like it, since I'm such a freak of nature.
But, an admirer would be something nice. If someone liked me for who I am, and could care less about my being M2F, and just admired ME, that would be awesome.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi
Quote from: Kristi on June 02, 2007, 11:28:38 AM
Well I think there is a real difference between "admirers" and "->-bleeped-<-s." I've only have experience with the ->-bleeped-<-s. Honestly, they make me sick, as if they get off on something they consider abnormal. I don't consider myself a freak. And, my (limited) experience with them is that they are intentionally obnoxious and think I should like it, since I'm such a freak of nature.
But, an admirer would be something nice. If someone liked me for who I am, and could care less about my being M2F, and just admired ME, that would be awesome.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi
Most of the time it has nothing to do with the fact that we are TS or GG. A lot of men have no idea how to talk to women in a romantic sexual way without coming off as totally creepy. It isn't that they are all jackasses but it is a good indicator that they aren't mature enough for a real relationship. This is just how most men are towards women regardless of what is their panties.
Quote from: Jeannette on June 02, 2007, 10:39:20 AM
Exactly. There's nothing wrong in a man who is attracted to a MTF transsexual, but when this attraction focuses exclusively on the incongruity between the genitals and body of the transsexual person, then it becomes kinky and disgusting.
i didn't concord with you on the philosophy thread, yet i wholeheartedly agree with you on this one.
A ->-bleeped-<- is not an admirer. A ->-bleeped-<-, as described by some girls here, is a weird, creepy guy.
Men who chase are always creepy... You go for a drink and all they want to talk about is girls they 'had', or 'gave one' to. Now I don't want to have anyone or give anything, I want to share - and if that includes bodily fluids and funny noises all the better; but anything that's not a two player game is no fun. (unless it's a three player game? ;)) (Shut up self, you're embarrassing me.)
Quote from: Miriam on May 31, 2007, 02:34:36 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who themselves have a repressed sexual fantasies of being in a submissive role, at least 90% are that way.
That is so not how it appears to work in my neighborhood. These appear to be regular men (or the occasional masculine dyke) who either are nearsighted, or my whole presentation is
close enough for rock and roll for them. It's quite hilarious to find this behavior coming my way after - how many centuries of - 'being male'.
Also in my experience: my first real girlfriend turned out to quite like, among other things, the manifestation of both types of secondary sexual characteristics in a person. She was 100% dominant, no switching...
I wonder if it occurs as a
primary preference, I have no idea on that.
tmw
Quote from: Katia on June 04, 2007, 02:00:29 AM
Quote from: Pica Pica on June 02, 2007, 05:04:11 PM
Men who chase are always creepy...
period.
Katia?
May I have some of that blood you're drinking, Please?
Added 6/7:
Hey, what happened to the blood?
As I've said before, one of the first things I did to express my TG was to get an adult site profile and throw up a couple of pictures that were reasonably flattering and sexy. No intention of actually meeting anyone through it (well, guys at least), but it was fun. And I got a lot of positive reactions, heh.
Nearly all of them were "straight." As I've said before though, men will never identify as bi just because they've got some ideas in their heads. It's social suicide.
The main belief I held was what Doc expressed. We're seen as vulnerable, we want to be women... "Here's a dick" - Chris Rock.
There were a couple of young guys (20-25) who contacted me, but the vast majority were at least 40, most in their 50s. A lot of them expressed interest in cross dressing, a few mentioned either no or very little gay interaction, but the desire to be with TG. A few offered to make me their little girl. A lot were married and said that their wife didn't approve of their crossdressing.
I talked to a couple of the young guys, and they were just rather awkward. I think that all of the reasons expressed in this thread are valid for different people. There are always parasites who exploit those who are vulnerable, there's confused people, there's people who don't know why they are the way they are in periods of their own transition, confused kids, people who've repressed things all of their lives and have been warped a bit by it...
I can also believe the whole thing about us being more liberated and open to things. I've also heard that TG will put more effort into their appearance than GG, since it's always an uphill battle for us. The extra feminine-effort that's required to pass attracts men who want their women to be that way.
--
I had a 3.5 year online relationship with a woman, and I came out with her help basically. Eventually, after 2 years or so when I began to put the pieces together about myself we swapped gender roles in our fantasies. She enjoyed it a lot and became quite dominant and enjoyed the switch. And of course for me, it was divine escapism since I knew no other ways of dealing with it. Of course, this was something that came up after a lengthy relationship and was less about the physical (being online anyway... blargh, mistakes of youth.) At the time, I couldn't feel feminine without the allure of penetration. Now, of course, I'm older and wiser and recognize that that comes from within, not from what someone's putting in you. She never really understood the true nature of TG, she thought it was entirely sexual for me. I over-sexualized it because I knew no other way to express it at the time.
Oddly enough, it was by her suggestion that I crossdress the first time, without any prior inclination expressed by myself. I was still in my manly denial stage when we first met and for the first half of our time together.
She had an attraction to women, but because of the whole self esteem/women being in competition with other women thing, she said she could never actually be with another woman. She got to explore her own curiosities with regard to that with me.
I miss her :laugh:. Different circumstances, and she would have been the perfect person for me. As is, if I hadn't had her support and love I wouldn't have been able to begin chipping away the costume like I have.
---
Of course, since a lot of ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s want to be topped, that just doesn't work out for (most of) us :D Though, let's face it, to a male brain putting your wang in something is a good thing. I can see why those ignorant of the depth of TGism would think that they're doing us a favor by switching off.
In the Cisgender world, the equivalent of a ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- would be a skirt ->-bleeped-<- or a wolf. It's all about the pursuit of a willing sex partner without a relationship commitment. On the other hand, there are both male and female Admirers who earnestly seek love, romance and a long term relationship with those who are Transsexual. I would equate them with a man who feels Asian women are more beautiful and exotic than women of their own race. In the military area I live in, I see many soldier's Asian wives who dearly loved and cherished in part for the esteem the husbands feel for their wife's oriental beauty and mystery.
Over the years, I have conversed with a few dozen men (and a couple of women) who would be categorized as ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s and Admirers. Surprisingly, I discovered many of them are also transgendered but were unwilling to admit it to themselves... or anyone else. They would frequently ask "Why do I feel this way about TS's, why do I have this attraction? Where did it come from?" Many were afraid their longing for a Transwomen meant that they were gay or somehow perverted. Others knew their reasons. Some felt Transwomen were more feminine than Cisgender females. Others felt Cisgender women were too 'easy', little challenge, and that a Transsexual's heart is not nearly as easily won. Generally, Admirers felt Transsexuals were beautiful people both inside and out, and held much respect for their determination to live as women or men despite their natal sex.
It's difficult at times, to understand how someone else could feel love in spite of, or even because of, what one may find unattractive in themselves, but it happens a lot. It happens all the time.
-Emerald :icon_mrgreen:
My best male friend of 20 years + was I guess an "admirer".
We met at a TV/TS venue (he dressed in a half hearted way, I dresse an looked "wow") ... but my attraction to him was not physical at all, more us being on a very similar intellectual, cultural, musical footing.
We became the best of friends rather than sexual partners.
He with his doctorate in medieval history was my ideal guide as we traversed the length and breadth of Europe on countless holidays together ....
And then he met Jasmin, a post-op woman who became the love of his life, ten years together, and now UK laws permitting married for over a year.
Jasmin is a best friend of mine too ....
But ask Brian about why he "dressed" all those years ago, why he wanted or needed a TS partner, forming our relationship, and ultimately the relationship with his wife, its a closed book .... even after five pints of strong beer I can't get him to reveal his deepest feelings and motivations !
Laura x
TS Admirers - What makes 'em tick?
If you hear them ticking, you should submerge them in some water.
i agree, if it ticks, call the bomb squad... (or pest control :police:)
I find it interesting the use of the word ->-bleeped-<-s, I would call them stalkers lol... That sounds more fitting cause the way yall put it, it sounds like they don't give up... or are very presistent to say the least.
A couple of days ago I was kind of bored, so I pushed a marble into my ear and I was listening to it roll around in my head and then I had a thought - What if TS admirers are another form of sexual preference? Gay, straight, TS, genderqueer?
TS ->-bleeped-<-s are attracted to those who completed transition and genderqueer ->-bleeped-<-s are attracted to those in mid transition or who are intentionally non-binary?
Food for thought. Don't get any on your blouse.
Think god for Admirers I am pre-op,and go out alot. I love it win men wont me.
I am dateing more than one men,and thay all like diffront thing about me
Kimberly
->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s?
I really don't quite understand them. I just love people in general... although some situations could be hard (like my girlfriend having more dick than me might be an issue)...
Quote from: Elwood on July 20, 2008, 12:38:52 PM
I just love people in general... although some situations could be hard (like my girlfriend having more dick than me might be an issue)...
;D aint the variety of human life great?
Alice, you dress sharp. All your pictures show that, especially the latest one. You obviously have an inherent gift for style. And to think you were holding back all that time! Shame to keep all that style bottled up!
Quote from: togetherwecan on May 31, 2007, 02:48:50 PM
Maybe we should define just what this *->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-* person is...
I am in love with a transsexual, I did not know in advance that she was a transsexual, my desire for her is the same as before I knew. Would I be with another transsexual in the future? Who knows. It wouldn't be like I was specifically looking for one. People are people, right?
Can a person desire another person with honest intent and feeling without it being labeled as something else?
sometimes not, together, i personally don't like ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s, so far all i have encountered are the ones who only want sex. and they have all been bio male. if the trans person wants a TC, then they can have them, but i personally don't care to know what makes them tick. i'm a woman, and deserved to be treated as such even when it comes to relationships and sex. i'm not some kind of in between sex-object that they can play with and throw away when they get bored. i have a female partner and i hope she always stays that way, but if not i know i have other gender options, but so far, bio male has NOT been one of them. now an ftm is a different story, and he'd be better than any bio male or ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- if you ask me, but that's my opinion.
Warrior Princess Mickie
Ive found most admirers quite charming to be honest, im not wholey sure on some of the motivation behind alot of them but i joined a dating site a little while ago in an attempt to break my lonlieness. I stated very honestly in my advert that im a transsexual woman ect ect blah blah and the repsonse has been overwhelming with over 20 mails a week.
Maybe theres alot of admirers in my area i really dont know but apart from the usual sex that most want or hey ive never dated a she-boy comments a few have turned out to be quite the gentlemen.
Ive currently got a self-help writer trying to court me, maybe he feel's he can somehow help me too i dont know but my experience has been so far with a couple of small issues a very positive response and helped me feel a bit better about myself.
Quote from: togetherwecan on May 31, 2007, 02:48:50 PMMaybe we should define just what this *->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-* person is...
I am in love with a transsexual, I did not know in advance that she was a transsexual, my desire for her is the same as before I knew. Would I be with another transsexual in the future? Who knows. It wouldn't be like I was specifically looking for one. People are people, right?
Can a person desire another person with honest intent and feeling without it being labeled as something else?
I don't think you're a ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-. You love her as a woman, not because she's a transsexual.
You'd be a ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- if you thought it was hot that she was "half man half woman" or something. ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s are the weirdos that call guys like me "men with pussies" and want to pretty much abuse us.
I know that some people who specifically like transsexuals aren't like that, but to gear specifically for a transsexual is worrisome. I'd think it's more practical to love men and women, be them cismen/women or transmen/women. I don't want someone to date me because I
don't have a penis.
Quote from: vanna on July 21, 2008, 05:05:36 PM
Ive found most admirers quite charming to be honest, im not wholey sure on some of the motivation behind alot of them but i joined a dating site a little while ago in an attempt to break my lonlieness. I stated very honestly in my advert that im a transsexual woman ect ect blah blah and the repsonse has been overwhelming with over 20 mails a week.
Vanna,
I too have found the same experience. While I have not dated TC's, I did meet a number of them in my early days in southernCA. They were very nice. Unfortunately, I was not very nice to them. I gave them a clear and undeniable signal that I was not interested in any sort of relationship. I never considered that one of them might end up being a good friend. As I have matured, I'm more open to anyone as far as friendship goes.
Cindi
Hi Cindy
(why are Cindy's always so nice :)
Yes i can relate to what your saying, i think its easy to feel that you haveto put some of your own personal hurt onto someone showing an interest in you without realising. Ive so far kept them all at arms length but im glad ive done what ive done as some really nice friendships are beginning to build up. My only worry is that is some of them think they have no chance of sex with they will move off and the friendship was just a type of male facade to get me in bed.
Only time will tell i guess and i hope im not just being paranoid.
It seems to me that you can spill a lot of ink (uh... electrons?) speculating on what makes admirers tick. But nothing is quite as effective as asking a few of them.
Do "admirers" only pursue pre-ops? Or are there admirers of post-ops too?
I guess I'm wondering... is it the *physical* contrast (female appearance, but with male genitalia) that's the attraction? Or is it just knowing that the girl was born male?
Would a passable post-op have "TS admirers?"
~Kate~
Quote from: Kate on July 23, 2008, 08:25:23 AM
Do "admirers" only pursue pre-ops? Or are there admirers of post-ops too?
I guess I'm wondering... is it the *physical* contrast (female appearance, but with male genitalia) that's the attraction? Or is it just knowing that the girl was born male?
Would a passable post-op have "TS admirers?"
~Kate~
Most of the "admirerers" I know gasp at the thought of a pre-op trans girl going post. Most take on a "then I might as well date a GG" sort of attitude. I'm sure there are exceptions.
So, I conclude it's phsyical... makes sense right? But then they vehemently deny being anything other than straight?!
uhmmmkay... what ever helps you sleep at night. :eusa_shifty:
I just don't get it...
This is another rather interesting topic. I hadn't even thought about such a thing as a TS Admirer.
As a straight guy I thought about different things that draw couples together and why some relationships last and others don't. I must admit that whether or not a person is TS wasn't one of them.
I tend to believe that TS means little.
Face it, I see the women as women and the guys as guys.
I can't help but wonder if the TS community thinks about it more because they are classified as TS?
The straight guys and gals have the same thing to an extent.
Is she really in love with him or drawn to his bank account?
Would she feel the same towards him if he was old, fat and bald like me?
I see from those I've known over the years that marriages based on sex, money, personal appearances and things other than love many times fail when the grass is greener over the fence and if she left him while married for you, what makes you think she won't leave you for someone else? The same holds true the other way as well with men leaving.
I personally believe that everything including TS issues should come after true love. True love endures finding out your mate was TS.
Because she always was and is a woman.
But, that's just my opinion.
I guess there are some wierdos out there that think transsexuals are some sort of conquest like the blonde cheerleader type but maybe they should just get their jollys with the ones out there that give true transsexuals a bad image.
I guess there are some that would feel a little betrayed if they found out later but that's their insecurities and I guess every case is different.
When I was dating back in the stone age transsexuals weren't out in our neck of the woods so nobody knew about them.
If I had found out that my wife was transsexual after I married her it would not have made me love her less. And I guess if I put my male ego aside and admitted that she was the first girl I ever liked enough to date I would just go one step farther and say I may not have even known until after we were married.
To me, all that matters is that she was the girl I loved enough to spend my life with regardless of the events in her life. Both before I knew her and after we married.
If she was TS it would not have mattered.
Quote from: lacitychick21 on July 23, 2008, 10:26:46 AM
Most of the "admirerers" I know gasp at the thought of a pre-op trans girl going post. Most take on a "then I might as well date a GG" sort of attitude. I'm sure there are exceptions.
So, I conclude it's phsyical... makes sense right? But then they vehemently deny being anything other than straight?!
uhmmmkay... what ever helps you sleep at night. :eusa_shifty:
I just don't get it...
I don't know that it's that cut and dried. Self-acknowledged admirers come in more flavors than just "heterosexual" males. What if you have fallen in love with a bisexual person who obviously loves you, and for many reasons other than just physical? And you talk about GRS, and they say they support you in that but don't know whether they will still be physically attracted to you the same way afterwords? They're not saying they won't, only that they don't know. And what if you suddenly find that this person's love is more important to you than the GRS you thought was the goal of your life? Then imagine that this is not all hypothetical. What then?
I do agree that speaking in hypotheticals can have us running in pretty wide circles in no time... but again, this is my thinking.
As I see it, a "TS admirer" may come in a variety of colors, but they're TS admirerers on the impetus that thay're dating a trans boy/girl -- by definition a person who carries regard, or marvels at someone born in one gender but lives/presents as the other. If I were in a head-over-heels relationship with a man -- to illustrate a point let's say -- based mostly on physical attraction, and he came to me and said, "Babe, I want a nose job" or "I want to grow my hair long" or "I want to gain 200 pounds"; I'm sure I would take issue because, again, I love him mostly for his physical attributes that I am attracted to. Now, let's say he came to me and said: "Babe, would you mind if I had my tonsils removed?" or "I want to get rid of my appendix." Hmm... I guess I wouldn't mind all that much. Sure, those are still physical parts of him, but it just doesn't matter to me whether he has tonsils or an appendix. It doesn't because I love him for reasons beyond that.
That said, I don't loath my dangly bits. I just don't care for them and yes, it is a life's goal to eventually remove them. I don't want a man who desires me for those bits. If said bisexual man (or any man for that matter) will leave me or possibly not be attracted to me when those are removed but everything otherwise stays exactly the same, then love be damned! I've never been much of a head-in-the-clouds romantic anyhoo. He may love me for a variety of reasons but obviously, removing my bits is a deal breaker (even if he is saying he's "just not sure" -- then those bits factor in waaaaay too heavily). This girl's destined for GRS and I'll find a man who couldn't care less when the "girl's" are gone. :laugh:
My last boyfriend and I had an account we regularly put money into as we saved for my GRS. He couldn't wait to bid them adieu! AWWwwwwwwWww!! :icon_walk:
Too bad he cheated!!! :icon_punch:
Well
an update on one admirer i have, hes just written and said he thinks he falling in love with me..........
to tell the honest truth em, i just think theyre wierdos who get a rise from the thought of it all. maybe not all of them r like that, but u have to admit it is pretty weird for someone to admire another person for a sexual preference. i dunno, i guess thats just my opinion. ;) anyway i hope u find ur answers. :D
This thread is kind of making me sick.
I'm currently dating an 'admirer' who self-describes herself as a ->-bleeped-<-. She's a formerly lesbian identified cisgendered woman who identifies herself as queer. Is this because she's attracted to women? No. is it because she considers me to be one? No. She recognizes the difference between our relationship and the heteronormative. In fact, she pouts when I shave the stubble off my face, doesn't like to see pictures of the 'former' me and has no interest in listening to my old radio broadcasts because of my voice, even though I'm proud of them. My former female-ness isn't something she finds to be an asset, but something she'd rather not really think about.
That being said, I'm completely and totally happy. She's supportive of my continued transition (let's be honest here, does it ever truly STOP?), my identity, etc. I'm introduced as her boyfriend, not as a 'partner' as was the case in previous relationships. Basically, it's all good and I couldn't imagine being in a more supportive relationship.
i feel for anyone who's had these 'creepy ->-bleeped-<-' experiences, but labelling the group 'creepy' as a whole it something I couldn't sit back and read anymore.
I agree, I've meet some who are nice, some who are not nice, some who are sad, and some who rock. No group is any individual member.
When I was extremely early in my transition (read: just figured myself out!!) I joined a yahoo group for ftm dating. A few weeks later I realized it was too soon to begin to even think about dating, and un-joined. I still get IMs from bio-males (straight and gay) who want to *date* me. Mostly I'm still figuring out my own sexuality and likely won't date until at least a year from now, after I've been on T for a while (just started yesterday) and a have had surgery. I want to be seen 100% male before I date.
I'm not sure I'm interested in someone who wants me only because I'm trans; I want someone who wants me for ME. It all depends on how we meet, and also depends on mutual respect. Some of the '->-bleeped-<-s' I've met, as others have mentioned, are just interested because of my anatomy. I'd like to think I'm more than a sex object, thank you.
Are there honest admirers out there? I'm sure there are, as in Mister's case and others. I haven't met any yet; but then I'm very, VERY early in transition and do not pass.
Jay
I want someone who wants me for ME
Agreed, but that means all of you, not just your mind. Someone who really wants a hot throbbing XXXX, they are not on the same track you are.
Quote from: tekla on July 26, 2008, 03:47:23 PM
I want someone who wants me for ME
Agreed, but that means all of you, not just your mind. Someone who really wants a hot throbbing XXXX, they are not on the same track you are.
Yes. I want someone who loves me for who I am as a person, and is accepting of my physical body as well. I'm not interested in someone who wants me for my body only.
Quote from: sneakersjay on July 26, 2008, 03:40:02 PM
Are there honest admirers out there? I'm sure there are, as in Mister's case and others. I haven't met any yet; but then I'm very, VERY early in transition and do not pass.
Jay
Yes, there are. But it is as with any other kind of potential partner, you have to sift the wheat to eliminate the chaff.
I'll take the person who wants me for my body only, if only for the night.
But I don't even want to know their name, hence "honey" and "Doll." Its not like I give them my real name either.
Quote from: tekla on July 26, 2008, 06:31:50 PM
I'll take the person who wants me for my body only, if only for the night.
But I don't even want to know their name, hence "honey" and "Doll." Its not like I give them my real name either.
Ew! I tried that once and
so hated it.
Oh, that was you? So sorry.
Quote from: tekla on July 27, 2008, 12:27:27 AM
Oh, that was you? So sorry.
Ew!!!!!! Don't say that!!! I don't want to stop liking you.
In my experience, most admirers are looking for sex; which, in itself, isn't all bad!!!!
I thought Mister made some good points. *shrug* Of course, that's just me.
But, does anyone else think that we should change the terms "->-bleeped-<-" and "admirer" to just plain ole "horn-dog?" Would that simplify for everyone? :)
Nichole
What is a TS supposedly being "admired" for? Why do we call TS "admirers", admirers anyway? ;)
tink :icon_chick:
Quote from: Nichole on July 28, 2008, 08:23:28 PM
I thought Mister made some good points. *shrug* Of course, that's just me.
Thank you! In talking to my lady about this thread, she agreed with my opinion of why she's attracted to FTMs- She's attracted to us for our masculinity as well as being emotionally available. This is stereotypically speaking, of course, and not I'm not trying to assign attributes to ALL FTMs, this is just what happens to work for her.
Horn-dog sounds good to me ;D
closeted homosexuals make up a good portion of them. Usually very secretive and possessive, sometimes abusive. Other's it is just fulfilling a fantasy or fetish. Some are trans themselves and are tryingto live their dreams through you.
Quote from: Tink on July 28, 2008, 08:27:52 PM
What is a TS supposedly being "admired" for?
tink :icon_chick:
The broad jump? ::)
The broad jump?
O, Rebis. That was terrible, even for you!!
Nichole
I surprised myself. I was just trying to think of an olympic sport which people get admired for doing, and then, it hit me. >:D
Quote from: Rebis on July 30, 2008, 02:42:09 PM
... and then, it hit me. >:D
This, I hope? :) (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cottamhorseshoes.com%2F67lb-anvil-web.gif&hash=8ee5e9ed7987a247c3841ed409c40dd3c9e0fb5a)
N~
Quote from: Rebis on July 30, 2008, 02:24:52 PM
The broad jump? ::)
Too funny! :P
**************************************************************
*MY perspective*And by the way, this is not directed at anyone in particular, alright?
Quote from: Tink on July 28, 2008, 08:27:52 PM
What is a TS supposedly being "admired" for?
The fact that I "act" or "look like" a female? Well, duh, of course I behave and look like a female! so does the majority of women! Could it be that these ->-bleeped-<- admirers/->-bleeped-<-s (and incidentally, to me the two terms mean exactly the same thing) see *me* as something "other" than female?
Well, heck, I don't know how that can be a good thing at all. As a matter of fact it is demeaning and extremely insulting. I don't want to be considered "exceptional*, "special". or "ultra-anything" simply because my anatomy and mind didn't match when I was born. I'm NOT a "rarity" in any possible way. I am not "more or less' than anything. I am just a woman like the zillions of others who roam the earth. So get used ot it, world, and stop looking at me as if I were an "oddity" Period!
tink :icon_chick:
Quote from: Tink on July 30, 2008, 07:15:55 PM
Quote from: Rebis on July 30, 2008, 02:24:52 PM
The broad jump? ::)
Too funny! :P
**************************************************************
*MY perspective*
And by the way, this is not directed at anyone in particular, alright?
Quote from: Tink on July 28, 2008, 08:27:52 PM
What is a TS supposedly being "admired" for?
The fact that I "act" or "look like" a female? Well, duh, of course I behave and look like a female! so does the majority of women! Could it be that these ->-bleeped-<- admirers/->-bleeped-<-s (and incidentally, to me the two terms mean exactly the same thing) see *me* as something "other" than female?
Well, heck, I don't know how that can be a good thing at all. As a matter of fact it is demeaning and extremely insulting. I don't want to be considered "exceptional*, "special". or "ultra-anything" simply because my anatomy and mind didn't match when I was born. I'm NOT a "rarity" in any possible way. I am not "more or less' than anything. I am just a woman like the zillions of others who roam the earth. So get used ot it, world, and stop looking at me as if I were an "oddity" Period!
tink :icon_chick:
:eusa_clap: :eusa_clap: :eusa_clap: :eusa_clap: :eusa_clap: :eusa_clap: :eusa_dance: :eusa_dance: :eusa_dance: :icon_bunch: :icon_bunch: :eusa_dance:
YES!!!! .
Nichole
yeah. Like what Tink said.
Yep, Rebis, that one was good enough for posting in her locked thread of worthy quotes.
Nichole
Quote from: Tink on July 30, 2008, 07:15:55 PM
The fact that I "act" or "look like" a female? Well, duh, of course I behave and look like a female! so does the majority of women! Could it be that these ->-bleeped-<- admirers/->-bleeped-<-s (and incidentally, to me the two terms mean exactly the same thing) see *me* as something "other" than female?
Well, heck, I don't know how that can be a good thing at all. As a matter of fact it is demeaning and extremely insulting. I don't want to be considered "exceptional*, "special". or "ultra-anything" simply because my anatomy and mind didn't match when I was born. I'm NOT a "rarity" in any possible way. I am not "more or less' than anything. I am just a woman like the zillions of others who roam the earth. So get used ot it, world, and stop looking at me as if I were an "oddity" Period!
tink :icon_chick:
Oo! I have to confess that reading that brought me a lot of pain. But properly responding to it would involve saying things that are probably not my place to say. All I feel free to say is that either love will transcend that or you're not really in love. :icon_cry2:
Quote from: Tink on July 30, 2008, 07:15:55 PM
I'm NOT a "rarity" in any possible way. I am not "more or less' than anything. I am just a woman like the zillions of others who roam the earth.
I know what you mean... and yet... and yet... truth be told, I'm NOT like the zillion other women out there. I AM a rarity in many ways. The things I've experienced, the things I've felt and seen and done... aren't anything a "typical woman" has ever experienced.
So I dunno, I'm kinda beginning to make peace with all that. I'm not saying I "identify as trans" or anything like that, but I can't deny that my past was unusual, and that it's part of who I am now. Now, if someone wanted me JUST because of that past... as a type of "fetish" where *I* don't matter, and it's just a sexual kink thing... then ICK.
But if someone simply appreciated my unusual past as being interesting, an extra "edge" or "value added bonus," lol... sorta like admiring someone who's traveled the world or something... then is that so bad?
I just don't want to get caught up in "proving that I'm a real woman" to myself by denying my male past, ya know? Just because someone knows of my past... and appreciates the diversity and expanded viewpoint it allows me... doesn't mean I'm less ME to them. I hope, lol, I mean whada I know? All hypothetical for me...
~Kate~
This post probably isn't going to make me very popular around here. It's not intended to be 100% PC, be sensitive to the nuances of everyone's individual identities or even be anything more than a typed version of what's been whizzing around in my head on this topic since I first read it.
Maybe this whole ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- thing is different for FTMs v. MTFs.
For you post-op ladies, you're entirely right. Someone wanting you for your trans status is slightly odd, considering your bodies are 100% congruent with your gender identity and presentation. Sure, you might be taller or broader than you'd like thanks to missing out on female puberty when it generally occurs, but for argument's sake, you're physically female. Completely, totally and unmistakably. And your bottom surgeries are gorgeous! The few that I've seen are just plain impressive. Realistically, I'd find it EXTREMELY hard to believe that anyone would guess your genitals weren't natal. A ->-bleeped-<- wanting to date no one but post-op transwomen seems odd to me, simply for the fact that you are physically, emotionally and mentally female. In your case, no, there is no 'difference' between you and a biological female. I'm not talking socialization or other semantics- I'm strictly talking about bodies here.
For the pre-op gals, maybe it isn't repressed homosexuality in those who chase you. Maybe these people (typically men) are completely respecting of your female identity, could live without the 'dangly bits' and are just huge fans of anal sex? Because let's be honest, as much as I like to call what's in my pants right now a penis, it's a clitoris that's enlarged from hormone use. So if you're having penetrative sex it's not in your vagina, even if that's what you'd prefer to call it. So... what's wrong with some dude who's into women and anal sex finding some sort of Utopia in a transwoman? I can see how it could be construed as creepy, but it seems to me that'd be a case-by-case basis.
And from an FTM point of view, our bottom surgery sucks. Let's say I had $80k to spend on a phalloplasty. Let's also say that it (miraculously) came out looking like a biological penis, I had no problems with my urethral lengthening, got myself some testicular implants and a vaginectomy. In other words, the works. I'd still have to pump up my erection manually. And I'd still be missing something extremely obvious- ejaculation. So as much as we'd like to think we can sexually function as 100% male, we can't. I know my lady has slept with cisgendered men, but I don't find it constructive to ask if she'd *prefer* I had a fully functioning penis. And since there's no hope on the horizon for getting one, I am completely and totally cool dating a ->-bleeped-<-. Because really, we are physically different from biological men and probably will have no choice but to be for a while to come.
I hope that made sense. Oh, and to the moderators- I did my best to use words like 'vagina' and 'testicles' in this blog as casually as I'd speak of my big toe. I'd appreciate if the anatomical references not be censored or altered anyway as they're not being used as sexual language.
Quote from: Mister on July 31, 2008, 02:33:56 PM
Maybe this whole ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- thing is different for FTMs v. MTFs.
It's got to be different. I've heard trans-->-bleeped-<-s are men that are only after pre-operational gals. Quite an interesting subject & one that requires to understand how a trans-->-bleeped-<- thinks & why he does what he does.
Being the devil's advocate I usually am :laugh: here:
http://www.reneereyes.com/Webdocs/mtrelations.htm (http://www.reneereyes.com/Webdocs/mtrelations.htm)
I can only speak for me among the mods, Mister. But "penis" and "vagina" are not normally moderated. Your post was good as well. Have to admit from your intro I was worried about what I was gonna read.
Having read it. It gets a rep point. Excellently done.
:)
Nichole
Quote from: Nichole on July 31, 2008, 02:44:06 PM
I can only speak for me among the mods, Mister. But "penis" and "vagina" are not normally moderated. Your post was good as well. Have to admit from your intro I was worried about what I was gonna read.
Having read it. It gets a rep point. Excellently done.
:)
Nichole
Thanks for both the info and the rep. :)
Posted on: July 31, 2008, 01:01:10 PM
Quote from: Blanche on July 31, 2008, 02:42:48 PM
Quote from: Mister on July 31, 2008, 02:33:56 PM
Maybe this whole ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- thing is different for FTMs v. MTFs.
It's got to be different. I've heard trans-->-bleeped-<-s are men that are only after pre-operational gals. Quite an interesting subject & one that requires to understand how a trans-->-bleeped-<- thinks & why he does what he does.
Being the devil's advocate I usually am :laugh: here:
http://www.reneereyes.com/Webdocs/mtrelations.htm (http://www.reneereyes.com/Webdocs/mtrelations.htm)
That site wins the most quotes on a single page award.
I used to often go to these "trans" nights at clubs and stuff since I still felt more comfortable in those places. From my experience, however, I quickly got tired of it as there were many a ->-bleeped-<- at those places. Only occasionally did I meet a guy who I could genuinely have a conversation with without any assumptions being made about me or where the night would lead. Most of the time though they were the same old ->-bleeped-<- who seemed to be about one thing, the girl with something "a little extra" which I got asked quite a few times.
In my personal experience it always had to do with sex and probably the thought of the thrill of being with a girl with the anatomy of a guy. This is, however, probably due to the environment that I was in. I can't really expect any other type of guy to go there unless they were looking for a particular thing. I think the general consensus though was that they did still think of themselves as heterosexual (which they should), since I never got anyone who said anything like wanting to be with a man who looks like a woman. They always treated me as a lady. I never ever did anything with them so I don't know any information as far as what they preferred in bed (taking or being taken).
I never go to those places anymore since now I feel more comfortable in regular clubs and bars (when I actually go out).
That was an excellent contribution, Mister. From what I can see, the whole dynamic is very different-- with male ->-bleeped-<-s of MTF identifying as straight, while female ->-bleeped-<-s of FTM are usually openly queer, and the FTM's relationship with women so often emerging from a lesbian milieu, and to some extent remaining within the lesbian ambit. Margaret Cho is an outspoken queer woman and a well-known admirer of FTM boys. I had a friend who was a riotgrrrl sort of poet, and when I met her she had a relationship with an FTM guy-- she also dated women-- and she says about herself: "I'm not gay, lesbian, bi, straight, or any of those things. I'm just queer, that's all."
I dated a T-man too, and he totally treated me like a lady, he was such a gentleman to me. <sigh> I don't go out of my way looking for T-men, so I'm not a ->-bleeped-<- myself, but I do appreciate them above genetic men. The ones I've known have all been so much more hip to women's needs! Mmm now that's my kind of man.
Quote from: Hypatia on July 31, 2008, 07:07:52 PM
The ones I've known have all been so much more hip to women's needs! Mmm now that's my kind of man.
Agreed, Hypatia. Sorry, if I was gonna fall for a guy I think it would be a man with a trans history.
Nichole
Quote from: Kate on July 31, 2008, 08:29:56 AM
But if someone simply appreciated my unusual past as being interesting, an extra "edge" or "value added bonus," lol... sorta like admiring someone who's traveled the world or something... then is that so bad?
That doesn't fit the definition of a ->-bleeped-<- admirer/->-bleeped-<- though. That is what a SO/boyfriend/girlfriend/spouse/partner is. Heck, Chris does all that, does that mean he is a ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-/admirer? Or am I a ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-/admier because he is a FTM? Sorry but I think not. A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is this (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=-%3E-bleeped-%3C-+-%3E-bleeped-%3C-) or this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/-%3E-bleeped-%3C-_-%3E-bleeped-%3C-).
Quote from: Kate on July 31, 2008, 08:29:56 AM
So I dunno, I'm kinda beginning to make peace with all that. I'm not saying I "identify as trans" or anything like that, but I can't deny that my past was unusual.
I just don't want to get caught up in "proving that I'm a real woman" to myself by denying my male past, ya know? Just because someone knows of my past...
~Kate~
It has nothing to do with "denying" our past or "proving that we're real women". The difference lies in the personal desire to be objectified. If one enjoys objectification, (either as the objectifier or the one being objectified) then they will seek that dynamic. Now, that being said, people just can't assume that simply because one's gender/sex/medical history/transsexualsim is atypical that one would be welcoming of said dynamic, no?
tink :icon_chick:
Quote from: Hypatia on July 31, 2008, 07:07:52 PM
That was an excellent contribution, Mister. From what I can see, the whole dynamic is very different-- with male ->-bleeped-<-s of MTF identifying as straight, while female ->-bleeped-<-s of FTM are usually openly queer, and the FTM's relationship with women so often emerging from a lesbian milieu, and to some extent remaining within the lesbian ambit. Margaret Cho is an outspoken queer woman and a well-known admirer of FTM boys. I had a friend who was a riotgrrrl sort of poet, and when I met her she had a relationship with an FTM guy-- she also dated women-- and she says about herself: "I'm not gay, lesbian, bi, straight, or any of those things. I'm just queer, that's all."
I dated a T-man too, and he totally treated me like a lady, he was such a gentleman to me. <sigh> I don't go out of my way looking for T-men, so I'm not a ->-bleeped-<- myself, but I do appreciate them above genetic men. The ones I've known have all been so much more hip to women's needs! Mmm now that's my kind of man.
Quote from: Nichole on July 31, 2008, 07:26:49 PM
Quote from: Hypatia on July 31, 2008, 07:07:52 PM
The ones I've known have all been so much more hip to women's needs! Mmm now that's my kind of man.
Agreed, Hypatia. Sorry, if I was gonna fall for a guy I think it would be a man with a trans history.
Nichole
Thanks, ladies! :-*
Quote from: Tink on July 31, 2008, 07:33:44 PM
Quote from: Kate on July 31, 2008, 08:29:56 AM
So I dunno, I'm kinda beginning to make peace with all that. I'm not saying I "identify as trans" or anything like that, but I can't deny that my past was unusual.
I just don't want to get caught up in "proving that I'm a real woman" to myself by denying my male past, ya know? Just because someone knows of my past...
It has nothing to do with "denying" our past or "proving that we're real women". The difference lies in the personal desire to be objectified. If one enjoys objectification, (either as the objectifier or the one being objectified) then they will seek that dynamic. Now, that being said, people just can't assume that simply because one's gender/sex/medical history/transsexualsim is atypical that one would be welcoming of said dynamic, no?
Absolutely!! The Fairy Goddess states it succinctly and absolutely spot-on.
And I, for one, couldn't agree more. There's a major difference in being appreciated and respected for who I am and being objectified for reasons that are more, well sexual only. Matters not whether one is pre-op or post-op or gg. Same thing all-the-way-around.
Nichole
By the way, you're welcome, Nero. Though that was a pretty large set of objectification itself. Not just any man with a trans history and not because of his history, because of who he shows me he is and his capacity to appreciate me for me.
N~
Quote from: Tink on July 31, 2008, 07:33:44 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is this (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=-%3E-bleeped-%3C-+-%3E-bleeped-%3C-) or this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/-%3E-bleeped-%3C-_-%3E-bleeped-%3C-).
Interesting... so being "chased" for icky reasons isn't really a concern for postops then?
~Kate~
Quote from: Kate on July 31, 2008, 09:50:33 PM
Quote from: Tink on July 31, 2008, 07:33:44 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is this (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=-%3E-bleeped-%3C-+-%3E-bleeped-%3C-) or this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/-%3E-bleeped-%3C-_-%3E-bleeped-%3C-).
Interesting... so being "chased" for icky reasons isn't really a concern for postops then?
~Kate~
It shouldn't be but you never know what is in the ->-bleeped-<-'s mind when it comes to objectifying transsexual women in general (pre or post-op).
tink :icon_chick:
Well, I have to admit I enjoy being hit on when I am out and about. It's always by guys, who, I believe, have no idea. BUT, I have had a problem lately with some online peeps who get my information and hound me through pm, email, or chat to meet up, ..... What is the deal? Do some of us like being chased by individuals like that? They must be successful or they would not keep trying. Personally, I don't want any part of a relationship based on the premise that I'm such a freak that I would be more than happy to let some scummy guy get his rocks off at my expense. I don't like being used, and I happen to think more of myself than that. It took me a long time to accept who I am, and I'm not about to let some slimeball undo the progress I've made.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi
I like to think the "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-" is more inclined to appreciate a "strong woman" than other reasons. An indeed I can appreciate such a thought as my own desire runs parallel. But, meh, there are quite a few things which make people tick ;)
Quote from: Kristi on August 01, 2008, 09:43:46 AM
What is the deal? Do some of us like being chased by individuals like that? They must be successful or they would not keep trying.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi
Hey Kristi,
I've spent my fair amount of time online and I can tell you that yes, there are people who enjoy that attention. For what I can tell, they are tranvestites and others who basically have a fetish and get online for one purpose...to fulfill their desire for the fetish. It's a strange concept to actually
be someone's fetish, to be liked/loved for what you have vs. who you are. I have a pretty detailed profile that I think helps keep some of those guys clear of me. It's nice to talk to guys and learn what makes them tick online where it's safe, but it can be scary and intimidating, demeaning and demoralizing at times. Meghan
I noticed a pattern... at online dating and social networking sites, every time I honestly put that I'm bisexual-- you can already guess what the result was-- tons of men hitting on me. I got so tired of it, I changed it to lesbian and now the guys leave me alone. Not only that, in real life I'm just so fed up with the patriarchy, my real feelings have been shifting from bisexual to lesbian also. My best girlfriend and I sort of came to this conclusion together. Lately she's started saying a lot "Gee, I hate men," and came out as lesbian. I have to admit I would be perfectly happy going on as lesbian. I think I'm giving up bisexuality as just too much trouble.
ICQ was the worst. When I tried it, I filled in Arabic and Italian among the languages I know-- and before I knew it, every horny guy in Egypt and Italy was panting after me like packs of dogs after a bitch in heat. I soon shut down my ICQ account. I've been to Italy and seen how shamelessly the men harass women there, and I hear it's just as bad in Egypt. They can all go hang, I'm having none of it.
And all this without even letting on that I'm trans...
Quote from: Hypatia on August 01, 2008, 09:03:44 PMI've been to Italy and seen how shamelessly the men harass women there, and I hear it's just as bad in Egypt. They can all go hang, I'm having none of it.
I've never been to Italy, but I can tell you that in Egypt it is really bad. For Americans it is rather intimidating. They have no sense of personal space. They are right in your face, and their hands are all over you. And they like to come up to your group and offer to buy the girls for a bunch of camels. No thanks!
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi
Early on into my transition I had a 34 year old 'TS Admirer' who i met as a customer of my work (I was driving a cab). I was happy to receive the attention and apparent acceptance and so i let him have my number.
Well later that night he rang me several times and tried to convince me to go somewhere with him (in my car.. he seemed to stupid to be able to have his own car) He seemed extremely keen, and eventually i gave in and picked him up, and apparently he wanted to "go somewhere to talk" but when I picked him up he had sex toys, "ammel" a type of drug used by gay men, and god knows what else. Anyway I went along with it, I had thought if i backed out things could get bad and so I went along with everything and what he really wanted was sex. He encouraged me to "go down" on him unprotected, and.. well yeah..I won't let that happen again, but I guess at the time i was curious and I have always had difficulty saying no to people for anything, especially when with a person like him.
He said he had been with a trans-(something) of some description in the city a few times before and he also said something along the lines of "most people think he's straight but.."
He was also a marijuana user and he was using it while we were at the place.
When I dropped him back home he got me to drop him off a short distance from his house and to turn the lights off for some reason. Suprisingly though he said to call him the next day, but i sent him a message tactfully saying i can't do the sex, and I haven't heard from him since.
So anyway, I ended up getting the full STD screening twice but thankfully i'm ok thank god. I'd find coping with GID and a desease at the same time almost too much.
I've gathered from this that there is a type of selfish, dishonest, law-dodging, low intellegence, sex-driven individuals that can be found amongst the "TS admirers". Though I can only hope that there are sincere ones out there as well, or i might find myself quite lonely..
Jazzie
There is something about part of this thread that really bothers me. It's a kind of a double-standard that says it's okay for a person to be attracted to a female-bodied person, it's okay for a person to be attracted to a male-bodied person, but it's not okay for a person to be attracted to a female-gendered male-bodied person. And I'm also getting the feeling that there's an attitude that says it's not okay for that female-gendered male-bodied person to enjoy feeling that attraction. Well, gee! What if these two people who are not okay in who they are attracted to have fallen in love and want to get married?
Quote from: Ellie's Miss Lisbeff on August 02, 2008, 01:56:13 PM
There is something about part of this thread that really bothers me. It's a kind of a double-standard that says it's okay for a person to be attracted to a female-bodied person, it's okay for a person to be attracted to a male-bodied person, but it's not okay for a person to be attracted to a female-gendered male-bodied person. And I'm also getting the feeling that there's an attitude that says it's not okay for that female-gendered male-bodied person to enjoy feeling that attraction. Well, gee! What if these two people who are not okay in who they are attracted to have fallen in love and want to get married?
That is one problem I have with this thread and started to write it but decided against it.
Thank you for saying it better than I could.
Quote from: sd on August 02, 2008, 05:33:24 PM
Thank you for saying it better than I could.
Ya, well there's a reason I have strong feelings about this one. *walks off to be alone*
Quote from: Ellie's Miss Lisbeff on August 02, 2008, 01:56:13 PM
There is something about part of this thread that really bothers me. It's a kind of a double-standard that says it's okay for a person to be attracted to a female-bodied person, it's okay for a person to be attracted to a male-bodied person, but it's not okay for a person to be attracted to a female-gendered male-bodied person. And I'm also getting the feeling that there's an attitude that says it's not okay for that female-gendered male-bodied person to enjoy feeling that attraction. Well, gee! What if these two people who are not okay in who they are attracted to have fallen in love and want to get married?
Agreed! My partner loves me for who I am, as a multi gendered person. Most terminology, gay, straight, bi, has an implication that only binary genders count. Anything else can't possibly exist. ::)
Z
Its kind of funny but what with all the people in here who lament day in and day out that they 'want someone to love them for who they are' here are a bunch of people who do just that. And you reject them out-of-hand, with a pile of stereotypes that if they were used toward (rather than from) our community you would be burning up the broadband leaving little posts about how outraged you are that such stereotyping is allowed to blah, blah, blah.
'Ya, know, you can never catch a break, if you don't give one once in a while yourself.
The thing i find hot about ts women is the difference, i like the stronger voice coming from a woman, the blending together of male and female features in the best possible way, i went to a place the other night where a lot of ts women were and the thing i noticed about one woman was her height, the definition of her cheek bones and her shapely figure and she appeared to carry herself in a strong powerful way, in the way that men do, in the way that most women are socially conditioned not to. There is something exciting about a woman who has escaped being conditioned as a woman and has instead had opportunities men get. Some born women reject there social conditioning but most don't, so they are always in some way inhibited. ts women are more appealing when they do not try to tone there assertiveness down in an attempt to pass as a woman in a society's that associates femininity with being more submissive. Its unusual how the MTF community views admirers, how many transwomen assume admirers are only interested in sex and it is also interesting that it is assumed that we are all male. The other funny thing is how many transwoman complain they cannot get dates when they pass all the men interested in them off as ->-bleeped-<-s to be avoided. The funny thing about that is that recently i got the opportunity to attend a TS/TV club as i was invited by an acquaintance who is TV, when i was there one of the woman came over to us as the man that was also with us was not dressed on that night, she came over to make sure he was not a ->-bleeped-<-, she explained to me that they do not like ->-bleeped-<-s to come in. She did not realise she was talking to a closeted admirer; it's just a good job i was born a woman. X
That is a very good distinction, one that most people (outside of the gender-educated population [jesus, beat me for using a term like that]) won't understand.
There are people who literally act gay, it's its own cultural stereotype/an expression that a lot of gay men possess. We don't act that way. Last random stranger, friend of a friend who I outed myself to - granted, a pretty world-wise person, told me that he'd been wondering if I was trans because of my voice. I don't lisp or speak like a teenage girl. I've received sexual advances from guys in my social circle that are often stipulated with "i don't normally like guys, but you're different..." ::) >:-) ::) I'm sure they tell that to everyone, but at the same time, it makes perfect sense too.
Attraction towards femininity seems a perfect justification. In this case, femininity not just in mannerism, but the process we go through (removal of hair, muscle, etc) makes for a more complete package than say, a gay man who acted female, rather than gay.
ed: Besides, we go through so much confusion and difficulty with sex that if you find a caring partner who likes a girl with a not-so-functional penis, can you really blame them? We're not the only people in the world who deal with confusion, and though ours may be life or death gender issues, sexual attraction issues are still relevant for people.
Dee, your man loves you because you are a lovely woman. You are not ugly!!
And I agree with your man. Parts don't matter to me, the person does.
Jay
Quote from: ->-bleeped-<- link=topic=13877.msg394418#msg394418 date=1244884443
The thing i find hot about ts women is the difference, i like the stronger voice coming from a woman, the blending together of male and female features in the best possible way, i went to a place the other night where a lot of ts women were and the thing i noticed about one woman was her height, the definition of her cheek bones and her shapely figure and she appeared to carry herself in a strong powerful way, in the way that men do, in the way that most women are socially conditioned not to. There is something exciting about a woman who has escaped being conditioned as a woman and has instead had opportunities men get. Some born women reject there social conditioning but most don't, so they are always in some way inhibited. ts women are more appealing when they do not try to tone there assertiveness down in an attempt to pass as a woman in a society's that associates femininity with being more submissive. Its unusual how the MTF community views admirers, how many transwomen assume admirers are only interested in sex and it is also interesting that it is assumed that we are all male. The other funny thing is how many transwoman complain they cannot get dates when they pass all the men interested in them off as ->-bleeped-<-s to be avoided. The funny thing about that is that recently i got the opportunity to attend a TS/TV club as i was invited by an acquaintance who is TV, when i was there one of the woman came over to us as the man that was also with us was not dressed on that night, she came over to make sure he was not a ->-bleeped-<-, she explained to me that they do not like ->-bleeped-<-s to come in. She did not realise she was talking to a closeted admirer; it's just a good job i was born a woman. X
"it's just a good job i was born a woman. X"Thank God, that explains it ! hahaha
"There is something exciting about a woman who has escaped being conditioned as a woman and has instead had opportunities men get. "This can only be written by someone who is a somewhat masculine woman, bisexual, or a lesbian. Just like:
"Some born women reject there social conditioning but most don't, so they are always in some way inhibited. ts women are more appealing when they do not try to tone there assertiveness down in an attempt to pass as a woman in a society's that associates femininity with being more submissive."This is all projection, but I must agree that I know a lot of lesbian transwoman that fit perfectly well in your description, but I do not. I was feminine as a kid and therefor never had the opportunities men get, AND I never got the opportunities woman get!
I am submissive by nature, it had nothing to do with my social upbringing. And I am not trying to pass... I am just myself.
I would be horrified if someone liked me for the reasons you like transwoman. But then again, I only like men. Fortunately. :)
Creepy dudes who like us only because we have junk gives me the creeps. Honestly though, I'd be way more comfortable in a relationship with a cute trans man than a totally hetero dude. It think its because hetero dudes are the least questioned members of our society. A cute trans man, on the other hand (like the insane road-biking hottie I met in SF a month ago), totally knows what we're going through.
So, I guess I'm kind of a ->-bleeped-<-->-bleeped-<- too, but only for teh cute trans guy I met at Folsom.
I am not interested in guys at all, and have never so much as kissed one. But that has not stopped them hitting on me over the years. Most of the time, I get rid of them easily, but I guess the real persistent ones would have to be ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s.
Some of the things guys have said when begging me to have sex with them, over the years:
You know what men like better than a woman would.
I like when my GF/wife backdoors me with a dildo. I want to know what real flesh feels like but doing it with a guy would be gross.
->-bleeped-<-s give the best head. They look like women when they are doing it, but can take more cock in their mouths, because they have bigger heads and oral cavaties.
I have never had a ->-bleeped-<-, and I want to experience everything life has to offer.
I was involved with a ->-bleeped-<- before, and it was the best sex I ever had.
Being with a ->-bleeped-<- is the best of both worlds. You get sex with a woman, but the rest of the time, it's like hanging out with a buddy.
Quote from: GinaDouglas on October 25, 2010, 12:07:47 PM
Some of the things guys have said when begging me to have sex with them, over the years:
You know what men like better than a woman would.
I like when my GF/wife backdoors me with a dildo. I want to know what real flesh feels like but doing it with a guy would be gross.
->-bleeped-<-s give the best head. They look like women when they are doing it, but can take more cock in their mouths, because they have bigger heads and oral cavaties.
I have never had a ->-bleeped-<-, and I want to experience everything life has to offer.
I was involved with a ->-bleeped-<- before, and it was the best sex I ever had.
Being with a ->-bleeped-<- is the best of both worlds. You get sex with a woman, but the rest of the time, it's like hanging out with a buddy.
You are not kidding, are you? I am trying to imagine myself standing in your shoes recieving such comments. Most probably I would suggest them to pay an escort.
What is exactly wrong with these hormone and obsession driven males?
Quote from: Octavianus on October 25, 2010, 05:07:33 PM
You are not kidding, are you? I am trying to imagine myself standing in your shoes recieving such comments. Most probably I would suggest them to pay an escort.
What is exactly wrong with these hormone and obsession driven males?
No, not kidding. But that's across 25 years of experience.
Alot of them did think it was a matter of money, that if they offered me enough money, or some other coin I valued, that I would do it with them. Even though I didn't want to. And me wanting to mattered not a whit to them either.
It seems you regrettably met some very low class men. It gets me thinking, do they treat all women that way or only women in your situation?
Some men treat all women as mercenary sex-objects, and some men only treat ->-bleeped-<-s that way.
Did you ever look at Craigslist personals, just to see what's out there? Check out the posts under T4M and M4T. Makes my skin crawl.
Just had my first visit to the site and did as you told.
I am a pilgrim in an unholy land :embarrassed:
I guess you could call me a "TS admirer." There seems to be a lot of dislike toward them in this thread, though, so I hesitate to say that. I'm not really sure why I'm attracted to transsexual and transgendered folk (only MTF, however). It doesn't have anything to do with sex or genitals, because I'm pretty sure I'm asexual (I've never felt sexual attraction or desire before). Maybe I just don't make a distinction between natal women and MTF women; a woman is a woman is a woman to my brain, I guess.
Quote from: Birgitta on October 25, 2010, 07:07:12 AM
"it's just a good job i was born a woman. X"
Thank God, that explains it ! hahaha
"There is something exciting about a woman who has escaped being conditioned as a woman and has instead had opportunities men get. "
This can only be written by someone who is a somewhat masculine woman, bisexual, or a lesbian.
I am a lesbian yes, and a few months after writing what i wrote i met a rather nice translesbian who is also a feminist, we have been together over a year now. She is quite feminine, but has no need to wear make up as she is more attractive then most cis gendered women anyway, i never thought i would meet a transwomen who can wear cargo pants with crocs and still pass in the way that she does, without even looking butch, she is more feminine then me anyway! and i am not butch, or masculine in a conventional sense, i just have a mind of my own and do not need to think about what men think of me. But i quess that is considered masculine by some.
Quote from: Pundit on October 25, 2010, 11:59:05 PM
I guess you could call me a "TS admirer." There seems to be a lot of dislike toward them in this thread, though, so I hesitate to say that. I'm not really sure why I'm attracted to transsexual and transgendered folk (only MTF, however). It doesn't have anything to do with sex or genitals, because I'm pretty sure I'm asexual (I've never felt sexual attraction or desire before). Maybe I just don't make a distinction between natal women and MTF women; a woman is a woman is a woman to my brain, I guess.
I think there is a huge difference between you and what they are talking about in this thread. I think there are a lot of us that don't like what we are going through to be the target of a fetish group. I can't stand it to be honest. I don't want anyone asking me about the junk in my panties, touching it or anything at all dealing with it. And most t-->-bleeped-<-s I believe want that. I have no problem with t-admirers who don't look at me as desirable because of my pre-op status.
I hope I never run into someone who will be into "->-bleeped-<-s"...I honestly don't know whether I'd be scared or outraged. Needless to say those people that look at the transgendered/transsexual populous as sexual "jewels" are probably suffering from some other affliction...Gosh I'd probably just run and move away @_@
Quote from: Dana Lane on November 19, 2010, 10:09:27 AM
I think there is a huge difference between you and what they are talking about in this thread. I think there are a lot of us that don't like what we are going through to be the target of a fetish group. I can't stand it to be honest. I don't want anyone asking me about the junk in my panties, touching it or anything at all dealing with it. And most t-->-bleeped-<-s I believe want that. I have no problem with t-admirers who don't look at me as desirable because of my pre-op status.
Oh, okay, then I understand that. Male, female, trans, whatever, I'd be pretty pissed off if somebody liked me only for my junk or lack thereof. And I can see how it's doubly insulting to MTFs, since they so strongly want to get away from any kind of male identification.
It really depends on the person you are dating.
Amongst admirers there are great sweet handsome and normal men too!
Not all are obsessed with the "male" parts on transwoman.
*TS Admirers - What makes 'em tick?*
Rhymes with ?
Dick....
Arggh me thinks we have a (closet) winner with this line o thought baby....
Quote from: Cruelladeville on November 21, 2010, 08:10:41 AM
*TS Admirers - What makes 'em tick?*
Rhymes with ?
Dick....
right on. if you're pre-op or..umm... "non-op", chances are that you're going to have plenty of "admirers". lol
'->-bleeped-<-s give the best head. They look like women when they are doing it, but can take more cock in their mouths, because they have bigger heads and oral cavaties.'
That has to be the least sexy thing that I have ever heard in my entire life!! :o
I do think that it's a bit unfair to claim that all men who like trans women fall into this catagory but tbh I will wait until I have plucked up the courage to start dating before reaching conclusions, guys do have a habit of confirming your worst fears! :D
Quote from: Cindi Jones on May 30, 2007, 03:20:43 PM
I think that the apparent strangeness of the situation is a real mind bender. That in itself can be erotic.
Cindi
I agree. "Strangeness" is very intriguing and exciting for "str8" men who have admired cis-women all their lives.
After many decades, some str8 men realize that they don't really like ciswomen anymore (they can be a bit boring).
I was curious about this too so I explored and found some of them on a fetish forum.
The ones I saw were not all that interested in the reality of What transwomen actually are like they were drawn to something else a fantasy on what they think it would be like. Only a small section were interested in real material of transwomen. more were turned on by ideas involving rapid transformations from matcho men into ultra femmy females that can't happen in reality
and those who were sharing images of real trans-women some of them were debating on weather it was wrong to share those images because of the intended purpose by the author. there was some amusing bickering about this. (Least I don't jack off to captain planet!) lol
I did tell them breaking my cover "I really don't care about what you masturbate to."
beyond that.
What the images they were sharing consisted of basically transition slide shows so you know our before after and one in-between shot.
however some of them were naked compared to what I've seen here... which was bit of a shock when I see people I know in this forum NAKED.
Quote
Being with a ->-bleeped-<- is the best of both worlds. You get sex with a woman, but the rest of the time, it's like hanging out with a buddy.
This guy is going to get himself into a lot of trouble if he assumes that all Tgirls are low maintenance...
I've only experienced ->-bleeped-<-s/objectifiers/"admirers." They will say things that invalidate who you are (either your sex or gender). They might push you to not do certain parts of transition, or push you to do certain parts. They make generalizations of trans people and in many ways believe all trans people are the same.
An example would be this woman I was with who said I just needed top surgery and shouldn't go on T.
They make generalizations of trans people and in many ways believe all trans people are the same.
Unlike here for example.
ALL men objectify and fetishize the female form. ALL the time. They lie, cis-women lie, and you're lying to yourselves if you really think otherwise. Yes, you did it, too!
Quote from: Vallin on February 09, 2011, 10:00:14 AM
ALL men objectify and fetishize the female form. ALL the time. They lie, cis-women lie, and you're lying to yourselves if you really think otherwise. Yes, you did it, too!
:|
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
Quote from: Nygeel on February 09, 2011, 10:02:37 AM
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
That sounds like a really fun dance, actually.
Quote from: Lee on February 09, 2011, 12:55:13 PM
That sounds like a really fun dance, actually.
I imagine Whiskey is actually the prerequisite before doing the Tango-Foxtrot :P
Quote from: Vallin on February 09, 2011, 10:00:14 AM
ALL men objectify and fetishize the female form. ALL the time. They lie, cis-women lie, and you're lying to yourselves if you really think otherwise. Yes, you did it, too!
What about gay guys? As far as I'm aware, gay guys don't objectify and fetishize the female form. At least, every gay guy I've met doesn't.
i use to be what some might call a ->-bleeped-<- but not for the same reason as many men might. I sought someone like myself (or a FTM at times) but when i did meet someone they wanted to have sex too soon so it never went anywhere. I guess i was more interested in the dream of true love and so that never happened and well the cis men bothered me so i started to dress down and got my implants removed and cut my hair and take care of the elderly for the last 5 yrs. and live as a kinda FTM ???
an old site where i wrote about that love i sought but never found :embarrassed: http://web.archive.org/web/20050205065104/hometown.aol.com/danielegrl/ (http://web.archive.org/web/20050205065104/hometown.aol.com/danielegrl/) :'(
Way, way back....to those heady early pre-transition days in London...
There were one or two clubs I ventured in to Café de Paris types, where it was 'safe' to arrive dressed and explore ones new-found femininity... These naturally as a consequence attracted 'chaps' present whom I guess you'd term '->-bleeped-<-s'...
(New meat would obvioulsy get the ole hands in a lather)
As always they're looking for the perfect outta girlie, uber pretty, sexy barbie-doll shell.... with that something extra....ideally 6" rock hard and fully working...
But god, no, whatever are you suggesting?? - THEY ARE NOT GAY!!!
Twas why I didn't go back more than once or twice....the 'fetish' anything scene just isn't really my thang...
And it was what drove me to transform as convincingly as absolute possible, so that I could venture out and play in the real world as opposed to being 'objectified' in a fantasy one...
Yep fat women, hairy women, anorexic women, red haired women, blondes, brunettes, latex wearing women, boot-clad dominatrix type women, nappy wearing, high-heeled stiletto women, pi##ing women.... nylon/silk/satin clad women... you name it, and yep ladyboyz, chix-wid-dicks etc, etc...included.
Whatever the weirdness of the fetish - they'll be blokes out there that have a quirky hard-on and bent for it.... :-\
Ha, yes ...I had an idiot who contacted me through email and said he wanted advice about his trans child. He asked me questions about what kind of changes would happen...which I thought was fine at first. Then he started asking me to describe in detail...what T would do to me. I thought that was kinda odd because we were suppose to be talking about his mtf child. He eventually asked me to contact his kid through email to mentor him...which I agreed to do. His supposed kid started asking me the same questions his supposed father had asked me...about what changes would happen to me.
To make a long story short....I was later warned by another TS friend that this guy was going around online trying to talk to TS people because he had some kind of sexual fetish. She gave me the emails to look out for incase I was contacted. Lo and behold...it was the same email of that guy who I had been trying to help. Apparently he has two email accounts set up to talk to trans people while he gets off. What a sicko.
Hmm, when I saw the title of this thread my first thought was this
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1134.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm604%2Fmillieb1%2FimagesCADKQ4R3.jpg&hash=64ca893aac18edee9631e3aa7770a144ba774977)
Sticking that in their rucksack would make them tick >:-) >:-)
Seriously, I don't know and I'm pretty sure that I don't care. I'm not even sure that I like the term as I think that it throws some nice guys into a whole bunch of creepies. There's nothing wrong with having a thing about trans women, just don't objectify those trans women doing it.
I've received an e-mail from a guy once on a date site for ts people, he was telling me how much he liked trans men for their bodies that there was something really sexy about them blah blah blah he went on and on, i forgot about most of what he said, probably for good reason. he was for the most part describing all the filthy things (bdsm and the like) he wanted to do to me just because I'm a trans guy living in the same state as him. creepy that he lives only an hour or so away, good thing he wasn't bad enough to persist. there was only one e-mail from him that i deleted without replying.
Quote from: Devyn on February 09, 2011, 02:49:16 PM
What about gay guys? As far as I'm aware, gay guys don't objectify and fetishize the female form. At least, every gay guy I've met doesn't.
They objectify and fetishize the male form ;)
Quote from: Vallin on February 09, 2011, 02:17:40 AM
After many decades, some str8 men realize that they don't really like ciswomen anymore (they can be a bit boring).
hihihihi
so girls....
when transitioning.... dont try to be boring ok?
It will make you more convincing but less attractive :D
Quote from: Birgitta on February 11, 2011, 05:30:19 PM
They objectify and fetishize the male form ;)
Exactly. :laugh:
Quote from: MillieB on February 10, 2011, 09:03:14 PM
Seriously, I don't know and I'm pretty sure that I don't care. I'm not even sure that I like the term as I think that it throws some nice guys into a whole bunch of creepies. There's nothing wrong with having a thing about trans women, just don't objectify those trans women doing it.
It didn't take me very long to give up on the ->-bleeped-<-s... I've met quite a few... The funniest thing said to me on a first date was, "I thought you'd be more......masculine." X-D WTF? Another was terribly disappointed to find out that HRT had made my pre-op genitalia non-functional.
The one guy that I did develop feelings for wound up asking me, months into the relationship, if I could take a break from HRT so that I could penetrate him.
->-bleeped-<-s aren't straight.. They're bisexual men with unresolved sexuality issues. They all like to use the phrase, "I'm looking for a girl with something extra." They tend to be even more obsessed with sex than straight guys.
JessicaR, add a "usually" or "in my experiences" and you'd be good to go.
Could always use a strap on. I've got a friend who is a trans woman, she digs using a strap on.
Quote from: Nygeel on February 11, 2011, 11:08:55 PM
JessicaR, add a "usually" or "in my experiences" and you'd be good to go.
Could always use a strap on. I've got a friend who is a trans woman, she digs using a strap on.
You're a guy and, therefore, have man cooties. Cooties make your opinion invalid. Didn't U know?
;D
Quote from: JessicaR on February 11, 2011, 10:15:16 PMThe funniest thing said to me on a first date was, "I thought you'd be more......masculine." X-D WTF?
Unfortunately, a lot of the fetish scene has to do with such stereotypes. People want the best of both worlds, and they think ->-bleeped-<-s can provide that. That's why they lose interest when they realize your junk isn't functional.
Quote from: JessicaR on February 11, 2011, 11:31:37 PM
You're a guy and, therefore, have man cooties. Cooties make your opinion invalid. Didn't U know?
;D
FFFUUUUU I can't say the opposite without sounding like a misogynist. DAMN YOU!
No Nygeel, but you can pat them on the head, and say: "you're so cute when you think you have an opinion, now get in the kitchen and make me a sammich."
Quote from: JessicaR on February 11, 2011, 10:15:16 PM
It didn't take me very long to give up on the ->-bleeped-<-s... I've met quite a few... The funniest thing said to me on a first date was, "I thought you'd be more......masculine." X-D WTF? Another was terribly disappointed to find out that HRT had made my pre-op genitalia non-functional.
The one guy that I did develop feelings for wound up asking me, months into the relationship, if I could take a break from HRT so that I could penetrate him.
->-bleeped-<-s aren't straight.. They're bisexual men with unresolved sexuality issues. They all like to use the phrase, "I'm looking for a girl with something extra." They tend to be even more obsessed with sex than straight guys.
I know your stories are true, I knew them beforehand. So I always ask boys to the bone about their sexual preferences and desires. There are so called "->-bleeped-<-s' that are actually straight. They do excist. There are men that like us for who we are and not what we are. If I were post op, and a guy liked me, and did not have a problem with me beeing a TS, he will probably be indifferent about my genitalia too. It's the one's that are obsessed with it (genitals) you have to be carefull with.
A lot of ->-bleeped-<-s do want to be penetrated or give you head, you have to filter them out beforehand to avoid dissapointment.
BUT there are guys that like a TS for very different reasons as well. You can't really generalize TS lovers/->-bleeped-<-s, just like you can't with TS woman themselves. There are always exceptions.
Quote from: tekla on February 12, 2011, 12:57:33 AM
No Nygeel, but you can pat them on the head, and say: "you're so cute when you think you have an opinion, now get in the kitchen and make me a sammich."
haha that will probably work :)
Quote from: JessicaR on February 11, 2011, 10:15:16 PM
They tend to be even more obsessed with sex than straight guys.
Maybe that's because they don't bother pretending when they deal with a TS. I had a date once in the very beginning before HRT...
the guy confessed his whole life to me after sex ;). All things he had done wrong etc. ;D
Quote from: tekla on February 12, 2011, 12:57:33 AM
No Nygeel, but you can pat them on the head, and say: "you're so cute when you think you have an opinion, now get in the kitchen and make me a sammich."
Nuhhhhh I'm not that kind of a guy!
Cool fact: there are also ->-bleeped-<-s for trans guys. I would think they're harder to figure out than ->-bleeped-<-s interested in trans women. Also, are there ever any ->-bleeped-<-s into trans women that are women? Or has anybody experienced that?
Nygeel, if it makes U feel any better,
Your cooties could get together with my cooties anytime ;)
Quote from: JessicaR on February 13, 2011, 11:59:46 AM
Nygeel, if it makes U feel any better,
Your cooties could get together with my cooties anytime ;)
*rubs chin* Rhode Island isn't THAT far away...
:-* :-* :-*
Quote from: JessicaR on Today at 12:59:46 pm
Nygeel, if it makes U feel any better,
Your cooties could get together with my cooties anytime :-*
:-* :-* :-*
Posted by: Nygeel
*rubs chin* Rhode Island isn't THAT far away... :-*
well you two better get together because valentines day is hours away :police:
Cootie cuddle puddle?
While we battle with paddles on a noodle-eating poodle?
Don't get me started :icon_lol:
Quote from: JessicaR on February 14, 2011, 10:55:39 AM
While we battle with paddles on a noodle-eating poodle?
That sounds like a muddle puddle tweetle poodle beetle noodle bottle paddle battle.
Quote from: VeryGnawty on February 14, 2011, 11:31:42 AM
That sounds like a muddle puddle tweetle poodle beetle noodle bottle paddle battle.
:o ???....that is all.
So if you hook up with a ->-bleeped-<-, does that mean that you have a ->-bleeped-<- chasing cootie racing cuddle puddle pacing fanny straddle rattle?
Quote from: VeryGnawty on February 15, 2011, 12:04:06 AM
So if you hook up with a ->-bleeped-<-, does that mean that you have a ->-bleeped-<- chasing cootie racing cuddle puddle pacing fanny straddle rattle?
The answer is 42.
I've hooked up with too many ->-bleeped-<-s now that I think of it...and I haven't been active for over a year, longest time without.
I'm a straight, cis woman, and my partner is FtM. Though I am not looking for any other partner right now (too in love, can't imagine it!), I sometimes wonder, if I did move on some day, would I prefer my next partner to be FtM or cis?
The truth is, now that I've been with my FtM SO, cismen, bless their hearts, and their energy (cuz I do love male energy), seem like the biggest doofuses. Though I would never wish the difficulty of a trans life on anyone, I see my FtM partner as being way more interesting, emotionally wiser, and deeper than most people, because he walked in female shoes for a while. He relates to me more easily. I actually look at my exes (all cismen) and think, Yeah, that guy might have been richer (I mean emotionally, intellectually) if he'd been trans instead.
So it's very easy to picture myself preferring transmen to cismen.
I have one acquaintance who now dates only transmen, for a very similar reason. She prefers them on an emotional level, to the cismen she dated before.
I have another acquaintance who physically doesn't particularly like penises, but loves male energy and only gets excited by men. So she is with a transman too.
I know yet another person, who chases transmen for sexual reasons. She seems to want to sleep with as many as possible. To be honest, I think she kind of uses people, and likes power games. I don't admire her kind of chasing.
So I guess there are multiple types of admirers out there. Multiple motivations.
Weird sex-->-bleeped-<-s aside, I hope it will eventually be seen as normal and healthy, that a person prefers trans partners to cispartners. I think trans people have something to offer to partners, that cis people do not.
Elizabeth
Thanks for your perspective Elizabeth. With the term "admirers," I think of people who, like your friend, really only have interest in trans people for the sex, rather than the emotional factors involved. It is nice to hear from people who have a different point of view.
The frustration with the so called "->-bleeped-<-s" comes from guys wanting a woman with male genitalia. And a lot of them lose interest when you have surgery. That is painfull. Still their preference is totally legitimete and not suddenly perverse because we dont like it. These men deserve the deepest respect for their desire for love just like anybody else. A lot of them are perfectly normal decent loving AND masculine "straight" guys that like their woman to be a bit different.
It can make one insecure about having surgery though.
I do feel that we should be carefull not to lash out our frustration on people that love some of us for their own reasons.
The other problem is that men in general seem to be uneasy about beeing out in the open with their TS girlfriend, and to his friends and family. Woman that love TS seem to be way more relaxed about that then men.
You know! For some I think a big part of the succes of a transition is the ability to love and receive love.
For a FtM that loves woman it is probably way easier to get a girlfriend then a FtM that has to turn to the gay community to search for a boyfriend.
What it comes down too, is that we all have different problems and different lovers with different challanges.
And if your life as a TS is hard or not...also to some extend probably depends on those factors.
But in the end... true love is always rare, no matter what or who you are.
Love
Birgitta
Quote from: Nygeel on February 12, 2011, 10:58:53 AM
Also, are there ever any ->-bleeped-<-s into trans women that are women?
Yes me!
Quote from: ->-bleeped-<- link=topic=13877.msg689391#msg689391 date=1299094837
Yes me!
Alrighty. In my experiences it's usually men that chase trans women and women that chase trans men.
I don't like the generalizations ->-bleeped-<-s make. I don't like how they think I share some sort of insight or knowledge because of the genitals I was assigned at birth. I don't like how they see me as being "so brave" for simply being me. Do you tell a person of color that they're brave for existing?
Quote from: Nygeel on March 02, 2011, 04:52:14 PM
I don't like how they see me as being "so brave" for simply being me. Do you tell a person of color that they're brave for existing?
no and i have a friend who said that to me twice when i came out to her as trans, it was weird have to admit, it was supposed to be a compliment but it just felt eh...messed up ya know? i don't think I'm being brave for transitioning, I've never thought of her as brave for existing as gay it's just who she is so...i think it's good that she asked a few questions though now she's kinda sorta educated on it. maybe the best thing she thought to say was how "brave" i am because she just didn't know anything about us before.
Quote from: Jeannette on May 31, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
A ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<- is someone who gets aroused by the presence of male and female sex characteristics (breasts and penises for instance) in a kinky way.
What then would be the term for a person who is attracted to transgender people, but not because they have both male and female characteristics? Most people use the term "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-" very broadly, and your definition is very specific, which I appreciate.
i love it when people resurrect threads from ages ago. most of the original posters are no longer here. lol
Speaking for MtF -myself only- I think we are 'exotic' and it is this - in many cases - that may make the difference in attraction.
Axelle
Quote from: Natasha on November 23, 2011, 11:26:32 PM
i love it when people resurrect threads from ages ago. most of the original posters are no longer here. lol
I apologize...
Hi B :)
There's absolutely nothing wrong with resurrecting old posts if you find it relevant to anything you are thinking, doing, etc. Whatever someone wants to talk about and is an open thread is open discussion. Feel free to peruse and resurrect dead posts if you find topics that interest you :) Meghan
Q: TS Admirers - What makes 'em tick?
A: TS folk.
Quote from: MeghanAndrews on November 24, 2011, 01:35:19 PM
Hi B :)
There's absolutely nothing wrong with resurrecting old posts if you find it relevant to anything you are thinking, doing, etc. Whatever someone wants to talk about and is an open thread is open discussion. Feel free to peruse and resurrect dead posts if you find topics that interest you :) Meghan
Thank you for clarifying the policy, Meghan. By the way, that was a very interesting story about you having the chance to be on the radio to talk about trans issues. ;)
Quote from: TradMForever on November 23, 2011, 01:31:54 PM
What then would be the term for a person who is attracted to transgender people, but not because they have both male and female characteristics? Most people use the term "->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-" very broadly, and your definition is very specific, which I appreciate.
Lol i dont think there is a word for it. i dont really see how it would be possible to be attracted toa group of people whos only real shared feature is the mix of male and female characteristics with that mix playing some part in teh attraction. if you are attracted to an individual trans person though and see them as their preffered gender then i would call it "not being close minded"
Quote from: El on November 26, 2011, 07:36:45 AM
Lol i dont think there is a word for it. i dont really see how it would be possible to be attracted toa group of people whos only real shared feature is the mix of male and female characteristics with that mix playing some part in teh attraction. if you are attracted to an individual trans person though and see them as their preffered gender then i would call it "not being close minded"
Well, I've seen it written in other posts that we all have our little preferences, quirks, and peccadilloes. Believe me that if I could truly understand why I feel the way that I do, it would be halfway to figuring out a way to eliminate those feelings. If I could do that, I would probably be a far happier person...
Well most of my experiences with "admirers" have been pretty negative. Most have wanted to be "topped" which is a massive turn off for me, i dont want that junk let alone have to use it. but i have met one guy before who seemed really genuine and open to the idea of a trans gf rather than treating it as something sexual, sadly i wasnt ready to be with anyone a the time and we lost touch. For what its worth you seem like a nice enough guy from what little i have seen you write.
Ive always thought that if a man is willing to date me pre-op and post op then hes probably not one of the "scary ->-bleeped-<-s" who want some sort of ->-bleeped-<--dom rather than being open to dating a woman with a birthdefect.
Quote from: El on November 26, 2011, 09:47:11 AM
Well most of my experiences with "admirers" have been pretty negative. Most have wanted to be "topped" which is a massive turn off for me, i dont want that junk let alone have to use it. but i have met one guy before who seemed really genuine and open to the idea of a trans gf rather than treating it as something sexual, sadly i wasnt ready to be with anyone a the time and we lost touch. For what its worth you seem like a nice enough guy from what little i have seen you write.
Ive always thought that if a man is willing to date me pre-op and post op then hes probably not one of the "scary ->-bleeped-<-s" who want some sort of ->-bleeped-<--dom rather than being open to dating a woman with a birthdefect.
I know what you mean. You do see that kind of trashiness spread all over the Internet on pornographic sites, and that has never held any interest for me whatsoever; in fact, I've always been repulsed by it. It's sad that a lot of women who are going through transition feel that that's the only way they can earn the money that they need to complete everything. I definitely am open to a pre-op/post-op relationship, so I don't consider myself to a be a "scary ->-bleeped-<-". :)
:D well thats good! Glad to have you on the boards :)
Quote from: El on November 26, 2011, 03:48:42 PM
:D well thats good! Glad to have you on the boards :)
Thank you! ;)
Quote from: Emelye on May 29, 2007, 08:08:20 PM
I've read about men (and women?) who pursue trans people for relationships, sexual and otherwise, even some who do so exclusively. I've always wondered if this was urban legend, or if not, what these people are really like and if some of the members here ever had any experiences with admirers they'd be willing to share.
Besides hoping to satisfy my own curiosity, I'd like to get some material I can use in our Wiki.
thnx!
Emelye
Actual trans people vs the fantasy...
Most transpeople are into dungeons and dragons and renfairs instead of style and fashion. It's a fact!!!
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on November 26, 2011, 09:35:13 PM
Actual trans people vs the fantasy...
Most transpeople are into dungeons and dragons and renfairs instead of style and fashion. It's a fact!!!
Lol its true there are a lot of geeky trans people, although is it surprising considering how dysphoria can make people insular and escapist, and D&D and computergames are very escapist and insular, i dont find it surprising. That said I spend about equal amounts on geekyness and clothing, i get bored with games and clothes equally quickly and have to buy more. Yay for capitalism, consume, CONSUME!
Mahsa you always have the best facts. ;D
Quote from: Felix on November 27, 2011, 03:38:47 AM
Mahsa you always have the best facts. ;D
Not really facts. Just observations...
I always knew there were two sides to the TS community...girls like me and girls who I had met at conventions and stuff. It took me a long time to accept the latter, but now that I have....
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on November 27, 2011, 04:22:37 AM
Not really facts. Just observations...
I always knew there were two sides to the TS community...girls like me and girls who I had met at conventions and stuff. It took me a long time to accept the latter, but now that I have....
Lol i would say there are more than 2 sides, there are as many sorts of trans people as there are cis people. Im a person first, a woman second and a transgendered woman 3rd, at least in my own mind.
Quote from: El on November 27, 2011, 05:24:32 AM
Lol i would say there are more than 2 sides, there are as many sorts of trans people as there are cis people. Im a person first, a woman second and a transgendered woman 3rd, at least in my own mind.
I still retained my gay man vestigial tail. Oh well, despite my success I am still grounded in reality.
I am an insular nerd sometimes. I confess, it's much easier to live all in the dreams that in reality, but there's no satisfaction in it. Games and labyrinths of the mind are pointless.
I dont have experiences with ts admirers, and how couldit be... It s just my soul that is female now, i wish i will be just considered a person and not a fetish, but i confess that the thought of be desired can be fascinating...
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on November 26, 2011, 09:35:13 PM
Most transpeople are into dungeons and dragons and renfairs instead of style and fashion. It's a fact!!!
But, it's better if you're into fashionable Dungeons and Dragons.
Like, all of my characters have color themes for their armor in Guild Wars. Now, that's a fashion statement. My elementalist wears pink, and my dervish only wears brown.
Quote from: VeryGnawty on November 27, 2011, 06:58:32 PM
But, it's better if you're into fashionable Dungeons and Dragons.
Like, all of my characters have color themes for their armor in Guild Wars. Now, that's a fashion statement. My elementalist wears pink, and my dervish only wears brown.
I make gay gi joes.
Quote from: VeryGnawty on November 27, 2011, 06:58:32 PM
But, it's better if you're into fashionable Dungeons and Dragons.
Like, all of my characters have color themes for their armor in Guild Wars. Now, that's a fashion statement. My elementalist wears pink, and my dervish only wears brown.
I had to stop playing LOTRO because I kept spending too much real money buying cosmetic gear. ;D
Quote from: Lily on November 27, 2011, 08:29:57 PM
I had to stop playing LOTRO because I kept spending too much real money buying cosmetic gear. ;D
You can buy non existent cosmetics with real money?
How am I suppose to react to that?
Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on November 27, 2011, 08:37:51 PM
You can buy non existent cosmetics with real money?
How am I suppose to react to that?
I've bought nonexistent clothing with real money for my daughter's neopets before. :D
Quote from: Felix on November 30, 2011, 01:27:22 AM
I've bought nonexistent clothing with real money for my daughter's neopets before. :D
I buy gi joe action figures and remove their shirts.
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.yojoe.com%2Faction%2F11%2Fimages%2Fgnaw.jpg&hash=c9a08fc5aead1fc1229b38d144aac019446a4e17)(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.yojoe.com%2Faction%2F09%2Fimages%2Fmonkeywrench3.jpg&hash=224fdfcc214ebf5da95d1d8572b9c96eb61a9050)
Responding to the original question in the subject line, I can only speak for myself. My transsexual girlfriend asked me which I prefer...transsexual versus genetic women...and I told her that I view either as women. For the record, she is pre-op and plans to stay that way. If she wanted to get reassignment surgery, so be it. She's my girl, regardless of "the downstairs plumbing." I love her for the beautiful woman she is.
Quote from: Cindi Jones on May 30, 2007, 03:20:43 PM
I think that the apparent strangeness of the situation is a real mind bender. That in itself can be erotic.
Cindi
this is how i ended up here. at one time in my life i would set up a transgender account on porn sites and goof on these "TS Admirers". then i ran into one that the conversation went on a while (i guess a week) and before i knew it. he saw what i looked like (not a transition transgender woman), and he did not care. this really got things stirring in me that i have not felt in a long time and did not want it to be about sex. i apologized to him and deleted my account. soon after i ended up here and have a "TS Admirer" to thank for it.
Quote from: Doc on May 30, 2007, 06:19:10 PM
The FtM ->-bleeped-<-s I've met have been bisexual people. They've said they're looking for 'guys with pies' and seem to be utterly honest about that -- they want relationships, they like to play with a vagina, but they find that they feel closer and better connected to people with 'guy' personalities and that partnerships with 'girl' personalities don't work well for them.
Yeah, I think this is why my wife has dated so many (but not exclusively) ftms, she's attracted to female body but male personality (although she dated an in the closet mtf too). She doesn't know how to act around a femme woman and would feel her femininity threatened in a relationship with one. It's been a little rough as I'm actually transitioning because I know she was attracted to my female body parts but I had horrible dysphoria so I'm changing them. I want phallo and she's ambivalent towards penises so I'm not sure how that will work out.
Does it say something about our self confidence that when people show interest in us we are suspicious and have names for them? Or am I naive because I have never run into this? I will admit to feeling extremely doubtful I will run into this. Maybe it is a younger person's situation to face, I don't know.
Monica